Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[rednectum]

Was that a dealers bike you tried dat on?? ha ha

i get em after the dealer tells the customer it is normal-----------------so no is your answer, whatever you were implying.

[Steve Cole]

We hope to begin shipping in the next couple weeks. I do not know the part numbers yet but I can give you the prices of the 2 Software Kits. I should have the cable kit prices next week.

Single Bike kit with no cables is $425.00

Dual Bike kit with no cables is $625.00

The packaging of the kits is due to begin here late next week, beginning of the following week. The office will start taking orders next Wednesday for those who would like to place an order.

What you get in the kit is the software CD and the interface. The kit uses the same cables as the original SERT used. There are 4 programs on the CD. MasterTune which is the tuning program. DataMaster which is your data logging software. V-Tune which is used for Closed loop engine Auto tuning and the TTS Updater which is used to keep all your programs up to date via the internet. The software does not include any base maps but when you run the update software it will allow you to get all the FREE maps we have on file. The software will work with all current .MT6 files that are out floating around and the new .MT7 files that have all the new added features.

2008 DBW bike .MT7 maps has the following features

Air Fuel Ratio
VE Front Cyl
VE Rear Cyl
PE Air Fuel Ratio
Warmup Enrichment
Cranking Fuel
Closed Loop Bias
Accel Enrichment
Decel Enleanment
Spark Advance Front Cyl
Spark Advance Rear Cyl
PE Spark
Spark Temperature Control
Closed Throttle Spark
Adaptive Knock Retard
Idle RPM
IAC Warmup Steps
IAC Crank to Run
Throttle Blade Control
Engine Displacement
Injector Size
Max Knock Retard
Knock Control Enable/Disable
EITMS Off/On
Rev Limit

[rednectum]

bout time, cant wait!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Black Diamond]

We hope to begin shipping in the next couple weeks. I do not know the part numbers yet but I can give you the prices of the 2 Software Kits. I should have the cable kit prices next week.

Single Bike kit with no cables is $425.00

Dual Bike kit with no cables is $625.00

The packaging of the kits is due to begin here late next week, beginning of the following week. The office will start taking orders next Wednesday for those who would like to place an order.

What you get in the kit is the software CD and the interface. The kit uses the same cables as the original SERT used. There are 4 programs on the CD. MasterTune which is the tuning program. DataMaster which is your data logging software. V-Tune which is used for Closed loop engine Auto tuning and the TTS Updater which is used to keep all your programs up to date via the internet. The software does not include any base maps but when you run the update software it will allow you to get all the FREE maps we have on file. The software will work with all current .MT6 files that are out floating around and the new .MT7 files that have all the new added features.

2008 DBW bike .MT7 maps has the following features

Air Fuel Ratio
VE Front Cyl
VE Rear Cyl
PE Air Fuel Ratio
Warmup Enrichment
Cranking Fuel
Closed Loop Bias
Accel Enrichment
Decel Enleanment
Spark Advance Front Cyl
Spark Advance Rear Cyl
PE Spark
Spark Temperature Control
Closed Throttle Spark
Adaptive Knock Retard
Idle RPM
IAC Warmup Steps
IAC Crank to Run
Throttle Blade Control
Engine Displacement
Injector Size
Max Knock Retard
Knock Control Enable/Disable
EITMS Off/On
Rev Limit

I think this is good news but to be honest I was lost after Steve gave the prices    I am not about to act like I know what any of the rest of that meant. That's why you talk with experts, learn what you can and make the best decision you are able to!

Steve, I'll be in touch..again.  I think I'm seeing light at the end of the tunnel. Or is that a train? 

JW

[Steve Cole]

To answer how the 2008 DBW idle issue is happening I will try and explain it to you all. When the bike gets turned off the ECM expects that the Twist Grip Sensor is in the Zero position. If you have your hand on it and it is turned at all the system takes the information and learns it each time you shut it off. It averages the reading over 4 drive cycles. So each time it will adjust, just a little and can make the idle come up. My advise to all of you is to take you hand completely off the Twist Grip and then shut it off. If you currently have a high idle problem start the bike and get it up to normal operating temps. Take your hand off the Twist Grip completely and shut if off. Wait 10 seconds and start the bike again but do not touch the Twist Grip, PERIOD, then shut it off again. Do this 4 times in a row making sure to wait in between and the idle will return to normal. If it comes back up again it your causing the issue. We are looking into what we can do about it but do not have an answer just yet other than tell you not to turn the damn Twist Grip Sensor when turning the bike off.

