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CVO Technical => General CVO discussion => Topic started by: bradthomas1965 on October 13, 2018, 10:55:02 PM

Title: start without fob HELP!!
Post by: bradthomas1965 on October 13, 2018, 10:55:02 PM: I've got a 2013 CVO roadking. Trying to figure out how to by pass the fob in case i need to in the future. I've tried different ways, cant seem to get to the point to enter my 5 digit code. Every time i try to turn to ignition, alarm instantly engages. Tried pushing both turn signals simultaniously within 2 seconds, no luck. any help would be greatly appreciated.
Title: Re: start without fob
Post by: GregKhougaz on October 14, 2018, 02:57:05 AM: VIDEO-Set Override PIN Code & Access Harley Davidson OEM Alarm System With no Key Fob (https://www.lawabidingbiker.com/harleyalarm/)

https://youtu.be/zf0aCrD1OSg
Title: Re: start without fob
Post by: skratch on October 14, 2018, 10:31:51 AM: the video is good. couple of points, first, you're sure you have an override code set and you know it? secondly, are you sitting on the bike? if you are, don't. the alarm is pretty finicky when it comes to movement. next, is your fob in your pocket when you are trying this? if it is, take it out of range.
Title: Re: start without fob
Post by: bradthomas1965 on October 14, 2018, 02:44:45 PM: Thanks for the input. I already watched the video, have done exactly what they say. Im not on the bike, dont even touch it, i quickly turn ign on & instantly push both turn signals. Now, my speedometer/tach is different than video. I have factory CVO speed/tach combo. As soon as i try this, alarm instantly beeps. No change on speedo to put 5 digit code. Tried goin super fast also waited 1 sec, no difference. Tried turning key to ACC as well to try..... no luck !!!
Title: Re: start without fob
Post by: bradthomas1965 on October 14, 2018, 02:47:22 PM: & FOB is out of range.
Title: Re: start without fob
Post by: bradthomas1965 on October 14, 2018, 03:08:45 PM: speedometer
Title: Re: start without fob
Post by: kojak on October 14, 2018, 04:40:45 PM: You have an existing pin, i assume you dont know what it is. Look in your owners manual on how to discover your pin or google the utube videos.You dont need to rest the pin, you need to know what it is.
Title: Re: start without fob
Post by: grc on October 14, 2018, 05:49:47 PM: Quote from: bradthomas1965 on October 14, 2018, 02:44:45 PM
Thanks for the input. I already watched the video, have done exactly what they say. Im not on the bike, dont even touch it, i quickly turn ign on & instantly push both turn signals. Now, my speedometer/tach is different than video. I have factory CVO speed/tach combo. As soon as i try this, alarm instantly beeps. No change on speedo to put 5 digit code. Tried goin super fast also waited 1 sec, no difference. Tried turning key to ACC as well to try..... no luck !!!

Did you turn the ignition on-off-on-off-on as per the video, or just on? This system requires you to very precisely follow the instructions, any deviation at all will make your attempt fail.

Btw, your owner's manual has the proper procedure for your particular bike. If you bought the bike used, did you get the manual?

It shouldn't make any difference if the bike doesn't have the same type of gauges as in the video, as long as it has an odometer window it should work.

