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CVO Technical => Wheels/Tires/Suspension/Brakes => Topic started by: beefcake on April 24, 2017, 09:56:29 AM
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so i had a set of dna wheels put on the bike last week, 23" front, and 18" rear.
i have this odd sway rock now, not at all speeds and not in all gears.
at first it felt like the bike was rocking side to side at the handlebars, like the balance was off up front, but i was standing there when they balanced the front tire and got it to 0
i was on the hwy at 70, and in 6th gear, it got really bad, felt unsafe. my buddy was behind me, and said he sould see the rear end swaying from side to side, i imagine this is what is making my handle bars up front feel like they are rocking.
he said it doesn't seem like it's leaning from his view, literally that the rear end is going left then right then left then right.
again, not all speeds,
any idea what the issue is.
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Is it dogtracking? You can check cheaply by going through a puddle and see if the tracks line up.
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if thats the rear end, going from side to side
left to right, then yes. don't need to go through water, you can see it clear as day riding behind it, moving at least a few inches side to side
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Could be a tire separating (especially if it's a Metzler)? or a rim out of true? improper inflation? Improper Bearing / not installed properly?
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Did you also install a set of raked trees and leg extensions to correct the rake and trail? If not there is your problem. Installation of a 23" front wheel without doing so is creating a death trap.
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Could be a tire separating (especially if it's a Metzler)? or a rim out of true? improper inflation? Improper Bearing / not installed properly?
yes, just installed new metzler 888s
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Did you also install a set of raked trees and leg extensions to correct the rake and trail? If not there is your problem. Installation of a 23" front wheel without doing so is creating a death trap.
no leg extensions, but the dna kit did come with a raked tree
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if thats the rear end, going from side to side
left to right, then yes. don't need to go through water, you can see it clear as day riding behind it, moving at least a few inches side to side
No, dogtracking is when the rear wheel is tracking different than the front one. Bad alignment, one wheel spaced too far the wrong way, etc. It'll keep trying to correct itself, but the bad track keeps pulling it out.
If you ruled out the rake I'd check that. The reason to go through water is to lay down two paths so you can see how off it might be. We used to ride them through paint so the tracks lasted longer.
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No, dogtracking is when the rear wheel is tracking different than the front one. Bad alignment, one wheel spaced too far the wrong way, etc. It'll keep trying to correct itself, but the bad track keeps pulling it out.
If you ruled out the rake I'd check that. The reason to go through water is to lay down two paths so you can see how off it might be. We used to ride them through paint so the tracks lasted longer.
problem is, doesn't always feel like it's doing it all the time, mosltly light throttle stuff, at 70 in 5th, really don't notice it, in 6th, same speed on cruise, much more noticeable, quick accelerating not noticeable.
25 mph zone, light throttle, noticeable
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problem is, doesn't always feel like it's doing it all the time, mosltly light throttle stuff, at 70 in 5th, really don't notice it, in 6th, same speed on cruise, much more noticeable, quick accelerating not noticeable.
25 mph zone, light throttle, noticeable
It could be anything from the guy put the tires on with the arrow the wrong way to bushings to air pressure. Air pressure issues, you can test and fill the rear tire to the max PSI listed on the sidewall and go for a real short and easy ride at 25 to see if that changes anything?
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I know that on Touring Bikes there are spacers that go on the axle on each side of the rear wheel. They are specific from left to right. I wonder if they could have been left out? Maybe just the caliper keeping it located? :nixweiss:
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I know that on Touring Bikes there are spacers that go on the axle on each side of the rear wheel. They are specific from left to right. I wonder if they could have been left out? Maybe just the caliper keeping it located? :nixweiss:
the entire rear is moving, not the tire by itself
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For the hell of it, check the upper stabilizer, I had one that the ball on the frame side froze and wouldn't pivot so it broke off in the frame, it acted like something wrong in the rear wheel, this was on my 2015 Street Glide Special (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170424/87c545708b0688bce86b4100aed5c69b.jpg)
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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This is another of those things that look cool, to some, and ruin the ride quality of an expensive bike. The shop that mounted the tires/wheels & installed the rake kit has some responsibility here for returning bike to you in unsafe riding condition and to not install longer legs not good at all. You need them.
Quit riding the bike until you find the problem.is
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This sounds unsafe. I would bring it back to the shop that did the work and have them check everything and get the problem resolved.
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Another thing that can cause the "tail wagging the dog" affect relates to the head bearing preload. While most people understand that a loose head bearing can cause front end wobble, many don't realize that a too tight head bearing can cause a weave condition where the rear moves side to side because the front can't automatically make those tiny corrections most are unaware of as they ride. So one more item to be checked to make sure the installer actually set the preload to spec and didn't just crank it down and proclaim it good enough for government work.
