Topic: SEEG TOP DOG'S (Read 10071 times)

Fatboy · « **on:** July 07, 2005, 01:53:20 PM »

I thought maybe is was time start a thread dedicated to our SEEG (only! [smiley=oops.gif]) Top Dogs.

After reading and rereading the Dyno Number's and Freedom Pipe as well the Twin Cam threads their is now a mountain of opinion's and verified information which one can glean info from in say 5 or 6 hours...... [smiley=confused5.gif]

So let's cut to the chase and have all our favorite upgrade packages & number's consolidated in to one simple thread.

***And if possible "Please Stay On the Topic".....and no chatting! ***

Just facts and figure's.

So who is our "Top Dog"

?? [smiley=nixweiss.gif] [smiley=shocked2.gif] [smiley=smoking.gif] [smiley=thumbsup.gif]

hd2003-se2005 · « **Reply #1 on:** July 07, 2005, 03:13:59 PM »

Quote

I thought maybe is was time start a thread dedicated to our SEEG (only! [smiley=oops.gif]) Top Dogs.

After reading and rereading the Dyno Number's and Freedom Pipe as well the Twin Cam threads their is now a mountain of opinion's and verified information which one can glean info from in say 5 or 6 hours...... [smiley=confused5.gif]

So let's cut to the chase and have all our favorite upgrade packages & number's consolidated in to one simple thread.

***And if possible "Please Stay On the Topic".....and no chatting! ***

Just facts and figure's.

So who is our "Top Dog"?? [smiley=nixweiss.gif] [smiley=shocked2.gif] [smiley=smoking.gif] [smiley=thumbsup.gif]

What's your definition of TOP DOG?

1) Top Speed?
2) Most Horsepower?
3) Most torque?
4) Most chrome?
5) Any of the above with the least money spent?
6) Least amount invested? (biggest bang for the buck)
7) Most money spent?

Fatboy it's your thread, you set the benchmark and we will respond!

[smiley=pumpkin.gif] [smiley=banana.gif] [smiley=cherry.gif] [smiley=jalapeno.gif]

I like Tater's perception of TOP DOG, twist it till everyone else is behind you.
Cause if you can't run with the TOP DOGS, go back to the porch! [smiley=xyxthumbs.gif]
But again Fatboy, it's your thread, you tell us!

[smiley=bigok.gif]

spydglide · « **Reply #2 on:** July 07, 2005, 04:22:57 PM »

well, that didn't last long. Har! [smiley=huepfenlol2.gif] spyder

Fatboy · « **Reply #3 on:** July 07, 2005, 04:30:10 PM »

HD,

I was seeking a "Performance" upgrades related thread which consolidates the data everyone has been providing here without all the chatting and off topic discussion.

We could have 2 classes:

Top Dog "Daddy Big Bucks" [smiley=smoking.gif]: most spent perfomance wise, top Hp, top Tq, Top speed being the contributing factors.

Top Dog "Bang for the Buck" [smiley=cool3.gif]: basic upgrade packages or components that work well together. Dollars spent vs hp/tq gained.

This information will assist us novice's as we try to decide what path we are going to take??? [smiley=confused5.gif] [smiley=nixweiss.gif] [smiley=confused5.gif]

Example: spending $1k - $2k using this this set up should get you here_____ . Spending $4k -$5k with this combination can get you here__________. And so on..........Dyno Charts, Photo's, Invoice's etc. would be helpful but not required. Integrity matter's most in what's posted.

hd-dude · « **Reply #4 on:** July 07, 2005, 04:36:38 PM »

Biggest bang for the bucks...The Freedom Cycles package. Pipes, AC, PCIII. did not have it dynoed stock but now have 103hp & 104tq. Package comes dialed for the bike so no need for dyno time (although I did have them run mine since i'm close) about $1,400.00

JMHO

Good Luck

hd2003-se2005 · « **Reply #5 on:** July 07, 2005, 05:21:02 PM »

If you want just facts and figures then the
first entry in the competition is hd-dude

Stock SEEG is 84 H/P
His is 103

That a 23% increase for $1400.00.
Or, $60.85 per percentage point of increase.

Or $73.69 per each horsepower increase.

If I'm hd-dude's competition then he's the winner cause mine makes 2 pony's less for the same amount of money. [smiley=cry2.gif]

Let the facts and figures begin. [smiley=xyxthumbs.gif]

.

HUBBARD · « **Reply #6 on:** July 07, 2005, 06:23:57 PM »

Yeah, 'er 'uh, Fatboy,
Would you entertain some "words of wisdom", from one who does not possess a SEEG, but does possess an Ol' Black Ultra, that will flat-out fly? [smiley=thumbsup.gif] If this is a closed meeting, I'll understand, and sit this one out. [smiley=cry2.gif] Please advise. [smiley=huepfenlol2.gif] Later--HUBBARD

hd-dude · « **Reply #7 on:** July 07, 2005, 06:28:14 PM »

Quote

Hd,

Thank you for your reply......you are running the Freedom setup aren't you?

Yes, And Very happy with it!! [smiley=huepfenjump3.gif]

hd2003-se2005 · « **Reply #8 on:** July 07, 2005, 07:23:40 PM »

Quote

Hd,

Thank you for your reply......you are running the Freedom setup aren't you?

I was gonna respond to your question, then realized that
you weren't talking to me [smiley=shocked2.gif], or were you?

And I am running the Freedom set-up just like Mr. DUDE! [smiley=laugh.gif]

And my #'s are $82.35 per H/P increase!

Twolanerider · « **Reply #9 on:** July 08, 2005, 10:52:26 AM »

Here's another SEEG for your consideration as you think about your own SEEG and it's future. Mine baselined at 85 hp and 89 tq. After hardware changes it want to 93 hp and 99 tq. After dyno tuning with that hardware it went to 101 hp and 104 tq (numbers rounded).

The hardware changes were the relatively common things done. Stage I upload and higher flowing air cleaner. Vance & Hines duals combined with White Brothers E Series mufflers and a Power Commander. So none of the work was anything hard or especially difficult or time consuming to do.

I'll have to look up later what the component costs were and let you know.

MAVERICK · « **Reply #10 on:** July 08, 2005, 11:58:55 AM »

Hooker 2 into 1 exhaust @ $ 700.00
SE stage 1 airfilter @ $ 100.00
Power commander @ $ 340.00
Dyno tune @ $ 200.00
Stage 1 chip @ $ 128.00

GRAND TOTAL $ 1468.00

100 HP AND 103 FT LBS TORQUE

Ride it like you stold it. Its even better when its less money!! [smiley=laugh.gif] [smiley=shocked2.gif]

TB · « **Reply #11 on:** July 08, 2005, 01:42:19 PM »

Hmmm, I'm a loser....$29,995 for 84 hp. That's $356.08/hp.

Laker · « **Reply #12 on:** July 08, 2005, 02:15:19 PM »

When I bought the bike I convinced them throw in the Race Tuner. I also had them take the cost of the dyno off the price of the bike (the dyno was at their sister company). In the end I spent $550 on the Rineharts installed. 97 HP and 101 TQ for $550 more...not too bad. (of course this doesn't include the dyno time $240)

Forgot about the stage 1 and air filter. Add $150. [smiley=laugh.gif]

Twolanerider · « **Reply #13 on:** July 08, 2005, 04:06:40 PM »

Quote

Here's another SEEG for your consideration as you think about your own SEEG and it's future. Mine baselined at 85 hp and 89 tq. After hardware changes it want to 93 hp and 99 tq. After dyno tuning with that hardware it went to 101 hp and 104 tq (numbers rounded).

The hardware changes were the relatively common things done. Stage I upload and higher flowing air cleaner. Vance & Hines duals combined with White Brothers E Series mufflers and a Power Commander. So none of the work was anything hard or especially difficult or time consuming to do.

