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Custom Vehicle Discussions => CVO™ Breakout™ => Topic started by: zigscvobo on May 15, 2014, 04:48:46 PM
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2014 CVO BREAKOUT HAVING ISSUES WITH STARTING. I THOUGHT IT MIGHT BE THE COMPRESSION RELEASES. WHILE IT WAS AT LOCAL DEALER WHERE I BOUGHT IT I ASKED ABOUT IT AND THEY PUT IT ON DIGITAL TECH TO CHECK. THEY SAY THAT THEY ARE WORKING BUT I AM SUSPECT THAT BEING A WARRANTY ISSUE THAT THEY MIGHT NOT WANT TO PREFORM THE FIX. ANY IDEAS?
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2014 CVO BREAKOUT HAVING ISSUES WITH STARTING. I THOUGHT IT MIGHT BE THE COMPRESSION RELEASES. WHILE IT WAS AT LOCAL DEALER WHERE I BOUGHT IT I ASKED ABOUT IT AND THEY PUT IT ON DIGITAL TECH TO CHECK. THEY SAY THAT THEY ARE WORKING BUT I AM SUSPECT THAT BEING A WARRANTY ISSUE THAT THEY MIGHT NOT WANT TO PREFORM THE FIX. ANY IDEAS?
Of course, as you are under warranty, it's not your responsibility to give the dealership ideas of what might be the cause of your starting problem and have them check out your ideas, it is the dealerships responsibility to competently and efficiently diagnose and fix your problem.
Have you taken your bike to a dealership, described your problem and asked them to fix it? If you have, and they have not done so, then find another dealership and contact Harley Davidson customer service, open a claim and ask for their assistance in getting your problem resolved. :2vrolijk_21:
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Of course, as you are under warranty, it's not your responsibility to give the dealership ideas of what might be the cause of your starting problem and have them check out your ideas, it is the dealerships responsibility to competently and efficiently diagnose and fix your problem.
Have you taken your bike to a dealership, described your problem and asked them to fix it? If you have, and they have not done so, then find another dealership and contact Harley Davidson customer service, open a claim and ask for their assistance in getting your problem resolved. :2vrolijk_21:
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Give Frederick HD a call. In my experience they are much more customer service oriented.
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I agree it is up to them to figure out the issue. Being I would have to leave the bike due to it happening so far from a cold start I didnt want to have to take it that far down the road but looks like I might have to. Cam, you have mentioned Frederick before to me so that might be where I need to go.
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Frederick seems to still have that involved owner feel to it. The same couple have owned and operated it since the 70's. Since I am trying to find a dealer to purchase I had the broker reach out to them to see if they are willing to sell. The broker was told by the owners that they have no plans to sell it ever as they enjoy being a part of the Harley community as owners. To me that says they are in it for more than just the profit margin. Their attitude has been great so far.
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Wish more of them were like that.
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More details? Slow to turn over or slow to fire?
Have to checked your battery terminals for corrosion or being loose?
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Slow to fire up. Seems to like kick back and then cough out the breather. Only on cold starts. After warmed up statrs pretty quick. Going to another dealer to see what they might think. You have any ideas before I make the trip over?
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By the way Brett, What brand are the 16" apes you have on the BO?
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Slow to fire up. Seems to like kick back and then cough out the breather. Only on cold starts. After warmed up statrs pretty quick. Going to another dealer to see what they might think. You have any ideas before I make the trip over?
How many miles on your bike? Is it stock or is anything modified?
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Slow to fire up. Seems to like kick back and then cough out the breather. Only on cold starts. After warmed up statrs pretty quick.
Mine has done the same but put it down to operator error. Too eager and let go of the start before it has actually fired.
