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[North Star]

GMR 113 build- 10.8-1 coated pistons, GMR 600 cam, GMR porting and headwork (CCP at 215), SE 58mm TB with 5.3 injectors, SE Heavy Breather, Fullsac DX and CVO mufflers with 2" Fullsac cores.

Tuned by my tuner Dave Stoddart at Mt Pocono HD.

After getting opinions on a thread I posted, I thought I could get away with using my ceramic coated catless 2009 headpipe and my Rinehart 4" mufflers, which I really wanted to hang on to. I thought if I used my DX with the Rineharts, I wouldn't have enough back pressure for good low end torque.

I took it down to Dave 2 weeks ago with that exhaust combo. Long story short, after a full day of tuning it was giving him fits. Totally dead bottom end torque due to the timing adjustments he had to make. So, I left him the bike and went home. I mailed him my DX pipe that I should have brought with me (I brought my 2" Fullac cored mufflers the first trip and left them with him), so he installed the DX, and rather than have him experiment with the Rineharts, I told him to just install the Fullsac mufflers, since the results of that exhaust combo was pretty much guaranteed.

Tuning issues went away, and it looks like good results, although I thought the charts I've seen Steve (GMR) post with his 600 cam, the torque was a bit higher down low.

Haven't really taken it for a good ride yet- plan to on Tuesday, but the chart/curves look good I think. His dyno is a bit stingy, so I figure the numbers are probably a few points higher, but I don't care about that anyhow.

Initial thoughts are that the Fullsac's are too quiet for me, as I remember them being when they were on the bike when I first bought it in 2010, but I'll give them a chance and see if I can get used to their politeness, lol.

[North Star]

SAE

[North Star]

Standard

[North Star]

Also wanted to thank Steve at GMR and Dave- both complete professionals that know their stuff, and will spend the time talking to you. Can't recommend them enough, but I think you all know that already.

[Lever]

Looks great very  similar to my Hillside  / dark horse  build

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[grayghost731]

NICE!   

[North Star]

Looks great very  similar to my Hillside  / dark horse  build

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Thanks Lever. What exhaust did you go with on that build?

[Lever]

Vance and  Hines pro pipe

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[Lever]

Here is my dyno  sheet from 110-113 build

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[Lever]

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[Scott7d]

My father told me tales of TQ curves like that. My kind of build. VERY nice!!!

[Ridgerunr]

Your numbers are fine, and it will be a handful under full throttle.  Be careful and enjoy.   

[Lever]

like others have said and my own experience 
it will put a smile on your face ....the best part is going up hills ..it will be so effortless  the motor will just beg to roll on the throttle and shift gears  ..

[North Star]

Went for a short ride today. Under throttle, the Fullsac mufflers aren't too far off the sound of the Rinehart. I guess with the bigger heads, etc, the sound of these are better than I remember it was with the stock engine.

I do have a bit of engine noise that I never had before. Not sure if is the bigger TB, or if I'm just hearing more because of the quieter exhaust. I'm getting my mechanic that did the engine re & re to check the pushrod adjustment in a couple of days.

I don't think this build with the 600 cam should be noisy?

[KC2GIW]

like others have said and my own experience 
it will put a smile on your face ....the best part is going up hills ..it will be so effortless  the motor will just beg to roll on the throttle and shift gears  ..

That's exactly what I wanted when I went 117 and exactly what I got.

Totally makes all this fuss worthwhile.

Numbers look good to me!

[GMR-PERFORMANCE]

You may be hearing the t/b noise,  it has a heavy breather on it if I recall what Dave said .. They are the worst for amplifying the noise.  The cam is not loud in any way. What about rocker shafts in the support , what shape are they in , where they checked , rocker shaft end play ?

Overall all I do not know much about the dyno that Dave has , But if he says it stingy well then he would know. He has tuned many bikes and we all know where our own equipment  stands. I took the same bike and put it on several local dynos to see where mine stacked up

[KC2GIW]

Could slightly enlarging the hole in the TB blade help cut down on the clacking open/closed of the TB blade?

[GMR-PERFORMANCE]

No its has to do with the amount of the back lash in that given unit.. Some are worse than others.. I have heard new stock bikes that made more noise than ones with cams and intakes that increase the sound.  Drilling a hole will not help as you would end up creating a issue with the IAC idle function as the FBW has no dedicated idle air passage or IAC motor . It is now a function of the plate being controlled be the ECM.