I'll have to look up later what the component costs were and let you know.

Ok, here's the info I'd promised earlier:

White Brother's Mufflers @ $339.00
Vance & Hines duals @ 289.00
Stage I Chip @ 118.50
SE air cleaner @ 114.00
Power Commander III @ 289.00
Dyno tuning @ 200.00

Gives a total of $1349.50. The red bike started at 84.5 hp and ended up at 101. So that comes to $81.78 per horsepower. If you break it down to just before and after the dyno tuning that tuning rendered hp increase at a rate of $25.00 per horsepower.

hd2003-se2005 · « **Reply #14 on:** July 08, 2005, 04:19:55 PM »

Quote

Hmmm, I'm a loser....$29,995 for 84 hp. That's $356.08/hp.

No losers here!
Just having a Screaming Eagle makes you a winner! [smiley=xyxthumbs.gif]
TB this thread is about modifications. So get your wallet out and jump in!

.

hd2003-se2005 · « **Reply #15 on:** July 08, 2005, 04:27:28 PM »

Quote

When I bought the bike I convinced them throw in the Race Tuner. I also had them take the cost of the dyno off the price of the bike (the dyno was at their sister company). In the end I spent $550 on the Rineharts installed. 97 HP and 101 TQ for $550 more...not too bad. (of course this doesn't include the dyno time $240)

Forgot about the stage 1 and air filter. Add $150. [smiley=laugh.gif]

Lets see

97 - 84 = 13 H/P
550 + 150 =700
$700.00 for 13 H/P = $53.84 per horsepower
Good #'s Mr Laker!

Twolanerider · « **Reply #16 on:** July 08, 2005, 07:52:24 PM »

Ladies and Gentlemen of CVO. Regarding the thread he has started here Fatboy has asked the moderators if we would request of users to limit a bit the extraneous chatter in this thread that we are all so prone to drop in during the conversations. Fatboy is very interested in what the options are and would really like to narrow the focus down here to SEEG options, work that has been done, what the expenses might be, and how productive things have been.

Have read through the thread and it's actually surprisingly good (compared to most of our threads) for staying on topic. It does, however, have the few drop-ins. A response, and a response to a response that have no relavence at all to the questions Fatboy asked of us. One of these responses is in fact my own.

In light of our fellow user's request here I'm going to quickly scan back through the thread and remove my post that didn't specifically respond to the questions asked at the beginning. As a gesture of courtesy to Fatboy and his thread I'd asked each of the rest of you to quickly scan back through and see if you too have a post that merely converses but doesn't respond to his original question. If you do have such a post or posts please consider removing them as I did mine.

It was Fatboy's question after all. It is important to him. There are certainly any number of other threads where we might and will banter and chatter without intruding on a valuable topic that is contempary and important to one of our users.

Lastly let me just point out the obvious. If you do find something that is just conversation, doesn't specifically answer the gentleman's questions, and that you deem ok to remove; you don't then need to defeat the purpose of the removal by writing a new post saying that you've done so [smiley=7.gif]

Thanks everyone,
Don

DCFIREMANN · « **Reply #17 on:** July 08, 2005, 07:55:01 PM »

Ok I'll give it a try. Before the Zippers throttle body and a/c and ECM. I had a S/E air cleaner $100.00,power commander $320.00 ( I think)and a thunder header with heat shields $625.00. For a grand total of $1045.00 When finished

H/P 98
TQ 107

It runs much better now than it did then with the zippers GFC (go fast chit) Throttle body with air cleaner $250.00 (off ebay) Air cleaner cover(from zippers) $45.00 and Zippers ECM $400.00 with thunder header for a grand total of $1320.00 Sorry I need to get her dynoed.

Be Safe

THE DAWG

OTIS · « **Reply #18 on:** July 08, 2005, 11:18:18 PM »

I have a 95 in 10.5 pistons se hi perf heads comp cams ground to my specs. Egine was
blueprinted very well, have a Harley download into the stock Delphi computer. Bike has not been dyno since last cam changes . But if you count these people who say they have all this HP I must have 120 because I have busted all thier asses.

I REMAIN OTIS [smiley=xyxthumbs.gif]

SHRADER · « **Reply #19 on:** July 09, 2005, 09:07:02 PM »

Hey Guys

HD SE HTCC CNC Ported Heads
HD SE High Compression Stroker Pistons
HD SE Adjustable Pushrods
HD SE EFI Race Tuner
HD SE 253 Cam
HD SE Air Cleaner
Rineharts

105.8 Horsepower 107.1 Torque

Change to HD SE 258 Cam and Billet Sucker

113.2 Horsepower 115.2 Torque on the same dyno

Ya'll do the math

REGARDS
SHRADER

Twolanerider · « **Reply #20 on:** July 09, 2005, 10:42:21 PM »

Shrader, hope you don't mind. I resized your dyno sheet file to 800x600 so it would fit and display better and reposted it.

Without even worrying about where the top ends of the numbers are I love how early some of that is coming. That it's all in relatively early is just icing on the cake. That's nice.

hd2003-se2005 · « **Reply #21 on:** July 10, 2005, 08:38:54 AM »

Hey Shrader

We can't do the math if we don't have #s.
I know you probably got some deals from working where you did so give us the #'s that normal people would have paid. (does that make you not normal?)

And Otis some cost on yours would help also. Did that blueprinting help a lot and what was the cost?

OTIS · « **Reply #22 on:** July 10, 2005, 11:47:30 AM »

Quote

Hey Shrader

We can't do the math if we don't have #s.
I know you probably got some deals from working where you did so give us the #'s that normal people would have paid. (does that make you not normal?)

And Otis some cost on your would help also. Did that blueprinting help a lot and what was the cost?

You dont want to know parts cost , you would be upset at the time we built the motor my wife was one of the managers at the HD store.

OTIS

hd2003-se2005 · « **Reply #23 on:** July 10, 2005, 11:53:24 AM »

[smiley=oops.gif] Otis, I forgot about that.

If you could, do like I asked Shrader and post the prices that normal people would have to pay for the same mods.

Thanks

OTIS · « **Reply #24 on:** July 10, 2005, 02:26:15 PM »

Quote

[smiley=oops.gif] Otis, I forgot about that.

If you could, do like I asked Shrader and post the prices that normal people would have to pay for the same mods.

Thanks

Blueprinting works great the better parts fit the better they work.You got prices on going fast last week now bite the bullet.

OTIS

MAVERICK · « **Reply #25 on:** July 10, 2005, 03:30:12 PM »

Quote

Blueprinting works great the better parts fit the better they work.You got prices on going fast last week now bite the bullet.

OTIS

Otis, ride it like you stold it!!!

SHRADER · « **Reply #26 on:** July 10, 2005, 09:47:29 PM »

Thanks twolane for resizing the dyno chart. You are a real pal.

Now for the numbers. Since I don't have an SE book in front of me I'll try to use ballpark numbers from memory, so if I'm off a little don't hassle me too bad.

SE HTCC HEADS 1350
SE HIGH COMP STOKER PISTONS 270
PUSHRODS 120
AIR CLEANER 140
EFI RACE TUNER 450
RINEHARTS 808
TOTAL 3138

THEN LATER 258 CAM 270
BILLET SUCKER 200
TOTAL 470
PLUS LABOR OF COURSE

So to gain 31HP would have spent about 3600 or $116 per HP.

REGARDS
SHRADER

SHRADER · « **Reply #27 on:** July 10, 2005, 10:05:39 PM »

Who is it that says "cubic horsepower equals cubic dollars"

SHRADER

hd2003-se2005 · « **Reply #28 on:** July 10, 2005, 10:17:19 PM »

OK guys thanks for the information

I just figured all this again and can you imagine, there's a trend emerging!