My apes are 16 inch "High Ball" by Burleigh Bars.
http://www.burleighbars.com.au/bars/highball/customhandlebars_highballbars.html (http://www.burleighbars.com.au/bars/highball/customhandlebars_highballbars.html)
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Slow to fire up. Seems to like kick back and then cough out the breather. Only on cold starts. After warmed up statrs pretty quick. Going to another dealer to see what they might think. You have any ideas before I make the trip over?
Mine does the same thing, seems to be getting worse. I hope You find the problem and let us know.
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I am almost certian its the compression releases, but Ive been wrong before.
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Sadunbar, The bike is totally stock.
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Several things to do. I had the same problem of backfire out of the breather. Make sure you are in neutral when starting. Clutch pulled in. Use 93 octane if you can find it. Since I started doing all of the above it has stopped giving me problems starting.
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I have the same problem on my Rocker C (96''). It started doing this after an oil change... Tried many things and finally found out that the oil level has to be a little under the bar. Everytime I put to much oil, the problem gets back and I have to remove some oil.....
Don't Know if your cause is the same but..... just wanted to share...
Dah
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Got mine in January new. Just had my first starting issue, turned over slow and didn't catch. Hit button again and this time turns over too slow to fire then clickkkkk. Put it on the charger for about half hour and it started. Took it out for a nice long ride to charge it up. Been a hellacious few weeks so its been sitting. Two weeks sitting however shouldn't cause this much drain right? I'm just going to plan on putting the trickle charger on it from now on. Maybe someone will come up with a good explaination why this is happening.
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Got mine in January new. Just had my first starting issue, turned over slow and didn't catch. Hit button again and this time turns over too slow to fire then clickkkkk. Put it on the charger for about half hour and it started. Took it out for a nice long ride to charge it up. Been a hellacious few weeks so its been sitting. Two weeks sitting however shouldn't cause this much drain right? I'm just going to plan on putting the trickle charger on it from now on. Maybe someone will come up with a good explaination why this is happening.
Mine had the same issue after a while and at 3600 miles and 16 months old the battery was shot. it starts almost immediately now that the battery was replaced under warranty.
Just one more issue in a mountain of issues. Unless warranty covers it Harley is not going to get one more dime from me.
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Mine had the same issue after a while and at 3600 miles and 16 months old the battery was shot. it starts almost immediately now that the battery was replaced under warranty.
Just one more issue in a mountain of issues. Unless warranty covers it Harley is not going to get one more dime from me.
To me it sounds like my battery might just be a dud or too small cranking amps to begin with. When I hit it it turns over like once then hesitates a second then spins up and starts. Someone in this thread recommended pulling in the clutch as you start it so I am going to try that too, maybe it will help remove excess friction and allow it to spin. Haven't even had time to ride since my troubles the other day. At any rate my dealer is going to hear about it.
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REALLY? Pull in the clutch? The bike is in N when I start it. :(
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Bad battery or not enough cranking amps. Seems like the 110B has higher compression than the standard 110 in the touring. I would trickle or change battery.
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Bad battery or not enough cranking amps. Seems like the 110B has higher compression than the standard 110 in the touring. I would trickle or change battery.
Nope, not higher compression. But Softail batteries are smaller and of lower capacity than the Touring batteries. Bikes that aren't ridden several times a week will probably benefit from being kept on a battery tender to make sure the battery remains fully charged.
Jerry
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Being that it has the factory alarm system on it I have kept on Battery tender on it from day 1. Seems that after bike is ridden it will start up pretty quick which might lead one to believe that it has charged the bike some.
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REALLY? Pull in the clutch? The bike is in N when I start it. :(
Even with the bike in neutral your clutch basket causes a large amount of drag on the starter. If your battery is low, have a weak starter, high comp engine any of these things add drag to the motor when starting. The faster it spins the easier it starts, period. If you have a motor that is not starting easily pulling in the clutch will increase the starters speed by 10~20% on a cold motor.