Again the Heavy breather is the worst one to make the noise louder..   Look at the new vehicles today they have a separate chamber in the intake tube to reduce,  diminish that noise.   I installed a K&N kit on my chevy truck it lasted about 10 minutes the intake noise was horrible. 

[North Star]

So Steve does my chart look pretty much what you would expect?

[North Star]

The only issues Im having is recurring O2 sensor errors. Since my bike has 50,000 miles and the sensors are original, Im going to replace them. Im also going to check the torque on the header flanges.

Im also getting more valve noise than Ive ever had. Im going to change out my semi-synthetic oil from last fall to fresh mineral oil, and am also having my mechanic double check the pushrod adjustment. 

[GMR-PERFORMANCE]

Well if the senors was lazy that may have effected some of the tune at least in the NB section, as for oil I would never use syn oil even semi syn to break in a engine. I know some do , I do not and have had less than stellar results using non mineral oil .  Just one builders opinion, The numbers are what they are , again its hard to say when you have a bike tuned on a drum that the  tuners knows it reads low.

I target 12.6-12.8 wot fuel. Which will allow more timing in the curve, with out ign rollback,   which most times will result in a stronger power curve as well.  That looks to be 13.5.

As for valve train noise I cannot say much other than the cam is not loud , its in many of the bikes that have been posted and no one has issues with that.. I have no idea what was done on the build , right or wrong.   pushrods hitting the tube, what lifters? ( lifters are the best oil filter you have )  Trash in the lifter,  Cam chain tensioner not working correctly or stuck .  Or is it just FBW noise ?

[North Star]

The semi oil has been in since the new top end was installed. It has been in through the heat cycles and dyno break in, and dyno runs. I assume the rings are seated, but also assume the engine hasn't been fully broken in yet. It has about 200 miles on the build so far I think. Before I ride it anymore, I'll be doing an oil change with mineral oil, and after 2500 miles, I'll switch to whatever oil at that point, as you suggested.

The lifters are S&S, and were put in only about 2000 miles ago, along with the cam chain tensioner. Dave thinks it's valve noise, or maybe just the TB noise. I figure the only thing I have control over trying is adjusting the push rods a bit, so my mechanic is going to check out the adjustment. He will also replace the O2 sensors, and check the torque on the header flanges.

It's not a horrible loud noise, and it's not a ticking sound. It's hard to describe- before I could just hear the valvetrain very faintly in the background, but now it's way more noticeable. Like I said, I'm sure part of it is with the quieter mufflers I can hear more of the engine. The sound isn't alarming like something is horribly wrong. I'm guessing and hoping the push rod adjustment will do the trick.

Numbers wise, from what I recall from the charts you have posted, your 113 build with headwork and 58 mm TB averages around 128-130 squared, so numbers wise, I think it's on par give or take a few.

Mechanic is coming by Friday night, so fingers crossed.

[GMR-PERFORMANCE]

Ticking is valve train so you said that is not it .. the clucking is the FBW unit.. 

[RoadDawg]

Ticking is valve train so you said that is not it .. the clucking is the FBW unit..

What does FBW stand for? Sorry I'm just dumb about this stuff.

[bigchuck]

What does FBW stand for? Sorry I'm just dumb about this stuff.

Fly By Wire. Electronically controlled throttle instead of cable type.

[RoadDawg]

Fly By Wire. Electronically controlled throttle instead of cable type.

Guess that's what I hear clacking when I start the engine, especially when cold. After that it's only occasional.

[North Star]

Just an update. I replaced the O2 sensors and that seemed to cure the recurring errors.  The pushrods were double checked, and are properly set.

Im pretty sure the noise Im hearing is the throttle body. Its not bad, just more noticable with the quieter mufflers.

Im getting used to the quieter Fullsacs. They have decent volume with this build, as compared to when I ran them stock. I think the Rineharts were becoming a bit loud for me after this build, so I think the Fullsac 2.0's might be ok for me. Just have to see if I can get the PM tips from my Rineharts to fit the stock CVO cans.

Next up is a Baker compensator and Baker Attitude adjuster, SE clutch discs, and install my Aim VPC with a different clutch spring- it never ends!