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Author Topic: Fueling lifters  (Read 1204 times)

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elderjim

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Fueling lifters
« on: December 29, 2017, 05:07:07 PM »

Has anyone here tried Fueling lifters? If so what did you think of them. Thank you in advance and God bless.
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2002FXDWG3

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Re: Fueling lifters
« Reply #1 on: December 29, 2017, 05:39:42 PM »

Yes, they appear to be the same as the (now discontinued) HD "B" lifers and the current S&S standard lifters made in USA by Delphi.
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Twolanerider

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Re: Fueling lifters
« Reply #2 on: December 29, 2017, 06:37:56 PM »

I've used and had good service from the Feuling HP+ lifters for years. 

I won't use their "race" lifters.  Witnessed failures with them enough to keep me from trying.  So the lesser expensive product I'm fine with.  The more expensive when I won't use.  Gotta love counter-intuitive cost savings.
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HD Street Performance

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Re: Fueling lifters
« Reply #3 on: December 29, 2017, 09:03:21 PM »

Lifters and cheap are a huge no no.
I suggest using Hylift Topline B2313SE
They are the best yet affordable and include axle oiling that none of them have.
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Twolanerider

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Re: Fueling lifters
« Reply #4 on: December 29, 2017, 09:24:52 PM »

Lifters and cheap are a huge no no.
I suggest using Hylift Topline B2313SE
They are the best yet affordable and include axle oiling that none of them have.

Completely agreed.  "Cheap" and any internal power train component that might strand you and/or cause a significant and expensive repair as a result of their failure is bad idea.  Cheaply made and lesser expensive than some alternatives are not always the same thing though.

There's yet another consideration with lifters also though.  They fail as part of the system they're a part of.  The same lifters that used to be "good" or that we never considered as "weak" now fail all too regularly; because of the overall valve train they are installed and forced to work within.

An issue with the B2313SE lifters (have used two sets of them, fortunately, without issue of any kind) is it's so hit and miss being able to buy the damn things.  Spotty inventory is a PITA.
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HD Street Performance

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Re: Fueling lifters
« Reply #5 on: December 29, 2017, 09:38:54 PM »

I have them
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digga25

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Re: Fueling lifters
« Reply #6 on: December 30, 2017, 09:24:39 AM »

I used a set of the race series in my 117 for 10 k miles,No issues
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wfolarry

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Re: Fueling lifters
« Reply #7 on: December 30, 2017, 09:37:19 AM »

An issue with the B2313SE lifters (have used two sets of them, fortunately, without issue of any kind) is it's so hit and miss being able to buy the damn things.  Spotty inventory is a PITA.

You're calling the wrong guy. Always in stock.
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Twolanerider

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Re: Fueling lifters
« Reply #8 on: December 30, 2017, 10:31:22 AM »

An issue with the B2313SE lifters (have used two sets of them, fortunately, without issue of any kind) is it's so hit and miss being able to buy the damn things.  Spotty inventory is a PITA.

You're calling the wrong guy. Always in stock.


Good to know.  Vendors on the site give site members a 10% discount too.  Next time someone here needs a set will keep you guys in mind.
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bakon

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Re: Fueling lifters
« Reply #9 on: December 30, 2017, 03:40:18 PM »

I have used them in two builds. Both with multiple miles on long highway days. No problems. Sold both bikes and neither have had a letter failure years later.
Putting the then in a 117 build right now. 

Never used the race lifters.

Did have one old style SE lifter give up and take out cams. Was on a .650 lift woods 400g. 

