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[MJZ]

Hell, I've bought my 4th bike this year, 2 BMW's, 1 Triumph and a KTM and at this point I wouldn't spend a penny on a SE. After 3 SE's and spending a fortune on all of them after the initial buy, at 57,  I would think I'm their target buyer. Damn have they ever screwed the pooch. But I still love to sit in the garage and look at my nana, just have no desire to ride it.

[spydglide]

Hell, I've bought my 4th bike this year, 2 BMW's, 1 Triumph and a KTM and at this point I wouldn't spend a penny on a SE. After 3 SE's and spending a fortune on all of them after the initial buy, at 57,  I would think I'm their target buyer. Damn have they ever screwed the pooch. But I still love to sit in the garage and look at my nana, just have no desire to ride it.

Damn, I hope that they don't send you a satisfaction survey.  har!  spyder

[Twolanerider]

Hell, I've bought my 4th bike this year, 2 BMW's, 1 Triumph and a KTM and at this point I wouldn't spend a penny on a SE. After 3 SE's and spending a fortune on all of them after the initial buy, at 57,  I would think I'm their target buyer. Damn have they ever screwed the pooch. But I still love to sit in the garage and look at my nana, just have no desire to ride it.

Which is better to sit and look at Mark?  The 'nana or the Springer?

[bgregston]

I needed my 20K service before the GTG in Oregon. I called at 4:00 in the afternoon and got service the next day.

Bret

[grc]

I needed my 20K service before the GTG in Oregon. I called at 4:00 in the afternoon and got service the next day.

Bret

Bret, does that mean your dealer really values you personally and therefore juggled the schedule to make sure to get you in right away, or does it mean they had so little work lined up that they had openings the next day for anyone who called?

I remember a few years back when the service departments stayed busy just uncrating and supposedly "prepping" the new bikes for the sales department, and the real service and warranty work required a long wait on a list (kind of like the waiting list for a new bike).  Oh how the mighty have fallen (couldn't have happened to a more deserving bunch IMHO).

I really hope this little depression recession finally weeds out the worst of the "no customer service" dealers, and forces out most of the clueless and useless management at the MoCo as well. 

Jerry

[bgregston]

Jerry, no doubt they had openings for anyone that called. It's like a ghost town in the store... usually 2 or 3 people max. I was in the store recently and stood there with 3 salesmen just talking about nothing for probably 20 minutes.

Bret

[Harleydude001]

Funny how peoples perceptions can be.  Just finished a 3200 mile motorcycle trip through the West and heard the same thing from each store.  Bikes are available people want to buy BUT, the finance companies are not loaning the money.  People with excellent credit are being turned down.  In case you didn't know your credit rating now reflects a Risk factor which based on your industry can determine where you are.  You can have excellent credit but work in an at Risk industry and be turned down.  Oh and I just bought an 09 Screamin Eagle Road Glide and another new rider was picking up his bike the same day and two days before another guy picked up his new SERG.  So is it as gloom as it sounds, I don't think so.  Just my $.02 worth.

Ride to eat and eat to Ride

[yort4041]

The shop here in New Orleans has a huge inventory and mostly new bikes. They really are only dealing with Harley's bank who had totally changed their approval criteria. But they seem to still want over MSRP for their inventory.

[Glide-man]

I just bought my SERG May 23rd. From Adventure Harley Davidson in Dover Ohio. This is my 3rd Harley and my first from them. They made the process a great experience. The Loan process couldn't have been easier.  I was told that some people were buying these bikes with no money down. I'm a blue collar worker living day to day. If you go to work and pay your bills, you  :soapbox:can get a loan.

[grc]

............................................Bikes are available people want to buy BUT, the finance companies are not loaning the money. 

People with excellent credit are being turned down.  In case you didn't know your credit rating now reflects a Risk factor which based on your industry can determine where you are.  You can have excellent credit but work in an at Risk industry and be turned down.  .............................................................

Yup, there's always people who want to buy.  Wanting to buy, and being qualified to buy, now those two items aren't necessarily the same thing.  Harley's credit arm is swimming (and sinking) in bad debt from handing out loans to anyone still breathing, sort of like the mortgage folks and the credit card folks.  So I would fully expect financing to be more difficult, and I personally think that's the way it should have been all along.  I'm tired of paying more to make up for those who don't pay.

