Hey Howie. I think that dino oil is absolute crap and you're a total freaking moron for ever switching out the synthetic. Unless it works. Then you were a total freaking moron for using the overpriced synthetic crap to begin with. And, by the way, you're ugly and Binx dresses you funny. Any more thoughts on the controls for Joy?Wut, me??? :sauer021: :vrolijk_4: WudIdo :nixweiss:
Hey Scott!? Pinkie this :sauer021: :sauer021: !
Anyone who has ridden a motorcycle in less than 40 states is a pansy!
thems fightin words
Wait.... Got one. Twolane is a Chithead!!!
Wait.... Got one. Twolane is a Chithead!!!May be another Chithead that has something to say about that ???
I really don't understand the hijack. It is major B. S. that we've got to subsidize these failures.
#2 Chithead, I beg your pardon!
#2 Chithead, I beg your pardon!
All that effort... right down the :toilet: .
I also hate having to sudsidize Two?Lane!
>:( >:( >:( >:( >:( >:(
Speaking of crappers, is that anything like a flapper?
:nixweiss: :nixweiss: :nixweiss: :nixweiss:
I really don't understand the hijack. It is major B. S. that we've got to subsidize these failures.
I've got to be careful though. Wasn't very long ago that I almost got in major timeout chit.
The METS suck hind tit on a boar hog..... :jack:...hey...thread jacking is cool ;D
Yeah, and this year the Yankees suck all the others!!
Yeah, and this year the Yankees suck all the others!!
Yeah, and this year the Yankees suck all the others!!
hatin de problem is fine
pissin and moanin and blaming one group don't fly
FM where's the
PBR?
:nixweiss: :nixweiss: :nixweiss:
Gary watches Soap Operas!!I do.... it's a firehouse tradition. :nixweiss:
I ain't nevr bin calld a genie s bifore :nixweiss: :nervous:
:ROFLOL:.......how true...I guess the team goes as goes the manager (Girardi) ;D
:ROFLOL:.......how true...I guess the team goes as goes the manager (Girardi) ;D
I do.... it's a firehouse tradition. :nixweiss:
Chithead!!!! :huepfenlol2: :huepfenlol2:
:pumpkin:
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
:fireman:
But those CUBS are kicking a$$. CUBS WIN 6-1!
I do.... it's a firehouse tradition. :nixweiss::
:pumpkin:
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
:fireman:
But those CUBS are kicking a$$. CUBS WIN 6-1!
How bout that ZAMBI NO-Hitter last night?....Pretty Cool Huh?
2008 World Series. Angels over Cubs four games to two :bananarock: .
as the hydrant flowsHmmmmm.....
And almost another one today...no-hitter thru 6! :2vrolijk_21: :2vrolijk_21:
Hmmmmm.....
Chairman Chithead!!!!! :P :huepfenlol2: :huepfenlol2:
Oh I forgot......
Mr. Chairman Chithead!!!!! :huepfenjump3: :huepfenjump3:
:pumpkin:
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
:fireman:
i like red sox in 4
i like red sox in 4
Hey Scott!? Pinkie this :sauer021: :sauer021: !
Good job Don!
:2vrolijk_21:
Good job Don!
:2vrolijk_21:
Not so fast... I think my feelings are hurt... :bigcry: :bigcry:
chithead :huepfenlol2: :huepfenlol2:
You better be quiet or I'll tell some of the things Nancy has shared w/me about how sensitive you are. :oops:
OMG I'm devastated!
He really is a sensitive guy!
Naitram, , , can him!
He'll never make it as a moderator!
GEEEEEEEEEZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ
I just don't see how they are gonna get by the Angels...Since the Yanks are still sucking (Like Jane Fonda) I'm rooting for the Cubbies, but don't know how they can get past the Angels either :2vrolijk_21:
Not so fast... I think my feelings are hurt... :bigcry: :bigcry:
You only have feelings in 9/10's of yourself.
I was speaking to the 10/10th.
:2vrolijk_21:
chithead :huepfenlol2: :huepfenlol2:
(Like Jane Fonda)
when BOS takes the east. the angels will get the Rays.
Rays beat the Angels
Red Sox beat the White Sox
Sox beat the Rays for the ALCS
Sox sweep the NL offering
So it takes financial markets tanking to break a 100 year old baseball curse and bring on good pitching down the stretch. Man, that historical predetermination is some rad strong chit.
when BOS takes the east. the angels will get the Rays.
Rays beat the Angels
Red Sox beat the White Sox
Sox beat the Rays for the ALCS
Sox sweep the NL offering
Did you know that Klute was the only movie she ever made in which she acted in character?
How would you know? They fell off in the lake!
Fastest thread to 5 pages in CVOHarley.com history!! :2vrolijk_21: :jack: :huepfenlol2:
O chit!
That's way to complicated for me!
oh yeah.... :oops:
oh yeah.... :oops:
Maybe the cubs outta root for a 600 point drop tomorrow; maybe they'll get that 2nd No-Hit ??? :2vrolijk_21: We might all be in the bread lines though ;D
So much for Mr. Sensitivity!
You have nerve!
Fastest thread to 5 pages in CVOHarley.com history!! :2vrolijk_21: :jack: :huepfenlol2:
That's what happens when you talk nice to your friends :P .
So much for Mr. Sensitivity!
You have nerve!
I see a lot of chithead-calling going on, though! :nixweiss: :huepfenlol2:
I see a lot of chithead-calling going on, though! :nixweiss: :huepfenlol2:
Had nerve - (surgery last Friday - remember - lost two nerves - geez)
Hey - whatever it takes... a hundred years - come on..... :nixweiss:
I see a lot of chithead-calling going on, though! :nixweiss: :huepfenlol2:
:oops:
No stinky finger HUH?
:nixweiss: :nixweiss: :nixweiss:
Hey....I'm with ya Bro....Let's hear it....Lou...Lou...Lou...Lou ;D
What's it to you Chithead?
Wait, were you on the list?
:nixweiss: :nixweiss: :nixweiss: :nixweiss:
What's it to you Chithead?
Wait, were you on the list?
:nixweiss: :nixweiss: :nixweiss: :nixweiss:
PBR?
I love you, too, Chithead! :P
I was on the list and I have a Honda shirt! :2vrolijk_21: :huepfenjump3: :drink:
PBR?
I read somewhere (ok, nowhere) that it is now believed by many (ok, no one) that Lou is actually the reincarnation of Leo Durocher; just without the good clothes.
Political Bullchit Repellant?
(comes in an aerosol or an analog delivery system)
LOL, whoever keeps changing the titles on their posts!!! :huepfenlol2: :huepfenlol2: :huepfenlol2:
That would be just wrong and would only serve to intentionally confuse the already confused to a state of unconfusion; squared.
o.k. - I concede... :znotworthy: :znotworthy:
o.k. - I concede... :znotworthy: :znotworthy:
I'm out when we hit a 100!
This was fun!
Ummmmm....I heard (Ok, Not Really) he was actually the reincaration of Leo, Billy Martin, and Earl Weaver :2vrolijk_21:
I'm out when we hit a 100!
This was fun!
Which shocks of mine did you promise Floriday Marine again? :nixweiss: :huepfenlol2:
O chit
We woke up Hoist!
>:(
Kudos to TWOLANERIDER!
Yep...This be fun ;D But I'm ouuta here :2vrolijk_21: Go Cubbies! and don't saty up all night kids...Ya gotta get up and go to school in the morning ;)
Now did anyone learn anything from tonights lesson??
Kudos to TWOLANERIDER!
Now did anyone learn anything from tonights lesson??
BAAAHAAAHAAA!!!!! :huepfenjump3: :huepfenjump3: :huepfenjump3: :huepfenjump3: :huepfenjump3: :2vrolijk_21:
Hoist! 8)
Hey Lades and Gents,
Did you hear about Lehman and Merril Lynch? :P
I bet Sarah can fix that :2vrolijk_21:
I'm runnin' out of material; someone help me out here.
Well, I for one prefer muffins to donuts...there I said it, it is out in the open now and I feel better about it too.
But a nice yeast donut is still very comforting...cake donuts unless of the cider variety should just go back to from where they came...I'm just saying....
On rare occasions this diligent group of men and women have, quite unintentionally :jack: . Never before in the history of mankind has this occurred though:
blueberry, bran, other?
not a donut fan...too sweet
well, miker, ski and I pretty much do it daily...until Capo freakin yells at us
Not a donut fan?
Gaaaaaaaa! (I read that somewhere).
Cake donuts are only ok if they are the little powdery sugar kind that I used to live on in the summers of my wasted youth. they have a shelf life of 27 years & are stale 12 seconds after they are packaged.
I thought you were Capo. You mean he really is another poster?
:nixweiss:
I prefer to thread jack my own threads but am too lazy to post my own threads usually so look for other opportunities.
Cranberry orange, blueberry, lots of butter, coffee black or sometimes with a little turbinado sugar, fresh raw cane, careful once you try it you may become addicted.
How do feel we about croissant's, I mean really, they are tasty but can they change the name???
Cranberry orange, blueberry, lots of butter, coffee black or sometimes with a little turbinado sugar, fresh raw cane, careful once you try it you may become addicted.
How do feel we about croissant's, I mean really, they are tasty but can they change the name???
Fresh Hot NY Sesame Seed Bagel with scallion cream cheese schmear and some nice nova! :2vrolijk_21:
Hoist! 8)
I'm not a Capo, but I play one at work...
And I didn't sleep in a Holiday Inn express - so the free world is pretty much on their own today
I did loose 30k in my trading account yesterday, to be on topic and not bluntly jacking yet another thread...
.............and I do like croissant's only because we have a real baker that makes em here in lake worth, really for a french guy he is OK...
Hamsters cannot swim worth chit...tried one for largemouth bait once but because it was nice a chubby with those little legs n all it just sank...they were cheaper than wild shiners and gerbils are too hard to find but may swim better.
Well, I for one prefer muffins to donuts...there I said it, it is out in the open now and I feel better about it too.
But a nice yeast donut is still very comforting...cake donuts unless of the cider variety should just go back to from where they came...I'm just saying....
I usually do not eat bagels, unless I am starving & no cardboard boxes are available. It is a breakfast of last resort, since I was raised on sugary donuts made with real butter & half covered in chocolate instead of bagels.
I do buy bagels for breakfast for those who like bagels sometimes. I buy the assorted variety since I have no idea which ones taste ok & get a variety of cream cheese like honey walnut or onion with chives.
If you were a little closer to West Palm Beach, I'd stop by and have one with you.
Sounds ok to me. They don't let me get too close to WBP too often anymore.
I am in the metropolis of Mobile, AL currently. Not sure of the bagel/donut status here. Only premium gas at the exit & not that many cars on I-10 yesterday.
I did not realize that bagel were legal up there?..! That s good to know. It is one of the positives down here with the NYC migration of recent years. Bagels and pizza. I was wondering besides Howie how many legit NY'ers are actually left up there as most apparently have moved to Palm Beach County.
Several members here need to be a little nervous :nervous:
This is the most effective and efficient highjacking since 9/11/01. Don't answer the door, it's Homeland Security. :o
I believe bagels are illegal there...Were they not offering 50k per jew to move to bama get some in state...
Until the ratio improves your bagel quality coefficient will be very low..
I recall a trip I had to make to Peecola in February and had felt cold like that since I was a grommet engineer in Penobscot Maine in February, on a roof, in the wind...Schmoops often wants to run to Key West when it drops into the 50's here...
I believe they call those folks "joos" here but am not sure. Bagels are used for driveshaft donuts on some 4 wheel drive mudder trucks though. Nobody knows you can eat them &I am not abouut to tell them.
Several members here need to be a little nervous :nervous:
This is the most effective and efficient highjacking since 9/11/01. Don't answer the door, it's Homeland Security. :o
I recall a trip I had to make to Peecola in February and had felt cold like that since I was a grommet engineer in Penobscot Maine in February, on a roof, in the wind...Schmoops often wants to run to Key West when it drops into the 50's here...
Fresh Hot NY Sesame Seed Bagel with scallion cream cheese schmear and some nice nova! :2vrolijk_21:
Hoist! 8)
Nothing wakes me up like a nice onion bagel, tosted with cream chees and Tabasco on it . :pepper:
Now that does sound like a waker upper...along with a cup of coffee; ya outta be good for the day ;D
With a nice strong spicey bloody mary, yummy!
Yep :2vrolijk_21: or a shot of Southern Comfort with your Java ;D
well if we're spiking our coffe, then its gotta be vodka. not that fruity flavored stuff
strait up coffe and vodka
That sounds hard core.
I like Irish whiskey or Brandy with some cream. And of course, Bailey's every Christmas morning.
well if we're spiking our coffe, then its gotta be vodka. not that fruity flavored stuff
strait up coffe and vodka
not at all.state of union or state of mind? :huepfenlol2: :huepfenlol2: :huepfenlol2: :huepfenlol2:
besides 2lane says i cant be hardcore until i fill in more states
state of union or state of mind? :huepfenlol2: :huepfenlol2: :huepfenlol2: :huepfenlol2:
i assumed he meant states of the union, but now that you mention it...........
Anyone who has ridden a motorcycle in less than 40 states is a pansy!
his original quote. doesnt say you gotta hit em allAre you saying we need CLARIFICATION on this issue ?!?!?!? ;) ;) ;)
Great! only out 10k at the open...Sheesh...
i assumed he meant states of the union, but now that you mention it...........
Sorry it was Dothan...
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/09/08/group-offers-jews-50000-t_n_124905.html
So Hoist and Twolane are the de facto thread coolers. Kind of like bouncers with a side show. It's a little irritating having to plow through the show to find the next legit reply. If someone had in fact crossed the line, I'd prefer the mods step in and enforce the rules. My 2 cents. Don't mean to offend anybody.
I offended somebody once.
I wrote this disclaimer a few minutes ago, but everybody so far is ignoring it. It might be of some help, but since I wrote it, that's not very likely.
Disclaimer: Please stay on topic & keep your posts limited to the subject of the thread. If you see a related topic, do not start a new thread, post in the existing thread. Thread hijacking is not permitted & any and all thread hijackers will be subjected to very serious repercussions including suspension, banning, repossession of your keyboard, and cutting off all electricity within 27 miles of your residence to prevent unwanted posting from your stupid azz. Thank you for your attention to this matter.
So Hoist and Twolane are the de facto thread coolers. Kind of like bouncers with a side show. It's a little irritating having to plow through the show to find the next legit reply. If someone had in fact crossed the line, I'd prefer the mods step in and enforce the rules. My 2 cents. Don't mean to offend anybody.
I'm guilty of everything I'm accused of (Whether I've done it or not. You must be guilty if you're accused of something) and should be publicly lynched, and hung by the neck til dead!!! :hanged: :hanged: :hanged: ::) ;D ;)
Hoist! 8)
there were no legit replies in this threa. noone crossed any lines. the more active members were making a statement that there have been enough political threads here lateley. i doubt anyone here is still undecided on their vote with 6 weeks togo. so why do we need memebers getting into it at a personal level and throwing away friendships :nixweiss:
I'm gonna add that to the coin
Just watched Obama's speech on the matter. Here is the take away.....So what are you selling? :huepfenlol2: :huepfenlol2: :huepfenlol2:
"blah blah blah...... REGULATION....... blah blah blah....... REGULATE...... blah blah blah .......IN NEED OF REGULATING....."
Now is the time to be buying folks. The CEO's of these banking institutions are not in the business of losing money and jobs. The incentives they have are designed to encourage alternative thinking (some would call risk taking). That's more motivating than being REGULATED. There will be a rebound. With or without the Federal Reserve stepping in.
there were no legit replies in this threa. noone crossed any lines. the more active members were making a statement that there have been enough political threads here lateley. i doubt anyone here is still undecided on their vote with 6 weeks togo. so why do we need memebers getting into it at a personal level and throwing away friendships :nixweiss:
I'm guilty of everything I'm accused of (Whether I've done it or not. You must be guilty if you're accused of something) and should be publicly lynched, and hung by the neck til dead!!! :hanged: :hanged: :hanged: ::) ;D ;)More appropriate would be:
Hoist! 8)
I offended somebody once.::)
I wrote this disclaimer a few minutes ago, but everybody so far is ignoring it. It might be of some help, but since I wrote it, that's not very likely.
Disclaimer: Please stay on topic & keep your posts limited to the subject of the thread. If you see a related topic, do not start a new thread, post in the existing thread. Thread hijacking is not permitted & any and all thread hijackers will be subjected to very serious repercussions including suspension, banning, repossession of your keyboard, and cutting off all electricity within 27 miles of your residence to prevent unwanted posting from your stupid azz. Thank you for your attention to this matter.
So Hoist and Twolane are the de facto thread coolers. Kind of like bouncers with a side show. It's a little irritating having to plow through the show to find the next legit reply. If someone had in fact crossed the line, I'd prefer the mods step in and enforce the rules. My 2 cents. Don't mean to offend anybody.
there were no legit replies in this threa. noone crossed any lines. the more active members were making a statement that there have been enough political threads here lateley. i doubt anyone here is still undecided on their vote with 6 weeks togo. so why do we need memebers getting into it at a personal level and throwing away friendships :nixweiss:
IROAR, will offer the time and respect of one direct response to this thread. Neal, of course, nailed what was going on 100%. To fully detail the subject though the nature of the response was even more to the tone of how the topic was started than the topic itself. That should have been obvious.
Had it been an even moderately thoughtful mention of issues in yesterday's and the recent weeks and months market and other financial troubles nothing would have happened. We are bright people here capable of having intelligent well minded discussions on a regular basis. And we do. We're also bright enough to be bored chitless by drivel.