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Don't know if this is relative but my bike on first try cold would try to fire but die. Second or third time would start. After a long ride one day, about 3 hours, came home and went to leave again in about 15 min.and bike would not start at all. Wore the battery down where it wouldn't turn anymore. Took it for 1k service and dyno tune and they found it didn't have enough fuel pressure while doing the tune. It is still there waiting for new fuel pump..
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Same problem, went in for 1k service and they found that fuell presure was about 50 percent, put new feul pump in and it is much better now and is much more responsive, they also did a reflash but no dyno yet .
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Stevie, did your bike have the same issues in the start of this thread? I too thought it might be acr or battery and it still may be. Just wondering.
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Stevie, did your bike have the same issues in the start of this thread? I too thought it might be acr or battery and it still may be. Just wondering.
Yes same issue it would pop through intake and took 3 or 4 try's to start when cold stared fine after warmed up.
also with rear cylinder deactivated in traffic it coughed and sputtered and would sometimes stall.engine seemed to crank over good so I don't think it has a battery problem.It also seems to run a little cooler now, It must have been extra lean before.
Hope this helps someone,everyone on this forum has some great info.
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Thanks Stevie. Had identical issue only other thing was engine seemed to "catch" sometimes like not enough amps to starter or too much compression. It ran like chit when I first got it and returned to dealer. I told them then it seemed like a fuel issue then. They retuned it saying base maap wasn't any good, also an issue I saw others who had tuners ran into on this forum. Still didn't seem right but was somewhat better. Bought the bike at a dealer 3 hours away and had the SE pro kit installed. Then was informed they wouldn't dyno it till 1k but they charged for it in original price. Decided to have it dynoed at dealer here who did both my other bikes. Odd thing they wanted 7500 more for identical BO. Seriously? After I bought 2 bikes and an additional 10k plus into each bike? Said you'll never sell me another bike. Their basic answer. We don't care. The stupidity that infected their front end hasn't seemed to effect the service department. Sure hope they don't prove me wrong.
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Mine seems to be slow to turn over, like the battery is weak. I rode Sunday and had not been able to ride for 6 days, on the second start after riding for a while it turned over fine. Pretty sure my issue is battery related, or just need to keep on a trickle charger when I'm gone the whole week.
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Mine does the same. Never an issue starting but almost like a hesitation like the battery is weak but not the case because it's always on a tender.
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I have had no dramas at all, started fine after 2 n half weeks. Always on tender when in the garage. Using 98 octane, not that would cause starting issues but.
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I had a starting issue with my 2014 breakout and it turned out the fuel pump was spent bike was running lean. New one after a 2 week wait and good as gold. Hope you find the problem.
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Fuel pump replaced helped my issue on starting except it still has the hesitation (slow to turn over) when you first hit the start. Does fire on initial try now. I have a lot of pressure releasing from the tank now taking off the cap. Anyone else get this after fuel pump replacement?
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I rode mine Sunday and put it on a trickle yesterday. I tried to start today and no go on first try. Second try it did with a little struggle. Rode for a while, stopped twice. Both times it started but not effortlessly. My bike has a powervision on it, only mods are pipes. Fuel Moto mapped it and I have ran two auto tune sessions. Bike had an issue starting since the day I picked it up, I thought it might be due to compression. I have about 600 miles on it, I just don't want to get towed . Next week I'll do the 1000 mile service and I'll see what the dealer clowns have to say.
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I rode mine Sunday and put it on a trickle yesterday. I tried to start today and no go on first try. Second try it did with a little struggle. Rode for a while, stopped twice. Both times it started but not effortlessly. My bike has a powervision on it, only mods are pipes. Fuel Moto mapped it and I have ran two auto tune sessions. Bike had an issue starting since the day I picked it up, I thought it might be due to compression. I have about 600 miles on it, I just don't want to get towed . Next week I'll do the 1000 mile service and I'll see what the dealer clowns have to say.
Have you verified your compression releases are working (turned on in the software)....
