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[Robertschmidt1982]

I'm so relived to have found something wrong at least. You spend a chit ton of money building and tuning to get bad numbers and it makes a guy sick. I feel confident now that the numbers will be where I want them. Where the gears were set before, was I advanced or retarded in the timing? And would that be a significant loss in hp/torque?

[Twolanerider]

Unfortunate you had to dig back in but it feels good when you find a problem.  You are ATDC.  That's a 34 tooth gear so the math comes from that number.

While you're that far in did you go ahead and pull the gear itself yet to make sure the cams themselves are in time with each other?  I'd still check measure what comes out of the sump as well.  Too far in not to double check everything.

[JKM]

you said in the dealer installed a "103 map".  Did the dealer just use a canned map?  I would have it properly dyno tuned with a custom map from a reputable tuner.

[Robertschmidt1982]

I just did a baseline run with a canned map. To enter every value and do a full dyno tune was out of my budget for the moment. He did lean up my fuel mixture a bit as it was in the high 14s and upper 11s is where he thought it should be. I have the cables and intend to download the programming so I can tweek on it a lil. I did stack the v&h on top of the se race tuner. I called the tech at v&h and he said it was ok to do so with the new fp# for the stage II 103 map. If I end up doing a full dyno tune down the road, I'll prob eliminate the fuel pak.

[Robertschmidt1982]

Twolanerider: I did pull both gears and checked timing on the cams. They are in time. Thanks everyone for your help. Hopefully I'll get some numbers and report back. It will prob have to wait till spring at this point:(

[johnsachs]

Kinda put the cart before the horse. If you took a compression test you would have known if it was advanced or retarded. 
Your dyno results show me you were ADVANCED. Lucky you did no damage. 
John

[timo482]

do NOT use a fuel pak on top of se tuner - you are getting bad advice dude.

of course the guy at v&h told you it was ok - thats how they make money.. its really NOT a very good idea at all.

running perfect the bike should be about 13.9 to 14.6 isn - setting it to 11 is way way rich - out of the o2 range and going to make it just guzzzzzzzzle gas.

if its out of the 02 sensor range in normal driving down the street speeds the computer is just blindly pouring gas in there.

[Robertschmidt1982]

I might be wrong on the numbers. The mixture was in the 14s... It was running a lil rich. He leaned it up. So which ever way the numbers go... You're suggesting to remove the fuel pak. They haven't made a dime off of me. If I can get a good reason to remove it, I will. I'm impartial to having it or not. Let's talk reasoning:)

[Robertschmidt1982]

I would have run a compression check but my checker didn't have the correct end on it so I decided that the best way was to go into the motor and recheck my work. Glad I did as by the pic you can see I was off a cog.

[Twolanerider]

 Let's talk reasoning:)

It is belt and suspenders.  Both are tuning devices (though the Fuel Pak is a rather crippled attempt at being such with comparatively minimal function).  If you've got the option of two tools with which redundancy has no value why use the lesser one when you can use the better?

[sadunbar]

Kinda put the cart before the horse. If you took a compression test you would have known if it was advanced or retarded. 
Your dyno results show me you were ADVANCED. Lucky you did no damage. 
John

 

[Twolanerider]

I would have run a compression check but my checker didn't have the correct end on it so I decided that the best way was to go into the motor and recheck my work. Glad I did as by the pic you can see I was off a cog.

Don't be too worried, especially after the fact, about any "coulda, woulda, shoulda's."  You didn't have a compression tool so you couldn't use one.  No big deal.  You had a 15 degree Minnesota Saturday and that's got to be as good a tool as any to get some work done on the bike (unless you didn't have a heated work area, then you're just freaking nuts!).

[Twolanerider]

One other question I think I can read from the thread but am not absolutely sure.  Did the shop that gave you they dyno report actually attempt to tune the bike while the gears were out of sync or did they just load a map for something that was "close" and give you a dyno report based on that map?

If they actually attempted to tune anything you really need to get it retuned before you ride much.  Timing curves could be a real mess as they tried to chase what was there.  If they just loaded some close map and didn't alter anything after that it's not such a concern. 

Would still lose the FP though if the loaded map is supposed to be close.

[Robertschmidt1982]

Like I said I'm not partial to the fuel pak. I can nix it.

[Robertschmidt1982]

They loaded a few maps trying to get the horses up. The stage II 103 added the most gains. The only thing they adjusted is the air fuel mix. I couldn't afford a dyno tune so it was just a baseline after they installed the map. Lacrosse area Harley has a dyno and a really good guy running it. He was at a loss as to why the numbers were so chitty. Had they done the cam job, I'm sure it woulda been done right the first time and I woulda seen great numbers. And yeah, my shop is heated lol.