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[Texas 103]

Am getting ready for round two of the neutral rattle cure. Decided after talking to john Sachs that the Baker door may take care of it or at least quiet it down a lot. Since the shafts move back and forth laterally, he suggested replacing the final drive gear which is the second weak link in the HD 6 speed.   We all know old bearing with plastic in it was junk. Learning a hell of a lot more about transmissions than i really wanted to..lol


Seems that mother HD finally has become aware of this and for the '17 and prior that have come out with a new single row bearing for the MDG along with an "updated " MDG. Ran up to HD last night and picked my HD guy's brain a little . Says he has changed out a few, says he can't see or measure  a difference but that doesn't  mean their isn't . Only difference you can see is a groove for the o ring. I will be slipping one in there when we do the Baker door. For now here are the new numbers :   

8967-A  MDG Bearing  $35.00
35122-A New MDG      $109.00

P.S. Looked at the  Baker MDG upgrade..At $599.00. I'm going to pass for now.   

[Yellow09SERG]

Greg, does there happen to be any numbers on the bearing that a person could cross back to SKF or such?

[Texas 103]

Greg, does there happen to be any numbers on the bearing that a person could cross back to SKF or such?

I saw an very detailed pic yesterday, Let me find it again. I know it says   " Made in  Slovakia" . Didn't think to take a picture last night when I had one in my hand . One of my other HD tech buds commented " Auto Tensioner". They never had that issue with the '05 and prior. Said put the new SE Tensioner with a new chain. They tend to be noisy with an old chain...Guess we'll see..lol     

[Yellow09SERG]

Well good luck. Hows the motor treating you?

[Texas 103]

Well good luck. Hows the motor treating you?

It's rockin and rollin.. found out it will run on 91 went I went thru OK &  IL..

Just found this jewel on HTT:  The   trapdoor of the mainshaft also gets a new bearing 11000010.Guess that's a change for 17-18   Well I wonder why..lol they are heading the right way to maybe minimize the rattle a little, we'll see..   

[grc]

Changing more than one thing at a time won't tell you what was actually causing the issue, assuming changing all that stuff actually fixes the rattle.

A good short term fix is sawdust in the lube.  It worked wonders for guys trying to unload cars with noisy transmissions and rear axles back in the 60's.

Jerry

[Texas 103]

Changing more than one thing at a time won't tell you what was actually causing the issue, assuming changing all that stuff actually fixes the rattle.

A good short term fix is sawdust in the lube.  It worked wonders for guys trying to unload cars with noisy transmissions and rear axles back in the 60's.

Jerry

I hear you on that one!  I m sure HD has has their share of neutral rattle complaints.  I got it, let's market Jerry's Anti -Rattle special sauce!   your new anti rattle solution...Only available here for a limited  time!   

[J.D.]

Just so I'm clear, 6-speeds prior to '17 can benefit from a new main drive gear, main drive gear bearing, and trap door mainshaft bearing - all of which have been upgraded by the MoCo?

[grc]

Just so I'm clear, 6-speeds prior to '17 can benefit from a new main drive gear, main drive gear bearing, and trap door mainshaft bearing - all of which have been upgraded by the MoCo?

I never assume anymore that part changes Harley makes are intended as quality improvements to address customer concerns.  As often as not such changes are actually made to reduce their costs.  It would be nice if they would put out tech bulletins, known as TSB's in the auto business, detailing issues being experienced and providing information regarding the cause of the problem, any recommended diagnostics, updated part numbers, etc.  I know Harley occasionally puts out what they call "tech tips", but all too often they just ignore the customer complaints or put out a tip telling dealers to tell customers the condition is normal.  After all, everything is "normal" and "meets specifications" so they don't need to provide fixes.

Jerry

[J.D.]

It's very confusing.  I've finally got a handle on my '02 but have not really figured out the HD system, exactly as stated.

"Oh, that noise is normal, most of them sound like that." 

[Texas 103]

Just so I'm clear, 6-speeds prior to '17 can benefit from a new main drive gear, main drive gear bearing, and trap door mainshaft bearing - all of which have been upgraded by the MoCo?

YES, That's what my HD tech told me last night. It's a retro fit for all the way back to  "07 . Not sure what the engineering change is in the  "new" MDG. It's my  understanding if any 6 speed bike comes in with MDG issue, they get the  "new" gear & bearing. 

New Trap door bearings  MAY help, kinda doubt it. Problem is the bearings are held in the trap door  by snap rings that tend to collapse and let the bearings move back and forth when the shafts start moving laterally from what I've been told.The  Baker door is much thicker and bigger bearings that are held in by a plate and 6 screws keep that from happening . Wouldn't be surprised if the HD  door flexes also, some say it does..   

[Texas 103]

It's very confusing.  I've finally got a handle on my '02 but have not really figured out the HD system, exactly as stated.

"Oh, that noise is normal, most of them sound like that." 

You've got a real compensator that gets oil and a real primary chain adjuster. They never had any problem with the old manual adjuster set up. Just for grins you might slip the  the old manual adjuster back on I'd bet it will quiet down even more. '06 and on...not so much 

[J.D.]

Yeah comp is rock solid.  I actually "upgraded" to the auto adjuster and have absolutely no complaints or regrets.

