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[CVORick]

Took the bike in to the dealer to have the right grip replaced on Monday.  Told them I was in no rush.  Received a call this morning and the dealer asked me "Have you noticed a "ticking" sound coming fro the valve train?"  Almost laughed, as he knows I wear hearing aids and I never wear them when I ride.  I am sure when I rode it to the dealer it was not "ticking" loud enough for me to hear it.  The dealer opened it up and oil was full of metal pieces.  One of the lifters had failed and come apart.  Looks like new everything for the inside. They were pulling the cylinders and pistons as we were talking.  Going over to dealer in the morning to discuss how I want it rebuilt, different lifters, cams, pushrods, etc..., or will it have to be a new engine from the MOCO.  All this time I thought I had a good one!!!  Only 35,000 plus miles.  More tomorrow.

[Robmay]

What time you heading down Rick? If I can pull away from work I'll try and swing by for a minute or two.

[CVORick]

What time you heading down Rick? If I can pull away from work I'll try and swing by for a minute or two.

Probably between noon and 1PM.  This will be interesting.  I'm not upset or angry at all.  Life is to short and today was a good day.

[HILLSIDECYCLE.COM]

Perfect time to have those folks turn lemons, into lemonade for you.
Scott

[CVORick]

Perfect time to have those folks turn lemons, into lemonade for you.
Scott

Totally agree.  Looking forward to an interesting series of upgrades.

[Robmay]

Probably between noon and 1PM.  This will be interesting.  I'm not upset or angry at all.  Life is to short and today was a good day.

Hope to see you then. I'll be on the purty red ultra road glide....

[CVORick]

May be a little later, but will make effort to be there.

[Robmay]

May be a little later, but will make effort to be there.

Don't rush it or change it on my account. I will try to swing by closer to 1 and hang out with some of the sales guys. If I get to meet you that's great. If not, we can hook up some other time.

[CVORick]

Well it was a lifter bearing failure.  Don't remember which cylinder, rear i think, but metal ruined the crank, oil pump and cams for sure.  See attached pictures.

[CVORick]

Cams

[CVORick]

Oil Pump

[HD Street Performance]

Where did that metal travel and what else did it take in it's path? If I owned the bike I would be pulling the motor and pan and going back from there every piece inspected, changed and/or cleaned.

[RCFlyer]

It's only a scratch!! Just kidding. It looks pretty bad. I agree that a total tear down would be needed to make sure other parts weren't damaged. I know I'd want it done.  Good luck. I hope it comes out alright.

[CVORick]

Engine is coming out,  the case split and new crank and bearings going back inside.  They will also inspect while split and look for any other damage.  Going to put 259E cams and 10.5 to 1 pistons on the rebuild with S&S Lifters with travel limiters and tapered pushrods (Thank you SBB for all your troubles, I mean experiences).  Heads looked okay.  Will keep you posted.

[Fired00d]

Engine is coming out,  the case split and new crank and bearings going back inside.  They will also inspect while split and look for any other damage.  Going to put 259E cams and 10.5 to 1 pistons on the rebuild with S&S Lifters with travel limiters and tapered pushrods (Thank you SBB for all your troubles, I mean experiences).  Heads looked okay.  Will keep you posted.

Thought about having the crank trued/welded? May be a good time to spend a few dollars extra while the cases are split.

 
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
 

[mjb765]

Thought about having the crank trued/welded? May be a good time to spend a few dollars extra while the cases are split.

 
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
 

I would not pass up the opportunity to do that!!!! 

[Fired00d]

I would not pass up the opportunity to do that!!!! 

Me either... especially when the disassemble/assembly is being done on the MoCo's dime.

 
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
 

[DANYHD76]

It arrived to me the same problem and I ask Harley France to mount a new engine.
I am in disagreement with them which want to repair the engine
See the bond http://www.cvoharley.com/smf/index.php?topic=54085.0

Good courage

[HD Street Performance]

Congrats on the engine fix, now starting to not sound "sketchy" as my son says.


"Heads looked okay"
How would ya know? They all look good. Pull the valves and measure the clearance, stem fit. Look closely at the exhausts and signs of galling. Replace the seals with the latest revision and torque the ACRs at bare minimum if the fit pans out.

[SBB]

Congrats on the engine fix, now starting to not sound "sketchy" as my son says.


"Heads looked okay"
How would ya know? They all look good. Pull the valves and measure the clearance, stem fit. Look closely at the exhausts and signs of galling. Replace the seals with the latest revision and torque the ACRs at bare minimum if the fit pans out.

Good advise Don!

How would ya know? They all look good.

I wouldn't know how to tell.

I'm sure Rick is taking all this in.

Any help I'm sure is appreciated.