Laker 13 H/P $53.84 per H/P
hd-dude 19 H/P $73.69 per H/P
HD2003 17 H/P $82.35 per H/P
TwoLane 16.5H/P $81.78 per H/P
Shrader 31 H/P $116.00 per H/P
DCFireman 14 H/P $74.64 per H/P

OTIS, can't add you to the list till we have more info!

Yes I know, these cost are subjective.
We have all experimented and spent more than these cost but for comparison cost I am just using what the latest mods are.

Keep it coming! revised 7/11/05 to add DCFireman

Twolanerider · « **Reply #29 on:** July 10, 2005, 10:27:36 PM »

Quote

OK guys thanks for the information

I just figured all this again and can you imagine, there's a trend emerging!

Laker 13 H/P $53.84 per H/P
hd-dude 19 H/P $73.69 per H/P
HD2003 17 H/P $82.35 per H/P
TwoLane 16.5H/P $81.78 per H/P
Shrader 31 H/P $116.00 per H/P

DAWG, OTIS, can't add you to the list till we have more info!

Yes I know, these cost are subjective.
We have all experimented and spent more than these cost but for comparison cost I am just using what the latest mods are.

Keep it coming!

I didn't go back through the thread to look Chip but did anyone else break the expenditure down to before and after dyno tuning? We all realize it's all part of the same package. But it was a little surprising to see the stark contrast and just how completely cost effective the dyno tuning was.

hd2003-se2005 · « **Reply #30 on:** July 10, 2005, 10:41:18 PM »

Well Don without belaboring Fatboys request for simplicity in this thread, I didn't show #'s for that.

It's been hard enough to just get the parts used, the cost of those parts and the results of the use of those parts.

I think it would be HELL to try to breakdown the benefit of the duno tuning!

YES, it's a worthwhile question but to gather just that would take another thread.

I think WE ALL KNOW that the benefits of the dyno tune outweigh the cost involved for anyone that really interested in getting the best results from their motor!

I just jumped in here to help Fatboy on this thread ( his PM to me expressed his appreciation).

On fuel injected motors dyno tuning is mandatory! JMHO of course.

OTIS · « **Reply #31 on:** July 10, 2005, 11:10:20 PM »

Quote

I thought maybe is was time start a thread dedicated to our SEEG (only! [smiley=oops.gif]) Top Dogs.

After reading and rereading the Dyno Number's and Freedom Pipe as well the Twin Cam threads their is now a mountain of opinion's and verified information which one can glean info from in say 5 or 6 hours...... [smiley=confused5.gif]

So let's cut to the chase and have all our favorite upgrade packages & number's consolidated in to one simple thread.

***And if possible "Please Stay On the Topic".....and no chatting! ***

Just facts and figure's.

So who is our "Top Dog"?? [smiley=nixweiss.gif] [smiley=shocked2.gif] [smiley=smoking.gif] [smiley=thumbsup.gif]

I,am off topic I did not read the name of the thread I have SERG it is not fair to compare A SERG to a SEEG . And did'nt we do a poll on staying on topic last winter and voted it down.

OTIS [smiley=xyxthumbs.gif]

spydglide · « **Reply #32 on:** July 10, 2005, 11:26:10 PM »

I feel sure that the global modjewelators will keep the likes of you and me under control OTIS.......besides, that was last winter! Hell, it's 95 in the shade down here now and hurricanes are blowing ashore........we've got to chat from time to time about 'nothing' ! Har! spyder [smiley=huepfenlol2.gif]

OTIS · « **Reply #33 on:** July 10, 2005, 11:40:54 PM »

Quote

I feel sure that the global modjewelators will keep the likes of you and me under control OTIS.......besides, that was last winter! Hell, it's 95 in the shade down here now and hurricanes are blowing ashore........we've got to chat from time to time about 'nothing' ! Har! spyder [smiley=huepfenlol2.gif]

Are you getting weather from the hurricanes Spyder if so good luck.

OTIS

spydglide · « **Reply #34 on:** July 10, 2005, 11:58:38 PM »

nope, but as soon as Dennis moves up your way and out of the Gulf Shores I'm saddleing-up the ole SEEG to head down to Biloxi and New Orleans........you wanna go? Probably leave day after tomorrow if the storm is gone. spyder [smiley=laugh.gif]

OTIS · « **Reply #35 on:** July 11, 2005, 01:38:08 AM »

That would be a great ride and thanks for the invite . Last thursday I had to have carpel tunnel surgery on my clutch hand Doc says be blowed out for 6 weeks are you taking that Nite Al with you.
OTIS [smiley=xyxthumbs.gif]

Twolanerider · « **Reply #36 on:** July 11, 2005, 01:57:33 AM »

Quote

Well Don without belaboring Fatboys request for simplicity in this thread, I didn't show #'s for that.

That's ok Chip. I'll help out where I can. Fatboy was wondering about what was effective and what wasn't. And we've certainly all read threads here where someone had done an RT or PC and not gone on to do the Dyno. So illustrating the effectiveness is quite contextual, probably helpful to riders new to PC or RT more than you or I might realize, and certainly easy enough to do.

Just picked up your previous charting work and added one more column. Anyone else's numbers can be as easily added. All that's needed is the last before and after dyno run and the amount paid to the dyno guy. That chart is very informative Chip. Thanks [smiley=thumbsup.gif]

DCFIREMANN · « **Reply #37 on:** July 11, 2005, 07:33:23 AM »

Quote

OK guys thanks for the information

I just figured all this again and can you imagine, there's a trend emerging!

Laker 13 H/P $53.84 per H/P
hd-dude 19 H/P $73.69 per H/P
HD2003 17 H/P $82.35 per H/P
TwoLane 16.5H/P $81.78 per H/P
Shrader 31 H/P $116.00 per H/P

DAWG, OTIS, can't add you to the list till we have more info!

Yes I know, these cost are subjective.
We have all experimented and spent more than these cost but for comparison cost I am just using what the latest mods are.

Keep it coming!

Chip the first mods that were done was at a coat of $1045.00 and a H/P increase of 14 H/P for a cost of $74.64 per H/P I will try to get the bike back on the tread mill in the next few days. I wanted to dyno before Myrtle but there is only 24 hrs in a day!!!!!!

Be Safe

THE DAWG

Coolbreeze · « **Reply #38 on:** July 11, 2005, 06:09:22 PM »

Hey, can I play the low hand at this table?
'05 SEEG, w/ SEII exhaust, Big Sucker air cleaner, Stage 1 ECM, PCIIIUSB with dyno tune, and I get:... try not to laugh guys... 87.9 HP and 95 TQ, and the guys at the dealership where I had the dyno done said, " hmmm, very respectable numbers, that bike should really move!" OUCH!!, and to add insult to injury, they didn't pull a before print, so I don't know where I started!!!! [smiley=furious.gif]

Elvis · « **Reply #39 on:** July 11, 2005, 07:43:47 PM »

Quote

Hey, can I play the low hand at this table?
'05 SEEG, w/ SEII exhaust, Big Sucker air cleaner, Stage 1 ECM, PCIIIUSB with dyno tune, and I get:... try not to laugh guys... 87.9 HP and 95 TQ, and the guys at the dealership where I had the dyno done said, " hmmm, very respectable numbers, that bike should really move!" OUCH!!, and to add insult to injury, they didn't pull a before print, so I don't know where I started!!!! [smiley=furious.gif]

Those are the same guys that tell their wives 6 is really 12 inches. [smiley=nixweiss.gif]

Now we return you to the family portion of our show... [smiley=laugh.gif]

elvis

the O`Fender · « **Reply #40 on:** July 12, 2005, 11:03:11 AM »

SE Air Cleaner $100
SE Race Tuner $370
D&D Fat Cat $625
_________________
95hp/96fpt $1095

Dyno tuning $300
_________________
100hp/103fpt $1395

I do not have a true baseline so for round numbers I will use 85hp/90fpt

so $93 per HP / $107 per FPT

[smiley=1syellow1.gif]

hd2003-se2005 · « **Reply #41 on:** July 12, 2005, 03:19:47 PM »

OK guys thanks for the information

I just figured all this again and can you imagine, there's a trend emerging!

