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Author Topic: Hillary Facts-Snope it, I didn't yet!  (Read 7744 times)

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Hoist!

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Hillary Facts-Snope it, I didn't yet!
« on: January 25, 2008, 08:55:57 AM »

If Morris did say this, I have no reason to doubt it! ;)

Hoist! 8)

From Dick Morris, former political advisor to President Bill Clinton

If you happen to see the Bill Clinton five-minute TV ad for Hillary in which he introduces the commercial by saying that he wants to share some things we may not know about Hillary's background . . . Beware.

As I was there for most of their presidency and know them better than just about anyone, I offer a few corrections;

·  Bill says: "In law school Hillary worked on legal services for the poor."

The facts are:

Hillary's main extra-curricular activity in law school was helping the Black Panthers, on trial in Connecticut for torturing and killing a federal agent. She went to court every day as part of a law student monitoring committee trying to spot civil rights violations and develop grounds for appeal.

.   Bill says: "Hillary spent a year after graduation working on a children's rights project for poor kids."


The facts are :

Hillary interned with Bob Truehaft, the head of the California Communist Party. She met Bob when he represented the Panthers and traveled all the way to San Francisco to take an internship with him.

.   Bill says: "Hillary could have written her own job ticket, but she turned down all the lucrative job offers."

The facts are:

She flunked the DC bar exam, yes, flunked, it is a matter of record, and only passed the Arkansas bar. She had no job offers in Arkansas, none, and only got hired by the University of Arkansas Law School at Fayetteville because Bill was already teaching there. She did not join the prestigious Rose Law Firm until Bill became Arkansas Attorney General and was made a partner only after he was elected Arkansas Governor. That law firm represented ALL of the polluters in Arkansas, e.g. Tyson Industries, the chicken and pork processors, who's violations came before the State regulatory bodies. In effect, her partnership was a structured bribe.

.   Bill says: "President Carter appointed Hillary to the Legal Services Board of Directors and she became its chairman."

The facts are:

The appointment was in exchange for Bill's support for Carter in his 1980 primary against Ted Kennedy. Hillary then became chairman in a coup, in which she won a majority away from Carter's choice to be chairman.

.   Bill says: "She served on the board of the Arkansas Children's Hospital."

The facts are:

Yes she did. But her main board activity, not mentioned by Bill, was to sit on the Walmart board of directors, for a substantial fee. She was silent about their labor and health care practices.

.   Bill says: "Hillary didn't succeed at getting health care for all Americans in 1994 but she kept working at it and helped to create the Children's Health Insurance Program (CHIP) that provides five million children with health insurance."

The facts are:

Hillary had nothing to do with creating CHIP. It was included in the budget deal between Clinton and Republican Majority Leader Senator Trent Lott . I know; I helped to negotiate the deal. The money came half from the budget deal and half from the Attorney Generals' tobacco settlement. Hillary had nothing to do with either source of funds.

.   Bill says: "Hillary was the face of America all over the world."

The facts are:

Her visits were part of a program to get her out of town so that Bill would not appear weak by feeding stories that Hillary was running the White House. Her visits abroad were entirely touristic and symbolic and there was no substantive diplomacy on any of them.

.   Bill says: "Hillary was an excellent Senator who kept fighting for children's and women's issues."

 The facts are: Other than totally meaningless legislation like changing the names on courthouses and post offices, she has passed only four substantive pieces of legislation. One set up a national park in Puerto Rico. A second provided respite care for family members helping their relatives through Alzheimer's or other conditions. And two were routine bills to aid 911 victims and responders which were sponsored by the entire NY delegation. Presently she is trying to have the US memorialize the Woodstock fiasco of 40 years ago.

Here is what bothers me more than anything else about Hillary Clinton . She has done everything possible to weaken the President and our country (that's you and me!) when it comes to the war on terror.

1. She wants to close GITMO and move the combatants to the USA where they would have access to our legal system.

2. She wants to eliminate the monitoring of suspected Al Qaeda phone calls to/from the USA .

3. She wants to grant constitutional rights to enemy combatants captured on the battlefield.

4. She wants to eliminate the monitoring of money transfers between suspected Al Qaeda cells and supporters in the USA .

5. She wants to eliminate the type of interrogation tactics used by the military & CIA where coercion might be used when questioning known terrorists even though such tactics might save American lives.

One cannot think of a single bill Hillary has introduced or a single comment she has made that would tend to strengthen our country in the War on Terror. But, one can think of a lot of comments she has made that weaken our country and makes it a more dangerous situation for all of us.

Bottom line: She goes hand in hand with the ACLU on far too many issues where common sense is abandoned.