SBB

[CVORick]

Thanks for all the information and comments.  Don, "the heads looked good" was a statement from me. You right, how the hell would I know. Just a cursory look by me , but I will have the dealer do a thorough check of the heads as well.  This is the perfect opportunity check it all.  Getting the crank trued or welded?  Is this something the dealer would do or do they send it out?  Going back to talk to them tomorrow.  Again, thanks for everyones input.

[Fired00d]

Thanks for all the information and comments.  Don, "the heads looked good" was a statement from me. You right, how the hell would I know. Just a cursory look by me , but I will have the dealer do a thorough check of the heads as well.  This is the perfect opportunity check it all.  Getting the crank trued or welded?  Is this something the dealer would do or do they send it out?  Going back to talk to them tomorrow.  Again, thanks for everyones input.

More then likely send it out... search the site for "Darkhorse Crankworks"... they've got a good reputation for this type of work and there may be others that can do it too.

 
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
 

[Fired00d]

If you do decide to get the crank "trued/welded" might also want to consider "Timken" bearings.

All these will create a solid foundation (reliability) for your motor and if you ever decided to increase HP/TQ more then what you presently have in mind you'll have peace of mind in the future knowing that there is a "solid foundation" (crank) to build it on.

 
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
 

[aclass]

I dont think I understand the "lifter bearing",      From reading the threads my perception is a lifter came apart but what exactly happened to it?

[SBB]

http://www.darkhorsecrankworks.com/



SBB

[CVORick]

I dont think I understand the "lifter bearing",      From reading the threads my perception is a lifter came apart but what exactly happened to it?

The roller on the end of the lifter has needle bearing in it to help it spin.  The roller was still on the lifter but the bearing had come apart and gone through the oil pump.  Understand that sometimes the roller comes off as well.  The rest is history, as they say.

[CVORick]

Will check out Dark Horse.  Thanks.

[Robmay]

Rick,

Any updates? Get your bike back yet?

[Boatman]

Well it was a lifter bearing failure.  Don't remember which cylinder, rear i think, but metal ruined the crank, oil pump and cams for sure.  See attached pictures.

In this first picture with the end of the crankshaft, it appears that some of the rollers in the bearing that is in the case are gone (that supports the crank)??

[CVORick]

Rick,

Any updates? Get your bike back yet?

Should be picking it up today.  Also, Boatman, attached is a different pic of the crankshaft.  The old rollers were all still there.

[Boatman]

Should be picking it up today.  Also, Boatman, attached is a different pic of the crankshaft.  The old rollers were all still there.

Good to know the crank bearing hadn't failed.  Hope you have a big grin on the ride home today!

[murphy]

You should probably make sure they have pulled the oil pan and cleaned it out too... some folks forget that part when little metal chunks are found floating around.

When my stuff went we had a look in the pan just in case... took another half hour or so to flush all the fine metal powder that congregated in there as well!

[CVORick]

Well, I didn't get the crank trued/balanced or install the timken bearing or the 10.5 to 1 pistons, but I did put in the SE259E cams.  Finally got it down to Doc yesterday and had it retuned. When Doc went retune with TTS, as my dealer had used my SERT key to install a "base map" for the new cam, we discovered that my dealer had installed a 2010 map.  Brilliant!!  I thought the bike was running poorly. DUH!  After correcting the map and tuning, the final numbers were 105.52 Max H.P. and 114.56 Max Torque.  Not to shabby.

[RedDevil]

Well, I didn't get the crank trued/balanced or install the timken bearing or the 10.5 to 1 pistons, but I did put in the SE259E cams.  Finally got it down to Doc yesterday and had it retuned. When Doc went retune with TTS, as my dealer had used my SERT key to install a "base map" for the new cam, we discovered that my dealer had installed a 2010 map.  Brilliant!!  I thought the bike was running poorly. DUH!  After correcting the map and tuning, the final numbers were 105.52 Max H.P. and 114.56 Max Torque.  Not to shabby.

Do you have a copy of the dyno run to share with us.  I'd like to see when your torque peaks and see if it's a relatively flat torque line once it peaks.  Those are nice numbers, but for me I need to see if the torque comes on at around 2700 rpms instead of up around 4500.  I'm rarely up there when I ride.

[CVORick]

Your right RedDevil.  See attached. Also now has 38 disk in Supertrapp.  Did have 32 disk.

[RedDevil]

Your right RedDevil.  See attached.

Thanks Rick.  That looks pretty nice.  Torque "comes on" starting at around 3K.  Not too shabby.  Nice stead HP climb up to peak.  Looks like you found a winner there.  

[CVORick]

Here is what the curve looked like with the 255 cam. This run had 32 disks in Supertrapp.

[Rio]

call the bomb squad first!!