Laker 13 H/P $53.84 per H/P
hd-dude 19 H/P $73.69 per H/P
HD2003 17 H/P $82.35 per H/P
TwoLane 16.5H/P $81.78 per H/P
Shrader 31 H/P $116.00 per H/P
DCFireman 14 H/P $74.64 per H/P
O Fender 16 H/P $87.19 per H/P -----> I used a base of 84 H/P

Yes I know, these cost are subjective.
We have all experimented and spent more than these cost but for comparison cost I am just using what the latest mods are.

Keep it coming!

110tHunDer · « **Reply #42 on:** July 12, 2005, 03:57:05 PM »

Quote

I just figured all this again and can you imagine, there's a trend emerging!

Chip, maybe the next time you post this, you can do it in ascending order (lowest to highest) of the HP gain. The trend I think you're speaking of is that the more the HP gain, the more the cost per HP to get it which would show up dramatically if shown in this fashion. This is good data and should help some folks who are considering which mods to do determine where their point of diminishing return is ('cause we all know, Hubbard will always have more horsepower [smiley=laugh.gif]).

SHRADER · « **Reply #43 on:** July 12, 2005, 10:21:14 PM »

Hey?

Does all this make my SEEG the "Top Dog"? [smiley=thumbsup.gif]

Please Advise [smiley=beerchug.gif]
SHRADER

Fatboy · « **Reply #44 on:** July 13, 2005, 01:06:47 AM »

Bone stock Dynojet results from 7/9/05 cost: $20.00

Run 1: with air cleaner on.....82hp 92tq

Run 2: with air cleaner off.....88hp 95tq

Phase 1 Mods Pending: Race Tuner.... custom round filtered K&N style, Velocity Stack centered over the throttle body.... stock throttle body and intake bored out to 48mm to increase volume, flow & velocity....and Pipes "to be determined". (Freedom, V&H Big Shot Duals, Fat Cat [smiley=nixweiss.gif])

Should be able to post new number's within 2-3 weeks depending on when the Velocity Stack gets back from chroming out in California.

PS (& off topic!):*Schrader* do you know the story about the "Young Bull and the Old Bull" ? If so, consider yourself advised. [smiley=stars.gif]

OTIS · « **Reply #45 on:** July 13, 2005, 01:41:57 AM »

Quote

Hey?

Does all this make my SEEG the "Top Dog"? [smiley=thumbsup.gif]

Please Advise [smiley=beerchug.gif]
SHRADER

No that makes you DADDY BIG BUCKS. And with all the CHATTY CATHY cross talk I would say that 99 % understood this thread just fine.
OTIS [smiley=xyxthumbs.gif]

hd2003-se2005 · « **Reply #46 on:** July 13, 2005, 07:57:35 AM »

Quote

Hey?

Does all this make my SEEG the "Top Dog"? [smiley=thumbsup.gif]

Please Advise [smiley=beerchug.gif]
SHRADER

**************************************************************

Till someone else steps up to the plate with good information,

YES SIR IT DOES!

Fatboy · « **Reply #47 on:** July 13, 2005, 08:18:51 AM »

Yeah 'er uh HD2003,

Remember this thread is for "SEEG ONLY" information. [smiley=oops.gif]

CC/Otis will have to sit this one thread out........he "understands that just fine 99% of the time"......... [smiley=shocked2.gif] [smiley=laugh.gif]

And once DCFiremann, Tony 1700uk & Opee who are example's of current member's post. And Torch & Sparky (non member's) give me their number's to be posted I believe the bar will be raised above 120hp/120tq . [smiley=thumbsup.gif] [smiley=shocked2.gif]

Dr. Evil · « **Reply #48 on:** July 13, 2005, 08:32:54 AM »

Otis bro, that old SERG really scares some people [smiley=nervous.gif] [smiley=laugh.gif]

[smiley=beerchug.gif] Clearly, the legend of Otis (the bike) has spread [smiley=xyxthumbs.gif]

Fatboy · « **Reply #49 on:** July 13, 2005, 08:51:04 AM »

Quote

Otis bro, that old SERG really scares some people [smiley=nervous.gif] [smiley=laugh.gif]

[smiley=beerchug.gif] Clearly, the legend of Otis (the bike) has spread [smiley=xyxthumbs.gif]

Nah!

Just didn't think there was a correlation in the number's, 95" CVO start point versus 103"CVO start point when introducing this thread.

We love 'em all but........just trying to keep it "apple's to apple's".

SHRADER · « **Reply #50 on:** July 13, 2005, 07:27:49 PM »

Quote

Bone stock Dynojet results from 7/9/05 cost: $20.00

Run 1: with air cleaner on.....82hp 92tq

Run 2: with air cleaner off.....88hp 95tq

Phase 1 Mods Pending: Race Tuner.... custom round filtered K&N style, Velocity Stack centered over the throttle body.... stock throttle body and intake bored out to 48mm to increase volume, flow & velocity....and Pipes "to be determined". (Freedom, V&H Big Shot Duals, Fat Cat [smiley=nixweiss.gif])

Should be able to post new number's within 2-3 weeks depending on when the Velocity Stack gets back from chroming out in California.

PS (& off topic!):*Schrader* do you know the story about the "Young Bull and the Old Bull" ? If so, consider yourself advised. [smiley=stars.gif]

Well first thing it's SHRADER not *Schrader* and I ain't that young.

REGARDS
SHRADER

HUBBARD · « **Reply #51 on:** July 13, 2005, 08:23:40 PM »

Quote

Nah!

Just didn't think there was a correlation in the number's, 95" CVO start point versus 103"CVO start point when introducing this thread.

We love 'em all but........just trying to keep it "apple's to apple's".

Other CVO and non CVO member's PM'd me early on and understood the original post/request and graciously offered to sit this thread out to help meet the intended objective's.

And "MANY THANKS" [smiley=thumbsup.gif] [smiley=beerchug.gif] [smiley=xyxthumbs.gif] [smiley=thumbsup.gif]to them.

They know who they are! [smiley=7.gif]

Yeah, 'er 'uh, Fatboy,
That's one topic I just can't not comment on! I've been in the wind with OTIS, and you are right about there not being any correlation between a 95" and a 103" CVO. OTIS' 95" will dust your 103" so bad you will probably think the numbers you posted were inflated! Furthermore, against my better judgement, I conceded to participate in this topic, as a courtesy to your request. To my amazement, you now boast about posting numbers of those that are not even members of this site. While I don't ride a CVO, my numbers are already posted, and I am a member of this site! Therefore, I rescind my previous committment to not participate. Be it known, from this day forward, I will participate in any, and all topics, that I feel necessary. I'll leave it to the Global Moderators to decide if I am at any time, out of line. There endeth th lesson. Later--HUBBARD

Elvis · « **Reply #52 on:** July 13, 2005, 08:36:42 PM »

Although most interested in the 103's (cuz that's what I run), any data of upgrades on whatever engine (95,103 or whatever), cost of upgrades, and SAE results is helpful for comparison. If this thread ain't the place due to preferences of Fatboy, put it on the dyno thread. Garanteed we will refer to it.

thanks,

elvis

Twolanerider · « **Reply #53 on:** July 13, 2005, 10:12:43 PM »

Quote

you now boast about posting numbers of those that are not even members of this site.

