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[Big C.]

  On the fence here!  I'm currently running Bob's TW-7H as a drop in cam for my 09 FLTRSE3.  Wondering if the TW-555 would be better for my configuration:  Ceramic coated D & D Boss 2 into 1 with loud baffle, SERT,  SE Adj. PushRods and the stock air filter.  The bike was tuned by Rob's Dyno Service.  I  still have a little decel pop so we have to tune that out but it ran OK for a stock 110.  So since I have to put it up on the wheel again would any one recommend a cam change?  My current numbers are 95hp 110tq which I feel are a little low.  I'll post my dyno sheet below.

                                                                                                            Thanks in advance,
                                                                                                                      Cory           

[hogsty]

Your dyno run starts at 3000 rpm? 

[Big C.]

  I know, I thought that was a little weird!  Why do you think he did that?       

[Doc 1]

Your dyno guy also has the graph crossing at the wrong rpm because his scaling is off.....I'd have to say he is still learning or never been shown the correct way to run a dyno.
Doc

[HD Street Performance]

The 7 has it's place in a 103 but IME the TW5 works great as a SE255 replacement, then if the heads come off I skip the 6,555, and 7 and move to the 8 or TW400.

[Big C.]

  Doc,  I'm not sure whats going on with the weird print out.  But Rob to my knowledge knows his stuff he works independently for R & R cycle training their dealers how to tune their motors and stage kits!  So the 7 is a better fit in a 103?  What would I gain or lose swithing to the TW5?
       

[HD Street Performance]

Here is an example
Owner Vtuned

[Big C.]

  Last year before I changed out the cams I called Bob Woods and he said go with the TW-7H without the advancement gear.  After the install and tune just wasn't to impressed.  I know some of you have used the gear and swear you need it,  I  see it listed with a lot of hillside builds?  Also I've been hearing alot of guys are running and switching to the 555 and posting good results?  Dewy I would also entertain going with the 5 if that is the best drop in that has surfaced so far.      

[Big C.]

  Thanks for the dyno sheet Dewey.  So it looks like I didn't make much progress with the 7H If your seeing better #'s with the 255's and exhaust?

[Keats]

The crossover point is 5250,
it has to be by definition

so they scaling is completely off

[timtoolman]

here we go again,  the tw555  is  half tw6  and tw7 so sayeth  the man that has his name on the box,  Ive used the th7 for many years in different bikes, Its a good touring cam, I wouldnt go changing out a 7 for a 555,  But I would if i had a 255 in.  Currently i use a 400.  ( excellent torque cam when set up and tuned right ) and have excellent results heh heh heh heh

Wow there Don  it 's strange to see you say u recommend a woods 400 as in the past you've stated  in threads on this forum that you would stay away  form that cam, why the change???  

[timtoolman]

I wouldnt really read to deep in a "owner v" tuned dyno sheet either

[Big C.]

  What's an owner V tune??  Sorry still trying to learning this stuff.

[HD Street Performance]

Tim
I have not put down the 400 except in my old 95 it was so noisy I was embarrassed to say I was a tech. Well that was 8 years ago and then it made 115/110. My 117" now with a 408 is quiet with Wood 188# springs.
I posted a dyno on here a while back with the 400 in a 110. The 400 ran in that 110, quietly, because I set it up properly and it complimented the heads bore, stroke and compression. Does that mean it is the right cam every time, nope. It did work there though and made 122/122 SAE flat as a pancake torque curve (attached). My point with the 110 with those heads is work with short cams or go for it, no dabbling in between it is a waste of money.

TTS has a tuning device that allows road tuning with a laptop.

[timtoolman]

  dont want to jack this thread after this  ill drop it, Just wanted to make a point and yes you hated it on your bike  a 95  but there arent many better "torque cams"  just meant for torque  alone, Look at my sheet thats posted  the 400  did good  in a 107.


Don's reply from posting "400-6 cams" page 7 twin cam section

My only frame of reference is a 95" motor and I did try them back to back. In my own bike (pre 6 speed carbed A motor bagger) the 400 made 115hp 112TQ and was on early but the compression was too high for bagger use (10.8/1). That motor was so noisy I was embarrassed to say I was a tech. People would ask what's wrong? Different case altogether and today I could quiet them down some. The 408s in my 07 run reasonably quiet but that took everything to be correct and a lot of expensive gear including custom valves, corrected roller rockers, Wood rocker supports, Smiths pushrods, Thayer 3 stage oil pump, Wood lifters and very careful setup. Start doing the math it adds up quick. Others will sell the cam with headwork (cutting corners) and not do all that is needed and the end result will not work properly, Bobby will tell you the same.

The 110 heads and added stroke make this a very different case. I know of no back to back tests. There are none on Bobbys website either. I do see several with the TW8 or the TW408 either of which I would use and in both cases change the pistons and on the FBW bike a TB upgrade would be needed to reach those numbers and likely injectors too. Now we have the same torque profile with 100 torque coming in in the low 2,000 range hitting max at 2,500 and a solid 120/120 with a flat torque curve.

So anyone want to try the 400 for a test in the 110, TOFTT?
I may be all wrong, I am game to help with the test.

Choose your poison but the TW400 I would skip, not bad by any means just I personally could not justify the cost of the extra gear for the small potential gain.

