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[kraut]

I believe I mentioned it before: the importers in Europe are subsidiaries of H-D. They do make the big cut, not the local dealers.

Nothing to do with taxes and the like: when I do import accessories from US and paid all taxes, duties and transportation they are still cheaper as our dealers will get them from the national importers - and we are not talking about 10% but 60%.

Ok, that used to be far less in the old days when the $ was a strong currency - but everybody else has adapted except Harley-Davidson ...

[grc]

It's a very simple situation.  When there is no competition, many folks tend to charge what the market will bear, up to the point where the increased profits per unit do not offset the loss of sales.  All you guys buying your stuff through the back door screwed up the fine-tuned formula's of those money hungry folks at H-D.  As Kraut noted, most of those distributors in various foreign markets are just subsidiaries of the MoCo, and it's in their best interest to force everyone to deal with and through them. 

It's not unusual for a company to restrict "grey market" sales, in fact it's very common.  Buy a grey market camera or other electronic device for instance and then try to get warranty service.  Better hope you saved enough buying it through unofficial channels to offset the repair costs you will have to eat yourself.

I don't have an issue with Harley insisting that folks support their own countries distribution channels; if everyone went through the back door there would be no distributors or dealers and you wouldn't be able to walk into a showroom and buy a bike.  The issue I have is when H-D and those distributors play games with the pricing such that you pay two or three times the equivalent price in the home market.  Currency valuations, duties, and shipping costs don't come close to explaining some of the ridiculous pricing that's been reported around here.


Jerry

[backroad Mike]

I've purchased from St. Paul harley in the past and I'd do it again. 

[miceracs]

Perhaps it woud be better if ALL the affected HD dealers who trade out of state/country join forces and present HD with a big case.
I'm sure there are others within Europe who also trade cross borders.
I applaud St Paul's effort to raise this issue publically.   

[FLSTFI Dave]

I don't understand why the prices are so much higher in other countries than in the US. Seems like the only explanation is price gouging going on out there. Three to four X pricing cannot be justified by import duties, shipping costs, local costs, or anything else I can understand...

Many countries have crazy taxes.  I while I was in Norway the dealer in Stavanger was showing me sales tax on a bike was 100% of the sales price of the bike, and then they have a 25% VAT tax on top of that.  So a 18K bike in the USA stickers for 24K there, and is 54K out the door to the consumer.

[kraut]

I'm sure there are others within Europe who also trade cross borders.

H-D won't try this approach in Europe as over here it would be just evidently illegal and severely fined well beyond any bargain to be gained with such a practice.

In Europe they do it the indirect way: they try to discontinue the franchise with dealers who sell over the channel - and there are several british "victims" already ...

[cold1]

 What The F--- free trade. The other AMERICAN BUILDERS are going to gain. MY last CVO.  

[CVOJOE]

Maybe Chicago HD will join in the fray, they used to do a bunch of business across the border at one time. 

[kraut]

in the press yesterday:


"St. Paul Harley dealer wins ruling on new sales rules

The Business Journal by Jim Hammerand, Minneapolis / St. Paul Business Journal
Date: Wednesday, November 30, 2011, 2:49pm CST..



A federal judge has put the brakes on new Harley-Davidson sales restrictions that a St. Paul dealership said would put it out of business.

U.S. District Judge Patrick Schiltz on Monday ordered Milwaukee-based Harley-Davidson Motor Co not to enforce its ban on sales of parts, accessories and apparel through third-party websites or to international customers. The judge's order is effective through Feb. 29.

St. Paul Harley-Davidson (incorporated as St. Paul Motorsports Inc.) sued the motorcycle manufacturer in October to fight the policies, which would eliminate about a quarter of the 72-year-old dealership's revenue.

St. Paul Harley owner Tom Giannetti, who also owns a Harley dealership in Eden Prairie, Minn., said motorcycle sales have been dropping since 2008, but that the business has remained profitable thanks to the sales Harley wants to ban.

Attorneys for both parties are negotiating a resolution to the dispute, they said in a recent court filing. Schiltz put the case on hold through January as those conversations continue, court records show."


(source: Milwaukee Business Journal)


that's a first step but doesn't neccessarily mean much ...

[FLSTFI Dave]

Well that is a little good news for a while.   Just maybe the dealer does have a chance to win.

[JCZ]

The gauntlet has been thrown down.

[Buy early]

Hope he wins one for the dealers. How often do we say that?

[Eagle Eye]

Good news for our friends across the pond....


http://www.bizjournals.com/milwaukee/news/2011/11/30/st-paul-harley-dealer-wins-ruling-on.html?ana=RSS&s=article_search&utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+bizj_milwaukee+%28Milwaukee+Business+Journal%29

[faceracer]

Maybe Chicago HD will join in the fray, they used to do a bunch of business across the border at one time. 

Something is up with Chicago HD. I have spent thousands with them in the last ten years. Last august I called to order a tire 4 times over a 3 day period and got put on hold indefinitely? I finally got pissed and went to Surdyke for my tire and got the same 20% discount. October 13th I ordered some saddle bag lid parts for my new speaker lids from Chicago's web site. Yesterday I called them and asked about my order. This guy tells me "They are having trouble with their orders sticking in the system" What ever the F**K that means and goes on the say my parts have not even been ordered from the moco! Its been nearly 3 months and they didn't order my parts? Man I was pissed. He said I could wait and see when they get the parts or cancel! I canceled and ordered from Surdyke and already have a ship date. I think I am done with Chicago but wonder if this has something to do with it? HMMMMM?

[Twolanerider]

Something is up with Chicago HD. I have spent thousands with them in the last ten years. Last august I called to order a tire 4 times over a 3 day period and got put on hold indefinitely? I finally got pissed and went to Surdyke for my tire and got the same 20% discount. October 13th I ordered some saddle bag lid parts for my new speaker lids from Chicago's web site. Yesterday I called them and asked about my order. This guy tells me "They are having trouble with their orders sticking in the system" What ever the F**K that means and goes on the say my parts have not even been ordered from the moco! Its been nearly 3 months and they didn't order my parts? Man I was pissed. He said I could wait and see when they get the parts or cancel! I canceled and ordered from Surdyke and already have a ship date. I think I am done with Chicago but wonder if this has something to do with it? HMMMMM?

Chicago HD has been having (or creating) significant problems for a long time.  They don't even have the part number search tool on the home webpage any longer.

Try Lake Shore Harley.  Good on screen tool for Harley and many aftermarket part numbers.  Excellent service in my experience also.