One thing to keep in mind guys. Numbers from members not participating in the site may not necessarily be irrelvant to the thread. The guy starting the thread asked about 103s. If the numbers he lays on are from 103s they would be adding to the data on the topic and might be helpful. The downside, of course, is that they don't get the same kind of scrutiny that member's numbers get and, more importantly, we can't talk to those guys and learn from them whatevery they might have to offer.

hd2003-se2005 · « **Reply #54 on:** July 13, 2005, 10:51:08 PM »

Was going to update the results!
There have been 13 post (including this one) since the last update.
But no new facts or figures!

Brian (both of you) when we get some new info I will put the info in better order.

Thanks guys

Fatboy · « **Reply #55 on:** July 13, 2005, 11:41:48 PM »

Quote

Yeah, 'er 'uh, Fatboy,
That's one topic I just can't not comment on! I've been in the wind with OTIS, and you are right about there not being any correlation between a 95" and a 103" CVO. OTIS' 95" will dust your 103" so bad you will probably think the numbers you posted were inflated! There endeth th lesson. Later--HUBBARD

Hubbard,

Who can dust who is best keep in the trailer out of the rain. [smiley=laugh.gif]

We are still seeking information and data "specifically" related to the successful build up of a CVO 103 SEEG. Do you have anything constructive to add in that regard?

Thank you (in advance) for your most insightful and gentlemenly reply! [smiley=thumbsup.gif]

Dr. Evil · « **Reply #56 on:** July 14, 2005, 08:49:09 AM »

Quote

you are right about there not being any correlation between a 95" and a 103" CVO. OTIS' 95" will dust your 103" so bad you will probably think the numbers you posted were inflated!

I've ridden OTIS's bike. And it IS quicker than my SEEG! [smiley=nervous.gif] It may not be apples to apples... but that guy knows his chit! You should only hope he'd share his secrets. The guy is a genius! [smiley=xyxthumbs.gif]
And Hub, you the man! [smiley=laugh.gif]

Dr. Evil · « **Reply #57 on:** July 14, 2005, 08:59:03 AM »

Forgot to say...

$770.00 - 15 HP - $51.33 per

But that's not fair really since I get a huge discount at my local dealer...

Shoulda been...

$962.50 - 15 HP - $64.17 per

Fatboy · « **Reply #58 on:** July 14, 2005, 11:24:05 AM »

Quote

It may not be apples to apples... but that guy knows his chit! You should only hope he'd share his secrets. The guy is a genius! [smiley=xyxthumbs.gif]

Everyone out there who can contribute to the topic (CVO 103 SEEG) in a positive fashion "PLEASE DO" !!! [smiley=thumbsup.gif]

It seems there is no one "best way" that's been found yet.......that's the purpose of the thread. Seeking and sharing "all" the knowledge (sometimes secret's) that can be uncovered ! [smiley=thinking2.gif]

And figuring in the cost factor's, so the average Joe can make exceptional choice's for his own scoot. [smiley=cool3.gif]

Black_Dog · « **Reply #59 on:** July 14, 2005, 09:13:47 PM »

The cheapest HP that I ever added to my SEEG came last year, I lost 66 pounds and that adds just over 10 HP net under normal load, not quite relevent here because your all talking about static load.

Remember that real TOP DOGS do it on the street not on the bench.

Black Dog [smiley=beerchug.gif]

hd2003-se2005 · « **Reply #60 on:** July 14, 2005, 09:24:39 PM »

And fatboy

I asked Black Dog to post that information.

He can back it up if needed.

I thought it was very relevant to this topic.

So for every 6 lbs of weight on your bike your giving away 1 horsepower.

How do you get free horsepower, lose weight!

And to bring it full circle, the skinny guy vrs. the fat [smiley=cry2.gif]guy on the like equipped SEEG, guess what.

Skinny guy is TOP DOG

110tHunDer · « **Reply #61 on:** July 14, 2005, 09:30:11 PM »

Off-topic [smiley=oops.gif], but see new sig. (Beat ya to it, Chip! [smiley=ROFLOL.gif])

hd2003-se2005 · « **Reply #62 on:** July 14, 2005, 09:33:57 PM »

[smiley=huepfenlol2.gif] [smiley=huepfenlol2.gif] [smiley=huepfenlol2.gif] [smiley=huepfenlol2.gif] [smiley=huepfenlol2.gif] [smiley=huepfenlol2.gif] [smiley=huepfenlol2.gif] [smiley=huepfenlol2.gif] [smiley=huepfenlol2.gif] [smiley=huepfenlol2.gif] [smiley=huepfenlol2.gif] [smiley=huepfenlol2.gif]

I love it!

I damn sure need to try that approach!

Fatboy · « **Reply #63 on:** July 14, 2005, 10:50:33 PM »

Quote

And fatboy

He can back it up if needed.

I thought it was very relevant to this topic.

So for every 6 lbs of weight on your bike your giving away 1 horsepower.

Hd2003,

Does that theory also apply when the bike is on the DynoJet? [smiley=confused5.gif]

If so that could really skew the number's that have been posted........... [smiley=nixweiss.gif]

Twolanerider · « **Reply #64 on:** July 14, 2005, 11:25:16 PM »

Quote

Hd2003,

Does that theory also apply when the bike is on the DynoJet? [smiley=confused5.gif]

If so that could really skew the number's that have been posted........... [smiley=nixweiss.gif]

Fatboy the weight factor on the bike will increase the drag. More at higher speeds. Fixed on the dyno though all your measuring is the transfer of power through the rear wheel to the dyno. The weight on the seat won't affect that measure.

Don't thing of weight on the bike making the bike generate less horsepower. The weight on the bike doesn't affect how much horsepower is generated, just how much is used.

hd2003-se2005 · « **Reply #65 on:** July 15, 2005, 07:01:14 AM »

Quote

Hd2003,

Does that theory also apply when the bike is on the DynoJet? [smiley=confused5.gif]

If so that could really skew the number's that have been posted........... [smiley=nixweiss.gif]
**************************************************************

Actually Fatboy the weight of the dyno operator can make a difference!

If you get a reading with the dyno operator sitting on the bike and then another with the operator still on the bike but with their feet touching the ground (no weight on the seat) the #'s will be higher.

So yes, that "FACT" (not theory) does apply.

Another way to increase the #s on the dyno chart is to increase the air pressure in the rear tire. More air more power!

So it's all relative,

[smiley=laugh.gif]

hd2003-se2005 · « **Reply #66 on:** July 15, 2005, 07:07:47 AM »

Don

Your statement is correct, but I need to add to it.

Quote,
"Don't think of weight on the bike making the bike generate less horsepower. The weight on the bike doesn't affect how much horsepower is generated, just how much is used. "
The weight on the bike during testing can alter the readings that the dyno will show.

Chip

Twolanerider · « **Reply #67 on:** July 15, 2005, 10:02:55 AM »

Quote

So it's all relative,
[smiley=laugh.gif]

Yeah Chip without mentioning it I was assuming static conditions for the rider as a control. Though the production by the engine still stays the same in any case. The only difference is still where/how/doing what that power gets used up.

However..... it seems really uncool to be bringing fat relatives in to this discussion [smiley=huepfenjump3.gif] [smiley=huepfenlol2.gif] [smiley=huepfenjump3.gif]

HUBBARD · « **Reply #68 on:** July 15, 2005, 12:44:38 PM »

Quote

And fatboy

I asked Black Dog to post that information.

He can back it up if needed.

I thought it was very relevant to this topic.

So for every 6 lbs of weight on your bike your giving away 1 horsepower.

How do you get free horsepower, lose weight!

