www.CVOHARLEY.com
CVO Technical => Drive Train => Topic started by: Ironhorse on September 11, 2017, 08:55:57 AM
-
My '06 CVO Ultra came with a hydraulic clutch. It engages almost at the end point of release. I've been told that there is no adjustment and that's how they are.
Yesterday I rode my cousins 2015 Ultra Limited which also has a hydraulic clutch. His releases at the midway point.
Why is that?
Can mine be made to operate like his?
-
The Hydraulic Clutches in the '05 SEEG (bone stock, factory recommended amount of Formula+) and the '09 SERG (Alto Carbonite Plate Kit, AIM VP-95, SE Heavy Duty Spring, 1qt of Formula+ or Redline Primary Fluid) both have linear engagement centered in the lever travel, a motorcop would love it friction zone... Lever effort is the same at lower RPMs, effort increases on the '09 as RPMs climb and the AIM spools up...
The '05 has 62,xxx mi, the '09 59,xxx so far...
When upgrading the Charging System on the '05 (60k), discovered the Clutch Hub Splines degrading,,, no discernible symptoms,,, guess we caught it in time :confused5: replaced the Clutch Assembly...
Both Bikes have had the Clutch Hydraulic Fluid flushed & filled (at Dealer) as PM at least once...
'Had the opportunity to ride "Unbalanced" 131" '04 SEEG ;D (CVO Hyd Clutch, SE Billet Clutch Assembly), engagement was smooth & linear, great friction zone, at the end of lever travel, engaging "all the way out" took a little getting used to, as over the years I've always adjusted my (cable) Clutches to engage in the middle of lever travel. After I got used to it, no big deal, thinking about it,,, engagement at the last bit of travel can be advantageous (as long as no Slip is incurred), there is more lever travel applied to dis-engagement, less drag / clunking...
With Hydraulic Clutch Actuation, it is not necessary to have lever "freeplay" as with Cable Clutches,,, so as long as it's not slipping, engagement all the way out is fine with me. :2vrolijk_21:
'Thinking that stack heights / bearing depths come into play more than anything else...
fwiw, I recommend periodic Hydraulic Fluid replacement (25k-30k has worked for me) although it hasn't changed engagement, it makes me feel better :P
Ironhorse, Is your '06 Clutch stock?? How many miles?? Have you owned since new?? Any motorcop stuff??
-
the engagement on my 13 & 16 are bout same point half to 3/4 area of lever travel, its not adjustable and i just accept it. i dont even think about it.... except the one time the master went south and it started to to engage the clutch at a red light all by itself. that was on the 13 & HD took care of that...no issue since. also the 13 has a bandit clutch in it, and lever engagement is the same as it was with the stock clutch
-
I've been wondering if a different length of actuator rod would help. Not sure how much change would be needed to get it where the lever is at mid-travel, and still get complete disengagement. :nixweiss:
-
I always adjusted my cable clutches to release at the end of the travel. Quicker shifts there when I was younger, but when I got the 05 SEEG and it released at the end from the factory I was pleased, also my 09 and the current 15 all are that way and in my opinion that is how it should be. Not sure why so much effort is extended (or so it sounds from reading about this over the years on this site) or why anyone wants it anywhere but the end.
-
I always adjusted my cable clutches to release at the end of the travel. Quicker shifts there when I was younger, but when I got the 05 SEEG and it released at the end from the factory I was pleased, also my 09 and the current 15 all are that way and in my opinion that is how it should be. Not sure why so much effort is extended (or so it sounds from reading about this over the years on this site) or why anyone wants it anywhere but the end.
It might have something to do with the large difference in hand sizes, grip strength, etc. among the bike riding populace. If your hands are on the average or smaller side and the clutch releases and engages way out at the end of travel, it is harder to pull some clutch levers and harder to feather the clutch engagement. It also has a psychological component for those who grew up with cable clutches and free play adjustments. I personally like mine to engage and disengage near the middle of available travel with the ability to feather the engagement when required. The light switch off/on type is not for me, and is actually a good sign of a bad design or components. No one other than a dragster rider wants a light switch clutch (the dragster guys don't care because the electronics control "feathering" of the clutch anyway).