[fastfreddy]

hope you have some positive results. mine still same as new... noisy, rattly & clunky. 19.5k on it now but shifts just fine 

[Texas 103]

hope you have some positive results. mine still same as new... noisy, rattly & clunky. 19.5k on it now but shifts just fine 

I am with you my friend! stay tuned, there's a reason HD came out with the new MDG & bearing.   

[johnsachs]

Don't know about the MDG being a problem, but the main drive dual row ball bearing, with the plastic separators is a big POS. 
Keep us in the loop.

[Texas 103]

Don't know about the MDG being a problem, but the main drive dual row ball bearing, with the plastic separators is a big POS. 
Keep us in the loop.

Probably should have used your description of the MDG bearing..instead of it being a problem.. Will keep you in the loop!..

[hdbrad03]

Interesting! There  are eleven balls in the 8967A bearing.  Bearing uses a nylon retainer and is not sealed on either side.

What makes it better?


 

   Brad

[Texas 103]

Interesting! There  are eleven balls in the 8967A bearing.  Bearing uses a nylon retainer and is not sealed on either side.

What makes it better?


 

   Brad

Brad, I don;t know for sure, some guys are saying stronger and will last longer than as Mr. Sachs put it   that pos dual row ball bearing, with the plastic separators . What I plan on doing when I receive it is,if I can see any numbers is  going to one of the big bearing houses here in Dallas   and see what we can see, If there's a better quality bearing ..I'm in.

[johnsachs]

I'm sure the MoCo has gone backwards before, but the issues with the dual row bearing, has cost the mothership enough to come up with a better piece. 
John

[Texas 103]

Greg, does there happen to be any numbers on the bearing that a person could cross back to SKF or such?

Here is the best image I found  . Here is a comment on it from HTT: The leading F in number dictates it's not available, note the Slovaki

[Texas 103]

Interesting! There  are eleven balls in the 8967A bearing.  Bearing uses a nylon retainer and is not sealed on either side.

What makes it better?


 

   Brad

Was talking to a bearing  guy today, Mentioned I thought the bearing had Phenolic retainer  in it. He said yes ,very common. The higher quality ones have brass retainers  in them. Couldn't cross the number, said bring it in he's measure it and see what's available in better quality. 

Not I think the 8978-A is  a poor bearing , but if i can get a better quality bearing while I have it down, I'll go with it .   Stay tuned   

[Yellow09SERG]

Was talking to a bearing today, Mentioned I thought the bearing had Phenolic retainer  in it. He said yes ,very common. The higher quality ones have brass retainers  in them. Couldn't cross the number, said bring it in he's measure it and see what's available in better quality. 

Not I think the 8978-A is  a poor bearing , but if i can get a better quality bearing while I have it down, I'll go with it .   Stay tuned   

Greg is this driving you so crazy you are talking to bearing now? Lol. What else did the bearing tell you today? Just poking so fun.
Like we were talking the other day we see a lot of mid duty bearing with Phenolic retainers. Typically we see them in printer class bearings where the IRC is less than a .0005. Be real curious to know what the IRC ison that bearing. Once you get the dimensions a call to SKF would let you know what if anything is available. Not sure what bearing house you are using but Motion is a pretty good resource for identifying and locating bearing and I know they have a big warehouse their in Dallas

[Texas 103]

Greg is this driving you so crazy you are talking to bearing now? Lol. What else did the bearing tell you today? Just poking so fun.
Like we were talking the other day we see a lot of mid duty bearing with Phenolic retainers. Typically we see them in printer class bearings where the IRC is less than a .0005. Be real curious to know what the IRC ison that bearing. Once you get the dimensions a call to SKF would let you know what if anything is available. Not sure what bearing house you are using but Motion is a pretty good resource for identifying and locating bearing and I know they have a big warehouse their in Dallas

Ok I was really talking to the bearing guy, not the f*^**g  bearing...lol.  but I was talking to that big ass snap ring that retains the bearing in the case  yesterday, gotta have some serious snap ring pliers to get that baby out..NAPA fixed me right up with big ass pliers that have a ratchet in them that lock in position...works great, just didn't like the price. oh well..Gotta pay to play!

[fastfreddy]

my 13 has always had a quite trans...but at 25k ish it got a bad vibration under hard acceleration, turned out to be the trans main bearing. it was replaced under warranty and has been even quieter/smoother since that repair. not sure what else was replaced at the time. just thinking out loud here...wish the rental could work/sound as good as the 13 dose 

[Yellow09SERG]

Ok I was really talking to the bearing guy, not the f*^**g  bearing...lol.  but I was talking to that big ass snap ring that retains the bearing in the case  yesterday, gotta have some serious snap ring pliers to get that baby out..NAPA fixed me right up with big ass pliers that have a ratchet in them that lock in position...works great, just didn't like the price. oh well..Gotta pay to play!

Those ratcheting pliers are nice! Just make sure once you have the snap ring clear I would place it flat against the floor or something to the effect before releasing the ratchet otherwise what you might have is a really fancy snap ring launcher. Don't ask how I know

[Texas 103]

Those ratcheting pliers are nice! Just make sure once you have the snap ring clear I would place it flat against the floor or something to the effect before releasing the ratchet otherwise what you might have is a really fancy snap ring launcher. Don't ask how I know

The BAP..Big Ass Pliers!