What was started was not a high minded discussion of financial foibles. It was a barely-sensical kvetch about administrations and campaigns when everyone realizes that though they get credit and blame for the economy writ large the White House really does not control it. The thread title might as well have been "I want to bitch about Bush and McCain and this is the reason I'm picking today." I saw it and suffered an aneurism. Or had the thought "chit, not another thread like that; isn't enough freaking enough." The two feel the same.
Given the totality of the response numbers suggest most others felt the same. And, believe me, I'd have felt exactly the same way if it'd been a thread bitching about Obama and the legislature. Enough is enough. We've had good people here saying spurious things to other good people. Insults have been real. Enough is enough.
If a discussion of the state of the economy among a bunch of gear heads is important to you go start one. If it's legimately offered it won't get... um... any more slightly sidetracked than any other tread.
Rather than having to watch a potential train wreck and once again see friends picking at friends over nonsense you are right. I purposefully derailed the thread. With ill intent toward no one. With ill word not spoken to anyone. With not a shot fired that wasn't in jest. Isn't that really a better alternative in this venue than yet another thread about whether some Democrat's daddy can beat up some Republican's?
Having asked that question in closing I'll also say I really am unconcerned about the answer. As long as we're not bitching at one another I'm satisfied. That's the end of my part of any serious discussion here.
Your bike is ugly too. Both of em.
This has got to be the best thread jacking I've ever seen. It instantly went to 14 pages of nothing. :2vrolijk_21: It's fun.
I suppose you all havent hear about Lehman and Merril Lynch have ya :oops:
Did anyone say,
PBR
how come he takes credit for Nancy's bikes :nixweiss:
Hey, I see you took the color descriptions off your bikes in your sig. Does this mean a screen name change is coming soon? May I suggest "Chithead?"
Is that something we can discuss at the cookout Friday?
What does "Chithead" have to do with a color?
Are you prejudice?
Are Chitheads a certain color?
:nixweiss: :nixweiss: :nixweiss: :nixweiss: :nixweiss:
how come he takes credit for Nancy's bikes :nixweiss:Because he's going to clean it, work on it, and make it go fast....
See I told you. ;) ;D
Cause I can.
;)
Remember I'll be cooking. Any talk beyong trips, MV, touring, alcohol, tattos, garages, girls or MOTORCYLES will result in you eating what I give ya! And who knows what you might find in it! FTP!!! ::) ::) ::) :P ;D ;D ;D ;)
Hoist! 8)
IROAR, will offer the time and respect of one direct response to this thread. Neal, of course, nailed what was going on 100%. To fully detail the subject though the nature of the response was even more to the tone of how the topic was started than the topic itself. That should have been obvious.
Had it been an even moderately thoughtful mention of issues in yesterday's and the recent weeks and months market and other financial troubles nothing would have happened. We are bright people here capable of having intelligent well minded discussions on a regular basis. And we do. We're also bright enough to be bored chitless by drivel.
What was started was not a high minded discussion of financial foibles. It was a barely-sensical kvetch about administrations and campaigns when everyone realizes that though they get credit and blame for the economy writ large the White House really does not control it. The thread title might as well have been "I want to bitch about Bush and McCain and this is the reason I'm picking today." I saw it and suffered an aneurism. Or had the thought "chit, not another thread like that; isn't enough freaking enough." The two feel the same.
Given the totality of the response numbers suggest most others felt the same. And, believe me, I'd have felt exactly the same way if it'd been a thread bitching about Obama and the legislature. Enough is enough. We've had good people here saying spurious things to other good people. Insults have been real. Enough is enough.
If a discussion of the state of the economy among a bunch of gear heads is important to you go start one. If it's legimately offered it won't get... um... any more slightly sidetracked than any other tread.
Rather than having to watch a potential train wreck and once again see friends picking at friends over nonsense you are right. I purposefully derailed the thread. With ill intent toward no one. With ill word not spoken to anyone. With not a shot fired that wasn't in jest. Isn't that really a better alternative in this venue than yet another thread about whether some Democrat's daddy can beat up some Republican's?
Having asked that question in closing I'll also say I really am unconcerned about the answer. As long as we're not bitching at one another I'm satisfied. That's the end of my part of any serious discussion here.
Did anyone say,Oh HELL yeah!! PBR Rocks :drink: :drink:
PBR
(http://www.faithmouse.com/oolong_pancake_bunny.jpg)
HOLY CHIT...what the hell is it with bunnies and pancakes? :nixweiss:
There is a treasure trove of pictures of bunnies with a pancake on their head.
Google "Oolong". Sort of like the Travelocity Gnome, only different.
(http://user.it.uu.se/~erikb/images/oolong.jpg)
I'm late in posting on this thread and from the good Colonel's response a couple posts back, I'm not going to read backwards. Rather I'd ask what intelligent folks think of the road ahead. Does one bail on stocks and mutuals and hide out in money market funds or does one ride out the storm (meaning sit pat and do nothing since you only lose if you sell)
B B
Sit tight.
BWAAAHAAAHAAAHAA!!! ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
You're a pisser Mike!!! :2vrolijk_21: :drink: :huepfenjump3:
Hoist!
I'm late in posting on this thread and from the good Colonel's response a couple posts back, I'm not going to read backwards. Rather I'd ask what intelligent folks think of the road ahead. Does one bail on stocks and mutuals and hide out in money market funds or does one ride out the storm (meaning sit pat and do nothing since you only lose if you sell)
B B
There is a treasure trove of pictures of bunnies with a pancake on their head.
Google "Oolong". Sort of like the Travelocity Gnome, only different.
(http://user.it.uu.se/~erikb/images/oolong.jpg)
man, I love this site...other then alt.freaks where do you learn about stuff like this!
Don't remember where I saw this first. Been posting on boards since the old BBS dial in days (mid 1990's or so). Have been linked to so many weird/strange sites...... Miss the old boards sometimes - not many folks were posting, in comparison.
Don't remember where I saw this stuff first. Been posting on boards since the old BBS dial in days (mid 1990's or so). Have been linked to so many weird/strange sites...... Miss the old boards sometimes - not many folks were posting, in comparison.
(http://www.plasticliving.com/animals/OolongRabbit.jpg)
I used to use GEnie... And Gopher! (not the love boat Gopher...)
I had this purple wire bunny someone left on my desk when I was deployed to Qatar back in 04... Since I was locked into staying in Qatar and couldn't get to where I really wanted to be, I sent the wire bunny to Afghanistan, Iraq, Pakistan and every other "stan" that someone was going to.
Had to live my combat vicariously that year...made up for it spades since then.
That bunny got some mileage, had pics somewhere.
Sounds like fun. Gave up trying to remember all the 'stan' countries, so I usually just refer to some of them as
Wherethe'F'istans.
I had this one Marine LtCol swear he was going to kill me, they searched his luggage in Pakistan and the freakin bunny was in there!! Man, laughed my ass off about that one.
Don,
where the F&$K are my shocks?
BB look at the long term history on the stock market - it averages out at 10-12% a year.
I look at this as a buying opportunity - but I am 40 with at least 10 years before I retire...have my kids college paid for and have a retirement funded in large part by Uncle Sam (and your tax dollars, thanks by the way!).
Heard of some folks dumping out to CD's and such, but that locks you into a low interest rate for a set period, not my cup of tea.
Guess it depends on your stomach and situation...mine is iron clad and I am in for a long haul.
Don, thank you for hijacking the thread.......it was a service to our community
after the 3rd page of your nonsense my A.D.D. kicked in and refused to counter orig post....
Thanks again.......blood pressure returned to normal
Don...Does this mean your a community organizer? ::) ;D :2vrolijk_21:
Well first off, you should know that I had no plans to retire until I was 65, but have had it forced on me due to physical reasons. I have some investments, but no where near what I'd hoped would be in place 10 years from now. As such, what I do have I don't have the luxury of playing games with. Also, with the housing market being what it is, selling my house would not net me anywhere near what it should until things improve greatly. But that was a part of the retirement plan as the house is about 3 times what my wife and I need. So I guess sit tight may well be the best course of action. HOWEVER, I am known as a person who makes chit happen, so sitting around doing nothing is not exactly my forte.
B B
These are not mutually exclusive. I sit around AND made chit happen right after my 1st sip of coffee.
You're in a tough situation. Seems there is little choice but to sit it out and wait for the market to recover. Being forced into retirement is not fun but look at as an opportunity to do something different. Shouldn't take long for the market to recover. Election years are great that way.
Sure, we can have some Chithead talk at the cookout next Friday, especially since we'll both be wearing our Chithead-wear (Honda shirts)! ;D
First Bear Stearns, then Fannie/Freddie, Now Lehman and Merril Lynch, soon AIG and Washington Mutual! All these brilliant capitalists with the benign neglect from the Bush whitehouse have brought the financial institutions to their knees by their greed and incompetence. Taxpayers have been put on the hook for about $400 b already in rescuing some of these institutions. And all you geniuses want to elect McCain whose chief financial guru said America was in a "mental recession", who himself said he "doesnt understand the economy very well". Between just the firms I listed above, there will be approximately 60k jobs lost in the next 60 days. Oh yeah, somehow someone will blame the democrats for exerting bad karma over GWB's ability to govern! Unemployment has gone from 4% to 6.1% and rising, dollar has been devalued by 40%, surplus's have become massive deficits, your 401k is tanking and we want to give the republicans another 4 years?
Anyone who has ridden a motorcycle in less than 40 states is a pansy!
Hey Howie. I think that dino oil is absolute crap and you're a total freaking moron for ever switching out the synthetic. Unless it works. Then you were a total freaking moron for using the overpriced synthetic crap to begin with. And, by the way, you're ugly and Binx dresses you funny. Any more thoughts on the controls for Joy?
Well lets not talk about how Clinton signed in the NAFTA. That has nothing to do with how the economy is doing. Lets also not talk about how Mr. Clinton opened up our borders and let all of these terrorist in and even helped pay for their training to learn fly 2 planes into the Twin Towers and 1 into The Pentagon and a 4th plane they had to shoot down to stop another attack on Washington DC.Good Morning Mike ;)
There is no need trying to put blame on the Republicans or the Democrats. All Politicians SUCK!!!!!
How can you tell if a Politician is lying????? Their lips are moving!!!!!
It is not a perfect world. Suck it up!!!!
Be Safe
THE DAWG
Good Morning Mike ;)[/color]
[/color]
Sorry Howie JUST VENTING!!!!!!
Came into work this morning and walked into a knife fight at 0530hrs. One transported to the Hospital and one on Admin leave!!!!!
What a way to start your day.
Oh YES they were both employees!!!!!!!
Be Safe
THE DAWG
...................Now although I am not a financial expert I do work at a Financial Services firm. Let me sum up. If you regulate the market, we all lose. If you deregulate the market most of us lose in the short term. If you elect a republican - no change. If you elect a democrat - no change. If you wait patiently, invest prudently over the long term, You make a little bit. No one get's rich. No one get's poor. Only those near retirement ultimatly suffer in these panic driven market fluctuations... Oh yeah, we ride Harley's so we're all old and near retirement. AAAAAYYYYYY run for the hills. Get the guns. SELL SELL SELL Mortimar.
Invest Safe,
J-Carr
As noted by DCFIREMANN, if a politician's lips are moving, he's lying. As a matter of fact, if a politician is just breathing he's most likely thinking about lying. So yes, I agree that it makes little difference who we elect anymore. However, I don't believe regulation causes everyone to lose. For instance, regulations dealing with lending practices were obviously needed to counter the short term greed displayed by those running the mortgage industry as well as the opportunists on Wall Street who enabled them. The little guys inevitably lose, since the big guys are supposedly smart enough and tuned in enough to move their millions elsewhere. I've watched 20% of my 401k disappear over the past 10 months, after years of rebuilding it from the losses of the last bubble economy, and I'm starting to get just a little pi$$ed about following all the advice they hand out to the little guys like me and watching it all snatched away time and again. It's becoming easier for me to understand those folks from the 1930's who just stuffed their money in a mattress. Didn't make any interest that way, but by the same token they didn't have any shyster's in three piece business attire (or politicians) stealing it either.
Jerry
"I've watched 20% of my 401k disappear over the past 10 months, after years of rebuilding it from the losses of the last bubble economy, and I'm starting to get just a little pi$$ed about following all the advice they hand out to the little guys like me and watching it all snatched away time and again. It's becoming easier for me to understand those folks from the 1930's who just stuffed their money in a mattress."
Time and again....The Ahole from the Lehman that just finished rubbin the firm into the ground has moved into a little beach shack up on the Island, 10 mil.
Poor bastard has felt the sting of the real estate bubble, his NYC apartment is only worth 9 mil, he joint in Conn down to 12 and his place in Idaho on 8...milion that is..
How do you regulate that kind of thievery???
IROAR, will offer the time and respect of one direct response to this thread. Neal, of course, nailed what was going on 100%. To fully detail the subject though the nature of the response was even more to the tone of how the topic was started than the topic itself. That should have been obvious.
Had it been an even moderately thoughtful mention of issues in yesterday's and the recent weeks and months market and other financial troubles nothing would have happened. We are bright people here capable of having intelligent well minded discussions on a regular basis. And we do. We're also bright enough to be bored chitless by drivel.
What was started was not a high minded discussion of financial foibles. It was a barely-sensical kvetch about administrations and campaigns when everyone realizes that though they get credit and blame for the economy writ large the White House really does not control it. The thread title might as well have been "I want to bitch about Bush and McCain and this is the reason I'm picking today." I saw it and suffered an aneurism. Or had the thought "chit, not another thread like that; isn't enough freaking enough." The two feel the same.
Given the totality of the response numbers suggest most others felt the same. And, believe me, I'd have felt exactly the same way if it'd been a thread bitching about Obama and the legislature. Enough is enough. We've had good people here saying spurious things to other good people. Insults have been real. Enough is enough.
If a discussion of the state of the economy among a bunch of gear heads is important to you go start one. If it's legimately offered it won't get... um... any more slightly sidetracked than any other tread.
Rather than having to watch a potential train wreck and once again see friends picking at friends over nonsense you are right. I purposefully derailed the thread. With ill intent toward no one. With ill word not spoken to anyone. With not a shot fired that wasn't in jest. Isn't that really a better alternative in this venue than yet another thread about whether some Democrat's daddy can beat up some Republican's?
Having asked that question in closing I'll also say I really am unconcerned about the answer. As long as we're not bitching at one another I'm satisfied. That's the end of my part of any serious discussion here.
Don,
I agree with most everything you said in support of your decision to dilute, obscure or whatever you wish to call the effect of your actions. However, we already have published rules for posting which we all agreed to abide by as a condition to membership. You have added an additional layer of requirements which are based on the specific subjective judgments you employed in making the call to hijack the thread. Again, I agree that the choice of words and phrases suggested the thread was going to go downhill fast; but, I thought the mods should, under the rules of the cite, step in if appropriate.
If each of us employs our own individual smell test and then decides to take action we end up with many different standards for posting which can't be a good thing in the long run.
November 4th will soon be here and with it the collective BP of this cite will diminish. Then we can all get back to bitchin about the quality of the MOCO products.
Friendship, Brotherhood and Motorcycles forever.
:2vrolijk_21: Well said. If each of us decides to apply his or her own standards to each thread, and then hijack the ones we don't like, this place is going to go straight in the dumper. For instance, I've never cared much for Softails, so I guess I could highjack all the Softail threads. Of course, the Softail guys would most likely retaliate by highjacking the threads I do like.
Stick to the rules of posting and let the mods decide which, if any, posts or threads get the heave-ho. If the membership wants to start it's own censorship through highjack, then we at least need to have equal representation. Highjacking just the threads that attack the Shrub and his rich cronies, or that support a more liberal view in general, is just a tad highhanded in my opinion. If it's going to be mob rule, we should at least agree to import enough liberals and moderates to make it a fair fight.
Jerry
........................ Then everyone can go back to blaming me for everything again, ........................
Hoist! 8)
Friendship, Brotherhood and Motorcycles forever.
I wasn't aware that we ever stopped that. :nixweiss:
Jerry ;)
What is sad is that much of this mess we're in right now could have been prevented with a little regulation of the financial markets/companies. No political sides taken in this statement, but McCain said Monday that the economy was "fundamentally sound", then changed the tune the next day to "some regulation may be needed", when the government (taxpayers) had to bail out AIG to the tune of serveral tens of billions.
The foxes have been guarding the chickens for too long, and now the chickens are running around without heads.
And you can't blame the average citizen for taking a sub prime loan when offered. These are not dumb people that were taking the loans, but were being advised to "invest" their money into a home that was too big for them, as they were being told it would do nothing but increase in value and they'd have no trouble making a profit or refinancing "by the time the ARM jumps up".
What is sad is that much of this mess we're in right now could have been prevented with a little regulation of the financial markets/companies. No political sides taken in this statement, but McCain said Monday that the economy was "fundamentally sound", then changed the tune the next day to "some regulation may be needed", when the government (taxpayers) had to bail out AIG to the tune of serveral tens of billions.
The foxes have been guarding the chickens for too long, and now the chickens are running around without heads.
And you can't blame the average citizen for taking a sub prime loan when offered. These are not dumb people that were taking the loans, but were being advised to "invest" their money into a home that was too big for them, as they were being told it would do nothing but increase in value and they'd have no trouble making a profit or refinancing "by the time the ARM jumps up".
I'm with SADUNBAR on this one.
I also am not the brightest bulb on the tree so when I read money advice I check out the one giving it and see how financially solid their house is.
So many are eager to announce "this is what you need to do" but upon close inspection their own finances are in shambles.
So who do you follow, the guy that talks good advice or the guy that lives it.
It's an easy decision for me!
:2vrolijk_21:
If you can't afford it you don't buy it. Simple rule to live by.
B B
So who do you follow, the guy that talks good advice or the guy that lives it.
It's an easy decision for me!
Add my voice to the two above.
The same people who preach to the small investor to ride out the storm are the one's causing the crash by selling.