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I am new to the whole tuner thing so to answer your question , no. I know the issue was there since day one. I will call fuel Moto just to make sure there is nothing on the tuner end and will ask them about the compression releases. Thank you Sadunbar.
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Have same starting issue with mine. It doesn't start hard always but more times than not. Did you ever get yours fixed? First trip to dealer told me nothing was wrong battery tested fine. When i put a meter on the battery at start up, voltage drops to 9.7 to 6.0 depending on how hard it starts. I have a TTS Mastertune with map # EAT617-01. V&H 2 into 2 big radius, no other mods. I am sure that dealer will tell me that it is the TTS but i have had that map on bike since last November and didn't have starting issues until a month or two ago. Going to dealer again today. Anybody have any insight?
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I know its been a while since this thread was active, but thought I would chime in. I have had this problem of slow to start for some time now. First time I brought it in they blamed the battery and replaced it under warranty and seemed to start fine there at shop. I took it home and problem continued, so I decided to record what it was doing during start up which was taking three times to start. So I brought it back to the dealer and said I am leaving it here until you find the problem. At first they could not get bike to do it every time. They checked fuel pressure and it was fine. In one final attempt the tuner thought to leave fuel pressure gauge on to see if pressure bled down. Sure enough, that was it. They replaced the fuel pump for second time...more on that in a minute, and it runs like a champ. I say the second pump because when I first purchased the bike, they installed the wrong o ring on the pump and it was getting blow by which caused the bike to run like crap. This was after I broke down the day I bought it on way home due to bad voltage regulator. Needles to say my faith that CVOs were built by the best with the best parts has been tarnished. But my dealer treats me like family and takes care of me.
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I have the same problem. It hesitates on startup since new. I have it on a battery tender when parked. I'm taking mine to the dealer next week. Still under warranty. Your tip about the fuel pressure gauge is what caught my attention. Thanks! :2vrolijk_21:
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The fuel pressure problem makes sence. I am pretty tight with the guys near me too so I will ask them to check that out for me also.
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The fuel pressure problem makes sense. I am pretty tight with the guys near me too so I will ask them to check that out for me also.
Let us know how you make out. Seems like a number of us are having this issue.
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Ok, took the bike to the shop and told them about the hesitation on startup. Left it overnight because it happens mostly on cold starts (it's hit and miss...almost always on cold starts, sometimes on warm starts). The shop called Milwaukee for advice. No help. Shop checked battery, compression releases, and checked pressure on fuel pump. Found a slight drop in pressure so they replaced the fuel pump. No help whatsoever. Still does the same thing on startup. :wall:
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That sucks. I haven't taken mine up yet. I just put the new 14" Wild1's and haven't added the Dot4 yet. Manual says it has to be put on Digital Tech. Im guessing to start the ABS motor/pump in it. If I cant bleed both clutch and frt. brake I will take mine back to the dealer then and request they find out whats going on with the cold start issue.
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That sucks. I haven't taken mine up yet. I just put the new 14" Wild1's and haven't added the Dot4 yet. Manual says it has to be put on Digital Tech. Im guessing to start the ABS motor/pump in it. If I cant bleed both clutch and frt. brake I will take mine back to the dealer then and request they find out whats going on with the cold start issue.
Let us know if you find out what the problem is.
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That sucks. I haven't taken mine up yet. I just put the new 14" Wild1's and haven't added the Dot4 yet. Manual says it has to be put on Digital Tech. Im guessing to start the ABS motor/pump in it. If I cant bleed both clutch and frt. brake I will take mine back to the dealer then and request they find out whats going on with the cold start issue.
