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[Eqcons]

Since I got back from vacation, I've been thinking my 110 was making more valvetrain noise than usual.  I kept trying to convince myself that having just done 4000+ miles on a 103, I just needed to get used to the noisy 110 again, but it was still nagging me, so I listened while I held the revs up standing still without my helmet on, and sure enough, there's a major noise there that shouldn't be.

Starts about 2200rpm, and stays there - 3000rpm is about the worst point.  Despite my best efforts, I can't work out where it's coming from. Even listening with a screwdriver to my ear doesn't help.  Sounds like it MIGHT be a chain thrashing about, so that would either be the primary (but I can't feel any slack in that when I'm riding) or the cam chain (but the motor is running great.)  However, it's a nasty noise, and it shouldn't be there.  

Bike has done just 8000 miles.  

Any ideas folks?

Still under warranty, so I'll put the dealer on it next week, but I'd sure like to know what it is before I take it....


Jim

[Robmay]

I had a similar chain noise on my 09. Local dealer said it was normal.  Another dealer agreed, took the bike in, stayed at it and eventually replaced all of the lifters (I think). The problem was that the seals were allow the oil pressure to drop which in turn wouldn't keep pressure for the cam chain tensioners to work thus resulting in the cam chain slapping the case. Once they replaced them it was like night and day.

[Eqcons]

I had a similar chain noise on my 09. Local dealer said it was normal.  Another dealer agreed, took the bike in, stayed at it and eventually replaced all of the lifters (I think). The problem was that the seals were allow the oil pressure to drop which in turn wouldn't keep pressure for the cam chain tensioners to work thus resulting in the cam chain slapping the case. Once they replaced them it was like night and day.

Thanx Rob.  That sounds VERY possible - sometimes, but not always, when the bike is hot (strangely not when it's cold, because it's been hot before it got cold, if you see what I mean) the oil has drained down from one of the lifters and it chatters like crazy till the pressure builds again...

Jim

[RDWEAVER]

I have a 110 with the same noise I think. Sounds to me like it may be excessive piston to bore clearance. I have about 7K on mine still under warranty but you can bet I will know what it is before my 2 years are up.

RD

[Eqcons]

I have a 110 with the same noise I think. Sounds to me like it may be excessive piston to bore clearance. I have about 7K on mine still under warranty but you can bet I will know what it is before my 2 years are up.

RD

Mine goes to the dealer next Thursday, so I hope we'll find out before too long!

I don't think it's piston slap though, but I could easily be wrong......

Jim

[Foolhardy]

Eqcons, "Check 110 has knock in engine" thread aswell.

I had exactly the same problem at 600 miles - tappety noise sounded like coming from top left of front cylinder -

Dealer has pulled down the top end and cams - fault apears to be the circlip coming off the end of the front camshaft allowing the cam to float - that has caused wear in the camshaft outer housing, followers, rockers and valves as the gapping was "variable".

Good news is Singapore Harley have ordered up all the parts and lent me the demo 2010 Street Glide meantime.

Will follow up with any other info which might be usefull to y'all.  Maybe I should start a thread under "Circlip" just to get attention?[/b][/b]

Since I wrote this 10 days ago the dealership has received the parts from US (I live in Singapore) and are in process of fitting and hopefully roadtesting in next couple of days.  Be interesting to hear if you have the same issue??

I doubted my own sanity when I took the bike in but dealer agreed there was rather too much noise from the top end.  If you leave it the cam will start wearing an oval in it's outer support housing resulting in rocker to valve clearances getting bigger and potentially creating more damage.

This is an easy check for dealer but may not be the cause of your troubles!

Good luck!!

[Eqcons]

Eqcons, "Check 110 has knock in engine" thread aswell.

I had exactly the same problem at 600 miles - tappety noise sounded like coming from top left of front cylinder -

Dealer has pulled down the top end and cams - fault apears to be the circlip coming off the end of the front camshaft allowing the cam to float - that has caused wear in the camshaft outer housing, followers, rockers and valves as the gapping was "variable".

Good news is Singapore Harley have ordered up all the parts and lent me the demo 2010 Street Glide meantime.