They want us to stay in so they can recover some of their losses from us.
If the big guys practiced what they preached, there wouldn't be a crash.
Stocks go up when more people want to buy than there are shares available. They go down when there's more sellers than buyers.
As to people buying more house than they need because the back would finance it, that's about as dumb as it gets.
You buy what you can afford and if some of your "friends" look down on you for having a smaller house etc than them, you get new friends not a bigger house. Same goes for cars, motorcycles, boats whatever. If you can't afford it you don't buy it. Simple rule to live by.
B B
My car is 6 years old, Nancy's is 4.
Like the song says...'and the man in the suit has just bought a new car, on the profit he made from your dreams...'
That's not my point, and I'm not disagreeing with anyone at a personal level...I too could have bought way more house than I could have even afforded to furnish. However, most of us here are at least 40+ years old, and grew up with a different mindset regarding these kinds of things. I'm generalizing here, but take a young family in their late 20's or 30's (different generation), making a good living, out looking for perhaps their second home for their growing family. They get "pre-approved" for a mortgage that is 2 times what they thought they could be approved for. They get emotionally involved in the house. They are not dumb people, or they would not have the good jobs they have. They have every reason to think their income will be increasing over the next 3-5 years, which happens to be the time frame for most ARM's. Their parents may even live the high life, so why shouldn't they try to get there too? They can afford the house payment at 3%, so they sign on the dotted line. Their future's so bright, they have to wear shades. Then the unthinkable happens...the housing bubble bursts, financial institutions, because they have not had any real "rules" to follow, collapse. They cannot sell the home. The ARM matures and now their house is at 7% and their payment has jumped by 1K or more per month. They are screwed. Bad decisions? In hindsight, yes. But everybody else was doing it, and they were caught up in the moment. I'm not saying they were smart for doing what they did either. They were caught up in the dream.
If the institutions who were lending the money had not made this possible because the standards were so loose, with little if any verification of income, and frankly not caring whether the customer could afford the REAL interest rate when it came due, because even if they foreclosed, the house would be worth more than they had invested. Pop goes the bubble, and everyone is screwed except the one's who took the money and ran. All their employees get screwed too. And worst of all, we as taxpayers get screwed, because who is going to pay for the whole mess? WE ARE!
Like the song says...'and the man in the suit has just bought a new car, on the profit he made from your dreams...'
My car is 6 years old, Nancy's is 4.
Don't you have a new car?
:nixweiss: :nixweiss: :nixweiss:
Chip, don't make this personal, man. I got a new car for financial reasons that are my personal business.
I'm just making an attempt at saying that not every person walking around out there is always logical, rational, and that some regulation of greedy people is not a bad thing. Not OVER regulation...just some rules, that's all.
'and the man in the suit has just bought a new car, on the profit he made from your dreams...'
Nothing personal there Terry but you talk so much about the housing industy and the auto industry is doing the same thing.
When an "up" walks through the door the goal is to sell a car. Have income #'s been inflated? Or can that person really afford that new Escalade?
It's a sale man and that is what counts.
Nothing personal but you post,
Your post was basically right on, then you add the part about someone with a new car purchased on someone's dreams.
Don't flatter yourself thinking it's personal but clearly there are no new cars purchased here based on someone's dreams.
:2vrolijk_21: :2vrolijk_21:
The interesting thing to me about all the financial meltdown is that very few people mention the root cause of the explosive pop in this recent asset bubble (caused by subprime and soon to go into chimerical real estate and credit cards depending on the extent of the recession) and that is the ridiculous amount of leverage that these firms were using to buy the subprime and other notes. Lehman 30-1, Fannie and Freddy 70-1, most banks are 20-1. With those types of leverage, it takes so little to wipe out the equity. People just went crazy with greed and cheap money provided by the Fed and promoted by Congress. Cheap money in combination with people who were not frugal and thrift who used leverage and you have a recipe for disaster. We are a nation of consumers using borrowed money with very little savings - so this recession is going to be painful and force America to retrench and make some hard decisions.
For those of us with savings and low leverage, we just have to grind out this likely to be very long recession, lower our expenses and hope that our savings aren't too deflated by higher taxes on capital and inflation (two things that you can bet your life are going to happen).
Free
After careful consideration,, I have decided that I still like pudding.
Chocolate & banana mostly, but other kinds are ok too.
Tapioca, fresh and warm here. I prefer flan though
Flan...... ok, I like flan too. Have not had any tapioca for a while. Bread pudding is excellent, also.
Forgot about bread..... dayum..... Yup, bread too, warm, with bourbon and cream
I read this entire thread, Whew.....
I can name that tune in one word.
Greed
Good night all
Can I get an Amen?
!
Forgot about bread..... dayum..... Yup, bread too, warm, with bourbon and cream
Homemade Jello Chocolate pudding, lick the pot and spoon after cooking and pouring in bowls. Then chill and get that nice crust on the top. Mmmmmm! My favorite part!!! :huepfenjump3:
Hoist! 8)
whatz the recipe
I am happy to be overwirght in jnj and brkb lately...Even a blind mouse finds a piece of cheese now and then.And some pork skin and hot sauce and ... :huepfenlol2: :huepfenlol2: :huepfenlol2:
Yup, sometimes there is just too much month left at the end of the money.
Fundsalow..
Fun money has depleted even though I sold off boats, cars, bikes, campers, not out finacial distress just the old "too much stuff" rule...I have some real estate in north Fla but the taxes have 3x'ed and I know for sure in this market climate, it ain't gonna sell...Gaaa!
since there has been some serious discussion going on here, i'll add my personal experience.
6 yrs ago when we bought our house our combined income was 20-30% higher then it is today
cost of living at an avg of +3% /yr means my bills have increased by at least 20% in that same time
6 yrs ago we could live within our means while paying down vehicle loans that we no longer have.
we were not dumb borrowers no ARM here. and no complaints with the rate we are paying.
dont see any new vehicles in the family future.
do see college payments coming up in the near term. :nervous:
thats just where my family is at today. i'm not gonna blame anyone, not gonna tell my government to do something about it. we'll keep working hard and paying our bills, and try to keep the CC balances to a minimum.
since there has been some serious discussion going on here, i'll add my personal experience.
6 yrs ago when we bought our house our combined income was 20-30% higher then it is today
cost of living at an avg of +3% /yr means my bills have increased by at least 20% in that same time
6 yrs ago we could live within our means while paying down vehicle loans that we no longer have.
we were not dumb borrowers no ARM here. and no complaints with the rate we are paying.
dont see any new vehicles in the family future.
do see college payments coming up in the near term. :nervous:
thats just where my family is at today. i'm not gonna blame anyone, not gonna tell my government to do something about it. we'll keep working hard and paying our bills, and try to keep the CC balances to a minimum.
A suppository for bad debt
Terry
Can I ask a personal question ?
Do you have a bunch of money invested in a variety of financial instruments or are you simply participating in this discussion from a philisophical standpoint ?
B B
B B...I've never in my lifetime been fortunate enough to have enough money to invest in the stock market, other than through TIAA-CREF, or because my ex was a trust officer for a very large bank, and I gained a bit of knowledge through osmosis. I have a meager state pension and am still working.
Most of my comments are from a philisophical point of view, just to add a different perspective, as I've been at both ends of the spectrum.
Basically, I'm just an old, Happy Hippie, if that lends any qualitative assistance.
With the fiduciary responsibilities I took on recently with my Mom's affairs and my own investments, I'm into numbers high enough that the recent losses in the market have been painful, very painful. No disrespect intended here, but I'm looking for words of wisdom from folks who are actually losing money as I am and not discussion from somebody with no stake in the game.
B B
With the fiduciary responsibilities I took on recently with my Mom's affairs and my own investments, I'm into numbers high enough that the recent losses in the market have been painful, very painful. No disrespect intended here, but I'm looking for words of wisdom from folks who are actually losing money as I am and not discussion from somebody with no stake in the game.
B B
I thought this was the chocolate pudding thread! :confused5: :nixweiss: :nixweiss: :nixweiss: ;D ;)
Hoist! 8)
I thought this was the chocolate pudding thread! :confused5: :nixweiss: :nixweiss: :nixweiss: ;D ;)
Hoist! 8)
Yeah, what's with all the thread jacking to $$$$ talk? :soapbox:
B B...I've never in my lifetime been fortunate enough to have enough money to invest in the stock market, other than through TIAA-CREF, or because my ex was a trust officer for a very large bank, and I gained a bit of knowledge through osmosis. I have a meager state pension and am still working.
Most of my comments are from a philisophical point of view, just to add a different perspective, as I've been at both ends of the spectrum.
Basically, I'm just an old, Happy Hippie, if that lends any qualitative assistance.
Well I have just sat back and watched the market. Till last night. Then I got on line a checked to see where I am in all of this BS that is going on. I have lost almost 40%, but plan to leave everything where it is. I will be 55 in a couple of weeks so if I wanted to cash out now it would cost me out the A$$. In a couple of weeks though it may be a different story!!!!
BB I feel your pain. The only Good thing I have going for me is my GREAT District of Columbia Retirement Plan. It too is backed by the the FEDS!!!!!!
life goes on AND IT IS TIME TO RIDE!!!!
BTW has anyone looked at the weather for the MV weekend. it is getting closer and they are calling for rain!!!!!!
Be Safe
THE DAWG
Have a safe trip Howie, I'll be logging on to the web tune....
Can we talk about gum now? I like Juicy Fruit & Double Bubble.
That's about it Mike! Long term $$$! Let it ride! And LET'S RIDE!!!:morningcoffee: It's just gettin' comfy up here now. the v-twins love this weather :huepfenlol2:
And it was 38 when I got up. I'm in MA and leaving for Augusta shortly! Waiting for a bit of warmth right now! Forgot there's only 3 seasons up here, July, August, and WINTER!!! It's a damn frozen tundra!!! Prolly at freezing in ME. Leaving bet 8-9 now! FTC!!! ;D ;D ;D ;)
Hoist! 8)
With the fiduciary responsibilities I took on recently with my Mom's affairs and my own investments, I'm into numbers high enough that the recent losses in the market have been painful, very painful. No disrespect intended here, but I'm looking for words of wisdom from folks who are actually losing money as I am and not discussion from somebody with no stake in the game.Bryan, In last 10 years, I have lost almost everything 3 times. I've been able to recover 2 times and now this my third losing round and hoping that I can survive.
B B
Band aid on a tumor as they say....Or Lipstick on a Pig!
Or Lipstick on a Pig!
Did I mention that it was 43 deg. when I left the house this morning. It was cold on the bike and even with a 3/4 helmet, the cold air felt like a frozen knife on my neck. :huepfenlol2: :huepfenlol2:
61 in lovely Jacksonville and I froze my Florida ass off...Watch out for Hypothermia man .. :2vrolijk_29: :2vrolijk_29:
I HATE COLD!
Sean
Watch out for Hypothermia man .. :2vrolijk_29: :2vrolijk_29:
Its all relative... You yanks can have the cold, I'll take hot any day!46 here, prrrfct 110 weather :2vrolijk_21:
83 with thunderstorms...it is starting to get cool in the morning, the mini season will soon be here...:sauer021: :sauer021: :sauer021:
46 here, prrrfct 110 weather :2vrolijk_21:
46 here, prrrfct 110 weather :2vrolijk_21:
With the fiduciary responsibilities I took on recently with my Mom's affairs and my own investments, I'm into numbers high enough that the recent losses in the market have been painful, very painful. No disrespect intended here, but I'm looking for words of wisdom from folks who are actually losing money as I am and not discussion from somebody with no stake in the game.
B B
another thing to think about is only invest in what you know.
some hotshot analyst might say that Widget Co. is the next great investment.
but if you dont know anything about Widgets you have to take their word for it.
i tend to invest in companies that are in the same industry as my own. i can look at their press releases and new products and make my own self educated guess as to wether or not i think there is potential there
Watch out for a big sell off at the open. :confused5:
My newly installed, new design heated grips were needed this morning here in NoFl. It was 75 degrees!
seems about right...
I hope they work until the main w----ty runs out, at least.
On frigid mornings like these, warm fingers are important.......
Below 80 you really gotta watch out for frost bite...
Yeah, it's going to drop into the 60's here before long.
Riding last night the air was crisp & I only hit 43,753 love bugs.
so you missed most of them...good on ya.
And to clarify a very bad rumor, they were not an experiment by the UNIVERSITY OF FLORIDA (GO GATORS KICK THE CRAP OUT OF THE VOLS) gone awry...
GO GATORS
Arrrrggggghhhhh
so you missed most of them...good on ya.
And to clarify a very bad rumor, they were not an experiment by the UNIVERSITY OF FLORIDA (GO GATORS KICK THE CRAP OUT OF THE VOLS) gone awry...
GO GATORS
Arrrrggggghhhhh
easy now, the VOLS are at there best when doubted.
i hope Urban Meyer understands. :coolblue:
waiting to hear some rocky top!
over
TN
TN 35 - FL 21
Where did I put my tire jack???
Oh.... that wouldn't do for thread jacking, now would it??? :huepfenlol2:
Aye! An you be a jackazz to boot me hearty!(http://baysideproducts.com/store/images/victoria_cheval_mirror.jpg)
Aye! An you be a jackazz to boot me hearty!
I guess you really couldn't jack this thread much more then it was from about Post #2 on...
I have a J & S jack!
Did your's have a 384 price tag? :nervous:
bit less...they offer a 5% military discount. Being cannon fodder has its benefits from time to time.
OK...who's old enough to remember the x rated comic books back in the very early 70's? One of them was about a pirate ship with a Captain Pissgums...aaaaaarrrrrhhhhhggggg, crank my tool, matey
Zap comix.....
I got caught in school with some...
(http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y129/IguessImjustalame/tomphone3.jpg)
Tom's good to go - on the NRA board of directors.
Even at Howie speed???
Aye, that be them, matey...also Felix The Cat was another.Don't forget Tennessee Tuxedo .. :carrot:
Used to get an illegal grin and laugh my ass off at those comix...
Aye, that be them, matey...also Felix The Cat was another.
Used to get an illegal grin and laugh my ass off at those comix...
You mean Fritz the Cat? ???Felix was older than Fritz ... ;)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fritz_the_Cat
Don't forgt these guys! Fabulous Furry Freak Brothers! ;D ;)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fabulous_Furry_Freak_Brothers
Hoist! 8)
You mean Fritz the Cat? ???Nice try Howie with "wikipedia" as if you are not old enough to remember .. :huepfenlol2: :huepfenlol2: :huepfenlol2:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fritz_the_Cat
Don't forgt these guys! Fabulous Furry Freak Brothers! ;D ;)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fabulous_Furry_Freak_Brothers
Hoist! 8)
Nice try Howie with "wikipedia" as if you are not old enough to remember .. :huepfenlol2: :huepfenlol2: :huepfenlol2:
Nice try Howie with "wikipedia" as if you are not old enough to remember .. :huepfenlol2: :huepfenlol2: :huepfenlol2:
easy now, the VOLS are at there best when doubted.
i hope Urban Meyer understands. :coolblue:
waiting to hear some rocky top!
over
TN
TN 35 - FL 21
BB
I'm somewhat n your situation, lost both my parents last year. Got the inheritance, all invested in various things. Dad always played with it, but never did much. Over the years, what i learned from watching the markets is to never really fear a big drop. If anything, I'd like to get enough cash saved up to welcome a big drop. Buy it at that time and then cash out as it recovers. I'm not too far away from that now, probably another year or so. The market ALWAYS recovers! There's too many people with their lives invested in the markets to allow them to plummet and stay there. Hell we're almost back to the point we were last week, before this all started. It ain't even been a week yet. It'll be up over 12k before the end of the month. May not stay there, but it will cross the line.
jm.02
oh yeah, to really jack the thread www.ratemyboobs.com
Aren't many of the things traded nothing but mutual funds full of foreign stocks? Nobody said you had to stay with internal investments. I agree that the foreign stuff is better currently. When the US does take a hit in 100 years or so, the whole world is going to take the same hit.
Aren't many of the things traded nothing but mutual funds full of foreign stocks? Nobody said you had to stay with internal investments. I agree that the foreign stuff is better currently. When the US does take a hit in 100 years or so, the whole world is going to take the same hit.
You put Vagabond in a tight range there...
He's old enough to have seen them for also old enough to not remember it!
maybe i am a pessimist but i just am not bullish long term on the US market. We produce less and less things that the world wants, we are not savers but spenders, we are the largest debtor in the world and we cant stop spending ahead or revenues. i just dont see how that bodes well for the US dollar. Right now the Fed has the printing press working 24/7 and each dollar that comes off that press makes each dollar i own worth less. i have been putting my 401k in emerging markets and commodities (including gold and silver). In the short term, its hard to know what to do and there will certainly be lots of volitility BUT in the long run, there are fundamental problems that all point to a collapse in the dollar and long term inflation. So, maybe you can make money in the US equity markets but the question will be what that money will be worth in purchasing power. i dont have the answers but i can read a balance sheet and know that the US is broke and lots of promises our government is making are not going to be met.
Free
If and I repeat IF I went liquid right now I'd be down close to $400k . Anyone want to ask why I'm chitfaced long about now
B B
OK...who's old enough to remember the x rated comic books back in the very early 70's? One of them was about a pirate ship with a Captain Pissgums...aaaaaarrrrrhhhhhggggg, crank my tool, matey
Not easy to get locally, but we found a few anyway. Some were really funny & figure some of those writers went mainstream - SNL, Second City maybe?Makes one wonder if the players that a hand in the meltdown are the same players buying??? :nixweiss:
For those watching the market & our govt. throwing a trillion or so into propping it up, the Dow was down only 34 points last week. Dow was UP 40 over the past month. So basically, the Dow is where it was in mid August right now.