What I find unsettling about all this is the huge amount of variation in Harley's system. If everything is designed right and the parts are all made to tight tolerances, there shouldn't be the huge differences reported over the years from one bike to the next.
JMHO - Jerry
-
It might have something to do with the large difference in hand sizes, grip strength, etc. among the bike riding populace. If your hands are on the average or smaller side and the clutch releases and engages way out at the end of travel, it is harder to pull some clutch levers and harder to feather the clutch engagement. It also has a psychological component for those who grew up with cable clutches and free play adjustments. I personally like mine to engage and disengage near the middle of available travel with the ability to feather the engagement when required. The light switch off/on type is not for me, and is actually a good sign of a bad design or components. No one other than a dragster rider wants a light switch clutch (the dragster guys don't care because the electronics control "feathering" of the clutch anyway).
What I find unsettling about all this is the huge amount of variation in Harley's system. If everything is designed right and the parts are all made to tight tolerances, there shouldn't be the huge differences reported over the years from one bike to the next.
JMHO - Jerry
IMHO, the design seems to be close, if not right,,, :nixweiss: tight tolerances,,, well, that's another story...
-
So... I bought a used 08 CVO Ultra Classic Electraglide about 2 years ago... the only issue I’ve had with it is the voltage regulator... till today... got hung up in some stop and go traffic for about 45 minutes... when we started rolling again, when I shifted, if felt like my clutch levar was spongy... then No clutch, fortunately I was only in third gear at this point... I rode to the next exit and by the time I got to a stopping point I had clutch again... two thoughts...
1. how would you stop safely if you can’t get to neutral if the clutch is not disengaging when pulled... I had the wife on the back so I didn’t think I was gonna be able to hold it up with this type of stop cause she would have freaked out and tried to jump off, lol
2. I went home and got my trailer, when loading it, Clutch seemed normal Again... I found this odd... could the traffic (stop and go) overheated the clutch system somehow... and when it cooled the problem disappeared?
I’m not an expert rider, obviously, but I do want to be as safe as possible, what are your thoughts on this issue?
-
I'm no Harley expert but, somewhere on a previous thread, there was talk of a hydraulic line being run too close to the exhaust causing the symptoms that you describe.
Of course, it could have applied to the brake line ... I have a GREAT memory ... My recall sucks.
I'll be following this topic.
Cheers,
Smoketown
-
I'm no Harley expert but, somewhere on a previous thread, there was talk of a hydraulic line being run too close to the exhaust causing the symptoms that you describe.
Of course, it could have applied to the brake line ... I have a GREAT memory ... My recall sucks.
I'll be following this topic.
Cheers,
Smoketown
Very common issue. You can search the forum and probably find several threads / posts about the issue. Problem is that over time moisture gets in to the brake fluid (clutch uses same brake fluid as the brakes) then when it gets hot enough the water vaporizes inside the line and it doesn't compress as it would in a liquid state. When it cools off and becomes liquid again then function is restored. But having this happen once will lower the boiling point of the fluid and it will happen even easier in the future. The clutch (and the rear brake) line is very close to the exhaust so getting stuck in traffic can get the fluid hot enough for the water in it to vaporize.
This is why Harley recommends you flush the clutch and brake lines every two years regardless of mileage to prevent this from happening. Flush your lines with fresh brake fluid from a new sealed container.
-
I have a 2015 Street Glide and have posted on the late clutch engagement (Asst/Slip) been living with it, but hate the late engagement and the lack of progressive engaging, I feel many like myself dislike this too too. All clutches work on the same general principal. I never rode a Jap bike with a flakey clutch.
-
I have a 2015 Street Glide and have posted on the late clutch engagement (Asst/Slip) been living with it, but hate the late engagement and the lack of progressive engaging, I feel many like myself dislike this too too.
Yep, ruined my riding experience, till I discovered the fix, (37000295 - a slightly thicker judder spring seat) which works well.
-
My 2017 CVO Streetglide clutch hits right at the very end also. Was hard to get used to.