Jerry
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so i had a set of dna wheels put on the bike last week, 23" front, and 18" rear.
i have this odd sway rock now, not at all speeds and not in all gears.
at first it felt like the bike was rocking side to side at the handlebars, like the balance was off up front, but i was standing there when they balanced the front tire and got it to 0
i was on the hwy at 70, and in 6th gear, it got really bad, felt unsafe. my buddy was behind me, and said he sould see the rear end swaying from side to side, i imagine this is what is making my handle bars up front feel like they are rocking.
he said it doesn't seem like it's leaning from his view, literally that the rear end is going left then right then left then right.
again, not all speeds,
any idea what the issue is.
I haven't read all the posts in this thread. But I can tell you that what you describe is exactly what I felt when we were on our way back from the Santa Maria weekend get together. I was sure it was up front. But when we stopped, the two guys riding behind me told me that my rear end was swinging from side to side as we went down the freeway. Tires looked good, both had air. I got back on and rode another 10-20 miles it gradually got worse.
Long story short.....it was the wheel bearings in the rear wheel. Totally gone, the bearing races were destroyed and the hub had rusty water in it. :nixweiss:
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the entire rear is moving, not the tire by itself
Have you found out anything? Have me really curious about this as the symptoms sound exactly the same. :nixweiss:
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gonna drop it off tonight
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Just curious, do you still have the OEM wheels? Maybe swap them back on and ride it to see if the issue is still there.
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How did you make out with this?
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I haven't read all the posts in this thread. But I can tell you that what you describe is exactly what I felt when we were on our way back from the Santa Maria weekend get together. I was sure it was up front. But when we stopped, the two guys riding behind me told me that my rear end was swinging from side to side as we went down the freeway. Tires looked good, both had air. I got back on and rode another 10-20 miles it gradually got worse.
Long story short.....it was the wheel bearings in the rear wheel. Totally gone, the bearing races were destroyed and the hub had rusty water in it. :nixweiss:
Might want to mention why it had "rusty water in it"
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How did you make out with this?
so, we took off the 6" dna tree, and put on the american suspension tree with the 11" rake, and the longer legs, put in progressive springs.
and... same thing.
up to 65, i can ride the bike with no hands on cruise , and it's straight as an arrow. over 70 the wobble starts, (light throttle), 80 it's horrilbe, (light throttle)
i can WOT it to 100 and it feels fine, but when you let off, it wobbles bad, til you get it down to 65, last week on the highway, at 75 hit a bump on the highway and wobble starts and it just wont stop til you get her back to 65, i'm at a loss, the bike shop wants to put a "stabilizer bar"on it, says no way its the rear bearing. so who knows
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so, we took off the 6" dna tree, and put on the american suspension tree with the 11" rake, and the longer legs, put in progressive springs.
and... same thing.
up to 65, i can ride the bike with no hands on cruise , and it's straight as an arrow. over 70 the wobble starts, (light throttle), 80 it's horrilbe, (light throttle)
i can WOT it to 100 and it feels fine, but when you let off, it wobbles bad, til you get it down to 65, last week on the highway, at 75 hit a bump on the highway and wobble starts and it just wont stop til you get her back to 65, i'm at a loss, the bike shop wants to put a "stabilizer bar"on it, says no way its the rear bearing. so who knows
Is it the same wheel with both front ends?
Also, did he shop simply "say" it wasn't the rear with the tail wagging the dog? Or did they actually check anything?
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Pickard guarantees no wobble with their trees if you think it is a geometry issue. I've used several sets without a single issue.
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Is it the same wheel with both front ends?
Also, did he shop simply "say" it wasn't the rear with the tail wagging the dog? Or did they actually check anything?
yes, same front wheel, i watched them balance the front, it balanced to 0, i didn't see them balance the rear though. all they did was change trees out, the guy at american suspension said it was the geometry of the bike, and he hasn't had any issue with the bigger wheels, but it still didn't fix it
Pickard guarantees no wobble with their trees if you think it is a geometry issue. I've used several sets without a single issue.
actually completely untrue, i spoke to him, and he said he tells guys they have to go to a smaller rear , a 16" to cure the "wobble", why, i have no idea, as the overall diameter is the same. i'm not quite sure what that has to do with it.
the guy at american suspension says thats because pickard can't get it to work with an 18 where he can, but, mine is still doint it.
At this point, i don't know if it's a bearing, , if it's a geometry issue, or if it's a "wheel / balance" issue. , or, if its just expected with a big wheel at those speeds.
i can ride at 65 and enjoy it, but.....i like to go quick , and regularly do roll racing. and highways have speed limits to 75, so i'd really like to find the issue
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actually completely untrue,
They offer something.... :nixweiss:
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Interesting as we all ran/run 18's with our 23's (6+/- of us). I went to a 16" for the low profile tire that's one inch shorter overall than the 18". I eventually went back to the 18" for the matching wheel. Regardless, you still have a wobble and need to find it.
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I realize this is an old thread but i'm having the exact same issue, any chance you got this resolved and can share?