Makes one wonder if the players that a hand in the meltdown are the same players buying??? :nixweiss:
Excellent point.The big boys on the street have a WAR CHEST behind them. It goes down, they pump in more money and lower their average and bring it back up, it goes up when they are short, they short more and kill it. :whip:
Some folks made a LOT of money this week.
Unfortunately, I was not one of them.
Don't do it. Ride the storm. You might not lose as much if any. And it will stabilize. :2vrolijk_21:
I still have all of my holdings in the same financial instruments as always this morning and have a nasty hangover too
B B
Its easy to get comfort from short term swings in the market. You can usually look at numbers and say this week is better than last week. In the short term, you can torture the numbers until they start to sing, but in the long term, the numbers cant be rationalized away. The longer term trends (last 7 to 10 years) are incredibly disturbing. We have built up all this "wealth" - not on productivity but on paper gains and borrowings and turned that around to buy consumer goods. Credit card debt and commercial real estate will be the next cards to fall and then the US could go into a sustained long-term recession. If home prices are falling, then its only a matter of time for commercial real estate to fall. Lenders were making commercial loans with the same zeal as the home lenders, creating rising prices. With a recession, businesses will pull back due to lower demand and those strip malls will start to fail and those new high rises will not be filled.Hard to compete with Chines. And as long as INS issuing work visas to Indians who come over and work as consultants... chit, don't get me started on that .. :argue:
So, then the question is - what is going to bring us out of this recession/meltdown this time? I think we have to go back to actually producing things that the world wants (thats the only thing that makes sense to me). We have given up high paying manufacturing jobs for low paying service jobs over the past 15 years. I still maintain that this time it is different because the fundamentals of our balance sheet are so different from what they have ever been. hope i am wrong
Free
The big boys on the street have a WAR CHEST behind them. It goes down, they pump in more money and lower their average and bring it back up, it goes up when they are short, they short more and kill it. :whip:
We are the unfortunate ones, when it goes down, we don't have any more to out in.
And in cases like me (using margin), the down side is more radical and because of the margin call, I can't stay in any more. :wall:
Just sharing my saga because it's cheaper to learn from other's mistakes. :gossip:
you are either really smart or really dumb, investing in puts and calls in this market might as well take the bundle to Atlantic city. that way the win or loss is even faster....
I do not have the balls or stomach to play the margin game.
On the news early this morning. The Government is working on a 700 BILLION deal to try to salvage the economy. Damn now who is going to pay for that??????
Be Safe
THE DAWG
The best part Mike is that you can normally double anything they claim; if they admit to $700B it means over $1T in reality. We can add that unfunded trillion liability to the other trillion for the Iraq war, also unfunded, and we are starting to get into some fairly serious debt even before you look at the other trillion's in accumulated debt. If the Fed prints their way out of this, we all pay big time through inflation. Of course, we could mortgage even more of our country to the Chinese, assuming they want it. Isn't it funny, the same borrow and spend philosophy that got us into this mess will be the governments answer to getting out of it? Maybe that's why so many people thought borrow and spend was a good idea, they've been watching Uncle play that game for a long time.
Keeping with the the modern traditions of this country, what I want to know is "What's in it for me". It appears that before it's over Uncle will be bailing out everyone in this country who made bad decisions on debt or even those who cheated to pad their pockets. How about those of us who aren't in debt and who didn't participate in the general screwing of America? Shouldn't we get a little sugar too, since we and our descendent's will be the ones bailing everyone else out?
Jerry
The best part Mike is that you can normally double anything they claim; if they admit to $700B it means over $1T in reality. We can add that unfunded trillion liability to the other trillion for the Iraq war, also unfunded, and we are starting to get into some fairly serious debt even before you look at the other trillion's in accumulated debt. If the Fed prints their way out of this, we all pay big time through inflation. Of course, we could mortgage even more of our country to the Chinese, assuming they want it. Isn't it funny, the same borrow and spend philosophy that got us into this mess will be the governments answer to getting out of it? Maybe that's why so many people thought borrow and spend was a good idea, they've been watching Uncle play that game for a long time.That's the thing that gives me the most dissapointment in this entire mess. Couple of years ago when I knew I was going to have my hip replaced which would mean I wouldn't be working anymore OT, and wouldn't be working my part-time jobs I financially prepared myself for a decrease in income. I paid off CC's, and all other small loans (cars/motorcycle, etc), and then adjusted my lifestyle to the new income. Now it looks like I'm going to be paying for all those that didn't have the common sense to do this on their own. :sauer005:
Keeping with the the modern traditions of this country, what I want to know is "What's in it for me". It appears that before it's over Uncle will be bailing out everyone in this country who made bad decisions on debt or even those who cheated to pad their pockets. How about those of us who aren't in debt and who didn't participate in the general screwing of America? Shouldn't we get a little sugar too, since we and our descendent's will be the ones bailing everyone else out?
Jerry
What about the trillion for Freddie Mac and Fanny Mae ? The Bushies are spending more money in their last six months than they did in the previous 7.5 years. The mess we're in now was a result of those past failed policies and now what ?
Can you speak Chinese ?
B B
That's the thing that gives me the most dissapointment in this entire mess. Couple of years ago when I knew I was going to have my hip replaced which would mean I wouldn't be working anymore OT, and wouldn't be working my part-time jobs I financially prepared myself for a decrease in income. I paid off CC's, and all other small loans (cars/motorcycle, etc), and then adjusted my lifestyle to the new income. Now it looks like I'm going to be paying for all those that didn't have the common sense to do this on their own. :sauer005:
:pumpkin:
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
:fireman:
I hear you, Gary...
I have never relied on massive amounts of debt and credit to live my life. In over thirty years of owning cars, I have only had two or three auto loans. I paid cash for the rest. I have never borrowed money for a toy (including my motorcycles). I have purchased 4 homes in my life. Each was paid off before buying the next. Mortgage payments were always double or triple or quadrouple - whatever I could manage - so I could pay off the mortgages as soon as possible. I never wanted a level of debt to dictate my employment and earning level. I wanted my job to be what I wanted to do, not what I had to do. I have never had to fear losing a job or changing a job because of debt. Thanks to my advice and encouragement from my grandfather, I started investing in stocks and bonds when I was still in high school. I have been fiscally responsible in my personal life and in my business life since day one.
So to see the financial mess the country is in - driven by people living far beyond their means and greedy unethical lenders, along with incredibly poor oversight by our government is disgusting and disappointing. I have little sympathy for those caught up in this crisis. They all made decisions and choices that - unfortunately - we all will pay for - for a very long time.
That's the thing that gives me the most dissapointment in this entire mess. Couple of years ago when I knew I was going to have my hip replaced which would mean I wouldn't be working anymore OT, and wouldn't be working my part-time jobs I financially prepared myself for a decrease in income. I paid off CC's, and all other small loans (cars/motorcycle, etc), and then adjusted my lifestyle to the new income. Now it looks like I'm going to be paying for all those that didn't have the common sense to do this on their own. :sauer005:How is it different than unemployment tax that goes to mostly (probably over 95%) lazy a$$es that don't wanna work?
:pumpkin:
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
:fireman:
How is it different than unemployment tax that goes to mostly (probably over 95%) lazy a$$es that don't wanna work?You have to have worked and lost your job to collect unemployment tax (http://www.irs.gov/businesses/small/international/article/0,,id=104985,00.html), and employers pay into that fund.
:deal2: :furious2: :beadyeyes: :lipsrsealed2:
I said this on another thread awhile back. It would seem that the folks in charge of managing the Fed as well as the world bank are not concerned with the USA being somewhere around 4 or 5 Trillion in debt. So I ask myself why should I ?
B B
I said this on another thread awhile back. It would seem that the folks in charge of managing the Fed as well as the world bank are not concerned with the USA being somewhere around 4 or 5 Trillion in debt. So I ask myself why should I ?
B B
Four to five $T? Current legislated debit limit is $10.6T and part of the new bill that will be pending next week will be a raise to that limit of $11.3T or more.
Sorry
I guess I was just adding up the spending spree that started with fiscal year 08
Of course I knew one of you would correct me. I'm what they refer to in show business as the "set-up guy "
Bada Boom
B B
Actually DC Bush the elder was responsible for NAFTA, Slick Willie climbed aboard that bus which is how the two of them became cordial enough to work together for Katrina relief.
B B
Actually Brian Mr Clinton signed the NAFTA agreement into law!!!!! I think Mr. Clinton also made the statement that everyone should own a house. I think we are getting ready to pay for that one also.
Be Safe
THE DAWG
Confusion comes from the fact that Bush signed the treaty, and Clinton signed the actual bill. Following from wikipedia:
NAFTA was initially pursued by politicians in the United States and Canada supportive of free trade, led by Canadian Prime Minister Brian Mulroney, U.S. President George H. W. Bush, and the Mexican President Carlos Salinas de Gortari. The three countries signed NAFTA in December 1992, subject to ratification by the legislatures of the three countries. There was considerable opposition in all three countries. In the United States, NAFTA was able to secure passage after Bill Clinton made its passage a major legislative priority in 1993. Since the agreement had been signed by Bush under his fast-track prerogative, Clinton did not alter the original agreement, but complemented it with the aforementioned NAAEC and NAALC.
Jerry
You may respectfully retract previous erroneous statements on a one time free pass DC :P
B B
3 days away, and it ain't about chocolate pudding no more. Great! Don't have to look anymore now! 1 less thing to keep up with! ;)
Hoist! 8)
$11,300,000,000,000.00
>:(
They are going to kill this rally. Using it to cash out while encouraging investors to load up. IMO...they would never!! :huepfenlol2: :huepfenlol2: :huepfenlol2:
:nixweiss:
...they would never!! :huepfenlol2: :huepfenlol2: :huepfenlol2:
The market is on a wild ride. Energy prices (oil) is higher than it has been traditionally. Inflation is as inevitable as the recession. Officially we are not in recession, but emotionally we have been in 1 for about a year. Emotion controlling markets (also recession) is a dangerous game. The big money guys have shark blood in their veins, and little guys like me ride the waves they make. Wish I knew what the S & P would be on Dec. 31, 2008.....[/color]
[/color]
You ain't chittin iski, that's the day I have to decided whether to stay with my 401k or roll it into an IRA
B B
BB
Have several friends entering retirement this year. Each one is facing some tough decisions. Apparently as this baby boom generation retires, we will change the retirement market just as we changed the baby goods market when we were born, schools built as we got older, increase in houses built for our families, and so on due to the size of this population by age. I have a little over 10 years to work unless I get fed up sooner with it all. Do not envy you having to make these choices - to my way of thinking it's unfair when we work our whole life & invest like the supposed wise heads advise us and then we watch it evaporate while fat cat investment guys nearly bankrupt companies & get millions for parachutes. The companies they leave sell out & fire a huge percentage of the workforce & then these CEO's get another job making millions. And we watch our retirement plans change from fillet mignon to vienna sausages possibly.
Got off the subject on my rant there. In the other thread noticed you were looking for a retirement benefits/disability lawyer. Very good idea. Will cost some bucks but in the long run should be worthwhile. Do not know any lawyers in Cali - best of luck finding a very good one. Hope your back allows you to ride more than it has lately & sincerely hope you get this situation worked out to your benefit.
The plan for our nation to assume this massive debt is a huge shift in focus & scope & if done wisely it may well prevent a depression. Done poorly it could cause one. At this point it is not apparent which direction we are headed - hopefully it's upward & not downward for all our sakes.
Mike
Mike
Thanks for the kind words. I just got back from my Orthopedic's office. I had an appointment to get the paperwork filled out or me to collect my disability checks. I stated that I would undergo any test, any procedure necessary to ensure smooth processing of my claim. He told me I had nothing to worry about. The MRIs on file, xrays, etc etc , all in all 10 years worth of documentation on the onset and progression of my condition should be enough for anybody anywhere to approve payment.
I don't have a lot tied up in the 401k. I was too busy raising my girls and making sure they were prepared for the challenges of the 21st century, meaning far more education than a simple BA or BS. My wife and I had planned on going at the retirement funds whole Hog from age 55 to age 65. Since I'll be 55 this November, obviously, that plan hadn't gotten going full force as yet. We'll be ok though as I've always found ways to generate cash flow and will continue to do so. I'm more upset with seeing my Mom's investments drop 20% than my own. I've got time to see it through, she feels she doesn't and is very upset with the current state of things. (she worries about what she's leaving all of us) I tell her if she lives to 100 and leaves us nothing but sweet memories then she's lived a good life.
B B
I tell her if she lives to 100 and leaves us nothing but sweet memories then she's lived a good life. B B
Never met ya but look forward to some day. Maybe we can ride together & toast retiring.
Mike
Just an FYI!
I have met both of you and have mucho respect for both of you troublemakers!
:2vrolijk_21:
First Bear Stearns, then Fannie/Freddie, Now Lehman and Merril Lynch, soon AIG and Washington Mutual! All these brilliant capitalists with the benign neglect from the Bush whitehouse have brought the financial institutions to their knees by their greed and incompetence. Taxpayers have been put on the hook for about $400 b already in rescuing some of these institutions. And all you geniuses want to elect McCain whose chief financial guru said America was in a "mental recession", who himself said he "doesnt understand the economy very well". Between just the firms I listed above, there will be approximately 60k jobs lost in the next 60 days. Oh yeah, somehow someone will blame the democrats for exerting bad karma over GWB's ability to govern! Unemployment has gone from 4% to 6.1% and rising, dollar has been devalued by 40%, surplus's have become massive deficits, your 401k is tanking and we want to give the republicans another 4 years?
Only eight people in whole world understand whats going on at this time and six of them are democrats that what to give everyone something for their vote.
The glass stegil act that was repealed in 1999 is the under lying cause of this whole mess, it was enacted in 1930 to keep banks and investing firms separated, that's what caused the crash in 1929. 70 years later memories are short and most of the DEMS in 1999 voted to repeal it and signed by your shinning star Mr. Clinton!
I can not vote for Soma, I will vote for McCain because he will bring NEW folks into the Govt not reused folks from the Clinton and carter admin, BTDT.
If you think McCain will continue the policy's of the past 8 years then you are NOT thinking for yourself anyway. He will clean house and instill new crooks, but at least they will be new and NOT recycled.
My last haircut was too short.
I thought you may have stayed at Holiday Inn express last night...Do they give away free donuts???
Hair mousse is not the same stuff as the mousse they serve in restaurants.
Here's a view from a Wall Street insider who thinks a bailout is the wrong thing to do:Even the CEO of BB&T said it is the wrong thing to do to 'bail-out' a few of the banks that made bad investment decisions. That pretty much sums it up when even the solvent bankers start pubically saying how wrong this plan is......aaaaargh. spyder
http://www.marketwatch.com/news/story/letters-editor-bailout-un-american/story.aspx?guid={7CEB61F6-E939-4D46-961C-4EBC2AB5965A}&siteid=yahoomy
Jerry
Appears to be some sort of loan arrangement now instead of an equity stake arrangement. Loans could infuse enough cash to get the credit market re-started.
Nationalization of companies & businesses - even on a temporary basis with the fed. de facto running said entities is a VERY bad idea.
Our federal govt. is basically a big welfare bank at this point in time. Our taxes are used for corporate & social welfare programs to a very large extent and waste is the name of both games. Maybe we could give CEO's a plastic card with a balance renewed monthly like we do for food stamp folks? Lobbyists for social welfare & corporate welfare have the most clout in DC while we pay for the congressional largess of their influence.
Appears to be some sort of loan arrangement now instead of an equity stake arrangement. Loans could infuse enough cash to get the credit market re-started.
Nationalization of companies & businesses - even on a temporary basis with the fed. de facto running said entities is a VERY bad idea.
Our federal govt. is basically a big welfare bank at this point in time. Our taxes are used for corporate & social welfare programs to a very large extent and waste is the name of both games. Maybe we could give CEO's a plastic card with a balance renewed monthly like we do for food stamp folks? Lobbyists for social welfare & corporate welfare have the most clout in DC while we pay for the congressional largess of their influence.
I'm a firm believer in cutting out layers of wasteful bureaucracy. With that in mind, I propose that we just give the corporations the ability to print money on their own authority and cut out the middlemen. I'm sure they would never abuse that privilege, since they've proven time and again how we don't need to regulate their other activities.
Jerry
What does THAT have to do with pudding and thongs? :nixweiss:
I'm a firm believer in cutting out layers of wasteful bureaucracy. With that in mind, I propose that we just give the corporations the ability to print money on their own authority and cut out the middlemen. I'm sure they would never abuse that privelege, since they've proven time and again how we don't need to regulate their other activities.
Jerry
by the time it's all set and done, it'll be closer to $1.2 tri.
Just WaMu, BAC (for countrywide assets) and AIG will need around $300 Bil. :'( :'(
...................................Anyway, the real problem currently is "Who regulates the regulators?" And then who regulates the regulators that regulate the regulators that regulate the other regulators? If the regulators are payinglobbyingCongress & other politicians the day before they become regulators, it is doubtful they really want to regulate.
That's BS!!!! I say let them sink in their own SH$T!!!!!!!
I think I will go change my underwear now!!!! OPPS that was in another thread!
Be Safe
THE DAWG
Meanwhile back at the ranch, Tonto (cleverly disguised as a doornob) - - - - -- - The CEO of WaMu is being sent down the road - - - - - with a $13,000,000 severance pkg. I can't say in public how I'd deal with him
B B
makes as much since as any other plan i've heard.
in the beginning the federal reserve were gonna charge 11% on the 700 billion. that's alot of zeros on interest. over my head. :nervous:
us small business owners take the brunt and accountability.
scary times ahead
TN
Was watching Leno last night before bed...he was referencing (and making a joke) about some guy at one of the banks that is folding who was there for 17 DAYS and is getting a 20+ million severance package.I'm not sure that was a joke I believe I remember hearing something similar on the news yesterday. :nixweiss:
Excecutive compensation has gotten WAY the f out of hand, IMO. If a person invents a product or idea, markets it, and makes a chit load of money, that's one thing...but paying somebody to come into an excecutive position millions and millions of dollars, then paying them even more millions to LEAVE is f'd up. How much money is enough? How many friggin' houses does a person REALLY need? Who is really WORTH that kind of money, no matter what they know?
