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[Gone Fishin']

I was at York with the CVO tour. Softail factory was very busy with the assembly line moving swiftly. Touring factory was on hold because of production reduction. CVO assembly (they still had that) was very active. 2 out of 3 = not bad.

Ride safely,
Louis

I don't know when the workers actually work.  I've been to York at least three times and all the other plants once.  I came a day early to the Pony Express ride in Saint Joseph, MO, in Sept so I could tour the KC plant on the way.  I have never ever actually seen a production line run.  There must be elves putting the bikes together at night or something.  Workers have either been on lunch break, in a plant wide meeting, doing model year changeover, etc., etc.  No joke, never seen production line running.  I'm through doing plant tours - well maybe if they do move to KY since it is so close I might give 'em just one more chance. 

[HogBreath]

Union leadership is out for the union executives, not the blue collar guy or gal they represent.
Yep.

There is a reason all new auto plants have been built in the South like KY,TN, AL and so on.  Right to work states.  They still pay a very good wage, with good benifits. 

Ky doesn't have the right to work laws. Ky is a union state. Maybe not as strong as say Illinois..

[tazmun]

I was at York with the CVO tour. Softail factory was very busy with the assembly line moving swiftly. Touring factory was on hold because of production reduction. CVO assembly (they still had that) was very active. 2 out of 3 = not bad.
Ride safely,
Louis

Louis,
So when did you tour the plant?  When I was there, the line moved at a very SLOW pace!

[moscooter]

 
"Ky doesn't have the right to work laws. Ky is a union state. Maybe not as strong as say Illinois.."

IMO.....It would be insane for HD to relocate to Ky if they gotta deal with the union again.  WTF.

[djkak]

"Ky doesn't have the right to work laws. Ky is a union state. Maybe not as strong as say Illinois.."

IMO.....It would be insane for HD to relocate to Ky if they gotta deal with the union again.  WTF.

I wonder if the evolution of work rules and entitlements over the many decades that this plant has been around has resulted in a somewhat dysfunctional environment. Starting over may be an option that would return long term value. 

[AZ SESG]

"Ky doesn't have the right to work laws. Ky is a union state. Maybe not as strong as say Illinois.."

IMO.....It would be insane for HD to relocate to Ky if they gotta deal with the union again.  WTF.

   Union negotiations favor the company when it is a new enterprise in a new state. Where there is no precedent, the terms will support compensation based on employee performance, time sensitive production, higher quality standards, limited bias, etc.

  Many have posted their discontent toward the vile union. But, their displeasure is misplaced. The union can only gain strength at a rate allowed by the company. Poor or weak company management allows, sometimes promotes, a strong biased union. Once this precedent is set it is difficult, if not impossible, to regress.

  Members of the Detroit area UAW have, for many years, referred to one particular manufacturer as, “Generous Motors.”  This is the result of feeble company management. Whether you lose focus during the, “fat,” years due to total annual sales, manufacturer ratings, profit margins, bonus incentives, etc; the result of this lost focus shown brightly as companies surrendered their bargaining position to sustain the status quo.

  There has never been an occasion where a dynamic, focused, company management -team surrendered to the union.

Side note:
  Union leaders are often hand-picked by the companies; then solicited to the union membership by union leadership to insure election. This is relative to the question of sound company management: Many leaders of large companies consort with union leaders from day one. Large companies continue to make this vital error, failing to realize bargaining leverage is lost once you become bed partners with those whom you employ.

  My $.02

[NVTHIS]

The Union members voted yesterday to take the pay cuts and also cut in job. The York plant will stay right where it is. We (Kentucky) will have to give all the tax money to someone else.

[Gone Fishin']

I rest my case.

Ride safely,
Louis

(...)
I personally believe (at least for now) that the Moco has no plans to move the factory away from York. I think the high degree of publicity (how many times have we read about this in the last six to eight weeks?) speaks for a strong case of signaling. What they are probably trying to do is to make the people in York believe, that a move is in the works, while they barter for concession from unions, local authorities and the likes.

Just an analysis. I may be wrong.