And to bring it full circle, the skinny guy vrs. the fat [smiley=cry2.gif]guy on the like equipped SEEG, guess what.

Skinny guy is TOP DOG

Sooooooooooo, hd2003,
Taking into account my limited knowledge concerning the dynamics of Physics, would I be correct in assuming if one particular Motorsickle weighed 150 lbs. more than the other, and the heavier Motorsickle had 5 more HP by the "Hallowed" Dyno Sheet than the the other, the lighter Motorsickle would, in fact, have a 20 Horsepower advantage on the heavier one? Seems rather extreme to me. Please advise. Later--HUBBARD

Dr. Evil · « **Reply #69 on:** July 15, 2005, 01:01:59 PM »

So by that crazy math.... [smiley=nixweiss.gif]

Me 275
passenger 130

405lbs total

divided by 6 is 67.5!

So my SEEG has 31 horsepower when were on it.
My Road Glide has basically NONE... because 67.5 is probably more than a stock 88 has!
And my Springer - same story.

I think you better check your math because we rode all the way to Maggie Valley with zero (actually negative as we had 100lbs of crap on the bike) horsepower! [smiley=dunce2.gif]

HUBBARD · « **Reply #70 on:** July 15, 2005, 01:38:46 PM »

Quote

So by that crazy math.... [smiley=nixweiss.gif]

Me 275
passenger 130

405lbs total

divided by 6 is 67.5!

So my SEEG has 31 horsepower when were on it.
My Road Glide has basically NONE... because 67.5 is probably more than a stock 88 has!
And my Springer - same story.

I think you better check your math because we rode all the way to Maggie Valley with zero (actually negative as we had 100lbs of crap on the bike) horsepower! [smiley=dunce2.gif]

Yeah, 'er 'uh, DJW,
I think Chip's starting point is Stock HP coupled with published weight. But what the hell do I know? I was flogged once for saying, "Weight is Horsepower", here, so I'll wait for the formula. Later--HUBBARD

hd2003-se2005 · « **Reply #71 on:** July 15, 2005, 01:45:11 PM »

Whoa guys!

That's Tater and DJW

And I'm quoting myself,

"I asked Black Dog to post that information.

He can back it up if needed."
***********************************************

I just talked to Black Dog on the phone.

He's at work but he WILL post the math.

Knowing how mathmatically talented DJW, Tater and others on this site are, you can be assured that i didn't whip those #'s out of my a$$.

The 6 lbs. per horsepower is correct!

More to follow!

Dr. Evil · « **Reply #72 on:** July 15, 2005, 01:56:20 PM »

Well Chip, somebody musta whipped it outta somebody's a$$ [smiley=laugh.gif]

It just doesn't make any sense [smiley=nixweiss.gif]

How does a motorcycle (nearly stock TC88) loaded with 405lbs of people.... and conservatively 50-75lbs (ok, 100 was an exaggeration) of crap.... move 90mph for most of 750 miles (each way) with no horsepower?

480 divided by 6 = 80! That bike probably makes 70 horse on a good day.
So I'm 10 horse in the hole, without even considering the weight of the bike! [smiley=confused5.gif]

Twolanerider · « **Reply #73 on:** July 15, 2005, 02:01:15 PM »

Quote

Whoa guys!

The 6 lbs. per horsepower is correct!

More to follow!

That's another of those "as far as it goes" kind of things Chip. Once a rolling mass starts rolling it's not the increased weight in isolation that uses up greater amounts of energy (in our case measured horsepower). Remember, the actual horsepower output of the engine will (for the purposes of the measures we're looking at) stay the same. What we're actually taking about is how much of it goes to parasitic losses like drag due to increased weight. And that takes us back to the beginning.

Weight, in isolation, won't give a static loss of some amount of horsepower (transferrable). Weight will increase drag. That's actually what we're talking about here. I've never seen aero drag numbers for an Electra Glide so can't calculate for you what the amount of increased drag will be for increased weights at differetn speeds. But it's the drag that causes the "performance" loss.

The effect of drag will go up (exponentially) as speed increases. So the performance drag on a rolling mass (our bikes) of 10 pounds at 20 mph will be less than the loss due to that same 10 pounds at 80 mph unless something else changes aerodynamically between those speeds to change the amount of drag. But since our bikes don't have a variable sweep wing to change aerodynamics over a speed range like, say, the old F14 our drag only gets worse as we go faster.

So, yeah, both directly and indirectly weight "costs" horsepower. After all, it takes more push to get something going that weighs 900 pounds than it does soemthing that weighs 800 pounds. So that part is only obvious. But the greater loss at speed will be drag and that will increase more the faster we go. The curve may be smooth but the number won't be static.

Dr. Evil · « **Reply #74 on:** July 15, 2005, 02:02:48 PM »

That was my point as well... the number CANNOT be static. It's impossible.

hd2003-se2005 · « **Reply #75 on:** July 15, 2005, 02:04:08 PM »

Dr. Evil

Patience is required.
Black Dog will post the math.

Follow Tater's lead [smiley=laugh.gif] and chill a bit.

It's coming!

HUBBARD · « **Reply #76 on:** July 15, 2005, 02:08:54 PM »

Quote

That was my point as well... the number [bgcolor=Yellow]CANNOT[/bgcolor] be static. It's [bgcolor=Yellow]impossible[/bgcolor].

There endeth the lesson. Later--HUBBARD

Dr. Evil · « **Reply #77 on:** July 15, 2005, 02:17:27 PM »

Quote

Dr. Evil

Patience is required.
Black Dog will post the math.

Follow Tater's lead [smiley=laugh.gif] and chill a bit.

It's coming!

Patience is a virtue I do not possess unfortunately [smiley=laugh.gif]

Even better math problems.... [smiley=confused5.gif]

So if 6lbs (the alleged static number) costs 1 horse...
an 800lb bike would cost 133hp
an 800lb bike with me on it would cost 179hp
an 800lb bike with me and passenger would cost 200 horse!

My SEEG has only half that, and still moves pretty damn quick 2up! [smiley=laugh.gif] The math is flawed my friend.

Fatboy · « **Reply #78 on:** July 15, 2005, 02:21:06 PM »

Chip,

Is there some sort of "gyroscopic" effect which comes into play once the motorcycle (mass) is in motion?

I think I'm starting to understand better a catch phrase used here a lot....."judge by the seat of your pants experience."

The dyno number's are a tool....maybe best used to check the efficientcy and correct tuning of the scoot. But due to all the dynamics in play the actual ride on the street is what may matter most.

hd2003-se2005 · « **Reply #79 on:** July 15, 2005, 02:29:40 PM »

Quote

There endeth the lesson. Later--HUBBARD

Tater the lesson is not over.
Wait (please) until Black Dog post the math.
**********************************

And DJW
YEP, you are impatient. I have that problem also!
But bear with me till you read Dog's post.
***********************************

TwoLane
Thanks Bud for your help!
**********************************

Fat Boy

Sorry, I have clouded this thread. Just thought that info was important!

[smiley=nixweiss.gif]

Twolanerider · « **Reply #80 on:** July 15, 2005, 03:24:19 PM »

Quote

Is there some sort of "gyroscopic" effect which comes into play once the motorcycle (mass) is in motion?

Fatboy,
The gyroscopic effect is what keeps us upright. The gyros are the spinning wheels. While I suppose we all like to think it's our superhuman balancing skills that keeps our mean machines upright buzzing down the road at whatever miles per hour, well..... actually.... notsomuch [smiley=laugh.gif] .