I assume working for an American auto company would fall into that high risk occupation category, so I guess it's a good thing I retired before my credit rating could drop.   Now if only H-D would come out with something I would be willing to buy (still waiting for some quality and customer service). 

Jerry

[fourstar]

  I'm tired of paying more to make up for those who don't pay.

You're going to love nationalized health care!!!
 

[hard10]

From today's WSJ:
" Harley-Davidson Inc.'s second-quarter earnings plunged 91% amid its planned decline in shipments as the motorcycle maker will cut 1,000 more jobs and slashed its forecast for shipments again.

The company said it would cut another 700 hourly production workers and 300 nonproduction, mostly salaried workers, as a result of the lowered shipment volume. It slashed its expectations for this year's shipments, saying it now expects to ship 212,000 to 228,000 motorcycles this year, compared to April's estimate of 264,000 to 273,000.

Harley Davidson had already cut 1,400 to 1,500 hourly jobs earlier this year. The company has about 9,300 workers.

The high-end motorcycle manufacturer, which for years couldn't make enough motorcycles to meet demand, has been curtailing production and cutting jobs during the downturn. The credit crunch wreaked havoc on its finance unit, its main source of financing for buyers. However, Harley said in May that it had secured the $1 billion it needs to fund the finance unit for the year. The company also has been working to diversify its customer base to include women and young riders." ...

[hard10]

This was the last paragraph:
"It also said it was still considering what to do with its operations in York, Pa. Earlier this year it announced plans to consolidate paint and frame operations at the facilities into one plant, but it said Thursday it has since determined that the York operations aren't competitive or sustainable. It said it expects to make a decision on the status of the operations later this year."

[strangebird]

Interesting, all of the dealers I have spoke to in the Chicago area have reported better sales than last year, in fact, most of their floors have quite a bit a space for more bikes.  Maybe Kim Peterson rides a HONDA 
[/quoCHICAGO (Reuters) - Harley-Davidson Inc (HOG.N) and Polaris Industries Inc (PII.N) said on Thursday that cash- strapped consumers steered clear of their big, high-end motorcycles in the second quarter and warned demand would likely remain stalled for the rest of 2009.

Both companies said they were responding to the marked deterioration by making additional cuts to bike production. Harley-Davidson, which has already laid of about 1,500 workers, said it would cut another 1,000 jobs and accelerate some previously announced plant closures.

Harley's cuts were especially dramatic. The Milwaukee-based company said it would now ship between 212,000 and 228,000 of its namesake motorcycles to dealers and distributors worldwide in 2009, down 25 percent to 30 percent from 2008.

Ed Aaron, an analyst at RBC Capital Markets, called Harley's latest production cuts "massive ... more than what either the buy- or sell-side was expecting" and wondered how Harley would be able to sustain its gross margins "given the inherent operating leverage in Harley's model."

But Goldman Sachs analyst Patrick Archambault said the cuts would translate into "a significant reduction in dealer inventory which will ultimately better position the company for 2010" -- an interpretation that helped send Harley's shares higher.

Not everyone was impressed. Standard & Poor's cut Harley to sell from hold, saying the results suggested "far worse selling conditions than expected" and that "economic pressures on consumer spending will depress results" through 2010.

The production cut announcements came as Harley and Polaris reported second-quarter earnings.

Harley's results disappointed analysts, pulled down by -- among other things -- $72.7 million credit loss provision at its captive finance arm.

The numbers from Polaris, which makes Victory brand bikes, topped expectations, thanks to stronger sales of its side-by- side all-terrain vehicles

But both companies said bikes sales were continuing to soften. Indeed, during the second quarter, industry-wide retail sales of the heavyweight motorcycles Harley and Polaris make tumbled 48 percent.

"Motorcycle demand was much weaker than expected a few months ago," said Deutsche Bank analyst Rod Lache.

The shares of Harley, which saw its market share grow last quarter, were up 8 percent at $18.88, while Polaris, which saw its already tiny market share fall during the period, were down about 5 percent at $31.89 in afternoon trading.

te]

[hard10]

HOG broke $19 / share today. Go figure.