You're correct in your guess... You need to cycle the ABS pump with the Digital Tech as part of the bleeding process to eliminate all the air from the system. If you don't do this it is possible to obtain a good brake "pedal", only to have air escape from the pump into the line at the worst possible time. It's best to follow the directions in the manual - as working brakes are an important part of staying safe! :2vrolijk_21:
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Yeah it is one thing if it doesn't start but if it won't stop that could be real bad. Thanks, Zig
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New guy here, so 'hey' from the midwest. Similar hard to start problem here also. Bought the bike in October and all was good for the first 2-3 months and ~800 or so miles, then seemed to really struggle when I couldn't ride regularly even though I always keep it on the tender. Dropped the bike off for 1,000 mile service a few weeks ago and asked them to take a look at it. Service said the bike started several times with no problems until Saturday morning. They tested the battery and it was bad. So, they pulled and replaced under warranty. I sent them this entire thread as I wanted to put this issue "on record", since it seems as though many of us have experienced some sort of hard starting issue. Service Manager said no service bulletins have been issued and they haven't seen other FXSEBE starting problem but if the new battery doesn't fix the issue permanently, they'll investigate further. He read with interest the thoughts on enaging the clutch when turning the engine over & fuel pressure/fuel pump discussions.
Anyway, my first post. Snow is almost melted, had enough of winter and ready to ride. My plans over the next few weeks include installing a shotgun shock, oil cooler and Wards cooling fan. I like Cams heel rests too.
You guys have some awesome bikes.
...ride safe.
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I am certainly sorry you guys are still having problems. As to the pulling in of the clutch to start, I get what your trying to accomplish. I ride with a lot of Harley owners, most with a lot of performance upgrades. None of them.have to pull in clutch and have no problems starting. As for me, Harley mechanics went through everything y'all described to fix the problem...battery, even settings on how the engine senses position of crankshaft all under warranty. Until they replaced the fuel pump nothing worked. And they would not have found that without leaving the fuel pressure gauge on, because for several days they had it,it started fine and fuel pressure settings had read normal. They really were stumped before they checked to see if it bled down. Today I am very thankful, it starts great every single time regardless of wether it has been sitting, ran or not, on tender or not, and I never pull in the clutch. I have over 13000 miles on her and she is less than year old. I wish you guys best of luck in hopes your mechanic finds the solution. I wanted to put mine on my Christmas list.
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I finally had time to take her up to the dealer and again expressed the issue of the cold starting problem. Hopefully after sennding them several posts from here with the same issues they will take the time to check for fuel pressure bleed down or find out whatever the issue is with mine. I took it up there to bleed the front brake due to having ABS. They are telling me they are going to have to have top brake line fabricated.
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Hey as long as it's their dime who cares. Keep us posted zigscvobo
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With the TTS I'm wondering if it will or not.
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Just got a call from dealer.Well they have figured out a way to make this into something I will end up paying for. Said it threw a couple of codes. Limp mode and something to do with TBW. I had the starting problem before I did anything with the Bars I put on.
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By doing some research on these codes it looks like several people have had this issue. I was sent the SE extentions, so I did not have the green plug some were speaking of. I did wrap up the last 2 wires that were for the heated grips and shrink wrap them. Guess that still could be the problem. Waiting to hear what they find.
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Dealer said it is the fuel pump. You would think they would do a TSB on it by now. Says that it is even losing pressure at idle. Also told that I had crossed two wires while plugging into connector. Not believing that I did that as I checked and rechecked but to get the bike back I will have to except that. At least they have hopefully solved what started this whole thread in the first place. Won't know for sure till I get it back.
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Don't want to rain on your parade, but I had my fuel pump replaced too. Losing pressure. It didn't fix the problem, but I've heard from a few others that it a new fuel pump did the trick. Let us know how you make out.
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Got my Breakout back today from the dealer. wHEN SWITCH WAS FIRST TURNED ON IT ONLY HAD 20PSI. Once bike got started, running pressure was between 30-35psi and bleeds down after engine is shut off. Pressure should be between 50-62psi. Replaced fuel pump and pressure is now at 60psi. Ran great on the way back to work. See what it does after sitting for a couple of hours. Fingers crossed.