Also just removed the new SE which came stock in my 110. 29k miles. Still smooth.
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Will

prodrag1320

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Re: Fueling lifters
« Reply #10 on: December 31, 2017, 07:58:44 AM »

I would recommend S&S lifters.their all we will use here

wfolarry

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Re: Fueling lifters
« Reply #11 on: December 31, 2017, 11:19:02 AM »

 I have travel limiters too for the Hylift Johnsons for those that want them.
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FlaHeatWave

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Re: Fueling lifters
« Reply #12 on: January 03, 2018, 04:46:20 PM »

After experiencing fueling's dismal (lack of) quality control, tech support, and customer service, I'll never buy anything fueling again >:(

A few years back, I asked around the forums about lifters,,, S&S was recommended > 10-1 over any other lifter...
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bakon

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Re: Fueling lifters
« Reply #13 on: January 03, 2018, 05:07:51 PM »

My favorite part of forums....lack of agreement. One post says they are better than most, another says they are the same as others, then the worst thing ever post.  So then we have to weigh each opinion.  Who knows the most, owns a shop, posts the most, is the tallest?  Lastly we have to decide what to buy/use/install.  Which is usually just the most popular item with two technical posts and a bunch of "yeah I used them with peanut butter and it was much better than jelly."
 dont mean to offend....sorry if I did.
« Last Edit: January 03, 2018, 05:13:06 PM by bakon »
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Will

johnsachs

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Re: Fueling lifters
« Reply #14 on: January 03, 2018, 05:28:20 PM »

My favorite part of forums....lack of agreement. One post says they are better than most, another says they are the same as others, then the worst thing ever post.  So then we have to weigh each opinion.  Who knows the most, owns a shop, posts the most, is the tallest?  Lastly we have to decide what to buy/use/install.  Which is usually just the most popular item with two technical posts and a bunch of "yeah I used them with peanut butter and it was much better than jelly."
 dont mean to offend....sorry if I did.
And that's what makes horse racing.  :soapbox:
John
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HD Street Performance

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Re: Fueling lifters
« Reply #15 on: January 03, 2018, 05:47:53 PM »

The Topline-Hylift lifters have features the Delphi / S&S doesn't.  Consistent sizing on the OD, slow bleed, axle oiling.
Price is less than half of the premiums.
Another forum phenomena the perception that if one product is good everything else is junk. No so.
« Last Edit: January 03, 2018, 05:50:54 PM by HD Street Performance »
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FlaHeatWave

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Re: Fueling lifters
« Reply #16 on: January 03, 2018, 05:54:43 PM »

My favorite part of forums....lack of agreement. One post says they are better than most, another says they are the same as others, then the worst thing ever post.  So then we have to weigh each opinion.  Who knows the most, owns a shop, posts the most, is the tallest?  Lastly we have to decide what to buy/use/install.  Which is usually just the most popular item with two technical posts and a bunch of "yeah I used them with peanut butter and it was much better than jelly."
 dont mean to offend....sorry if I did.

Just like anything else in life,,, gather information, make your own decisions...

What one likes,,, another may not  :nixweiss:

Personally, I've gotten some great info from the Forums, and met some fine folks along the way...

You want to find disagreement (or a the most varied opinions) check out an Oil Thread or a Cam Thread...LMFAO ;D



« Last Edit: January 03, 2018, 05:59:27 PM by FlaHeatWave »
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bakon

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Re: Fueling lifters
« Reply #17 on: January 03, 2018, 06:03:19 PM »

Been part of motorcycle forums since 2001. I figured out Mobil 1 is best for S&S parts but Amzoil is too slippery and causes bearing flat spots....
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Will

fastfreddy

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Re: Fueling lifters
« Reply #18 on: January 03, 2018, 06:23:15 PM »

Been part of motorcycle forums since 2001. I figured out Mobil 1 is best for S&S parts but Amzoil is too slippery and causes bearing flat spots....
lmfao   :2vrolijk_21:
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Twolanerider

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Re: Fueling lifters
« Reply #19 on: January 03, 2018, 06:37:47 PM »

lmfao   :2vrolijk_21:

Both of them will leak too.  Because their molecules are too flat for round seals. 
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bakon

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Re: Fueling lifters
« Reply #20 on: January 03, 2018, 07:29:11 PM »

I forgot about that. Been putting Honda seal all over the primary trying to stop it. Damm ball bearings
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Will

Twolanerider

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Re: Fueling lifters
« Reply #21 on: January 03, 2018, 08:28:50 PM »