The wheels, once they start spinning, are our gyroscopes and they tend to pull everything inline along the axes they share. That's why if you lean over a bit while going down the road it kind of feels like "something" is pushing you back up on the bike (until you lean too far). That same gyro effect is why countersteering is what it is and works as it does. But gyro effect is a keep me upright kind of thing but not (directly) a make me go fast kind of thing. Gyro effect is why the bike stays up while going down the road but falls down if you let go (without the kickstand deployed) while it's standing still [smiley=beerchug.gif]

ufo · « **Reply #81 on:** July 15, 2005, 06:47:58 PM »

I'd like to claim top dog for leaving HD2003 in the dust from 70 to 120 mph [smiley=shocked2.gif] with the exact same setup he has but by using his pc map [smiley=thumbsup.gif]

Ok, in all fairness I probably weigh a little less [smiley=curtain.gif]. Nice meeting you HD and thanks again for the map.

ufo

hd2003-se2005 · « **Reply #82 on:** July 15, 2005, 07:24:59 PM »

Hi UFO

Strange how all this comes together!
The post above was about the skinny guy VRS. the (not so skinny) guy.

See, I am the example.
All conditions and equipment the same.
Probably 60 to 70 lbs. difference in riders.
10+ horsepower difference,
Results, I lose [smiley=cry2.gif]

UFO, I had posted the below to Hubbard the day you and I met at Stations Inn,

"I should have called you so we could have gone riding today.
It was a good day, rode 400 miles.
Went to Shatly Springs and then rode over to Stations Inn.
Ran into a UFO on a red SEEG and got dusted on the way back.
All in all a good day."
**************************************************

Was good to meet you UFO
I want another chance.
Me and 103T are dieting for horsepower!

[smiley=bigok.gif]

Actually it was hd-dude's map. Thanks Mr. Dude!
Would it help if I said I never loaded it into mine.
I'm looking at some other options.

Black_Dog · « **Reply #83 on:** July 15, 2005, 09:57:27 PM »

So far I'm missing critical data, I've started to build a 3D performance model that will show needed HP at a given weight, speed and CD, as I work on the curve using .400 and .500 for CD the results change dramaticaly it looks like we need to know the exact CD for a SEEG. I'll work more on this early next week. I also know that there are at least 2 HD Engineers that follow our threads quit often and just maybe they can help us out with the CD.

Black Dog [smiley=beerchug.gif]

Black_Dog · « **Reply #84 on:** July 16, 2005, 10:09:47 AM »

I was watching the Speed channel this morning and they were working on an old Mustang and were removing weight, they said that every 100 pounds you remove from the car it will take 15 less HP to launch the car with the same velocity. That equals 6.6 pounds per HP.

If 2 identical SEEG's are racing and one has a rider that is 80 pounds heavier it will take 12 more HP for him to accelerale at the same rate.

Black Dog [smiley=beerchug.gif]

ggraves427 · « **Reply #85 on:** July 16, 2005, 10:49:15 AM »

Yeah, if you see a little skinny fart on a B/B SEEG, stay away. How about a CVO meeting somewhere where there is a eighth mile drag race track near by. Have everybody that wants to play put in $20. Last man standing takes all. Timing slips talk and BS walks. [smiley=beerchug.gif] Quit spending money on engine parts and start buying diet beer. Look at beanpole, he's kicking ass.

Twolanerider · « **Reply #86 on:** July 16, 2005, 11:34:03 AM »

Quote

I was watching the Speed channel this morning and they were working on an old Mustang and were removing weight, they said that every 100 pounds you remove from the car it will take 15 less HP to launch the car with the same velocity. That equals 6.6 pounds per HP.

If 2 identical SEEG's are racing and one has a rider that is 80 pounds heavier it will take 12 more HP for him to accelerale at the same rate.

Black Dog [smiley=beerchug.gif]

It's true that the parasitic loss from extra weight at launch is important at the track. One of the most important things for someone really in to it actually. But even then it's not the only thing. Gearing, where the mill's power band goes through, where the stall is (if it's an automatic), and a variety of other factors all figure in. The Speed Channel is often entertaining. But it's not really a chalk board that presents physics too well.

But even then the weight becomes secondary as a source of parasitic loss of performance (not engine produced power, but overall performance) to the aero drag of the rolling mass going down the road. At the drag strip weight is so especially important because you're in an environment where the launch is sooooo important and you spend so little (comparatively speaking) time actually moving down the road.

In a different environment, however, there are particular circumstances where the weight has specific kind of benefits in terms of momentum. So you should always keep in mind that none of this stuff can stand alone and for every circumstance where an individual factor might be beneficial there's almost always some countervailing circumstance where a nearly opposite factor might also be important.

Some years back I used to be spend a lot of time at the track (oval and drags). Built a few cars and blueprinted more engines than I care to remember (it's a mind numbing exercise in details detail details). The scientific calculators and computers of the day were just part of what we did accounting for the total mass and where it was on the car (which is also just as important). I personally only ever ran naturally aspirated and my best time was only ever an 8.48 at 163. So we were by no means running with the big dogs. But you still begin to get clued in.

For our bikes running around the street a difference of 40 pounds pulling away from the stop sign will be felt in the seat of your pants. Sure. But it doesn't have the continuous parasitic loss once you get moving that DJ was humorously suggesting when he figured that with the weight of he and his passenger and loaded bags that he'd actually have to be riding downhill and backward with a tailwind to have gotten anyplace. It just doesn't work that way. The overall weigt will affect us starting out and have an impact on rate of acceleration to a desired point. The faster you're rolling, however, the more important becomes the aero drag; especially for something as small and comparatively light as our bikes. And doubling your speed doesn't simply double your drag. No, we're not that lucky. But once you get to a given speed it takes far less power (from the engine) to hold it there than it did to accelerate to that point. So that extra fifty pounds on the saddle or in the tour pak makes a minimal to cruising down the road.

So I guess you might say that (for normal riding) we'd go on a diet and lose weight to get started faster. But to move faster or more efficiently going down the road it would be more important to be aerodynamically sleeker. And believe me, sleek is one thing this body will never be [smiley=huepfenlol2.gif]

hd2003-se2005 · « **Reply #87 on:** July 16, 2005, 12:13:01 PM »

Don

I don't really see making a SEEG a whole lot more aerodynamic.
You can
remove tour pak
smaller windshield
remove lowers
leave off wind deflectors

But past the above, you start changing the essence of the look of the bike.
Our challenge is to make our brick as aerodynamic as possible and make up the difference with horsepower.

.

Mr. We · « **Reply #88 on:** July 16, 2005, 12:15:36 PM »

Lets not forget that diet! [smiley=thumbsup.gif]

I'm down 15 lbs, that's gotta be another horsey! [smiley=beerchug.gif]

Twolanerider · « **Reply #89 on:** July 16, 2005, 05:04:17 PM »

Quote

Don

I don't really see making a SEEG a whole lot more aerodynamic.
You can
remove tour pak
smaller windshield
remove lowers
leave off wind deflectors

But past the above, you start changing the essence of the look of the bike.
Our challenge is to make our brick as aerodynamic as possible and make up the difference with horsepower.

.

I agree with you completely Chip. They is what they is.

So barring changes that most of us really wouldn't want anyway we (to borrow a phrase) ride it like we stole it and just don't worry about it a whole lot [smiley=7.gif] . We may have something that has the glide ratio of just worse than a well thrown rock; but they look cool anyway !!

SHRADER · « **Reply #90 on:** July 16, 2005, 06:25:39 PM »

Heck,

With my bike making 113HP and me weighing 120 pounds less than I did a year ago, my bike might outrun the Space Shuttle !!! HEE HEE [smiley=huepfenjump3.gif]

SHRADER

Twolanerider · « **Reply #91 on:** July 16, 2005, 10:15:12 PM »

Quote

the Space Shuttle !!!