Do you think just going thought the gears and riding on weekends and trips there will be a difference that you can feel to the tune of all the added parts needed and the +$60 for the Designer Series cam? I know the dyno winner.




answering Big C's question   I think the op would lose going from a tw7  to a tw5  cam, I had a tw7 with +4 gear , it was ok   But  I personally agree with you this time  since he already has a tw7 he needs to move to where he feels a bang for the cambuck spent,  a 8, or a 400-6 would a good  move  maybe even  the  408,  orrrr  tman 626  cam   is more friendlier  I like that one also, Remembering these arent just drop in cams,  work and patience is needed to set them up right as we all know  , Tabatha's 110 with a 400 was  around 139 trq / 118 hp ,  The S&S 625g looks good also   lots of good choices  for both big  hp and trq numbers  with the heads matched to the cam.  There are a couple of 110's around here with the woods 408-44  and they run very,very  well  low lift, just needs some more compression

[HD Street Performance]

Look I am not on here to argue or prove I am right and someone else is wrong! Just stating my experience and backing it up with some SAE dynos.
Time marched on and I tried it. I said I would try them and it worked well. Nothing wrong with change, we sure don't live in a static world do we?
I like the 400 in the 110 as I do the 408 in my 117 with 110 heads. Actually the TW8 will run right there with either of them, very close and it is $60 cheaper and plus doesn't need the geometry correction, more $$.
The 5 works very well in a stock 110 for the guys that want to retain torque and gain some top end over the SE255
The 400 is not in the same league, not a bolt-in, do the changes to use that cam and reap further benefits.
A side note
Hydra chain drive is a far cry from the gears I had in the 95" with a crank with .002 runout. That was a large part of the noise I had, loose gears.
So back to the OP question
Neither cam as far as I am concerned. Bolt in a 5 or go further and use an 8, 400 or 408 depending on your goal and budget. This advice pertains to a CVO110.

[timtoolman]

 

[HD Street Performance]

OK so here is an example, SAE, of the TW8 I just touted.
This is in a SE113 +.010 190ccp and SE 110 heads, reworked, 07 ultra.

[Big C.]

  Talked with Bob yesterday and we talked about some new ideas and combinations.  But he felt I should stay put with the 7H until he asked if I run 2000 to 4000 or 2000 to 4500 rpm and then my weight  "275 lbs."  and if I ride solo most of the time or two up .  So I told him I'm running it up to 4500 and ride mostly solo.  He paused and said the TW-555 with the 4* gear would be my best combination but again It wouldn't be huge jump just a shift in the curve.  Then he had to let me go.  Oh he also said that he doesn't recommend the TW-7H with a 4* gear for any drop in config.!  He let me know that the 7H is done its job before the gear has the time to be affective.  So for anyone interested  The 555 and the 7H are both great Wood drop In's and will make similar numbers but the 555 will graph  a little more to the left.  So your riding style should make your decision and not what Joe Shmoe did.  If I do try the 555 I will post the sheet here and get a better print out from my last tune for a comparo.  Thanks Again for all your input everyone as usual great input, opinions and advice.        

[HD Street Performance]

Bob isn't a real big fan of the TW5-6 but based on what you said in this last post it is the clearcut better choice. It's intake close is close to the same as the 555 advanced and has 575 lift which the CVO head works well with.

[HILLSIDECYCLE.COM]

 Doc,  I'm not sure whats going on with the weird print out.  But Rob to my knowledge knows his stuff he works independently for R & R cycle training their dealers how to tune their motors and stage kits!  So the 7 is a better fit in a 103?  What would I gain or lose swithing to the TW5?
        

I was under the impression that the Manchester, NH based outfit, had their own dyno??
If he is training their dealers, he had ought to get the scaling squared away, and smooth off his afr lines while he at it, as well.
Being Bob Woods largest dealer in the country, and for almost 15 years, I will say that any/all of his cams work VERY well set-up and tuned correctly.
BTW the 5 will pull your peak over to the left, and really does not require a lot of compression either.
Might want to get your machine up on www.joescyclerepair.com dyno.
Averages 22,000-24,000 miles a year on that, with 4 monitor screens, and 2 guys making moves.
Had bikes in from 33 different states last year, and his 11th year tuning EFI.
He just had Direct Link change their program, so FBW can be tuned via throttle postion, vs manifold pressure.
Scott

[Big C.]

  Scott, I was hoping you would chime in here.  Heard lots of good about you guy's.  Reggie does have his own in house dyno room in ManchVagas.  Rob Helps them out with their dealer network.  So Rob will travel to a new R&R dealer and will help train them how to set up and tune their motors and stage kits you can check him out a www.RobsDyno.com let me know what you think.  As far as my dyno sheet goes who knows what's up with the scaling.  Do tuners normally check from 3000 and up or are all runs from 2000/2500 and up during a tuning session?  Scott if I walked threw the door and asked for a drop in cam to work with my bike, weight and exhaust choice what would you put in?  Thanks for the correction that the 5 graphs more left and NOT RIGHT I'll fix that last post.  

[hogsty]

He just had Direct Link change their program, so FBW can be tuned via throttle postion, vs manifold pressure.
Scott

That doesn't sound like something to brag about.  Maybe you can enlighten me on why that's a good thing?