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[ghost183]

ok, so what cams did you swap in and what performance gains did you get? keep in mind i must stay with HD parts to retain my warrantee, im looking at the 255 cams with cometic head gasket, any other suggestions?..

im rolling into my local HD sometime during the next couple weeks  and looking for real world replies..

im an early shifter and rarely hit 5+ on the gauge and dont like when the pistons are screaming for mercy up that high, im looking for max power in the 2000-4500 range, and yes, i read the spec sheets but lets face it,. spec sheets are no comparison to real world seat of the pants

i need to stay on pump 91-93 fuel, DONT want to mod the heads except for a cometic .030 head gasket and i want to leave the internals OEM..

actually, im not even sure i can mod the heads or internals cause im still under HD extended svc plan till 2017,

08 cvo springer softail, FXSTSSE2, my current set up is all oem except for V&H big radius 2-2..

[hd-dude]

08 CVO's all came with the 255's. And if you change from that cam to any cam from any manufacture ( even other SE cams) you will have warranty issues with the extended warranty plans.

[grc]

Ghost, I don't know who told you that swapping cams won't affect your warranty as long as you use H-D cams, but whoever it was is seriously misleading you.  Any modification from stock can, under the right circumstances, be a valid reason to refuse warranty coverage if that mod can be shown to be a causal factor in the failure.  And with the ESP, any mod can be used by that company to void coverage at their discretion.  The ESP is a service contract, and doesn't fall under the same legal rules as a factory warranty.

It's your bike, so you can do what you want.  I just hate to see people being fed incorrect information that could lead them to make a mistake.

Jerry

[ghost183]

Ghost, I don't know who told you that swapping cams won't affect your warranty as long as you use H-D cams, but whoever it was is seriously misleading you.  There is one cam I'm aware of that H-D says is street legal and won't affect your warranty, and I believe it's the new 585.  Any modification from stock can, under the right circumstances, be a valid reason to refuse warranty coverage if that mod can be shown to be a causal factor in the failure.  And with the ESP, any mod can be used by that company to void coverage at their discretion.  The ESP is a service contract, and doesn't fall under the same legal rules as a factory warranty.

It's your bike, so you can do what you want.  I just hate to see people being fed incorrect information that could lead them to make a mistake.

Jerry

hey jerry..


  yah, after drilling BOTH my local hd dealers, of which both gave me differant prices for the same kit, and both told me "yah, if we install it, we'll honor the ESP", which immediately lit caution signs in my head, i called ESP and after talking to them in hypothetical terms as a potential new customer, they, the phone rep, and an actual adjuster i spoke to, told me things i dont want to reveal on a public forum, but the jist of it is, after being defrauded for years by HD techs, they send someone to view and confirm the coverage being requested.. and specifically request to look at the cam numbers stamped on the cams, piston tops, and even head gaskets (to see if the compression was bumped the cheap way) if any internal engine repairs are requested


an actual quote from the adjuster


"ANYTHING ADVERTISED, LABELED, STAMPED, OR INCLUDED IN A RACE ONLY KIT, VOIDS THAT PART OF THE ESP IN ITS ENTIRITY"..


so even the clutch spring plate in the stage 3 voids the clutch assembly


so im at a crossroads...


cancel the ESP and get a good chunk of my $1800 back...


or leave the bike alone for another 29 months








according to them, the fuelpak even voids the warrantee...


unreal

[Ridgerunr]

" after being defrauded for years by HD techs,"

Breaking out the violin. ESP like all insurance companies, take your money then cry if they have to pay a claim. The majority of Harley owners change the muffs and that's it. I'd bet the majority of claims are the poorly designed compensators, primary chain adjusters, suspension parts, transmission seals, & lifters (the real cause of engine failure via debris). A significant amount of owners do change cams, but a bolt in cam hardly stresses a motor to failure. ESP had to know the risks of covering a design in excess of 100 years old.

[JoeVibe]

cancel the ESP and get a good chunk of my $1800 back...

That's what I did. Even though I trust my local dealer I wasn't comfortable that he would be the final decision maker on covered repairs. I think Jerry (GRC) suggested it to me, but after reading the fine print I cancelled my ESP and stuck the money in a bank account to cover repairs that may come up. After doing my upgrades, I feel like I addressed most all of the common issues so hopefully I won't need the money.

I agree with everything Ridgerunr says. Unfortunately the ESP companies have enough "bail out" language in their fine print that they can pretty much refuse anything if you touch the bike and it really sounds like the ESP companies are getting a lot more involved in inspecting the bikes before claims are paid. I've had a couple of friends locally that had claims refused because of dealer installed modifications.

IMHO, if you want to rely on the ESP keep the bike completely stock and ride it.

[HD Street Performance]

Don't add compression if using the se255 cam in a cvo110. Warranty considerations or not.

[HILLSIDECYCLE.COM]

The ESP has nothing to do with HD.
Seperate insurance plan that is sold thru a vehicle warranty outfit.
And btw, S&S was performing all the HD re-man warranty work from the summer of 2012 to just recently.
Scott

[ghost183]

yah..


after talking to my tech today, the guy actually tearing my bike apart, not the guy doing the paperwork, its done, im processing the clutch interlock thru warranty, as well as some other small issues the tech pointed out, and then killing the policy, all in all after talking to him for quite a while, whatever was left of that warm fuzzy feeling of having an ESP was gone, after using a box of tissues to wipe away the tears, (hehe)  they got my business for the stage 3 plus some additional work


none of us know if this a nationwide process for the ESP, but were assuming based on thier previous statements that its cause were in a metro area, but none the less..  bye bye ESP

[timo482]

if s&s is not doing the remans - who is doing it now???

ya i know its a thread jack but....

to

[geezerglide]

if s&s is not doing the remans - who is doing it now???

ya i know its a thread jack but....

to

If I'm not mistaken the Remanufactured Engine Plan is no longer offered by HD.

geezerglide

[grc]

I think they make more money with the new long block program than they would with the reman program.  $4400 for a long block 110-A for instance, which doesn't include the cams, rockers, rocker box upper and lower, primary, intake, etc., and they don't have to mess with your old worn out parts and the labor to disassemble, clean, measure, replace, reassemble, etc..  Of course, what you get with the long block program is just another production engine, with all the latest cost reduction changes to important parts that you get in a new Harley.  If you can find a really good engine builder locally, you may prefer having your old engine rebuilt with good parts by a real engine builder.

Jerry

[charles05663]

if s&s is not doing the remans - who is doing it now???

If I'm not mistaken the Remanufactured Engine Plan is no longer offered by HD.

I was thinking HD dropped S&S for reman's due to the increase in the quality of the builds.  Think how much money HD loses having a properly built engine out there.

 

[Ridgerunr]

"bye bye ESP"

This maybe more common as folks learn that even a proper tune could void coverage.

[ghost183]

"bye bye ESP"

This maybe more common as folks learn that even a proper tune could void coverage.

thats right.. even a tuner installed voids the warantee of something internal gets damaged or premature failure.. 


anyhow,


im a proud new owner of a stage 3 cvo 110, and happy overall, wouldve been great of the power starting in a little lower, but im good with it thus far..  and no more esp..