I know a little something about compensatory factors regarding positions, and there is no relationship between what some of these guys are being paid and true market value (though the market is artificially inflated because everybody is doing it). It's GREED, and it's wrong.
I'm not sure that was a joke I believe I remember hearing something similar on the news yesterday. :nixweiss:
:pumpkin:
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
:fireman:
Meanwhile back at the ranch, Tonto (cleverly disguised as a doornob) - - - - -- - The CEO of WaMu is being sent down the road - - - - - with a $13,000,000 severance pkg. I can't say in public how I'd deal with him
B B
Unfortunately that is right on target. The incestuous relationships in Washington have left us with nothing but foxes guarding the hen house, and no one is really held accountable for the screw-ups and outright thievery. The big question is, since the entire process is corrupt, how do we fix it? Does anyone really think Congress is going to clean up their own house? Seems to me that a clean start is needed, but short of throwing some tea in the harbor and declaring our independence again, how do we get there from here?
Jerry
Congress, investment bankers, and irresponsible home buyers have managed to do what terrorist couldn't do on 911, bring the American financial institutions to their knees!
Talon
Everyone dreams of owning their own home. Many people borrow by the philosophy that if the bank will approve the loan it must be ok. The subprime mortgage market was a case of pure greed on the part of investment bankers. I know it's easy for those of us with coventional mortages to point fingers at people who "had no business owning a home" but if you're a working mom and dad trying to do your best by your family and you get a chance to own a home and you jump at it, I don't think you're a bad person. An awful lot of these subprime mortages went to families where Mom and Pop worked two jobs each to try to pull it off. Yes, I think many of them realized that they'd bit off more than they could chew, but when you look at the way the wealthy walk away from their debts shielded by family trusts and layers of insulation from responsibility for businesses that they in fact outright own you have to ask yourself if you want to kick the little guy who only wanted a house or the big guys who wanted to toss another few million on their already bloated piles of money. All of this business about not allowing bankruptcy judges to rewrite mortgages is wrong in my opinion. A lot of these houses are on the lower end of the spectrum. Who's going to buy them ? In an economic downturn, the lower income earners will suffer the most, they always do, so again, who's going to buy te $80,000 house in Peoria or the double wide in Sanford Maine ? The best course of action here is to try to keep money coming in on those mortgages and I for one believe that the vast majority of working class Americans given a 2nd chance at hanging onto their house would do everything in their power to keep it. What's a bank holding company gonna do with that 2 bedroom ranch in Peoria ? What do the Amercian taxpayers do with a double wide in Sanford ? I haven't as yet read the details of this latest example of Wall Street feeding at the Hog Trough of the American working class, but I have no doubt that the WaMu CEO collecting his huge severance pkg is only the very tip of that iceberg. All of the so called negotiators at the forefront of this "deal" have deep ties to the Wall St fatcats.
B B
Talon
Everyone dreams of owning their own home. Many people borrow by the philosophy that if the bank will approve the loan it must be ok. The subprime mortgage market was a case of pure greed on the part of investment bankers. I know it's easy for those of us with coventional mortages to point fingers at people who "had no business owning a home" but if you're a working mom and dad trying to do your best by your family and you get a chance to own a home and you jump at it, I don't think you're a bad person. An awful lot of these subprime mortages went to families where Mom and Pop worked two jobs each to try to pull it off. Yes, I think many of them realized that they'd bit off more than they could chew, but when you look at the way the wealthy walk away from their debts shielded by family trusts and layers of insulation from responsibility for businesses that they in fact outright own you have to ask yourself if you want to kick the little guy who only wanted a house or the big guys who wanted to toss another few million on their already bloated piles of money. All of this business about not allowing bankruptcy judges to rewrite mortgages is wrong in my opinion. A lot of these houses are on the lower end of the spectrum. Who's going to buy them ? In an economic downturn, the lower income earners will suffer the most, they always do, so again, who's going to buy te $80,000 house in Peoria or the double wide in Sanford Maine ? The best course of action here is to try to keep money coming in on those mortgages and I for one believe that the vast majority of working class Americans given a 2nd chance at hanging onto their house would do everything in their power to keep it. What's a bank holding company gonna do with that 2 bedroom ranch in Peoria ? What do the Amercian taxpayers do with a double wide in Sanford ? I haven't as yet read the details of this latest example of Wall Street feeding at the Hog Trough of the American working class, but I have no doubt that the WaMu CEO collecting his huge severance pkg is only the very tip of that iceberg. All of the so called negotiators at the forefront of this "deal" have deep ties to the Wall St fatcats.
B B
bail out bill did not passA certain kiss of death was having Nancy Pelosi coming out yesterday saying a deal had been struck......
Maybe I'm a moron, I'm beginning to think so from the number of you who disgree with me that we (the government) should help people hang onto their houses by rewriting some of these mortages and insuring others. I just don't see how dumping thousands of homes into an already glutted marketplace is going to do anything but further the recession. The housing industry is a huge driver of our economy. Like I said, maybe I'm a moron because it just seems to me that if we (the taxpayers) agreed to back up all of these bad mortgages then we'd be protecting the equity in our own homes as well as keeping all of these sub prime mortgages from implodingamen
Just my dumba$$ $0.02
B B
Maybe I'm a moron, I'm beginning to think so from the number of you who disgree with me that we (the government) should help people hang onto their houses by rewriting some of these mortages and insuring others. I just don't see how dumping thousands of homes into an already glutted marketplace is going to do anything but further the recession. The housing industry is a huge driver of our economy. Like I said, maybe I'm a moron because it just seems to me that if we (the taxpayers) agreed to back up all of these bad mortgages then we'd be protecting the equity in our own homes as well as keeping all of these sub prime mortgages from implodingThe flip side is the taxpayer is on the hook and it implodes anyway. Take your medicine now when you are not as sick or take your medicine when you are on death row.........
Just my dumba$$ $0.02
B B
Maybe I'm a moron, I'm beginning to think so from the number of you who disgree with me that we (the government) should help people hang onto their houses by rewriting some of these mortages and insuring others. I just don't see how dumping thousands of homes into an already glutted marketplace is going to do anything but further the recession. The housing industry is a huge driver of our economy. Like I said, maybe I'm a moron because it just seems to me that if we (the taxpayers) agreed to back up all of these bad mortgages then we'd be protecting the equity in our own homes as well as keeping all of these sub prime mortgages from imploding
Just my dumba$$ $0.02
B B
amen
Maybe I'm a moron, I'm beginning to think so from the number of you who disgree with me that we (the government) should help people hang onto their houses by rewriting some of these mortages and insuring others. I just don't see how dumping thousands of homes into an already glutted marketplace is going to do anything but further the recession. The housing industry is a huge driver of our economy. Like I said, maybe I'm a moron because it just seems to me that if we (the taxpayers) agreed to back up all of these bad mortgages then we'd be protecting the equity in our own homes as well as keeping all of these sub prime mortgages from imploding
Just my dumba$$ $0.02
B B
BB - Foreign markets are tanking and appear to be tied to the problems we face here in the USA. All I have invested in foreign markets are through mutuals - are overseas type mutual funds - no T-bill instruments from foreign governments - so no help there.
Unfortunately, this looks to be world wide. My grandfather put silver dollars in a mattress (absolutely true) prior to the Great Depression in 1929. I should have followed his lead - much safer.
From what I have read, Asian markets (including China) are tanking also.
http://www.cnbc.com/id/19832390/site/14081545/?sky=GGL|CAMP022CNBC_Intl_News_Content|ADGP015AsiaPacificNews|KWRD018china+stock+market&__source=SI_28965890_898451866_0 (http://www.cnbc.com/id/19832390/site/14081545/?sky=GGL|CAMP022CNBC_Intl_News_Content|ADGP015AsiaPacificNews|KWRD018china+stock+market&__source=SI_28965890_898451866_0)
As I understand it, the Chinese hold over 2 trillion ($2,000,000,000,000) in T-bills.
What happens if they decide to sell ?
B B
To who? Got 2 trillion laying around to do the buying? :nixweiss:
The US Treasury has to buy them sadunbar I am fairly certain that T-bills are like bearor bonds
B B
I was making a funny! :huepfenlol2: :huepfenlol2: I didn't think the US government had that amount of change laying around...
BTW - when you decide to take it out on "Wall Street fat cats blah blah" in actuality you are taking it out on everyone who is invested in Wall Street. At this point those investors are 60%+ of the US population.
Wall Street fat cat= Washington Mutual's CEO Alan H. Fishman, who has been on the job for 17 days, is bailing out with parachute worth close to $20 million, according to an executive compensation analysis conducted for the New York Times by James F. Reda Associates.
You heard right. That's $20 million for 17 days on the job ... and his company failed
If Fishman represents 60% of the population I feel like a real loser.
As I understand it, the Chinese hold over 2 trillion ($2,000,000,000,000) in T-bills.
What happens if they decide to sell ?
B B
Brian,
Experts are urging gold and other precious metals
Greg
HA, see I was correct all the time. If all of you had GOLD bikes, you'd be good to go.
Or you can buy like hell, knowing that this is all going to come back up again...
Sean
They already do...How is your Farzie or Mandarin...dang I wasted all this time learning spanglish too...Arabs speak Arabic.
I hope this means that someday my$3,500Enron stock will be worth more than $.18. Suggested a background check on gold bike riders to the FBI, SEC, CIA, & Mr. Beer Corp. already. I figure they have my $3,499.82.
Jerry's idea about Wall Street CEO's doing the same as Lee Iacoca did during the Chrysler bailout ($1 salaries) has a lot of merit. Too bad Congress cannot bring the common sense needed to over ride greed & their desire to get re-elected.
Mike
Arabs speak Arabic.
Farsi is spoken in Iran, Afghanistan and Tajikistan.
You need mandarin since we will be working for them.
i'll trade you 350 shares of MCI for a CVO Coin.
Belize is looking better, national laguage is english too...It's more like Spanish and Portuges. :confused5: :nervous:
Arabic or farsi is that like the difference between spanish spanish and cuban spanish verus mexican spanish...
Oy!
language smangluage...they all understand the perspective of a flash suppressor aimed at their brain housing group.You know Sean, they make AK47 and send it to us so we can use it on them. I guess that explains why AKs work like crap.
Come take our banks and buildings you bastards - see how far you get before you get dropped with .223 ball.
They already do...How is your Farzie or Mandarin...dang I wasted all this time learning spanglish too...shows you what I know, I thought Mandarin was a fruit
shows you what I know, I thought Mandarin was a fruit
Well if it looks like a duck......but one does look entirely cooked, the way prefer them, crispy...
(http://www.smh.com.au/ffximage/2007/04/17/bill_duck_narrowweb__300x452,0.jpg)
That's fup duck! (say it quietly to yourself a couple times)
You mean it's not a duck?
(http://www.utahbirds.org/featarts/2004/MandarinDuckTS4.jpg)
The Donald said it best. It's all a shell game. Ya bail out this mess and oil goes up. Ya don't, it'll go down. This nation's biggest expense is oil. It's the do all to everything we do financially. Them pr!cks at OPEC control our economy because of it. We free up credit by the bailout, we'll pay for it with higher oil prices. Even our food cost is exorbitant now because of energy. This whole thing is just a big scam and there's no recovering until we become energy independent with nuclear! JMO! ;)I worked at an oil refinery here in the northeast 22 years ago. At that time,during my orientation, the Human resource suit told us that the U.S. EXPORTS 42% of all the oil (crude and refined) that is pumped out of American soil. We could have used it then, we can certainly use it now. the problem has always been that our leaders use it as political leverage. We sell them our oil to keep them from getting it elsewhere,ie. Russia(or any of the anistans), China, or the Middle East. Our threat to shut off our flow to Japan was one of the problems leading up to the War. We all know how that worked out. according to National geographic, right now the U.S. is the leader in consumption and therefore the biggest purchaser of foreign oil. They predict that within 10 years,China will far surpass us. Now if we carry this out, with a finite amount of crude available, the highest bidder gets the product. I'm guessing that since the two economies (ours and Chinas)are headed in opposite directions, in 10 years we could be remembering the "good old days" as when we paid $4.00/gal for our fuel. Coincidentally, Nat Geo says that any new drilling now won't show a payoff for 10 years. Coincidence or propaganda?
Hoist! 8)
I worked at an oil refinery here in the northeast 22 years ago. At that time,during my orientation, the Human resource suit told us that the U.S. EXPORTS 42% of all the oil (crude and refined) that is pumped out of American soil. We could have used it then, we can certainly use it now. the problem has always been that our leaders use it as political leverage. We sell them our oil to keep them from getting it elsewhere,ie. Russia(or any of the anistans), China, or the Middle East. Our threat to shut off our flow to Japan was one of the problems leading up to the War. We all know how that worked out. according to National geographic, right now the U.S. is the leader in consumption and therefore the biggest purchaser of foreign oil. They predict that within 10 years,China will far surpass us. Now if we carry this out, with a finite amount of crude available, the highest bidder gets the product. I'm guessing that since the two economies (ours and Chinas)are headed in opposite directions, in 10 years we could be remembering the "good old days" as when we paid $4.00/gal for our fuel. Coincidentally, Nat Geo says that any new drilling now won't show a payoff for 10 years. Coincidence or propaganda?
buffet to buy ge perferred, 3 billion investment
buffet to buy GE perferred, 3 billion investment
Every day, some politician or somebody says something on the idiot box that gets me worked up over this. Yesterday a GOP senator said to Chris Matthews that the $700 billion amounted to $6,800 for every man woman and child in the country. Now I'm not going to get out the latest census reports and do the math, so for the sake of discussion we'll go with that. At the beginning of the year, $300 to every taxpayer was supposed to give the ecomomy a boost and get things going again. That's every taxpayer which is I believe only about 1/3rd of the population. So given that stratagy, why wouldn't given everybody in the country $6,800 sent the ecomomy into orbit ? I know, rather simplistic I agree, but my point is based on what FDR did during the Great Depression with the CCC and WPA. Rather than bail out Wall St, the government put people to work. Since the Chicken Little tag line for this current crisis is that it will create massive unemployment etc etc, why not spend the taxpayers money on the taxpayers. I don't have a clue and one thing I found interesting on Hardball yesterday was Chris Matthews asking Tom Delay to admit that nobody in Washington truly understands what happened, why, how, who etc so they are relying on the very people who are responsible for the mess in the first place for advice on how to fix it.
Just my rambling thoughts for the day
B B
Yes, he got "Preferred stock" with a 10% Guarantee.
GE will now Issue 12 BILLION additional shares of common Stock to raise Capitol, which means that will dilute the current value of GE to about $2.00 a share when they are flooded onto the market.
Every day, some politician or somebody says something on the idiot box that gets me worked up over this. Yesterday a GOP senator said to Chris Matthews that the $700 billion amounted to $6,800 for every man woman and child in the country. Now I'm not going to get out the latest census reports and do the math, so for the sake of discussion we'll go with that. At the beginning of the year, $300 to every taxpayer was supposed to give the ecomomy a boost and get things going again. That's every taxpayer which is I believe only about 1/3rd of the population. So given that stratagy, why wouldn't given everybody in the country $6,800 sent the ecomomy into orbit ? I know, rather simplistic I agree, but my point is based on what FDR did during the Great Depression with the CCC and WPA. Rather than bail out Wall St, the government put people to work. Since the Chicken Little tag line for this current crisis is that it will create massive unemployment etc etc, why not spend the taxpayers money on the taxpayers. I don't have a clue and one thing I found interesting on Hardball yesterday was Chris Matthews asking Tom Delay to admit that nobody in Washington truly understands what happened, why, how, who etc so they are relying on the very people who are responsible for the mess in the first place for advice on how to fix it.
Just my rambling thoughts for the day
B B
Just a simple calculation:
Population 300 million (if not more)
$700 billion divided by 300 mil:
700,000,000,000 / 300,000,000 = $2,333.33
Were did he come up with $6,800?
It's that sort of math that got us where we are.
Every day, some politician or somebody says something on the idiot box that gets me worked up over this. Yesterday a GOP senator said to Chris Matthews that the $700 billion amounted to $6,800 for every man woman and child in the country. Now I'm not going to get out the latest census reports and do the math, so for the sake of discussion we'll go with that. At the beginning of the year, $300 to every taxpayer was supposed to give the ecomomy a boost and get things going again. That's every taxpayer which is I believe only about 1/3rd of the population. So given that stratagy, why wouldn't given everybody in the country $6,800 sent the ecomomy into orbit ? I know, rather simplistic I agree, but my point is based on what FDR did during the Great Depression with the CCC and WPA. Rather than bail out Wall St, the government put people to work. Since the Chicken Little tag line for this current crisis is that it will create massive unemployment etc etc, why not spend the taxpayers money on the taxpayers. I don't have a clue and one thing I found interesting on Hardball yesterday was Chris Matthews asking Tom Delay to admit that nobody in Washington truly understands what happened, why, how, who etc so they are relying on the very people who are responsible for the mess in the first place for advice on how to fix it.
Just my rambling thoughts for the day
B B
This taxpayer didn't get chit... :furious:
Now they claim the majority of folks that did receive a check used it to pay down debt or saved it (which was prudent), so the effect on the economy isn't what they projected it would be. Says a lot of the quality of the projection!
Add me to this list (didn't get chit) :-\We got $200 total (family of 5).
We got $200 total (family of 5).