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Hugh Janis

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Re: Hillary Facts-Snope it, I didn't yet!
« Reply #1 on: January 25, 2008, 09:04:48 AM »

 :nervous: :nervous: :nervous: :nervous: :nervous: :nervous: :nervous: :nervous: :nervous: :nervous: :nervous: :nervous: :nervous: :nervous: :nervous: :nervous: :nervous: :nervous: :nervous: :nervous: :nervous: :nervous:
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LRebel

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Re: Hillary Facts-Snope it, I didn't yet!
« Reply #2 on: January 25, 2008, 11:34:09 AM »

Ok Howie, you finally convinced me.......I'm voting Republican! ;) ;D
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Re: Hillary Facts-Snope it, I didn't yet!
« Reply #3 on: January 25, 2008, 11:51:59 AM »

This information cannot be verified, as Snopes is in the process of researching the data for accuracy.

That Morris said this is highly suspect, but everybody go ahead and foam at the mouth all day about Hillary.  That will be todays social/political topic, even if there are no public facts to support or deny it.
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Re: Hillary Facts-Snope it, I didn't yet!
« Reply #4 on: January 25, 2008, 12:01:32 PM »

This information cannot be verified, as Snopes is in the process of researching the data for accuracy.

That Morris said this is highly suspect, but everybody go ahead and foam at the mouth all day about Hillary.  That will be todays social/political topic, even if there are no public facts to support or deny it.

Sorry Terry......, but I was voting Republican anyway.  ;)
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Re: Hillary Facts-Snope it, I didn't yet!
« Reply #5 on: January 25, 2008, 12:05:45 PM »

Here's the true story on one small part of this, which casts doubt on whether any of it is accurate.

http://www.snopes.com/politics/clintons/panthers.asp
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Re: Hillary Facts-Snope it, I didn't yet!
« Reply #6 on: January 25, 2008, 12:09:25 PM »

Sorry Terry......, but I was voting Republican anyway.  ;)

I would have never guessed otherwise... ;D ;)

Quite honestly, I have not even come close to making my mind up yet, other than those I know I will NOT be voting for, then it will come down to who comes the closest...all are far from perfect, sort of like real people.
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amigo Jorge

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Re: Hillary Facts-Snope it, I didn't yet!
« Reply #7 on: January 25, 2008, 12:16:18 PM »

I am going to vote for  :gorgeous:
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Re: Hillary Facts-Snope it, I didn't yet!
« Reply #8 on: January 25, 2008, 12:22:53 PM »

I would have never guessed otherwise... ;D ;)

Quite honestly, I have not even come close to making my mind up yet, other than those I know I will NOT be voting for, then it will come down to who comes the closest...all are far from perfect, sort of like real people.

Totally Agree.  I vote Republican because (in the past anyway) they have more closely represented my values, both fiscally & socially.
Not at all impressed with the field this time.  I will have to narrow it down via process of elimination......I have until Feb. 5th for our primary election.
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Re: Hillary Facts-Snope it, I didn't yet!
« Reply #9 on: January 25, 2008, 01:28:14 PM »

Here's the true story on one small part of this, which casts doubt on whether any of it is accurate.

http://www.snopes.com/politics/clintons/panthers.asp

Actually Terry, what he said in Hoist's post is almost exactly what the Snopes article states, that she went there with a group of students for the ACLU to monitor for any civil rights violations.   So, IMO, it doesn't cast doubt on whether any of that post is inaccurate.  Besides, who made Snopes the authoritative website for the "truth"?  Not saying they aren't, just asking the question.

  :devil:
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Re: Hillary Facts-Snope it, I didn't yet!
« Reply #10 on: January 25, 2008, 01:47:23 PM »

Howie's post states...

·  Bill says: "In law school Hillary worked on legal services for the poor."

The facts are:

Hillary's main extra-curricular activity in law school was helping the Black Panthers, on trial in Connecticut for torturing and killing a federal agent. She went to court every day as part of a law student monitoring committee trying to spot civil rights violations and develop grounds for appeal.

Snopes.com states....
Quote
Neither Mr. Lee nor Senator Clinton "defended" the Panthers in the legal sense implied here.  Bill Lee wasn't a lawyer, or even a law student; he was simply another Yale undergraduate who had no involvement in the Black Panthers' trial. Hillary Rodham (as she was known then) wasn't a lawyer then, either. She was a Yale law student, and like many of her politically-minded fellow law students who saw the latest "Trial of the Century" taking place right in their back yard, she took advantage of an opportunity to be involved in a minor, peripheral way by organizing other students to help the American Civil Liberties Union monitor the trial for civil rights violations.  In any case, her tangential participation in the trial in no way helped "free" the two Black Panthers tried for the murder of Alex Rackley: they went free because the state failed to sufficiently prove its case, and after several days of deliberation the jury was unable to reach a verdict.   The charges were dimissed, and the state declined to retry either Bobby Seale or Ericka Huggins.