Will follow up with any other info which might be usefull to y'all.  Maybe I should start a thread under "Circlip" just to get attention?[/b][/b]

Since I wrote this 10 days ago the dealership has received the parts from US (I live in Singapore) and are in process of fitting and hopefully roadtesting in next couple of days.  Be interesting to hear if you have the same issue??

I doubted my own sanity when I took the bike in but dealer agreed there was rather too much noise from the top end.  If you leave it the cam will start wearing an oval in it's outer support housing resulting in rocker to valve clearances getting bigger and potentially creating more damage.

This is an easy check for dealer but may not be the cause of your troubles!

Good luck!!

Thanks FH. I read your thread already, so will add that to the list to suggest to the dealer!

Jim

[Foolhardy]

Good luck mate.

By the way, my info should have read 6000 miles, not 600!

I see the Jockinese flag on your post, where are you located?

[Eqcons]

Good luck mate.

By the way, my info should have read 6000 miles, not 600!

I see the Jockinese flag on your post, where are you located?

St Fillans, in Perthshire - you're in Singapore, I see, but where are you from?

Jim

[Foolhardy]

Old man and Gradpa from Aberdeen - I escaped as far as Alnwick in Northumberland!

Are you, the bike and the dealer in Gods country then?

[Eqcons]

Old man and Gradpa from Aberdeen - I escaped as far as Alnwick in Northumberland!

Are you, the bike and the dealer in Gods country then?

Yes, we are, firmly positioned here! 

What are you doing in Singapore - a long way from Alnwick? (I have a customer in Percy Street, in Alnwick)

Jim

[Jon Seddon]

Since I got back from vacation, I've been thinking my 110 was making more valvetrain noise than usual.  I kept trying to convince myself that having just done 4000+ miles on a 103, I just needed to get used to the noisy 110 again, but it was still nagging me, so I listened while I held the revs up standing still without my helmet on, and sure enough, there's a major noise there that shouldn't be.

Starts about 2200rpm, and stays there - 3000rpm is about the worst point.  Despite my best efforts, I can't work out where it's coming from. Even listening with a screwdriver to my ear doesn't help.  Sounds like it MIGHT be a chain thrashing about, so that would either be the primary (but I can't feel any slack in that when I'm riding) or the cam chain (but the motor is running great.)  However, it's a nasty noise, and it shouldn't be there.  

Bike has done just 8000 miles.  

Any ideas folks?

Still under warranty, so I'll put the dealer on it next week, but I'd sure like to know what it is before I take it....


Jim

Jim

Please keep me updated as mine is exactly the same age and about the same mileage.

Thanks

Jon

[Eqcons]

Jim

Please keep me updated as mine is exactly the same age and about the same mileage.

Thanks

Jon

You'll read it here first Jon! 

Jim

[RDWEAVER]

Jim

Please keep me updated as mine is exactly the same age and about the same mileage.

Thanks

Jon

Ditto for me. FYI, I asked a dealer this week, not my dealer but he was questioning my crankshaft?
RD

[LFMC Pharaoh]

Not sure if it may not be a problem that isn't necessarily specific to the 110.  Friend of mine recently had same noise as what it seems you are describing on his 2003 Classic.  We were on a trip out of state and didn't want to damage his scoot by not having it checked - took it to local "stealer" and eventually learned it was a loose compensator sprocket.  Exactly one hour later (charged for two and a half of labor -"stealer") we were back on the road with no further issues.

[Eqcons]

Not sure if it may not be a problem that isn't necessarily specific to the 110.  Friend of mine recently had same noise as what it seems you are describing on his 2003 Classic.  We were on a trip out of state and didn't want to damage his scoot by not having it checked - took it to local "stealer" and eventually learned it was a loose compensator sprocket.  Exactly one hour later (charged for two and a half of labor -"stealer") we were back on the road with no further issues.

Hmmmm.........  I've heard other instances of the compensator nut coming loose, I'm sure.

Jim

[Foolhardy]

Been to the dealership this afternoon - bike is back together and has been run but they want to give it a long roadtest prior to handover.