:bananarock: :bananarock: :bananarock:
Payoff as in return on equity amy reach 10 years, not to production....Spuddin an average well nowadays, I'd take a wag, at anywheres 10-100 mill based on depth.
At nominal production rate, declining market condition the return on equity could run that high..prolly not but could.
Chevron's Deep Water gulf find(found last year) will cost a cool billion to spud, 10 years to reach fruition and with no guarantees.
I get a little crampy when I hear whining over "big oil" profits.
Profit margin is defining factor in business ..Oil, 6-8 points..Insurance 20-30, Investment banking was the same....tell me who makes more.. all this ranting is just me, I am out of coffee..
I love fossil fuel! :D
Yeah, I don't hate big oil either for their profits since duh they are in line with other commodities. But if you point that out the demagogues go on demagoguing and there is a lot of money to be made in demagoguery these days. i should have been a demagogue mebbe but did not study that in school but some of the profs tried to teach it to me anyway.
Hope you got some coffee.
Oh yeah, I got about a brazillion dollars in the freebie gummint money & used it to buy some toothpicks and beer.
:worthless:
I made a half a brazllion $ drinkin WB' Kool Aid...annual return 13% since 98... Donuts on me ifin yall come to land of Cubanos n queers, Cigars and the best Lechon Asado this side of Orlando... :)
(http://www.davidstuff.com/humor/cliff.jpg)ah.. the last of the postal who didn't go postal ..
Ay yi yi! 13% since 98! I be a dumbo investo. Will be in SoFl in October & since I don't mind the queers or any of the polysexyul alternative lifestyles due to my understanding nature of openmindedness & tendency to gawk at stuff and say lookit!, will be looking forward to it.
We shall feast on donuts...
Would I be so graced as to have your iskiness and his jestenerness the same time, 10.24???
Please tell me when your twistedness is to arrive so I may prepare adequate pie
We shall feast on donuts...
Would I be so graced as to have your iskiness and his jestenerness the same time, 10.24???
Please tell me when your twistedness is to arrive so I may prepare adequate pie
JW in MB on 24th. ok Maybe will be there that week but not likely on Friday. Will work on the schedule after Monday. Usually not in PB or Rat Mouth area but will make exception for this trip due to exception I will make for this trip.
I've read 10 of your posts tonight and every one of them is jibberish.
Thank you for making me feel like I'm not alone when the only one who gets my jokes is myself
B B
Excellent and an exceptional Friday we shall have had by then.
Usually where are you practicing when you visit the tip of the fine state of fla ha da, as it is now pronounced by the overwhelming population of jerseyites and newyaugkers...Which is fine with me...No big whoop.
!
!
I heard on the late news that $100,000,000,000 in pork got added to the bill. Anybody read yet where it's going ?
B B
I am again speechless except for this exception to note my speechlessness.
(http://www.laokay.com/lathumb/laphoto/DonutHoleLaPuente.jpg)
Indubitably - I am betting you just gave Miker a full bodyhard-onshiver with that picture
First Bear Stearns, then Fannie/Freddie, Now Lehman and Merril Lynch, soon AIG and Washington Mutual! All these brilliant capitalists with the benign neglect from the Bush whitehouse have brought the financial institutions to their knees by their greed and incompetence. Taxpayers have been put on the hook for about $400 b already in rescuing some of these institutions. And all you geniuses want to elect McCain whose chief financial guru said America was in a "mental recession", who himself said he "doesnt understand the economy very well". Between just the firms I listed above, there will be approximately 60k jobs lost in the next 60 days. Oh yeah, somehow someone will blame the democrats for exerting bad karma over GWB's ability to govern! Unemployment has gone from 4% to 6.1% and rising, dollar has been devalued by 40%, surplus's have become massive deficits, your 401k is tanking and we want to give the republicans another 4 years?
and they stick it to us yet again. this time by both parties
One of the fallacies is that the Republicans are for big business and the wealthy, and the Democrats are for the poor and working class. I don't know that that has ever been really true, but it definitely isn't these days. All politicians are for big business and the wealthy, regardless of party. How many f'ing poor folks have you seen treat their congressman or senator to a "fact finding" junket to Tahiti, or contribute millions to their campaigns via various backdoor conduits?
Jerry
I could treat them to a Donkey Piss (Corona), taco, and refried beans fest. Do you think they'd help me out if I did that? Maybe they'd pass a tax credit for my being good to my dogs...the vet bills add up, you know, and they are my children. My bird has a kid's name...maybe I ought to start claiming him...he's college age now.
Terry,You mean, like: Harley, Evo, and Knuckle? :nixweiss: har. spyder
When the kids were babies, I filled out a survey - claimed I had 6 kids & a nice income. Only had 2 kids then - and ever since. When the "fake name" kids would have been college age, they got college invites & invites to join the armed forces. Credit card offers with up to $10k credit. All kinds of stuff. Went on for years. We laughed about it. The names I used for the "extra" 4 kids were pet names. Pretty typical pet names, too.
Mike
This is a very sad morning in American history. To wake up and see what our elected officials have done to this country. We are in trouble maybe not right now but you can bet sometime in the future this will all come to a head. They may have avoided a DEPRESSION right now. All they did was move it into the future.
If you think it is going to be bad now. With Democratic control in congress we better hope Obama does not win the election.
Be Safe
THE DAWG
:soapbox:
Trickle down doesn't work because you can't insure that the CEO's will share with the middle class. Instead, if they can make more money out sourcing the jobs to improve the bottom line and improve shareholder value they will. Reward corporations for keeping jobs here to offset labor savings abroad. What's good for General Motors is no longer what's good for America.
Remember it was the Republican president and Republican controlled congress of the last 6 out of 7 1/2 years that took a surplus from a Democratic president and turned it into the largest debt ever.
Trickle down doesn't work because you can't insure that the CEO's will share with the middle class. Instead, if they can make more money out sourcing the jobs to improve the bottom line and improve shareholder value they will. Reward corporations for keeping jobs here to offset labor savings abroad. What's good for General Motors is no longer what's good for America.
It was something they inherited. You think this CHIT started 6 or 7 years ago????? NOT!!!! If we would close our borders and protect our borders it might help. BLM is partiallyy correct we are seeing our US dollars leaving this country at an alarming rate like we have never seen it before. The NAFTA has also helped bring our economy down not to mention lending money to people who have no right to it or the means to pay it back. But our great liberal Congress will guaranty those loans.
This whole world economy is in grave danger. WE NEED A DEPRESSION to straighten it back out. Why do you think Alan Greenspan retired?????? He didn't want to be a part of this BULLCHIT.
Be Safe
THE DAWG
The country is not butthole deep in debt only because of these recent activities, nor the subprime lending fiasco. Nor the bailout. The elephant in the room that nobody wants to acknowledge is GW's obsession...the Iraq War. I have lost count of how many billions of dollars we've had to borrow to fight that war, instead of the proper war in Afghanistan, but I think at last count it was quickly approaching 1 Trillion, and the currently monthly expenses are around 10 Billion, not including the interest we're paying on the borrowed money to fight the war. Now we are stuck there, and cannot pull out without looking like failures. Now, whoever wins the election is going to have to deal not only with a faltering economy, but also how to continue to pay the war expenses and debt incurred.
I don't care how you look at it, or how far you want to go back to try and prove that it was not GW's fault, blah, blah, HE has been in charge of things for the past 8 years, and had a Republican Legislative Branch for the vast majority of that time, so if something was broken, HE should have fixed it. Trying to shift that responsibility onto past administrations does not hold water. Whether you want to debate the reasons into the ground or not, some of the most prosperous years for the economy, in our history, were during the Clinton years, and regardless of accounting methodology, we were a hell of a lot better off in 1999 than we are in 2008. Those are facts which cannot be denied.
We can debate this stuff ad nauseum...the bottom line is The President gets both the blame and the credit for things. Our reputation has been damaged worldwide by the arrogance, and frankly ignorance, of GW...the world's confidence in our economy, which has traditionally driven the rest of the world, has been shaken to the foundations. I am not surprised. The blame game can on on endlessly. The future of the country depends on who steps up to the plate and trys to fix it, painful though it may be. It is my opinion that the average working stiff out there is not going to put the party who they feel is responsible for making the mess back in charge. The polls support this view, but it's funny how people only want to believe the polls when they support what they want to hear, and not the other direction.
The country is not butthole deep in debt only because of these recent activities, nor the subprime lending fiasco. Nor the bailout. The elephant in the room that nobody wants to acknowledge is GW's obsession...the Iraq War. I have lost count of how many billions of dollars we've had t
The country is not butthole deep in debt only because of these recent activities, nor the subprime lending fiasco. Nor the bailout. The elephant in the room that nobody wants to acknowledge is GW's obsession...the Iraq War. I have lost count of how many billions of dollars we've had to borrow to fight that war, instead of the proper war in Afghanistan, but I think at last count it was quickly approaching 1 Trillion, and the currently monthly expenses are around 10 Billion, not including the interest we're paying on the borrowed money to fight the war. Now we are stuck there, and cannot pull out without looking like failures. Now, whoever wins the election is going to have to deal not only with a faltering economy, but also how to continue to pay the war expenses and debt incurred.
I don't care how you look at it, or how far you want to go back to try and prove that it was not GW's fault, blah, blah, HE has been in charge of things for the past 8 years, and had a Republican Legislative Branch for the vast majority of that time, so if something was broken, HE should have fixed it. Trying to shift that responsibility onto past administrations does not hold water. Whether you want to debate the reasons into the ground or not, some of the most prosperous years for the economy, in our history, were during the Clinton years, and regardless of accounting methodology, we were a hell of a lot better off in 1999 than we are in 2008. Those are facts which cannot be denied.
We can debate this stuff ad nauseum...the bottom line is The President gets both the blame and the credit for things. Our reputation has been damaged worldwide by the arrogance, and frankly ignorance, of GW...the world's confidence in our economy, which has traditionally driven the rest of the world, has been shaken to the foundations. I am not surprised. The blame game can on on endlessly. The future of the country depends on who steps up to the plate and trys to fix it, painful though it may be. It is my opinion that the average working stiff out there is not going to put the party who they feel is responsible for making the mess back in charge. The polls support this view, but it's funny how people only want to believe the polls when they support what they want to hear, and not the other direction.
Terry this is America and you have your right to your opinion. What I want to know is where were you on 9-11-2001??????
You are so caught up in this Liberal propaganda BS you are blind to the fact why we are spending BILLIONS in the war. I promise you if you were right beside me on that day at 1030hrs you would have a different opinion. I PROMISE!!!
If Mr Clinton would of closed our borders instead of giving non US Citizens come into this country with little or no documentation and giving them more rights than we as Citizens have that day would be JUST ANOTHER DAY!!!!!
As far as our economy goes and who will step to the plate and fix it. I DON'T THINK WE WILL SEE THAT IN OUR LIFE TIME!!!!! JMHO!!!!!
Sorry to rant about the war but I can tell you I am scared for life over that day JUST DOING MY JOB!!!!!!
Be Safe
THE DAWG
OIF is less then 5% of the GDP - do your math again (WWII was 50%, Korea 30-35%, Vietnam 15% and Desert Storm 10%). And the money flowing to it is not in a vacuum, it comes back here in the form of salaries of the goods required to support it. It's not like its spent and just goes into thin air. War is a racket, but it is not one w/o returns to the economy.
Out of control spending in a welfare based government is where your tax dollar is flowing, and the last time I checked it was Congress that dictates what and where $$ is spent the President only signs the legislation, not create it.
Remember it was the Republican president and Republican controlled congress of the last 6 out of 7 1/2 years that took a surplus from a Democratic president and turned it into the largest debt ever.
Trickle down doesn't work because you can't insure that the CEO's will share with the middle class. Instead, if they can make more money out sourcing the jobs to improve the bottom line and improve shareholder value they will. Reward corporations for keeping jobs here to offset labor savings abroad. What's good for General Motors is no longer what's good for America.
Terry this is America and you have your right to your opinion. What I want to know is where were you on 9-11-2001??????
You are so caught up in this Liberal propaganda BS you are blind to the fact why we are spending BILLIONS in the war. I promise you if you were right beside me on that day at 1030hrs you would have a different opinion. I PROMISE!!!
If Mr Clinton would of closed our borders instead of letting non US Citizens come into this country with little or no documentation and giving them more rights than we as Citizens have that day would be JUST ANOTHER DAY!!!!!
As far as our economy goes and who will step to the plate and fix it. I DON'T THINK WE WILL SEE THAT IN OUR LIFE TIME!!!!! JMHO!!!!!
Sorry to rant about the war but I can tell you I am scared for life over that day JUST DOING MY JOB!!!!!!
Be Safe
THE DAWG
Mike, I was at work, like most folks, and was horrified, like most folks. And of course I don't know what it felt like to be there, because I wasn't.
HOWEVER, last I heard, those who were actually RESPONSIBLE for that terrible day are still alive and well, living in the mountains of Pakistan, and Al Queda is currently gaining strength BECAUSE we went into Iraq, and did not focus on where the real problem remains. The public, and the Congress were LIED to, either on purpose, or through an unwillingness to listen to those around him, or both. That is why we are currently in Iraq....there was absolutely NO evidence, and none was discovered, that Iraq, or Saddam, had ANYTHING at all to do with 9/11. That is a historical fact.
Regarding propaganda...one side or the other does not have a monopoly on it. The truth generally lies somewhere in the middle, and it's up to the individual to figure out which "truth" they choose to buy into. Rush Limbaugh, nor his counterpart, whoever that may be, will tell things the way they want people to hear them. There is as much conservative, right wing propoganda out there as there is any other kind.
OIF is less then 5% of the GDP - do your math again (WWII was 50%, Korea 30-35%, Vietnam 15% and Desert Storm 10%). And the money flowing to it is not in a vacuum, it comes back here in the form of salaries of the goods required to support it. It's not like its spent and just goes into thin air. War is a racket, but it is not one w/o returns to the economy.
Out of control spending in a welfare based government is where your tax dollar is flowing, and the last time I checked it was Congress that dictates what and where $$ is spent the President only signs the legislation, not create it.
I think you need to be careful about linking military spending to the GDP which is an argument that is always made by supporters of higher military spending. Comparing any spending to the GDP tells you the expense burden relative to the economy, but it tells you nothing about the burden the spending puts on U.S. taxpayers. Although we may be able to absorb higher military spending, the question is whether the current spending is necessary and whether we are funding the proper priorities. Our GDP is overstated given the recent asset-bubble and such comparisons tend to be made when the economy is healthy. And be careful for what you wish for because if you argue that military spending should be a certain portion of GDP, then in two years when GDP is drastically reduced, would you then be okay with a drastic reduction in military spending?Not sure of what you consider a priority, but having been in and around the CENTCOM AOR for most of my 19 years in the Marine Corps, I consider the death of any Islamofascist a good thing.
Free
:beatdeadhorse: :beatdeadhorse: :beatdeadhorse: :beatdeadhorse: :beatdeadhorse:
et tu Brute
B B
The country is not butthole deep in debt only because of these recent activities, nor the subprime lending fiasco. Nor the bailout. The elephant in the room that nobody wants to acknowledge is GW's obsession...the Iraq War.
Way too much time on MSNBC I hope ......... first impression was that you may have ingested your avatar.......psilocybian?
The US should have told the House of Saud to get their house in order 30 years ago.
The Wabbist movement is from SA and started to take root after the US backed the jihaddist in the Russian debacle in Afganistan.
Most of the loonies that flew those planes were Saudi, no?
This is a US/Saudi issue nothing more.
They should be told one last time, reign it in or else...
Then glow em, starting in SA...All of them.
Remember it was the Republican president and Republican controlled congress of the last 6 out of 7 1/2 years that took a surplus from a Democratic president and turned it into the largest debt ever.
Trickle down doesn't work because you can't insure that the CEO's will share with the middle class. Instead, if they can make more money out sourcing the jobs to improve the bottom line and improve shareholder value they will. Reward corporations for keeping jobs here to offset labor savings abroad. What's good for General Motors is no longer what's good for America.
Correct, Bubba Clinton decimated the military to save money.....then we were attacked......then GW had to spend money to fix the military. And by the way, while we were closing bases, the Russians started to rebuild their military. China and North Korea never mssed a beat.
The dot com bubble pop happened under Clinton.
GNP comparisons, considering the variables which have changes since WWII, is not a valid basis for debate, IMO. You are correct, defense spending does create jobs and contributes to the overall economy, but overall, it's still an expense to the budget. The President proposes the budget each year, if I'm not mistaken, and the Congress modifies/approves, then the President Vetoes/signs. That's not counting the emergency spending requests coming out of the Executive branch as well.That's what I read also, but the rest of the story is that it is an excise tax - the mfgr just collects it like sales tax and passes it on to the govt. It has absolutely no benefit to the mfgr, period, end of story. And it was levied only on mfgrs in the US so the chicoms can send their cheap ass arrows over here and there is not such tax levied. Chit I do NOT call this pork or a giveaway. It is simple economic justice and withdraws an excise tax that never should have been levied.
One could consider any government, regardless of type, to be a "welfare" based entity, by definition.
No matter...what's done is done, and what will be will be. The pork that was added to the "rescue" bill, was on both sides of the aisle. No way around it, IMO.
BTW....the children's wooden arrow deal was explained in a bit more detail this morning on the radio: From what I heard, this bill has been floating around for a long time, waiting to get attached to something. A few years ago, they levied a flat tax of $.39 on every arrow, instead of the traditional %....well this worked out great for those who make 10-12 dollar arrows like Ted Nugent uses, or most bow hunters. But it sucked big ones for the guys making the $2.00 arrows for children's bow and arrows sets. So the little guys making the cheaper wooden arrows got hit a lot harder than the guys making the more profitable expensive arrows. You (I don't mean this directed at you, FM) decide whether it was a good thing or bad, and whether it should have been recified a long time ago to be more fair.
That's what I read also, but the rest of the story is that it is an excise tax - the mfgr just collects it like sales tax and passes it on to the govt. It has absolutely no benefit to the mfgr, period, end of story. And it was levied only on mfgrs in the US so the chicoms can send their cheap ass arrows over here and there is not such tax levied. Chit I do NOT call this pork or a giveaway. It is simple economic justice and withdraws an excise tax that never should have been levied.
Mike, I was at work, like most folks, and was horrified, like most folks. And of course I don't know what it felt like to be there, because I wasn't.
HOWEVER, last I heard, those who were actually RESPONSIBLE for that terrible day are still alive and well, living in the mountains of Pakistan, and Al Queda is currently gaining strength BECAUSE we went into Iraq, and did not focus on where the real problem remains. The public, and the Congress were LIED to, either on purpose, or through an unwillingness to listen to those around him, or both. That is why we are currently in Iraq....there was absolutely NO evidence, and none was discovered, that Iraq, or Saddam, had ANYTHING at all to do with 9/11. That is a historical fact.
Regarding propaganda...one side or the other does not have a monopoly on it. The truth generally lies somewhere in the middle, and it's up to the individual to figure out which "truth" they choose to buy into. Rush Limbaugh, nor his counterpart, whoever that may be, will tell things the way they want people to hear them. There is as much conservative, right wing propoganda out there as there is any other kind.
Terry when the events of 9/11 happened I was assigned to the SPECIAL OPERATIONS DIVISION of THE DISTRICT of COLUMBIA FIRE DEPARTMENT. I can tell you I drilled with units from Quantico Virginia. These units were Federal Units. I can also tell you I was privileged to information you and most of America was not. I can tell you for a fact you statements are VERY INCORRECT.
You can believe anything the Liberal media wants you to believe. I can bet you the Liberal Media never talked about a stolen 500 lb cylinder of S$%#&* C*&%^$# that we moved from above Metro Center. Metro Center is the hub for Washington DC's subway system. It was in a cube van and set up to feed the tunnel on a Monday Morning. If they (who ever it was) were successful it would of killed over 10,000 people.
I am sorry to rant about this and other incidents. It has just left a very sour taste in my mouth. You may think you are safe in Bumm F$%K where ever you live but I assure you are not. This country and many others are in grave danger. This country's financial problems are a small part of our problems. Remember this war is not about OIL it is all about RELIGION. Please EVERYONE think how you are going to vote this year before you do it.
As always I am not afraid to say I LOVE MY COUNTRY and I LOVE MY JOB!!!!!
Be Safe
THE DAWG
Remember it was the Republican president and Republican controlled congress of the last 6 out of 7 1/2 years that took a surplus from a Democratic president and turned it into the largest debt ever.
Trickle down doesn't work because you can't insure that the CEO's will share with the middle class. Instead, if they can make more money out sourcing the jobs to improve the bottom line and improve shareholder value they will. Reward corporations for keeping jobs here to offset labor savings abroad. What's good for General Motors is no longer what's good for America.
In moving, even tentatively, into this new area of lending, Fannie Mae is taking on significantly more risk, which may not pose any difficulties during flush economic times. But the government-subsidized corporation may run into trouble in an economic downturn, prompting a government rescue similar to that of the savings and loan industry in the 1980's.
''Fannie Mae has expanded home ownership for millions of families in the 1990's by reducing down payment requirements,'' said Franklin D. Raines, Fannie Mae's chairman and chief executive officer. ''Yet there remain too many borrowers whose credit is just a notch below what our underwriting has required who have been relegated to paying significantly higher mortgage rates in the so-called subprime market.''And he was behind all the bad paper at Fannie causing their melt down....
The action, which will begin as a pilot program involving 24 banks in 15 markets -- including the New York metropolitan region -- will encourage those banks to extend home mortgages to individuals whose credit is generally not good enough to qualify for conventional loans. Fannie Mae officials say they hope to make it a nationwide program by next spring.
Fannie Mae, the nation's biggest underwriter of home mortgages, has been under increasing pressure from the Clinton Administration to expand mortgage loans among low and moderate income people and felt pressure from stock holders to maintain its phenomenal growth in profits.
I think Midnight Rider's comments are correct. I also believe that this country's financial problems are the biggest threat to our country by far.
Free
I thought is was interesting when the CEO of Wells Fargo Bank was interviewed and asked how our Country got into this mess and his opinion is that it could be summed up in one word: GREED. He said his bank lost a great deal of money by not participating in the loans that have caused the bank failures and the mess that most are in now. Hard to just blame either political party regardless of your alliance. The same holds true for not dealing with the illegal immigrants problem......ea. side has had the time in control to address this problem but haven't done so and allowed it to continue to escalate. I may be naive, but I would think that securing our borders would help in the fight against terrorism. :confused5: spyder
Free I don't disagree with Terry or you either about ire financial problems. What I disagree with Terry about is why we are fighting the war. We are spending money on a war we would not be fighting if we had tightened our borders years ago. I also disagree with giving non US Citizens in this country SOCIAL BENEFITS. It is costing us as much if not each month as the war.
Be Safe
THE DAWG
I thought is was interesting when the CEO of Wells Fargo Bank was interviewed and asked how our Country got into this mess and his opinion is that it could be summed up in one word: GREED. He said his bank lost a great deal of money by not participating in the loans that have caused the bank failures and the mess that most are in now. Hard to just blame either political party regardless of your alliance. The same holds true for not dealing with the illegal immigrants problem......ea. side has had the time in control to address this problem but haven't done so and allowed it to continue to escalate. I may be naive, but I would think that securing our borders would help in the fight against terrorism. :confused5: spyder
Good ol dems caused this. The NYT in 1999 precicted this financial melt down back in 1999
Thanks for the post. Perhaps lending to the less qualified coupled with little or no regulation caused a good part of this mess. First time i have seen anyone quote the NYT as an authority on this site.
I thought is was interesting when the CEO of Wells Fargo Bank was interviewed and asked how our Country got into this mess and his opinion is that it could be summed up in one word: GREED. He said his bank lost a great deal of money by not participating in the loans that have caused the bank failures and the mess that most are in now. Hard to just blame either political party regardless of your alliance. The same holds true for not dealing with the illegal immigrants problem......ea. side has had the time in control to address this problem but haven't done so and allowed it to continue to escalate. I may be naive, but I would think that securing our borders would help in the fight against terrorism. :confused5: spyder
Agreed. Greed is the root of this mess, coupled with the belief that real estate would not go down and laws from the 1920's that are glacial in reaction to the possibilities as a result of the technological advances since 1987 and the Monday 20% crash tied to the internet. The correction and changes in law will affect the greediest (read HEDGE funds) and less scrupulous (read Sell short) Wall street and off shore pinkos! IMO we are in the short term squeezed and the medium to long term infinitely better off so long as the book gets a rewrite now........the 'markets' ~~ only 'legal' games in town! ??? har! spyder
I thought is was interesting when the CEO of Wells Fargo Bank was interviewed and asked how our Country got into this mess and his opinion is that it could be summed up in one word: GREED. He said his bank lost a great deal of money by not participating in the loans that have caused the bank failures and the mess that most are in now. Hard to just blame either political party regardless of your alliance. The same holds true for not dealing with the illegal immigrants problem......ea. side has had the time in control to address this problem but haven't done so and allowed it to continue to escalate. I may be naive, but I would think that securing our borders would help in the fight against terrorism. :confused5: spyderGreed mixed with arrogance. The deadly combination that caused it.
and who's responsible for the 'checks and balances'? :nixweiss: spyderGovernment. And we are responsible for Government. That's why we are paying for it.
Government. And we are responsible for Government. That's why we are paying for it.Yes it is. There is a certain amount of roller coaster that comes with capitalism and the GREEDY BA$TARDS made it much, much worse, IMHO!
As long the law only dictates what's not allowed they (we) can always find loopholes. May be it (the law) should dictate what's allowed only...
Wait a minute, that's called Communism.. I think..
Yes it is. There is a certain amount of roller coaster that comes with capitalism and the GREEDY BA$TARDS made it much, much worse, IMHO!Wasn't that a 'tax' issue? :-\ Not sure how to blame this mess on taxation. :-[ arrrrrgh. spyder
There was a TEA party once that seemed to get alot of attention? Whatdayathink!?????
Wasn't that a 'tax' issue? :-\ Not sure how to blame this mess on taxation. :-[ arrrrrgh. spyder
Yes it is. There is a certain amount of roller coaster that comes with capitalism and the GREEDY BA$TARDS made it much, much worse, IMHO!
There was a TEA party once that seemed to get alot of attention? Whatdayathink!?????
QuoteGood ol dems caused this. The NYT in 1999 precicted this financial melt down back in 1999
Thanks for the post. Perhaps lending to the less qualified coupled with little or no regulation caused a good part of this mess. First time i have seen anyone quote the NYT as an authority on this site.
You mean, like: Harley, Evo, and Knuckle? :nixweiss: har. spyder
Pour your mortgage into a bay?
Thanks for the post. Perhaps lending to the less qualified coupled with little or no regulation caused a good part of this mess. First time i have seen anyone quote the NYT as an authority on this site.
I hate the NYT, I figure it is a far left liberal rag. I quoted it because I was shocked they actually had something right. I was also shocked that they have not pulled the link or article from their web site.
While Clinton was pushing for the Sub prime and writing loans to less qualified low income people, they are not the only ones to blame.
Many middle class Americans took out Teaser Rate Arms on 250K homes when they could only really qualify for a 150K home on a traditional mortgage. They gambled they would get a promotion, pay raise or the home value would go up. Neither happend, the low rate adjusted up, and now they can not afforded the home note, and the home is now worth less then the owe.
Many investors did the same gamble the middle class guy did.
So now we have three groups defaulting on their mortgage.
Had they all had to put 20% down like before 1999, how many would walk on their loan? Had they all had to have good credit, how many would walk on their loan?
My home has lost 80K in value over the last 2 years. However with my 24% down in 2002, I still have lots of equity in the home. Most all the homes with zero down, and ARMS in my neighborhood are up for sale, and they are upside down in the home. These are the people that were living check to check in a home they could not afford to begin with.
:(I just listen to a financial "expert" who said if this downturn turns into a depression, it will take until the year 2033 to get back to our highs in the market. I might miss out on that one.
I just listened to financial expert (me :o) that said if Hoist kept spending money on Cybil there would never be a recession.
Go Hoist!
:2virology_21:
Financial expert, isn't that an oxymoron?? Like, Government Intelligence, Bad Sex, Crash Landing, or Legally Drunk????
In regards to my post the answer is,
YES!
I lost a screaming eagle this morning alone...It is gettng ponderous...
Jumbo shrimp
Postal Service........
Maybe I'll have enough left for cheetosThey make Lip Balm but not sure for which set of lips?
Hope the high yield stocks keep yielding, take the divi's and batten down on the valuation...
It is tough for me not to buy a little brk-b today with some cvx and bac thrown in for the yield...
I thought you BOTH speak "New England" :)
Thats a good sign...He is the ultimate contrarian!Hey Miker, I have a GREAT idea. :2vrolijk_21: Rather than loose all that money why not just LEND me a couple hundred thousand and I"ll give it back to you (maybe) sometime. KB :2vrolijk_21: :2vrolijk_21: :2vrolijk_21:
Sorry.
High yield stocks pay a dividend regardless of what the value of the stock does (given price on any day).
For example;
BAC is the abbreviation on the exchange for Bank of America, I have gathered quite a bit over the years(20).
It pays a dividend of $2.5 something cents per share held and at todays per share price of around $32, that is over a 7% yield and is pretty secure. In the early 90's I bought some at $10 and it promptly dropped like a rock to 3 or 5 bucks, it happened to me with Apple too. I sure wanted to sell and lick my wounds but I stayed the course and am better off for it.
It is disturbing to watch the valuation(stock price) of the stocks plummet like they have, especially if you must sell them. If the portfolio has some solid dividend paying stocks in it, you just have to try and ride the storm out. I am afraid this one is going to be here a while. I sometimes buy small amounts when the markets get like this, I have not seen it like this since 2000.
Death and taxes are all we are truly guaranteed, unfortunately.
And if I were so danged smart and could offer real good advice, I wouldn't be on this website while at WORK... :P
!
Interesting diagram. This type of coil is used in the magnegas generator. There are two stainless tubes with only a few thousands space between where water is electrolyzed. The gases emitted at the top are subjected to the fields from a toroidal coil to change the hydrogen somehow. The hydrogen and oxygen gases not only burn together bu improve the combustion of the gasoline vapors at the same time. Any physicists on-line who can expand on how this works?
I don't know how this relates to this topic but I like the diagram Miker posted. :P
Pretty sure that diagram has something to do with donuts somehow BigR! ::) ;D ;)
Hoist! 8)
Thanks. I called the family financial guy and he is going to get me the numbers on the stocks in the portfolio that pay dividends with falling share prices. The guy thinks I'm pretty smart for asking. (Thanks for that, I needed an ego boost today) Also, called the family accountant and discussed selling some shares at the end of the year to take a loss equal in value to the tax owed for the year. This was my idea and the accountant also gave me some kudos. So while I didn't really do anything, I did thanks to this site gain a measure of comfort and also made a plan. That's more than I had with my morning coffee earlier.
B B
Mr. Market giveth.........and.........Mr. Market taketh away. :'( aaaaaagh. spyder
but just think, if someone had the cajones to buy in at the low this morning - you could have make a decent score...Mr. Market got me by the cajones early on.......there wasn't any cash left to buy with... :-[....aaaaaargh. spyder
Thanks. I called the family financial guy and he is going to get me the numbers on the stocks in the portfolio that pay dividends with falling share prices. The guy thinks I'm pretty smart for asking. (Thanks for that, I needed an ego boost today) Also, called the family accountant and discussed selling some shares at the end of the year to take a loss equal in value to the tax owed for the year. This was my idea and the accountant also gave me some kudos. So while I didn't really do anything, I did thanks to this site gain a measure of comfort and also made a plan. That's more than I had with my morning coffee earlier.
B B
Hope the high yield stocks keep yielding, take the divi's and batten down on the valuation...
It is tough for me not to buy a little brk-b today with some cvx and bac thrown in for the yield...
Tomorrow I invest in Krispy Kreme. I plan to purchase one dozen, chocolate iced. Then I will eat them one by one & if it all goes well after about 6, I will buy a 12 pack of beer later on. The stock market is not my friend - I plan to invest more wisely in the future in craps or maybe even blackjack.I'm hoping that our market 'bottom' doesn't last as long as Japan's has......I don't have that much time. :( spyder
I'm hoping that our market 'bottom' doesn't last as long as Japan's has......I don't have that much time. :( spyder
BB,
You might want to do a bit more research. The dividend is getting wiped out due to big loses and companies hurting for cash. BAC (bank of america) went down after the market close and they also cut their dividend. When you get the list, check out those co. charts for last 2 years before pulling trigger.
One good source of information is Barron's weekend edition. You can get it online every Saturday morning through "NewsStand". Also you can subscribe to Briefing.com, they have daily market analisys and some very good research tools.
Education is your best friend, and there are a lot of good books and sources out there. If you don't trust your guy, get a different one. When you had your medical problem, did you get second opinion from another Dr. or cvo members (no offense to anyone).
Time to get off :soapbox:
Tomorrow I invest in Krispy Kreme. I plan to purchase one dozen, chocolate iced. Then I will eat them one by one & if it all goes well after about 6, I will buy a 12 pack of beer later on. The stock market is not my friend - I plan to invest more wisely in the future in craps or maybe even blackjack.
Invest in liquor, people drink when things are good, and they drink when things are bad, you can't go wrong! :drink:
This is a correct statement. Now answer me this. WHO LET THIS CHIT HAPPEN?????
I built my house in 1998. I built in a mountain area in the middle of no where. I had put 20% or more into construction costs out of my pocket and owned the land. When I applied for a mortgage I was told I over built the area. They still gave me a loan to replace the construction loan. Thank God the area started to build up and my home value shot through the roof. As far as equity goes I am in great shape. But this does not help the people who are losing their homes
Be Safe
THE DAWG
FREE THE UNABOMBER !
Bump
If freed does he go to Wall Street or Congress? Both?
I suggest Wall Street first, before the bastards flee to their off shore paradise with our money. Those clowns in Congress are too used to being on the public dole to flee Washington.
Jerry
If freed does he go to Wall Street or Congress? Both?
The pay for a guy losing mega millions for his company should be minimum wage.
The clowns in DC should be paid scale wages for clowns for actual hours supposedly "worked". The President as well as Speaker of the House & Senate Majority leader should wear clown wigs when talking in public also.
Mike
Obviously, you haven't read his "Manifesto" He targeted the CEO's of companies whom he believed were raping America and it's working class. Very Marxist in it's tone, it is nonetheless a good read when viewed from today's perspective.
B B
We all want to get the Fat Cats getting these big payoffs, but I think Congress is a little hypocritical about this.Your points are valid. Congress can vote themselves the Treasury proceeds, so they do. Insane.
SOCIAL SECURITY:
(This is worth reading. It is short and to the point.)
Perhaps we are asking the wrong questions during election years
Our Senators and Congresswomen do not pay into Social Security and, of course, they do not collect from it.
You see, Social Security benefits were not suitable for persons of their rare elevation in society. They felt they should have a special plan for themselves. So, many years ago they voted in their own benefit plan.
In more recent years, no congressperson has felt the need to change it. After all, it is a great plan.
For all practical purposes their plan works like this:
When they retire, they continue to draw the same pay until they die.
Except it may increase from time to time for cost of living adjustments..
For example, Senator Byrd and Congressman White and their wives may expect to draw $7,800,000.00 (that's Seven Million, Eight-Hundred Thousand Dollars), with their wives drawing $275, 000.00 during the last years of their lives.
