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[napalm]

I have an '08 SEUC...tried to order a fuel door off an '09 that has the CVO logo....guess what...ain't goning to happen.  Tried two different dealerships, could not order it with out a '09 vin number and a returned part.

Assembling the CVOs on the standard production line may in fact improve quality.

napalm

[chesterc]

I think it would be better too,   I bet if the regular models were experiencing some of these issues with chrome peeling, over-heating of certain models and all the other issues associated towards the cvo line-up.  Kinda make ya think with the limited numbers it's not that big a deal to harley, I bet they would correct the Quality issues if it was on their normal production line when they started having 1000's of claims a day from their higher produced bikes. Not knocking the 1 person building a bike thing, but their are definatley issues in their quality management, I know I would have been fired from my Quality/trouble-shooting/QC job a long time ago if I had sent products out over and over and with these issues.  Just dreading the thought of all the issues with the 09SE road-glide,is the only reason I haven't bought the one on the dealer floor, 30 grand and then  hope and pray it stays together.

[Fired00d]

I think it would be better too,   I bet if the regular models were experiencing some of these issues with chrome peeling, over-heating of certain models and all the other issues associated towards the cvo line-up.  Kinda make ya think with the limited numbers it's not that big a deal to harley, I bet they would correct the Quality issues if it was on their normal production line when they started having 1000's of claims a day from their higher produced bikes. Not knocking the 1 person building a bike thing, but their are definatley issues in their quality management, I know I would have been fired from my Quality/trouble-shooting/QC job a long time ago if I had sent products out over and over and with these issues.  Just dreading the thought of all the issues with the 09SE road-glide,is the only reason I haven't bought the one on the dealer floor, 30 grand and then  hope and pray it stays together.

Just wondering if the issues we are experiencing in regards to chrome peeling doesn't already exist and not as widespread since they aren't stock on other models. All the extra chrome we get on our bikes comes straight from the MoCo's P&A Catalog and when you add these to a regular model bike what is (if there is any) warranty? Off hand I'm thinking 30 days - year at the max. I'm not sure if a different group of people putting the bikes together is going to change the quality or lack of quality of the parts they are putting together.

 
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
 

[sixstringer99]

I come from the aerospace industry being a professional metallurgist.  From my experience it is possible that hand built items can be of vastly superior in quality like a hand built musical instrument.  But there is also a good possibility that the item, vehicle, or gadget can be of lesser quality by a single person as well depending on their capability and ultimate desire for perfection.  Just being hand built by one or two people doesn't guaranty quality.

Ironically most commercial aerospace companies these days are building the planes and structures according to the Toyota Production System (TPS).  We are now manufacturing a higher quality and more uniform product.  Believe me, big commercial aircraft are hand built by people.  It's the workmanship qualification of the technicians and mechanics and their adherence to process and quality that keep these big planes up in the air.  So what I am saying is that it is easily possible to have a larger group of people put together a high quality product like a motorcycle if the production is set up properly.

[PR3VS56]

Good to know there's always a human factor.

[hogwild11]

Well, I must admit that this deception worked.  I have a 2011 CUSE6 and I purchased it under the impression that is was built by a "dedicated few", not a normal assembly line..., and that's why (I was told) it costs so much more.  With an automotive background, I know each scenario has its pros and cons, however, I would have preferred knowing this up front. 

[Twolanerider]

Well, I must admit that this deception worked.  I have a 2011 CUSE6 and I purchased it under the impression that is was built by a "dedicated few", not a normal assembly line..., and that's why (I was told) it costs so much more.  With an automotive background, I know each scenario has its pros and cons, however, I would have preferred knowing this up front. 

Didn't know that the dealerships were still regularly spinning the "hand built" mantra.  Since the sales staffs often don't know beans about the current details of the products they could be just that far behind the curve.  Or it might just sound good to help make the sale....

[grc]

I come from the aerospace industry being a professional metallurgist.  From my experience it is possible that hand built items can be of vastly superior in quality like a hand built musical instrument.  But there is also a good possibility that the item, vehicle, or gadget can be of lesser quality by a single person as well depending on their capability and ultimate desire for perfection.  Just being hand built by one or two people doesn't guaranty quality.

Ironically most commercial aerospace companies these days are building the planes and structures according to the Toyota Production System (TPS).  We are now manufacturing a higher quality and more uniform product.  Believe me, big commercial aircraft are hand built by people.  It's the workmanship qualification of the technicians and mechanics and their adherence to process and quality that keep these big planes up in the air.  So what I am saying is that it is easily possible to have a larger group of people put together a high quality product like a motorcycle if the production is set up properly.

    Having a couple of the boss's favorites bolting and screwing on (up?) stuff somewhere in a converted hallway instead of on a purpose built assembly line definitely does NOT ensure quality.  Those of us with the older versions can attest to the fact that many of those supposedly hand built bikes were poorly assembled, with poorly fit components and all sorts of loose fasteners among the many problems right out of the crate.

Much of what makes current Harley's so poor in overall quality isn't related to how they are assembled, it's more about the poor quality of the cheapened designs and component parts.  Can't blame the guy on the assembly line for the crappy paint from that outside vendor, or the cheapened parts in the engines, or any of those fine pieces of Chinese chrome that flake before your eyes.

While much of the rest of the world has adopted the TPS, Harley seems to be sticking with their production system, the POS.  People with no knowledge of how a vehicle manufacturing plant works like to blame everything on the folks screwing the stuff together.  Those of us who have spent decades in similar industries know better.  Management is the key, and Harley has proved time and again that they don't measure up.  So don't worry about where your bike was screwed together, worry about the management decisions that compromise customer satisfaction and reliability, or worry about how those same manager's constantly try to avoid paying for their bad decisions by shifting the burden onto the customers and employee's.


Jerry