I forgot about that. Been putting Honda seal all over the primary trying to stop it. Damm ball bearings

Referencing the Honda seals I would say something about how all those Japanese molecules seal alike. But that would be racist and, therefore, wrong. 
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TIMINATOR

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Re: Fueling lifters
« Reply #22 on: January 28, 2018, 12:21:48 PM »

Travel limiters are irrelevant if you adjust the lifters UP a half turn from the bottom. That's enough to take up any heat growth in the cylinders and heads, and yet limit the bleed down that ALL hydraulic lifters have. Lifter bleed down saps horsepower. Of course you need to have adjustable pushrods, and you should have those if you are trying to make any reasonable HP anyway. JMHO   TIMINATOR
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HD Street Performance

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Re: Fueling lifters
« Reply #23 on: January 28, 2018, 12:36:33 PM »

What if the valves float and there is .170" of plunger pump up. That is a quarter inch + of valve action.
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MCE Performance

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Re: Fueling lifters
« Reply #24 on: January 30, 2018, 08:38:49 PM »

What if the valves float and there is .170" of plunger pump up. That is a quarter inch + of valve action.

If the pushrods are already adjusted so the plunger is all the way out  (less a slight preload) that's not
really possible. Additionally; the only way a lifter "pumps up" is when the spring can't control the valve train.
The lifter pumps up when the lifter comes off the cam lobe.

So if your lifters are "pumping up" your springs can't handle the rpm/cam profile. Simple as that.
« Last Edit: January 30, 2018, 08:47:34 PM by MCE Performance »
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MCE Performance

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Re: Fueling lifters
« Reply #25 on: January 30, 2018, 08:55:35 PM »

Valve "float" (inadequate spring pressure) will destroy the lifter bearings faster than anything else.
Like a missed shift at full rpm
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TIMINATOR

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Re: Fueling lifters
« Reply #26 on: January 31, 2018, 09:00:12 AM »

Valve float was largely a phenomenon of the 1970s when computer generated fast acting lobes started to appear,  and Spintrons and high speed photography hadn't caught on yet (or been able to be affordable for the small guys). Spring surge, "fuss" points, and harmonics were not much understood yet, by the small cam grinders anyway. Their "solution" to a misunderstood problem was to make the lifters bleed off quicker. Back then when lobe design had eclipsed spring design, float was common. In the last 20+ years we only see evidence of float mebbie once a year, if that, and almost never from the major cam companies products, and usually the end result of a "mix and match" approach to parts purchase, and desire to save a few bucks.
Using the springs and retainers from the same company, of the same set of parts, designed for each other, and employing the correct installed height, in the proper designed for operating range, pretty well guarantees satisfactory  results. Small companies that don't have all of the required bazillion dollar research departments are the ones that have surge, harmonic, and float issues.
The small companies that only grind cams, and buy others ancillary parts from wherever is cheapest, are companies we stay away from. Do you really think that some small company that grinds a small amount of cams, and has claimed to have "re-invented the wheel" has anywhere the amount of resources to investigate all properties of their own, or everyone else's parts?
Why do you think that the large companies are not following the lead of these small guys? Even I have a cam analyzer, an inexpensive one is less than $5 grand, so I can analyze cam profiles. With one of those anyone can analyze every degree (of the 720 degrees in the event) to a 10 thousandth of an inch and tenth of a degree. So there is a reason that the big guys are not copying what the small guys are doing, maybe the profile makes power, but at the expense of valve train stability or longevity. Its the same deal with the header companies that claim to make more power than everybody else, all it takes to find out what is happening there, is a ruler, dial veneer caliper and a dyno.
As far as hydraulic roller cams are concerned, I was the unwitting "guinea Pig" of a then large companies new hydraulic roller cam program in the early 1980s. I figured out their problem in a couple of weeks on my own, and when confronted, they admitted their errors. Search this and other boards for "hydraulic roller lifter issues".
 Trust me. The big guys all know what the small guys are doing, but the reverse can't be said. JMHO    TIMINATOR
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