Jerry
Title: Re: start without fob
Post by: skratch on October 14, 2018, 06:22:57 PM: the instructions for my 2013 say to turn the ign on-off-on-off-on. that works. but it also works if i just turn the ign on. try both ways and see what happens.
Title: Re: start without fob
Post by: bradthomas1965 on October 14, 2018, 07:57:29 PM: "Disarming with a PINDo not turn handlebars, straddle seat or lift motorcycle off the jiffy stand. During a PIN disarm, ifthe Smart Security System detects motorcycle motion the system will activate the alarm.Entering a PIN to Disarm HarleyDavidson Smart Security SystemSTEPNO.ACTIONWAIT FOR CONFIRMATIONNOTES1If necessary, verify the current5digit PIN.Should be recorded onwallet card.2Turn ignition switch toIGNITION.3Quickly (within 2 seconds ofturning ignition switch) holdboth turn signal switches inuntil confirmation.Key icon flashes at fast rate. Inthe odometer window, aflashing dash will be followed byfour more dashes.See OdometerWindows PIN. Fivedashes will appear in theodometer window.4Enter first digit (a) in the PINby pressing left turn switch aThe first digit (a) in theodometer will be the first digit in"
( per owners manual).
And yes I know what my 5 pin number is. I am not trying to figure that out, I am simply trying to override the fob and be able to start my bike by using the pin in case of an emergency.
Title: Re: start without fob
Post by: bradthomas1965 on October 14, 2018, 08:16:21 PM: Yes Jerry, I tried "on off on off on" then turn signals. Alarm beeps instantly. Thanks but still nothing.
Title: Re: start without fob
Post by: 14 CVO King on October 15, 2018, 07:39:15 PM: If you have already reset the PIN, flip the ignition switch and wait til it asks to enter PIN then hit just the left turn signal (all of this with the pod out of range). If you have not reset the PIN to your own code, the pod has to be in range, flip the ignition on-off-on and hit the left turn signal twice, then the right turn signal once and the first number should be flashing. Use the left turn to increment the number and right turn to move to the next number.

forgot to add, when changing the PIN start with the ignition in run then cycle off-on twice, the pod must be in range.
Title: Re: start without fob
Post by: bradthomas1965 on October 15, 2018, 09:52:44 PM: I walk up to my bike,(w/o sitting on it, touching it, or even BREATHING on it) FOB out of range, I turn IGN on , within 2 secs i push BOTH turn signals. According to Harley, my manual & many others, the speedometer should read dashes where i COULD put my 5 digit pin that i have memorized. I get no dashes,speedometer lights up, mileage pops up, blinkers flash& alarm starts sounding & not allowing me to enter code.
Maybe a bad HSFM/TSM ???
Title: Re: start without fob
Post by: 14 CVO King on October 16, 2018, 12:47:13 AM: It already has a PIN programed in it, you need to have the pod in range to reprogram. The CVO Road Kings are a little touchy but to me it sounds like the PIN is programed and if you don't hit the left turn signal and put in the code the alarm will sound. So bring the pod in range, try the steps I mentioned above to reprogram, once complete take the pod out of range and try with your newly programmed PIN.

Quick note, when reprogramming the PIN, Have the Fob Present and in range press the left turn 3 times (not 2 which is 2014-up) then press the right turn 1 time. the pre-programmed PIN will appear with the first digit blinking. Use the left to increment digits and right to move to the next digit until complete.

Once programmed move the fob out of range. turn on the ing, quickly (within 2 seconds) hold both turn signals until the key icon flashes at a fast rate and a flashing dash will appear followed by four solid dashes (you can't just press both turn signals and release). press the left turn until reach the digit desired. If the to turn signals are not simultaneously pressed within 2 seconds of the ignition turned on the alarm will sound. Hope this helps and clears up your problem.

I know for my Road King it was a pain in the back side, 3 out of 4 times the alarm would go off. I sat and practiced a bunch until I got better results, problem was I did not consistently use it so it's still a pain.
Title: Re: start without fob
Post by: ScottAL on October 16, 2018, 11:27:53 AM: Silly question but are you pushing and holding the turn signals until dashes appear?
Title: Re: start without fob
Post by: dayne66 on October 16, 2018, 12:02:00 PM: I have a video on my phone of ME doing the little song and dance to get it started without the fob. I have had the fob near the bike in the garage......started it....went for a two hour ride....stopped for fuel...and find out I don't have a fob!!
Title: Re: start without fob
Post by: bradthomas1965 on October 16, 2018, 08:06:48 PM: Yes & