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[NVTHIS]

It is being reported on the news and in our local newspaper that HD in York, PA is moving there operations to one of three states. My home state of KY. - IN. or TN. One site in KY is in Shelbyville about 20-30 minutes east of Louisville, where there's a lot of manufacturing type businesses. The news reported that it would be a Motorcycle manufacturing facility (not sure what model) and parts distribution center. Officials from HD has visited the KY site at least 3 times and said it would employee around 100 workers. Man thats what we need here is JOBS. Come on HD we welcome you with open arms. Does anyone know why they want to leave PA? is it wages? Union? Who knows.

Chris  

[Gone Fishin']

Actually the York facility has three production areas

- the Touring factory, quite old, no a/c
- the little CVO facility, which is being phased out, as we learned
- the quite modern Softail factory, which is actually Harley's newest plant (2003, I believe)

In my mind a factory can be moved. In essence it is a big hall, and anything in there can be removed and installed elsewhere in another big hall. Moving the know-how of the workers and managers is much harder to do. And specifically Harley, with their high grade of production depth (they manufacture quite a lot themselves, instead of buying each part from a just-in-time supplier) is depending very much on quality workmanship. Moving the entire production of Touring & Softail bikes would certainly cause issues with production to be felt for six to nine months ongoing.

I personally believe (at least for now) that the Moco has no plans to move the factory away from York. I think the high degree of publicity (how many times have with read about this in the last six to eight weeks?) speaks for a strong case of signaling. What they are probably trying to do is to make the people in York believe, that a move is in the works, while they barter for concession from unions, local authorities and the likes.

Just an analysis. I may be wrong.

Ride safely,
Louis

[RedDevil]

I doubt that they would move the York assembly line either, plus if they are saying that the Kentucky plant would employ about 100 people, that's not even a 1/4 of the workforce that's at York.  There's no way that a new plant in Ken with that few of employees could replace the York facility.  Maybe they're going to move their fabricating portion (tanks, fenders, etc.) out of the assembly building and move it to Kentucky.   

[CVOStreetglide]

Some random thoughts......

I think that the Harley Factory "Footprint" is too large now that we are starting to see a peak in sales. The idea here is to try and consolidate functions into a new state-of-the-art facility in a geographically strategic location. Remember the HD test track in Talladega too.........

My guess is that we may see the HD Museum and old Factory turned into tourist destinations while the future production and manufacturing move to a more efficient environment.

Many of the long term employees (intellectual capitol) will or are retiring. Those that don't may move on to a new environment with the right incentives--$$$$ and relo packages--etc.

In todays world, why are the motors made in Milwaukee and bikes assembled in York, PA and Kansas City?? Transportation is a very large and growing cost component that is passed on to the customers (us).

When I was searching for my 2010 CVO Street Glide I would always ask the General Mangers how business was and what their were thoughts about the future. To a person (12-15 dealers all over the east coast-north and south) they felt that The Motor Company was going to:

• Reduce their size quickly both physical plant and employees.
  Reduce the total number of dealerships worldwide--profitable or not.
  Reduce the number of bikes produced and return customers (us) to the "put your name on the list" and wait era.

Of course, the used bike market will benefit from this and selling and trade prices should get much better.

So, state-of-the-art supply chain management technology and consistently updated customer profile demographics will help to determine where they end up. Of course there will have to be the usual financial and tax concessions from the lucky state that wins.

Since many of us here have just bought new bikes we'll be happy to watch how it evolves over the next few years.   

[Gone Fishin']

@cvostreetglide

I beg to differ. There is no way the Moco is going to shrink beyond immediate economic needs. That would completely destroy any profitability because of very expensive unit cost in procurement, production, and distribution. And you are plain wrong. when it comes to transportation cost. Prices are almost at an historical low. It costs less than 2$ to bring a refrigerator from China into the U.S.

Ride safely,
Louis

[CVOStreetglide]

@

I beg to differ. There is no way the Moco is going to shrink beyond immediate economic needs. That would completely destroy any profitability because of very expensive unit cost in procurement, production, and distribution. And you are plain wrong. when it comes to transportation cost. Prices are almost at an historical low. It costs less than 2$ to bring a refrigerator from China into the U.S.

Ride safely,
Louis

Louis

Differing opinions make interesting debates..... I wish we were closer geographically so we could do this over some beers and a steak or ??

In my assessment the driving force in the next few years is going to be improving the stock price and stockholder value in the coming years.

Harley is at risk of following the Detroit automobile dealers down the proverbial drain if they don't cut back on production and remove stale inventory in the retail stores.

It really doesn't matter if the bikes are floor planned or purchased by the dealers. In the end if the customers aren't buying everything that is being made there is going to be trouble.

The average age of the Harley rider is moving up and the average age of the Harley employee is moving down(younger and better formal education but not as much street sense). So employee mobility is not going to be an issue in the future --fewer employees, more automation-factory, design and last but not least sales.

I am a huge fan of Internet sales for HD.

If we could see the new bikes on line and order what we wanted right then and there and have it delivered to our home or the closest dealer in say 2-3 weeks I would be all for it. No sales person with an attitude or guessing where the bike is or how much just plain old sales.  Look at the supply chain productivity improvements that would occur, the improved cashflow and of course profits.

Look at the involvement in the service area over the last few years due largely to improved data gathering. Bikes are warrantied for 2 years and growing and oil services are being done at longer and longer timeframes. Tires have been increasedin diameter and the treads have been "redesigned for longer wear while the cost has come down somewhat.

Transportation Cost understand the Chinese $2 refrigerator shipping cost but Harley's volume discount shipping cost is now $380 passed on to us to ship from York, PA and it's going to get more expensive over time.  In fact you may already be aware of this but Harley outsourced their shipping function last year to save costs. I think they may still own some of the trailers but that tractors are the vendors.

My last thought on this is if you aren't convinced then please take a look at all of the Harley executives that are "hanging up their spurs", cashing out on their stock and stock options and leaving the business to the new and younger guys and ladies that in many cases have been hired from the"outside" and have no idea about Harley's.

Regards

Jerry

  

[jpparker]

Some random thoughts......

I think that the Harley Factory "Footprint" is too large now that we are starting to see a peak in sales. The idea here is to try and consolidate functions into a new state-of-the-art facility in a geographically strategic location. Remember the HD test track in Talladega too.........

My guess is that we may see the HD Museum and old Factory turned into tourist destinations while the future production and manufacturing move to a more efficient environment.

Many of the long term employees (intellectual capitol) will or are retiring. Those that don't may move on to a new environment with the right incentives--$$$$ and relo packages--etc.

In todays world, why are the motors made in Milwaukee and bikes assembled in York, PA and Kansas City?? Transportation is a very large and growing cost component that is passed on to the customers (us).

When I was searching for my 2010 CVO Street Glide I would always ask the General Mangers how business was and what their were thoughts about the future. To a person (12-15 dealers all over the east coast-north and south) they felt that The Motor Company was going to:

• Reduce their size quickly both physical plant and employees.
  Reduce the total number of dealerships worldwide--profitable or not.
  Reduce the number of bikes produced and return customers (us) to the "put your name on the list" and wait era.

 

I would tend to agree with this statement except for the fact that HD just borrowed $300 million from Warren Buffett in February and though some have said it's not repayable until 2014 (at 15% mind you) most reported that it was to be paid yearly which would be 45 mil a year IN INTEREST ALONE.  I know this loan was for the financing arm but it's hard to see them repaying this loan while planning to cut production and sales.  Just my thoughts.

[MobileAGBell]

It is being reported on the news and in our local newspaper that HD in York, PA is moving there operations to one of three states. My home state of KY. - IN. or TN. One site in KY is in Shelbyville about 20-30 minutes east of Louisville, where there's a lot of manufacturing type businesses. The news reported that it would be a Motorcycle manufacturing facility (not sure what model) and parts distribution center. Officials from HD has visited the KY site at least 3 times and said it would employee around 100 workers. Man thats what we need here is JOBS. Come on HD we welcome you with open arms. Does anyone know why they want to leave PA? is it wages? Union? Who knows.

Chris  

It's been all over the media here in Indianapolis, too. Reports indicate HD plans to move the entire York, PA, operations.

The Indiana site under consideration is Shelbyville, IN, along I-74. According to the media the plant would employ at least 1,000 people. It's also been reported that the plant could attract ~100,000 visitors a year. One of the local TV stations interviewed the owner of the closest HD dealer to the proposed plant. Needless to say he is very excited about the possibility of the increased traffic and business to his shop. The governor of Indiana rides a Harley and is active in benefit rides here which can't hurt the efforts.

Sounds like the York plant is going to move. Somewhere.

[Harleyrider_49]

I have heard rumors & tales of this move also, not sure of which "Shelbyville", but have heard KY. Would love to see this thing come to IN. On another note, how do ya git' these "characters" in your messages?

[04se103]

  this what you talking about? If so they are above where you type in the box

[smkymtnboy]

i just want to get one of those chinese frigs at $2 dollars shipping. shipping charges on my bike from idaho to tn was 654.00. guess they just burnt my arse on that one. never seen it coming either.

[Harleyrider_49]

to: 04SE103.....Yep, that's what I'm talk"n bout.... can't seem to upload a pic of my bike as an avatar ,neither,ain"t much on this computer stuff,will keep try'n

[04se103]

Look at this maybe it will help you out http://www.cvoharley.com/smf/index.php?topic=3583.msg46923#msg46923

[Gone Fishin']

Louis

Differing opinions make interesting debates..... I wish we were closer geographically so we could do this over some beers and a steak or ??

Hey Jerry,

Over some beers would be fine. And of course we are debating the issue, not us ;-). 

Harley is at risk of following the Detroit automobile dealers down the proverbial drain if they don't cut back on production and remove stale inventory in the retail stores. It really doesn't matter if the bikes are floor planned or purchased by the dealers. In the end if the customers aren't buying everything that is being made there is going to be trouble.

Yes, but reducing volume does not work in a competitive market, unless you’d want to marginalize yourself. If Harley would cut down production further, reduce dealers and such, competitors would immediate move ahead and grab the Marketshare.

Transportation Cost understand the Chinese $2 refrigerator shipping cost but Harley's volume discount shipping cost is now $380 passed on to us to ship from York, PA and it's going to get more expensive over time.  In fact you may already be aware of this but Harley outsourced their shipping function last year to save costs. I think they may still own some of the trailers but that tractors are the vendors.

Yes, it is know that they transportation has largely been outsourced. But since, for bikes to dealers, it is charged (seems at a 400% premium) to customers, it does not matter to Harley. Transportation of parts throughout the country for final assembly is truly a cost which matters very little in our days.

My last thought on this is if you aren't convinced then please take a look at all of the Harley executives that are "hanging up their spurs", cashing out on their stock and stock options and leaving the business to the new and younger guys and ladies that in many cases have been hired from the"outside" and have no idea about Harley's.

You are not correct on the insider trading. Please take a look for yourself: http://www.secform4.com/insider-trading/793952.htm You’d have to go back into 2006 to see significant sales by insiders.

With all that pr around a possible move of the production facility away from York, I continue to view that as a very crude, but probably effective negotiation tactic. We’ll see.

Ride safely,
Louis

[CVOStreetglide]

Louis:

It will surely be interesting to see how all of this evolves over time.  But we're safe since we have our new rides..

Regards

Jerry