While not the exact same wording, it looks to be the exact same message. This supports the initial post instead of discrediting it. IMO.

:indian_chief:
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Re: Hillary Facts-Snope it, I didn't yet!
« Reply #11 on: January 25, 2008, 01:57:28 PM »

Actually Terry, what he said in Hoist's post is almost exactly what the Snopes article states, that she went there with a group of students for the ACLU to monitor for any civil rights violations.   So, IMO, it doesn't cast doubt on whether any of that post is inaccurate.  Besides, who made Snopes the authoritative website for the "truth"?  Not saying they aren't, just asking the question.

  :devil:

Charlie...My point, which I should have made more clear, is that whenever someone infers that someone "helped" the Black Panthers, 99% of the time, people are going to think bad things about that person.  The Snopes article is a full explanation of exactly what happened, when, and why, and not just one statement taken somewhat out of context.  Further, the statement in the first post says she "mainly" did this...it also does not address whether she did other activities to help the poor.

Snopes has a pretty good reputation for thoroughly researching these kinds of things...they obviously do not have an "agenda".

There was some viscous statements going around back a couple of years ago when Bo Bice was on American Idol.  A lot of what was said was absolutely not true, or the truth exaggerated.  I had known Bo for nearly 3 years prior to him being on Idol...we had talked about problems we'd both had in our lives, many times.  I knew the truth.  When Bo started the audition process for Idol (he honestly did it on a dare from his Mom), I encouraged him to be completely honest with everyone about his past.  He was.  He did not get kicked off Idol, because they already knew all the "juicy" details of his past.  Snopes set the e-mails, false reports by other media, etc, straight.  They did a thorough job of checking the story out...I gained respect for Snopes because of their accuracy in that situation.
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Re: Hillary Facts-Snope it, I didn't yet!
« Reply #12 on: January 25, 2008, 02:00:10 PM »

Howie's post states...

Snopes.com states....
While not the exact same wording, it looks to be the exact same message. This supports the initial post instead of discrediting it. IMO.

:indian_chief:

We could discuss semantics...the words "main activity" and "minor/peripheral" mean completely different things to me.
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Re: Hillary Facts-Snope it, I didn't yet!
« Reply #13 on: January 25, 2008, 02:06:28 PM »

Snopes or not : FACT cross the Clintons and you end up discredited or missing or dead!
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Re: Hillary Facts-Snope it, I didn't yet!
« Reply #14 on: January 25, 2008, 02:18:16 PM »

Charlie...My point, which I should have made more clear, is that whenever someone infers that someone "helped" the Black Panthers, 99% of the time, people are going to think bad things about that person.  The Snopes article is a full explanation of exactly what happened, when, and why, and not just one statement taken somewhat out of context.  Further, the statement in the first post says she "mainly" did this...it also does not address whether she did other activities to help the poor.

Snopes has a pretty good reputation for thoroughly researching these kinds of things...they obviously do not have an "agenda".

There was some viscous statements going around back a couple of years ago when Bo Bice was on American Idol.  A lot of what was said was absolutely not true, or the truth exaggerated.  I had known Bo for nearly 3 years prior to him being on Idol...we had talked about problems we'd both had in our lives, many times.  I knew the truth.  When Bo started the audition process for Idol (he honestly did it on a dare from his Mom), I encouraged him to be completely honest with everyone about his past.  He was.  He did not get kicked off Idol, because they already knew all the "juicy" details of his past.  Snopes set the e-mails, false reports by other media, etc, straight.  They did a thorough job of checking the story out...I gained respect for Snopes because of their accuracy in that situation.

Terry,
Like I said, I'm not saying they aren't credible, just asking why everyone thinks they are.  If it's because they footnote their research? That usually lends to credibility, but from what I've seen in their articles, the footnotes, for the most part, are not links to allow immediate credidation to what they are claiming.  You have to go to the library, B. Dalton's, or somewhere and borrow or buy the references to in fact verify what they are claiming is a fact.    Or are they, to a certain extent, doing what they say about the emails that say "this has been verified on snopes"?  They list a bunch of references knowing full well that most of us will not bother to go out and verify if it is 1) an actual source, and 2) that they did not interpret what was written in a different way then what the source actually stated.  Words, as we all know can be turned around, just like statistics can be manipulated, to get your point across without actually being an outright lie.  This is why I hate this time of the year, every four years, because truths become half-truths, and get twisted to express one's point of view.  It's also why I'm a registered independent...I chose the individual, regardless of party affiliation, that I think has my best interests, as an American Citizen and taxpayer, at heart.  Unfortunately working downtown in the "seat of democracy", I have found that politicians of that ilk are few and far between.  So far, none of the candidates from either party are clear front runners in my mind.   Okay, I'm done .... phew!!

  :devil:
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