This is calculated on an average life span for each of those two Dignitaries.
Younger Dignitaries who retire at an early age, will receive much more during the rest of their lives.
Their cost for this excellent plan is $0.00. NADA..! ZILCH...
This little perk they voted for themselves is free to them. You and I pick up the tab for this plan. The funds for this fine retirement plan come directly from the General Funds;
' OUR TAX DOLLARS AT WORK '!
From our own Social Security Plan, which you and I pay (or have paid) into, every payday until we retire (which amount is matched by our employer). We can expect to get an average of $1,000 per month after retirement.
Or, in other words, we would have to collect our average of $1,000 monthly benefits for 68 years and one (1) month to equal Senator Bill Bradley's benefits!
Obviously, you haven't read his "Manifesto" He targeted the CEO's of companies whom he believed were raping America and it's working class. Very Marxist in it's tone, it is nonetheless a good read when viewed from today's perspective.Very interesting, BB. Just goes to show that even paranoid people can have real enemies. :-X spyder
B B
Very interesting, BB. Just goes to show that even paranoid people can have real enemies. :-X spyder
Your points are valid. Congress can vote themselves the Treasury proceeds, so they do. Insane.
For the early retirees on SS it was a bonanza of sorts. They paid little to nothing & collected for years. Now a passbook savings account is not so far from SS when someone pays the max into it each year. Add the SS payroll cost of employers to see how bad SS sucks as a "forced investment." Also, SS cost to employers of SS is considered as income for those employees who many times have no clue that is actually part of their compensation that they never see due to the structure of federal law.
SS sucks in my opinion. I am 45, and have been paying in for 29 years. I have at least 17 more years to pay in. That makes 46 years of paying in at least when I hopefully retire. I doubt I will get anything out at the system will be broke. I have all been paying in the max for 8 years now, and will pay max for the next 17 years.
Properly invested, I would have well over a million in investments if I could have all my SS dollars.
That coupled with my investments for the past 10 years, I could retire with a six figure income in my retirement years.
SS sucks in my opinion. I am 45, and have been paying in for 29 years. I have at least 17 more years to pay in. That makes 46 years of paying in at least when I hopefully retire. I doubt I will get anything out at the system will be broke. I have all been paying in the max for 8 years now, and will pay max for the next 17 years.You should have opt out of SS when you started. But if you opt out, you can't get back in (it soppose to be the down side but it's not).
Properly invested, I would have well over a million in investments if I could have all my SS dollars.
That coupled with my investments for the past 10 years, I could retire with a six figure income in my retirement years.
You should have opt out of SS when you started. But if you opt out, you can't get back in (it soppose to be the down side but it's not).
I never understood that you could Opt out of Social Security...how?Yes you can. When I was the treasurer for our church, our minister opt out of SS and instead invested the same amount in Mu. funds.
Does Punchie have SS benefits?
I never understood that you could Opt out of Social Security...how?
Free wipes for the Piccachu...past that no.
Have you checked to see how many times he is registered to vote? Punchie might be able to vote up to 5 times in my county........
I heard he was going to be on the starting lineup for the Cowboys - and was consequently registered to vote by ACORN.
So he doesn't live in Vegas with Romo. Too bad. Voters here in 2000 & 2004 bragged they voted 4-5 times each at different precincts. Know what the local elections (D) folks did?
............. Me either.
Probably they gave them 5 more voter cards so they could vote 10 times in 08 maybe?
A fairly good friend of mine is to recieve $100,000 in a bequest from a elderly gentleman he knows with no family whom he (my friend) has looked after in a myriad of ways for the past 10 years. The bulk of the man's estate is to go to a wide variety of charities. My friend has seen the will and it simply says $100,000. It doesn't stipulate cash or whatever. The elderly man is 93 and in failing health, so my friend and I have discussed his options at the time of the gentleman's death. This person has a substantial investment portfolio which actually comprises the bulk of his estate. To pay my friend the $100,000 in cash, the executor will have to sell off some of the portfolio. I suggested to my friend that he take a small amount (say $25K) in cash and the reminder in stock from the portfolio as when he market rebounds he will end up with far more than the $100k bequest at no cost to the estate. My friend thinks I'm crazy and that he should take the $100k in cash. He also doesn't believe the executor can pay him in stocks. I say he can pay him in anything of value contained in the estate so long as my friend is in agreement with the executor.
Opinions please ?
B B
A fairly good friend of mine is to receive $100,000 in a bequest from a elderly gentleman he knows with no family whom he (my friend) has looked after in a myriad of ways for the past 10 years. The bulk of the man's estate is to go to a wide variety of charities. My friend has seen the will and it simply says $100,000. It doesn't stipulate cash or whatever. The elderly man is 93 and in failing health, so my friend and I have discussed his options at the time of the gentleman's death. This person has a substantial investment portfolio which actually comprises the bulk of his estate. To pay my friend the $100,000 in cash, the executor will have to sell off some of the portfolio. I suggested to my friend that he take a small amount (say $25K) in cash and the reminder in stock from the portfolio as when he market rebounds he will end up with far more than the $100k bequest at no cost to the estate. My friend thinks I'm crazy and that he should take the $100k in cash. He also doesn't believe the executor can pay him in stocks. I say he can pay him in anything of value contained in the estate so long as my friend is in agreement with the executor.
Opinions please ?
B B
Have him "Gift" up to 12,000 in cash while he is still alive. If his friend survives past the first of the year, gift another 12,000. Then, have his broker present a cost basis analysis of the stock available to bequest. Even after today's 678 drop, he most likely will have stocks that have appreciated above his cost. Have your accountant look at the situation and set up the transaction to reduce the tax implications.
I never understood that you could Opt out of Social Security...how?
You should have opt out of SS when you started. But if you opt out, you can't get back in (it soppose to be the down side but it's not).Most people by law can not opt out.
The fallacy is that this is an investment of some sort. It is not, it is a direct transfer of assets from one group to a different group. There is no guarantee that anyone will get the money they have "invested" in the system. It is what it is, and anyone who relies on SS for their retirement is a fool.
Jerry
How much do I loose today? 15-20K? again...
Down $400k since the skid started. Am so frustrated I want to find somebody to kick the crap out of.
B B
BB start here
I can hardly wait until they finally have the raffle for the knuck at WTT and announce that I won. It will ease the pain.
Down $400k since the skid started. Am so frustrated I want to find somebody to kick the crap out of.
B B
Only lost 6k today. Yeah!
I tossed my calculator in the pool two days ago
B B
Good choice.. :D
If it were not for the 10 hour ride tomorrow for the new road sofa, I'd be at the range shooting...Or self actualizing as FM says..
Hang in there, once a new pol gets in office thing may improve, any pol, election years are brutal.
Adding 5-8 years to the salt mine tour has not been a pleasant thought this week.
It's very low voltge solar powered.
I just looked in the pool as the sun is out
it still reads negative numbers
I have to go for a swim with a hammer
I'll be back in a bit
B B
If you gently fish it out of the pool, maybe you could put it in a vise and squeeze it to death.
No can do Tim
Because Frank is a , that'd make it a hate crime vice simple assault
B B
Now that oil prices have dropped like a rock as the world economy begins to tank, gas prices are finally dropping along with crude prices. More of a lag than what we saw on the way up, but at least things are going in the right direction. Now, here's the big question. Will the average American consumer continue to cut back consumption, or will the past year be forgotten and the waste resume? I personally have so little faith in the common sense of the typical consumer that I would fully expect to see many/most go right back to their wasteful ways if credit was still available and cheap. I guess we will all get to see for ourselves as gas drops below that magic $3 number.:2vrolijk_21:
Jerry
Now that oil prices have dropped like a rock as the world economy begins to tank, gas prices are finally dropping along with crude prices. More of a lag than what we saw on the way up, but at least things are going in the right direction. Now, here's the big question. Will the average American consumer continue to cut back consumption, or will the past year be forgotten and the waste resume? I personally have so little faith in the common sense of the typical consumer that I would fully expect to see many/most go right back to their wasteful ways if credit was still available and cheap. I guess we will all get to see for ourselves as gas drops below that magic $3 number.
Jerry
The market shot up 950 something points on the day. Largest one day gain in the history of the exchange. Keeping my fingers crossed on tomorrow and the rest of the week. If it gets back up to within 100 points of where it was July 1st, I'm pulling everything out and putting it all in T-bills till at least January. Don't care if it keeps climbing and I end up down a bit for the year, the last two weeks have made me sick.
B B
BB,
That's the point I've been trying to make all along. There's way too many fat cats with their hands buried in the markets for them to tank too long. It will always come back, it's just a matter of when. Don't sweat the day to day crap, it don't mean anything. 20 years from now and you're looking back on your life, will you worry about some chit you did in the fall of 2008, or how about the spring of 1968???? Nope, you won't; you'll only be comcerned with your life as a whole and how you feel about it.
Hell, look at the late 20's. What happened to the market then? Went to hell and a handbasket, right? Where was it in 1935- well above where it was in 1928 before all the crap started.
I don't believe we've seen the bottom yet. But it will recover. Period!
The market shot up 950 something points on the day. Largest one day gain in the history of the exchange. Keeping my fingers crossed on tomorrow and the rest of the week. If it gets back up to within 100 points of where it was July 1st, I'm pulling everything out and putting it all in T-bills till at least January. Don't care if it keeps climbing and I end up down a bit for the year, the last two weeks have made me sick.
B B
Now that oil prices have dropped like a rock as the world economy begins to tank, gas prices are finally dropping along with crude prices. More of a lag than what we saw on the way up, but at least things are going in the right direction. Now, here's the big question. Will the average American consumer continue to cut back consumption, or will the past year be forgotten and the waste resume? I personally have so little faith in the common sense of the typical consumer that I would fully expect to see many/most go right back to their wasteful ways if credit was still available and cheap. I guess we will all get to see for ourselves as gas drops below that magic $3 number.
Jerry
Why do you only want July numbers? I'd much rather see the numbers from October '07, before they began the long slide that culminated in the big crash. If anyone thinks they've lost a ton just recently (Jul-Oct), recalculate the losses based on a full year (Oct-Sept). I did, and it makes me really sick.
As for the optimistic approach, where everything quickly goes back to pre-crash numbers, I hope that happens but I doubt it will. The tech bubble crash at the beginning of the decade decimated my 401k, and it took until Oct '07 for my balance to struggle back to where it was prior to the 2000 crash. I believe this will be another long term deal, as there has been a ton of money pulled out of the market that nervous folks are going to be very slow to reinvest in the market. The part that really pi$$es me off is that the greedy bastards who created the mess and walked away with multimillion dollar bonuses and parachutes will now be able to buy up everything on the cheap and profit even more handsomely from their screwing of the rest of us.
Jerry
Found in my email.......
Back in 1990, the Government seized the Mustang Ranch brothel in Nevada for tax evasion and, as required by law, tried to run it. They failed and it closed. Now we are trusting the economy of our country to a pack of nit-wits who couldn't make money running a whore house and selling booze?
Vicious circle, they were the best customers, so they just got their own money back! :confused5:
If you listen to media & blindly believe it, you are exactly the sucker they are looking for. Commodities go up & they go down. Oil is a commodity. It just happens to be one of several some ideologues enjoy demagoguing.
As long as we sheep are willing to buy the Media's manipulations will continue to be sold. Literally! It's all about the money.
It's all about the OIL!!! ;)I would argue economic terrorism!!! That was after all the point of the cowardice of 9-11-01
Hoist! 8)
It's all about the OIL!!! ;)OIL / MONEY
Hoist! 8)
OIL / MONEY
It's one and the same.
Mike
:drink:
Oil, drug companies, medical companies, among others.Lest us not forget the "business" of the Media :soapbox: :drink:
received the following in an e-mail......:ROFLOL:
"THIS IS WORSE THAN A DIVORCE.
I LOST HALF MY MONEY AND I STILL HAVE MY WIFE."
For all the doom and gloom on the news, Orlando is packed! Having a hard time finding parking at the places we are going to at night. I am not seeing it (the down turn) here, other then the junk offerings of the geek vendors on the show floor SUCK!
Did score a Digital Picture Frame, but the best they are offering is pens and "green shopping bags"...weak!! How and I supposed to justify a conference in Orlando without good stuff to bring home?
Down Town Disney Harley Davidson offers 10% Military Discount...got the obligatory shirt and shot glass.
Cindy McCain is a blond beer heiress worth millions of $. More ads with rich good looking blondes drinking beer would be better than the current crop of drivel politically.I hear Ed McMahon has begun a new career in rap.... and can be bought.....cheap :nixweiss: If'n the boat is in need of additional entertainment that is ;)
McCain should get a big boat (Named "Big Beer Vote Boat), fill it with bikini clad blondes drinking beer, and smile & wave & yell "vote for me" as he captained it all over Lake Havasu. I would rather see that than the crappola they have on nw.
I hear Ed McMahon has begun a new career in rap.... and can be bought.....cheap :nixweiss: If'n the boat is in need of additional entertainment that is ;)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tl4gh60WJWY
Give the pens to the kids & the wife gets the shopping bag - automatic souvenirs. Leaves the picture frame for you, of course.
already done...
You coulda ridden down, blown off the Geek-o-rama conference today, and ridden over to Daytona to join the happy throngs in thongs.....Is Gary in Daytona :confused5:
You coulda ridden down, blown off the Geek-o-rama conference today, and ridden over to Daytona to join the happy throngs in thongs.....nah, got this small problem with appointed place of duty thing... On leave tomorrow, doing MGM and Magic Kingdom - have already bribed the 6 year old to go on the Rockin Roller coaster (costing me a $50.00 Star Wars Lego Ship)...
nah, got this small problem with appointed place of duty thing... On leave tomorrow, doing MGM and Magic Kingdom - have already bribed the 6 year old to go on the Rockin Roller coaster (costing me a $50.00 Star Wars Lego Ship)...Sounds good, enjoy the family :2vrolijk_21: :2vrolijk_21: :2vrolijk_21:
Then doing a one day push back to NC Saturday...
Disney extended a $99 a night rate for me...sweet!
Steve Balmer is the Key Note today, gotta see where MS is going.
BAck to my geekness
Is Gary in Daytona :confused5:
;D ;D ;DSame here. Will the great OZ please come out from behind the curtain?? :huepfenlol2: Maybe he's a fabrication to keep Sean and Miker in line :huepfenjump3: :huepfenlol2:
I have never actually seen Gary except in pictures. Most of them involve a thong. If he wore it in Daytona..... canceling all those thoughts immediately. :nervous:
nah, got this small problem with appointed place of duty thing... On leave tomorrow, doing MGM and Magic Kingdom - have already bribed the 6 year old to go on the Rockin Roller coaster (costing me a $50.00 Star Wars Lego Ship)...
Then doing a one day push back to NC Saturday...
Disney extended a $99 a night rate for me...sweet!
Steve Balmer is the Key Note today, gotta see where MS is going.
BAck to my geekness
Same here. Will the great OZ please come out from behind the curtain?? :huepfenlol2: Maybe he's a fabrication to keep Sean and Miker in line :huepfenjump3: :huepfenlol2:
His thong is some sort of fabric but I never plan to touch it. :nervous: ;DHe is all knowing and never very far :ROFLOL:
According to the Great Mystic Crystal of the CVO Universe (Users Online) Fired00d is not here currently.
He is all knowing and never very far :ROFLOL:
;D ;D ;D
I have never actually seen Gary except in pictures.
Yup, he ain't got it.. The smirking of both during the so called "debate" made me watch "Bewitched" reruns while drinking frozen strawberry things. The Jestor Decor put the idea into my little mad cow infested brain...Shame on you Cheri.
He's been hold up in his computer room since leaving Maggie Valley in October of 06 and hasn't been at a "gathering" since. I was worried about him for awhile, but he's got a firm grip on cyberspace and is fine :P
B B
So he's not just a figment of our imaginations - a phantom that posters Photoshop pics of thongs on in many threads. Glad to hear he is well, he hashelped me spend a lot of moneygiven great advice always.
Mike
Well there was a suggestion that the 2010 National CVO gathering be held at his house due to many members such as yourself doubting his actual existence, but I think that got 86'd.
B B
One more drop and we'll be done (hopefully). One more time a big drop will scare the daylight out of everyone while the hedge funds cash out and election over (market hates uncertainty) and we should see the day light. :nervous: :nervous:We did have a drop but not as much as I expected. I think we see a big up followed buy down again (Dow 8100) by election day before moving upward to the end of the year window dressing. :nixweiss:
CEO --Chief Embezzlement Officer.So sad........but so true. :'( aaaaargh. spyder
CFO -- Corporate Fraud Officer.
BULL MARKET -- A random market movement causing an investor to mistake himself for a financial genius.
BEAR MARKET -- A 6 to 18 month period when the kids get no allowance, the wife gets no jewelry, and the husband gets no sex.
VALUE INVESTING -- The art of buying low and selling lower.
P/E RATIO -- The percentage of investors wetting their pants as the market keeps crashing.
BROKER -- What my financial advisor has made me.
STANDARD & POOR -- Your life in a nutshell.
STOCK ANALYST -- Idiot who just downgraded your stock.
STOCK SPLIT -- When your ex-wife and her lawyer split your assets equally between themselves.
FINANCIAL PLANNER -- A guy whose phone has been disconnected.
MARKET CORRECTION -- The day after you buy stocks.
CASH FLOW-- The movement your money makes as it disappears down the toilet.
YAHOO -- What you yell after selling it to some poor sucker for $240 per share.
WINDOWS -- What you jump out of when you're the sucker who bought Yahoo @$240 per share.
INSTITUTIONAL INVESTOR -- Former investor who's now locked up in a nuthouse.
PROFIT -- An archaic word no longer in use.