Interestingly I saw the "Screaming Eagle" cam plate in the accessories and Spares dept - this sports beautiful bushes inserted into the three shaft carriers - as per another thread here my "Screaming Eagle" engine comes with a bushing only for the mainshaft - the cams run in aluminium, this is better than the 2011 version which has NO bushes - looks like cost savings on what is supposed to be a top end engine!

Obvious question is if they offer the SE cam plate as an upgrade @ S$850+++ there is obviouly some mechanical advantage in having this component installed - unless they're just ripping us off - so why isnt the f*%"**g thing fitted as standard.......don't we pay for an SE engine, that kinda hints at SE internals??

Dealer has been great thus far but I will have to bring up the subject of the cam plate and ask them to quiz HD on this.  There are also superior cam bearings on offer for the other end of the shaft but again, I am 4 months and 10,500km into a 2 year warranty - why would I go to the expense of fitting these, especially as they should arguably be fitted in the original SE engine?

Another strange issue - right rear indicator does not work when the bike is very hot - this is when the rear cylinder goes into "pump" mode.  Anyone else noticed this or hazard a guess at the cause?

Will keep you guys updated on the rebuild.

[LFMC Pharaoh]

Check out this update: www.cvoharley.com/smf/index.php?topic=52566.msg765355#msg765355

[Foolhardy]

Thanks Pharaoh.

Ive got to ask the stupid question - what's a compensator? 

I'm assuming this is a terminology issue as I've pulled a few engines apart over the years and I don't believe that HD has actually come up with something "new" that I might not have seen before?!

[sadunbar]

Thanks Pharaoh.

Ive got to ask the stupid question - what's a compensator? 

I'm assuming this is a terminology issue as I've pulled a few engines apart over the years and I don't believe that HD has actually come up with something "new" that I might not have seen before?!

open the attached link.....   

[Eqcons]

Last night, I was sitting thinking about the trip to the dealer to investigate this noise. 

I suddenly - and I don't know why! - decided I thought I knew what it was, so I went straight to the garage, in a state of considerable undress (yes, I know, too much information...  ) and fixed the noise in 30 seconds.

It had happened before, you see, a year ago, but my aged memory had forgotten. (Why can I always remember the word "Alzheimers" whenever I try, but I forget everything else?)

The answer, the thing that made all that noise...........  One of my headbolt bridges was ever so slightly loose!  Got maybe 1/8 of a turn with the Allen Wrench on both screws.  Loose enough so you could just feel movement in it, tight enough so you wouldn't notice, except for the noise.  As I say, it happened a year back, both bridges, seriously loose, but I'd just forgotten.  Such is old age......

I did still go to the dealers though, to complain about the MAJOR cupping on both front and rear tyres!

Jim

[Boatman]

The finned head bolt bridges being loose really sound like the noise is in the motor-good find.
Terry's (Midnightrider) thread on his 06 made it easy for me on my 05 to fix.

[GregKhougaz]

Congrats Jim!  Glad you found the answer.  Here's a thought:

     LOCTITE!!     

                           

[Eqcons]

Congrats Jim!  Glad you found the answer.  Here's a thought:

     LOCTITIE!!     

                           

LOL!  Yes, they came with threadlocker, and last year I put loctite on when they came loose...... Only bike I've had this problem with, and I've had those same finned bridges on my last 4.....

Jim

[DESERTBEAR54]

Any Chance you can take a picture of that area for the Finned Head Bolts.

[Eqcons]

Any Chance you can take a picture of that area for the Finned Head Bolts.

Sure. It's the sunken Allen screws in the holes arrowed in red.

[bubtrauma]

Just a comment guys, I wonder. They do look good but do you not think they have a tendecy to retain heat. Please it is just a comment or observation or a question. I am not slamming the covers.

Bub

[Eqcons]

Just a comment guys, I wonder. They do look good but do you not think they have a tendecy to retain heat. Please it is just a comment or observation or a question. I am not slamming the covers.

Bub

Because of their large surface area, they should help dissipate heat...

Jim

[Boatman]

Because of their large surface area, they should help dissipate heat...

Jim

Yes, I think they would help in the cooling process too!  Better than a open area.

[Twolanerider]

Don't feel bad man.  I've had that happen at least three times over the years.  Both of the first two I hunted for awhile before I found it.  Good catch!