[Black Diamond]

Thanks Steve. Good to know!

JW

[Black Diamond]

Well I got the download done and check the results on the dyno before we broke it. No change. We were able to verify the throttle body is staying wide open as it should. Based on the tq / hp numbers being close to identical, I am assuming Steve was correct in telling me the 58mm SE TB will work with the SERT.

On the up side:
I don't need to spend the additional $500 for the super tuner
The bike still has a lot of torque and I love the way she rides.

I'm not done trying to get better numbers out of her but I will not waste anymore good riding time chasing my tail. Maybe I'll take a vacation to Florida and let Wes and company take a shot at it. There's something amiss (heads, cams, rings, etc) but I for one do not have the expertise to know what. But I'm in good company, the vendor and builder feel the same way.

Ain't that important, my daughter comes home from Iraq in several weeks. Now that's important!

Bet she'd ride to Florida....

JW

[Black Diamond]

I'm posting this summary of my build to see if anyone can shed light on what went wrong with my package. This package is very similar to several fellow CVO members on their 110's. All are doing great. This isn't just about dyno numbers. I feel her hitting a brick wall once you open her up. Good at the bottom but flat on top. I've invested a lot of time and money, just looking to get what there out of her. If I can figure it out, it will be this winters project.

117 Build Summary: Upper
Cams and SE 110 head by Cycle Rama / Wes Brown
CR-595 lift cams
Intake: Open 21 Close 41 Lobe center 100 Overlap 34
Exhaust: Open 49 Close 13 Lobe center 108
Intake duration: 242 Exhaust duration: 242
Rocker ratio: Intake 1.625 Exhaust 1.625

CR-Screamin Eagle 110 heads - Port & polish your heads, Multi angle valve job on intakes, radius angle valve job on exhaust. Set valve to valve & seal to retainer clearance, set installed valve spring height, CC chambers, Mill heads. Flow test & Velocity probe ports

Intake valve size: 2.080 Multi angle cutter
Exhaust valve size: 1.620 Radius angle cutter

Valve spring pressure on the seat: #190 intake & exhaust
Valve to Valve clearance .260

Compression: 10.1 with a .040 head gasket -10cc pistons
.630 Valve stem protrusion on intake
.633 Valve stem protrusion on exhaust

Heads flowed on a Super Flow 1020 Pro Bench @ 10 inches
Lift    Intake    Exhaust    Flowed open port
.100    46.2    33.1
.200    84.9    75.1
.300    114.7    99.8
.350    130.1    110.3
.400    143.0    118.3
.450    152.4    125.9
.500    162.3    130.2
.550    170.1    131.8
.600    174.3    132.2
.650    179.9    132.7

Compression
10.1 to 1
9.3 to 1 corrected

Viton valve stem seals
Heavy Duty valve spring kit
Performance gasket kit
Port and polish heads / valve job / CC chambers / mill heads
Performance lifters

Axtell cylinders
Axtell 4.125 / 117 ci cylinders
JE stroker reverse dome pistons
JE rings

Throttle Body
Screamin Eagle Pro High Flow 58mm EFI
Screamin Eagle Pro High Flow Injector Kit - 5.3 gr/sec
Screamin Eagle Pro High Flow Air Cleaner and Breather Kit
Assembled by Gutterridge Harley Davidson - Danville Illinois

Lower:
Darkhorse / Hoben Bros
True and balance crank
Install Timken bearing
 
Gutterridge HD
Mill spigots for 117 ci cylinders
SE cam support plate
Clearance cam chest
Clearance rocker boxes
Torrington cam bearings
Roller rockers & SE rocker arm support
Quik Install Adjustable pushrods
Chrome billet aluminum lifter covers
AIM VP92T clutch upgrade

The dyno sheet is listed in the RoadKing stick postings.

After the low numbers from the dyno Gutterridge did a compression test which showed
185 lbs rear cylinder / 194 lbs front cylinder. Should this be more in the +200 lbs area?

I have been told by Cyclerama that the tune can not be successful using the Race Tuner as it is not compatible with the SE 58mm TB. Will not stay WOT. This information was passed on to CycleRama by HD Tech. HD experience the same problem with this TB on a Jim's 120 or 131. HD Tech used the Super Tuner and got the results they were looking for.