[09S/E roadglide]

   Union negotiations favor the company when it is a new enterprise in a new state. Where there is no precedent, the terms will support compensation based on employee performance, time sensitive production, higher quality standards, limited bias, etc.

  Many have posted their discontent toward the vile union. But, their displeasure is misplaced. The union can only gain strength at a rate allowed by the company. Poor or weak company management allows, sometimes promotes, a strong biased union. Once this precedent is set it is difficult, if not impossible, to regress.

  Members of the Detroit area UAW have, for many years, referred to one particular manufacturer as, “Generous Motors.”  This is the result of feeble company management. Whether you lose focus during the, “fat,” years due to total annual sales, manufacturer ratings, profit margins, bonus incentives, etc; the result of this lost focus shown brightly as companies surrendered their bargaining position to sustain the status quo.

  There has never been an occasion where a dynamic, focused, company management -team surrendered to the union.


Never been an occasion   Maybe you should look into Eastern Airlines. My whole family works or worked for GM. You think that GM gave all that to employees cause of weak management !! Im sure there was no union pressure  Please.....there is NO place for unions in the current environment   

Side note:
  Union leaders are often hand-picked by the companies; then solicited to the union membership by union leadership to insure election. This is relative to the question of sound company management: Many leaders of large companies consort with union leaders from day one. Large companies continue to make this vital error, failing to realize bargaining leverage is lost once you become bed partners with those whom you employ.

  My $.02

[NVTHIS]

I rest my case.

Ride safely,
Louis

Louis, you called it.

[moscooter]

 
I agree,  you called it (this time).  I have to believe recent and still current economic conditions and the degree of unemployment across the country contributed greatly to the union members accepting the reality of the situation.

Most of the time,  unions won't back off and take the company down the tubes.   It happened recently in the steel industry in Georgetown, S.C.,  it happened in the meat packing industry in Omaha and Chicago when I was a kid,  we've seen the fallout in Detroit........on and on.

At least,  most of these guys/gals will still have a job versus standing in the unemployment lines and moaning about how they got screwed by the company.......

[CVOStreetglide]

   Union negotiations favor the company when it is a new enterprise in a new state. Where there is no precedent, the terms will support compensation based on employee performance, time sensitive production, higher quality standards, limited bias, etc.

  Many have posted their discontent toward the vile union. But, their displeasure is misplaced. The union can only gain strength at a rate allowed by the company. Poor or weak company management allows, sometimes promotes, a strong biased union. Once this precedent is set it is difficult, if not impossible, to regress.

  Members of the Detroit area UAW have, for many years, referred to one particular manufacturer as, “Generous Motors.”  This is the result of feeble company management. Whether you lose focus during the, “fat,” years due to total annual sales, manufacturer ratings, profit margins, bonus incentives, etc; the result of this lost focus shown brightly as companies surrendered their bargaining position to sustain the status quo.

  There has never been an occasion where a dynamic, focused, company management -team surrendered to the union.
Side note:
  Union leaders are often hand-picked by the companies; then solicited to the union membership by union leadership to insure election. This is relative to the question of sound company management: Many leaders of large companies consort with union leaders from day one. Large companies continue to make this vital error, failing to realize bargaining leverage is lost once you become bed partners with those whom you employ.

  My $.02

Well you may not have been around when "The Union" put Eastern Airlines out of business. They union guys did it just to make a point regarding who had the most power--Eastern or he Union. Like the old saying goes...."Now how's that working for you" ...today???

Regards

[sadunbar]

http://motorcycling.speedtv.com/article/bikes-harley-davidson-to-remain-in-york/bikes-harley-davidson-to-remain-in-york


Looks like it's over... HD to stay in York....

[AZ SESG]

  I should have been more clear on the point regarding strong management teams and surrender.

  Companies with strong management teams who refuse to give away the farm but, do not react quick enough, (hiring replacement workers - restructuring - using the opportunity to establish a non-union shop), to salvage their business, have not surrendered. They may have gone down but, they put up a fight. They did not cave-in, granting every concession to the union, placing themselves in a financial snare which would soon require them to rob Peter and write Paul a bad check. Strong, experienced management teams do not surrender.

 

[CBW]

hd just announced that they are staying in york