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Out of curiousity what color is the bikes with the issue? I have a blue one and some of the issues I read on here seem to be color related. Example, paint peeling was yellow 2013, orange 2014 had some rusting issues. I have had no starting issues, just wondering.
Do they assemble the bikes in different plants according to color? and that is why some bikes are affected with certain problems and not others? I know bikes are assembled at different plants, is this a cause?
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Sir, I dont think that they are painted in different plants due to color.
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It appears the starting issue was finally solved for mine. Started right up one the first push of the button after sitting over night. The pump did sound a little different than the other one.
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So far, mine has been fine with the new battery. This fuel pump thing is worrying me a bit though. I just have a feeling it's a matter of time. Hope I'm wrong.
Recd my shotgun shock yesterday. What a nice looking and well built product. Will be turning wrenches Saturday morning.
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I have several days with new fuel pump on and she starts on the first time now with no hesitation.
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Filled up with gas after riding about 40 miles home from work (almost 90F in Texas already) and the bike would not turn over. Slow to crank then I would hear a loud clunk. Moved away from the pump, shifted from N to 1, to N to 2 then to N. Let it rest, check to make sure I didn't over fill the fuel tank, all OK. Slow to turn and metallic clack sound. I was 2 miles from home. Called my wife and she brought my truck with the jumper cables, jumped it no problem. Put it on the charger over night. Started fine this morning. I do get the backfires thru the breather most times when I start. Bike runs real lean. Running Bassini 2 into 1 pipes. 2014 with about 4,500 miles. No loose terminal connections, no corrosion. Not running any electronics. Why would she not start, warm?
Alternator not charging right? Battery already toast after less than a year? I read a bit in this thread about fuel pump issues. Any suggestions?
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I had the same issue reported earlier in this thread. Would not fire after riding and short wait. It did turn over but not for long till the battery drained. Fuel pump replaced and hasn't happened since.
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Seems that the fuel pumps they have in these 14's might be the issue. Fixed mine anyway. Are recalls only done when it's a safety concern?
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Running rough at low RPM's and hard to start. All rectified by a new fuel pump.
The existing pump was only developing half the PSI it should have been.
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Same with mine. Now I have 60psi
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Since the starting problem I mentioned here on April 24th I put the trickle charger on the battery twice and had no starting issues until this morning. I took off the charger and put the seat back on, powered Eve up (that's her name) and pushed the start button. Got a hell of a clatter from the front lower left side. Sounded like spinning metal clatter (starter bendix?). It sounded horrible! Same results for the next two attempted starts. Started up like normal on the forth try. After driving 40 miles to work I started Eve going to lunch and returning, no problem. Why all the spinning banging clatter?
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Since the starting problem I mentioned here on April 24th I put the trickle charger on the battery twice and had no starting issues until this morning. I took off the charger and put the seat back on, powered Eve up (that's her name) and pushed the start button. Got a hell of a clatter from the front lower left side. Sounded like spinning metal clatter (starter bendix?). It sounded horrible! Same results for the next two attempted starts. Started up like normal on the forth try. After driving 40 miles to work I started Eve going to lunch and returning, no problem. Why all the spinning banging clatter?
That's your problem right there. Going as far back as the dawn of time 'Eve' has been less than reliable. ;D
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I hadn't thought of that. I was thinking along the lines of beauty and new beginning.
More dependable names might be like Madonna or Lady Gaga, but those just don't work for me.
I will put a meter to the battery this weekend and see if under a load it is not putting out.
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Chalk me up with a new fuel pump too after more hard starting.
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my bike has always been hard to start. But just recently the bike would not start. It has always been on a tender and battery is fine. One day it wouldn't start so I thought i would try a different tender. I tried it after it was charging for awhile and it started. I took it out and it stalled after a couple miles of riding. I pulled over and it started right up. The next time out, it started no issue, rode it for a while and pulled over for a second. I shut it off and it would not start. It sat for an hour and it started right up. Dropping it off Saturday to the dealer.