And yet another example of something with the glide rate of a well thrown rock !! [smiley=huepfenlol2.gif]

DCFIREMANN · « **Reply #92 on:** July 17, 2005, 07:52:12 AM »

Quote

Heck,

With my bike making 113HP and me weighing 120 pounds less than I did a year ago, my bike might outrun the Space Shuttle !!! HEE HEE [smiley=huepfenjump3.gif]

SHRADER

120lbs?

? SCRADER we are going to put you in charge of the FLHRESI.ORG DIET CLUB!!!! That would be another good topic instead of talking about making all this H/P we need to work on our weight. I don't know how you did it but you are the man.

Be Safe

THE DAWG

SHRADER · « **Reply #93 on:** July 17, 2005, 12:13:27 PM »

Quote

120lbs?? SHRADER we are going to put you in charge of the FLHRESI.ORG DIET CLUB!!!! That would be another good topic instead of talking about making all this H/P we need to work on our weight. I don't know how you did it but you are the man.

Be Safe

THE DAWG

122.5 to be exact using simple willpower ol'boy, and determination. I would be happy to head up the diet club if desired.

SHRADER (NO "C")

SHRADER · « **Reply #94 on:** July 17, 2005, 12:17:30 PM »

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And yet another example of something with the glide rate of a well thrown rock !! [smiley=huepfenlol2.gif]

The only question I got is if the Shuttle has speed wobbles like my SEEG?

SHRADER

OTIS · « **Reply #95 on:** July 17, 2005, 12:49:02 PM »

All he did was go to the rest room.

OTIS

SHRADER · « **Reply #96 on:** July 17, 2005, 08:22:18 PM »

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All he did was go to the rest room.

OTIS

Yeah uh 'er OTIS,

Talk about me!! [smiley=nixweiss.gif] Between you and Hubbard we are gonna have to install some sort of ventilation system in the secret underground garage of HRR. PHEW!!! [smiley=thumbsdown.gif] [smiley=zstupid.gif]

Always Gasping
SHRADER

hd2003-se2005 · « **Reply #97 on:** July 17, 2005, 09:44:57 PM »

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Heck,

With my bike making 113HP and me weighing 120 pounds less than I did a year ago, my bike might outrun the Space Shuttle !!! HEE HEE [smiley=huepfenjump3.gif]

SHRADER

**********************************************************************

No sense in trying the shuttle if you get dusted by a TATER! [smiley=shocked2.gif]

[smiley=cherry.gif]

spydglide · « **Reply #98 on:** July 17, 2005, 09:53:11 PM »

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Patience is a virtue I do not possess unfortunately [smiley=laugh.gif]

Even better math problems.... [smiley=confused5.gif]

So if 6lbs (the alleged static number) costs 1 horse...
an 800lb bike would cost 133hp
an 800lb bike with me on it would cost 179hp
an 800lb bike with me and passenger would cost 200 horse!

My SEEG has only half that, and still moves pretty damn quick 2up! [smiley=laugh.gif] The math is flawed my friend.

DJW..........if I could just make myself take the triple-basic-loads for ea. weapon out of my saddlebags, I could probably be 'TopDog' in a hurry! Har! [smiley=rifle.gif] spyder

Dr. Evil · « **Reply #99 on:** July 18, 2005, 10:19:55 PM »

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DJW..........if I could just make myself take the triple-basic-loads for ea. weapon out of my saddlebags, I could probably be 'TopDog' in a hurry! Har! [smiley=rifle.gif] spyder

[smiley=beerchug.gif]

HUBBARD · « **Reply #100 on:** July 20, 2005, 03:07:49 PM »

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122.5 to be exact using simple willpower ol'boy, and determination. I would be happy to head up the diet club if desired.

SHRADER (NO "C")

Yeah, 'er 'uh, DCFIREMANN,
And here is SHRADER preparing himself for the trip to the restroom! [smiley=huepfenjump3.gif] [smiley=huepfenjump3.gif] [smiley=huepfenjump3.gif]Later--HUBBARD

HUBBARD · « **Reply #101 on:** July 20, 2005, 03:11:45 PM »

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120lbs?? SCRADER we are going to put you in charge of the FLHRESI.ORG DIET CLUB!!!! That would be another good topic instead of talking about making all this H/P we need to work on our weight. I don't know how you did it but you are the man.

Be Safe

THE DAWG

Yeah, 'er 'uh, DCFIREMANN,
More preparation for the trip to the restroom! [smiley=huepfenjump3.gif] [smiley=huepfenjump3.gif] [smiley=huepfenjump3.gif] OTIS said it was really BAD! [smiley=yes.gif] Later--HUBBARD

DCFIREMANN · « **Reply #102 on:** July 20, 2005, 09:22:14 PM »

HUBBARD THAT LOOKS LIKE LESSON NUMBER ONE FOR THE CVOHARLEY DIET CLUB!!!!!

Be Safe

THE DAWG

spydglide · « **Reply #103 on:** July 20, 2005, 09:29:09 PM »

What's that blue thing coming out of Shrader's shirt? Is that part of the 122lbs? Aaaarrg! [smiley=pirate.gif] spyder

Twolanerider · « **Reply #104 on:** July 20, 2005, 10:21:44 PM »

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What's that blue thing coming out of Shrader's shirt? Is that part of the 122lbs? Aaaarrg! [smiley=pirate.gif] spyder

Spyder, maybe it's the CVO version of "Alien?" [smiley=nervous.gif]

HUBBARD · « **Reply #105 on:** July 20, 2005, 11:31:11 PM »

Yeah, 'er 'uh, spyder,
You silly boy! You clowns crack me up! That's no more than a "Hillbilly Belly Ball", and SHRADER is performing the "Pre-Enema Roll" procedure, in OTIS's garage. OTIS told me it's funny now, but at the time, he failed to find the humor in it. OTIS told me he had to call "ROTO-ROOTER", AND the Chit Wagon, (up here, that's "Brown's Septic Tank Service", their slogan is "If it don't go down, Call Brown!) to come pump his septic system! Worse than that, it took 'em three days to get his system back in operation, and Mr. & Mrs. OTIS had to rent a "Here's Johnny" to do their business! [smiley=huepfenjump3.gif] [smiley=huepfenjump3.gif] [smiley=huepfenjump3.gif] Gawd, I'm tellin' ya', we could write a book! [smiley=bigok.gif] I gotta' go, man! I'm laughin' so hard, my sides hurt! Later--HUBBARD

hd2003-se2005 · « **Reply #106 on:** July 21, 2005, 07:32:23 AM »

Black_Dog

Hows it coming with those figures?
Don't need all that fancy stuff just some understandable math!

[smiley=nixweiss.gif]

SHRADER · « **Reply #107 on:** July 21, 2005, 08:54:08 PM »

At least this proves I was once 360 pounds. It also proves that I'm no longer full of "chit", unlike brother HUBBARD. HUBBARD the ball is still at OTIS house whenever you want to use it. YOU NEED IT BAD!!!

REGARDS
SHRADER

spydglide · « **Reply #108 on:** July 21, 2005, 09:08:15 PM »

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Yeah, 'er 'uh, spyder,
OTIS told me he had to call "ROTO-ROOTER", AND the Chit Wagon, (up here, that's "Brown's Septic Tank Service", their slogan is "If it don't go down, Call Brown!) --HUBBARD

Yeah Hub........I've got a good buddy that I ride with that's got a septic tank bizness that's called: Dr. Pumper and his pumpout truck is painted like a Dr. Pepper can.........needless to say, the soft drink people are not happy and threatened to sue him.........course you've gotta know Dr. Pumper to understand that he just don't give a chit what they threaten....he's still driving around in the truck looking like a giant soft-drink making pumpout calls! Har! [smiley=toilet.gif] spyder

Author Topic: SEEG TOP DOG'S (Read 10071 times)

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