[Eqcons]

Don't feel bad man.  I've had that happen at least three times over the years.  Both of the first two I hunted for awhile before I found it.  Good catch!

Found it easy the last time, that's the thing, Don! 

[Twolanerider]

Found it easy the last time, that's the thing, Don! 

First two here were probably ten years apart.  Remember looking awhile the first time and finally touching the bridge while just generally touching everything trying to find the noise.  One of the "eureka" moments when the noise went away.

Second time I remember far more vividly.  Was a long way from home and began to hear engine noises.  Wasn't sure what it was but it didn't sound good.  In one of those "well, might as well ride it until it drops" modes as it was on a long holiday weekend, nothing was open and had 800 miles to get home.  At a gas stop didn't immediately find anything.  Then after what had been a couple hours highway riding it dawned on.  Reached down and burned my finger on the rear bridge and, voila, no more noise.  Finger didn't hurt at all .

[Eqcons]

First two here were probably ten years apart.  Remember looking awhile the first time and finally touching the bridge while just generally touching everything trying to find the noise.  One of the "eureka" moments when the noise went away.

Second time I remember far more vividly.  Was a long way from home and began to hear engine noises.  Wasn't sure what it was but it didn't sound good.  In one of those "well, might as well ride it until it drops" modes as it was on a long holiday weekend, nothing was open and had 800 miles to get home.  At a gas stop didn't immediately find anything.  Then after what had been a couple hours highway riding it dawned on.  Reached down and burned my finger on the rear bridge and, voila, no more noise.  Finger didn't hurt at all .

That would be probably the same finger that I sizzled when I found it last time! 

[DESERTBEAR54]

Thanks Eqcons!! This is good to know and hopefully I will remember this when the time comes. Is their a specific torque on them or just snug or no noise tight?

[Eqcons]

Thanks Eqcons!! This is good to know and hopefully I will remember this when the time comes. Is their a specific torque on them or just snug or no noise tight?

Would be near enough impossible to get an accurate torque on them - just nice and tight with the Allen key supplied.

Jim

[LarryB]

common problem

[sadunbar]

common problem

Nowwwwww you tell him!!!   

[SBB]

Nowwwwww you tell him!!!   

Larry is practicing for a political position.


SBB

[Twolanerider]

Would be near enough impossible to get an accurate torque on them - just nice and tight with the Allen key supplied.

Jim

3/8" drive might but a 1/4" drive Allen socket and ratchet get them in Bristol fashion.  Easier than 20 on-and-offs with an Allen wrench.

[Eqcons]

3/8" drive might but a 1/4" drive Allen socket and ratchet get them in Bristol fashion. 

If only such tools were to be found here! 

[Jon Seddon]

If only such tools were to be found here! 

Loads do em,  Uk tools for one http://www.uktools.com/product_info.php/1434drive-imperial-25mm-long-socket-p-38918 .

Pleased to hear you've sorted your problem.

Jon

[Eqcons]

Loads do em,  Uk tools for one http://www.uktools.com/product_info.php/1434drive-imperial-25mm-long-socket-p-38918 .

Pleased to hear you've sorted your problem.

Jon

No, those (as you say, easily available) wouldn't do, Jon.  Not long enough to get down to the head.  And ball-ended would be useful too...

Jim

[Jon Seddon]

No, those (as you say, easily available) wouldn't do, Jon.  Not long enough to get down to the head.  And ball-ended would be useful too...

Jim

My mistake, now there's a challenge.

Jon

[Eqcons]

My mistake, now there's a challenge.

Jon

plus a torque wrench small enough to get in! 

[Hotrod50]

Sure. It's the sunken Allen screws in the holes arrowed in red.

What year of 110" is this?  My 2009 SERG doesn't look like this.

[Twolanerider]

What year of 110" is this?  My 2009 SERG doesn't look like this.

The head bolt bridges are an accessory item.  Something from the P&A catalog.  Not a stock part.

[Eqcons]

What year of 110" is this?  My 2009 SERG doesn't look like this.

2009 - but the headbolt bridges are an accessory part, which will be why yours looks different.

Jim