The latest download from HD to correct the high idle problem with the new electronic throttle system did not address my problem as was hoped. The download and re-dynoed showed no change that could not be room temp, etc. Less than two HP difference. However, the throttle plate appears to stay wide open when I watched the latest dyno runs. Since there is no real difference, I assume the TB was wide open on the first runs.

Sorry this post is so long. Just looking for help. This site has a lot of extremely knowledgable folks that may have the key to my problem.

TIA, JW

[Hoist!]

Jeff, after testing this package (as a 110), we found that it needs a larger throttle body and exhaust than originally designed. Scott and I are using 62mm HPI. I think you'll only need 4,89 injectors too, not the 5.3's. What exhaust are you using. We found you need a large exhaust system too. I use the Performance FatCats as they tested the best. The way Wes has this top end setup and these 110 heads done, it needs to really flow in and out. It made a big difference when we were testing various components on mine.

With the changes I'm suggesting you'll see a new, nice flat torque curve and the bike will pull like a mutha to redline. You're TB and exhaust sound like they're holding that motor package back. I can't guarantee you anything, but that's exactly how I wound up with the components I did on the motor in the end. I tested til I got the best combo!

Hoist!

[Unbalanced]

Black Diamond,

Not sure you will need to go to a larger throttlebody since atm there is not one to go to, The only issue I can see with the the 5.3 injectors  is the possibility of low speed cruise control if not tuned right it can be jerky.   I suspect when you get the butterfly to open and stay open at 100% the numbers will come up and you can put this behind you.   I hope that happens in the near term for you.   Has Steve Cole commented on this to you publically or privately since the new download which did not correct this issue?   He or Doc are probably your best source of information as Steve was the person who developed the SERT and now the TTS.

[Black Diamond]

Hi Harry

I've been occupying a lot of Doc's time. He's been great. I sent you an email for some info. I know this is a good package. I've got three bro's on this site that have proven it to me.

Doc still feels it is the ECM. I'll let him speak for himself as I'll just mess it up. I do not see the aftermarket for TB's and the like to do much until the tuning devices can over ride the ECM's desire to shut things down.

This will get figured out. In the mean time, I love to ride her as is also. A real win - win.

JW

[skyhook]

I agree with what spiderman said in the road king dyno run thread...your cam is way too short...hillside cycle built a couple 117's with wood tw6 cams (which have similar duration as your cams)...I think they're posted on the hillside cycle or joe's cycle repair website...the charts are uncorrected so the numbers are higher than your sae...but if you look at the shape of the torque curve and the fact that they make about 15 points more tq than hp, I'd say there's nothing wrong with your build, you just ain't gonna make much more hp with those cams...just my opinion and I'm surely no expert!

[sadunbar]

I agree with what spiderman said in the road king dyno run thread...your cam is way too short...hillside cycle built a couple 117's with wood tw6 cams (which have similar duration as your cams)...I think they're posted on the hillside cycle or joe's cycle repair website...the charts are uncorrected so the numbers are higher than your sae...but if you look at the shape of the torque curve and the fact that they make about 15 points more tq than hp, I'd say there's nothing wrong with your build, you just ain't gonna make much more hp with those cams...just my opinion and I'm surely no expert!

Gotta disagree...  There are a few on the site that use the exact same cam as Jeff, and have achieved much better results.  Like everyone always says, it is the total package, not just a component that determines the results. 

[Black Diamond]

What I'm trying to figure out is how this package as a 110 make in the area of 120tq /120hp. Give or take a little. Yet with more cubes it makes 116tq / 101hp. The package has been sound with others. To my way of thinking, either their is something terrible messed up or the 08 throttle system ECM is the culprit.

Hillside is one of the builders I spoke with. Great guys to talk with on the phone. They do seem to know their stuff.

JW

[Black Diamond]

Also, I don't want anyone to think I'm bashing CycleRama. They have called me on may occassions with ideas and whatevers new that they learn. They already have my money. They sincerely are working with me without me calling them.

Pam has called twice in the last three weeks with new information. The ECM download idea was floated to them. They called me. But first they called my HD builders to fill them in on what they had learned. Wes has talked to me a number of times also. I can tell this is getting at him. Good people.

JW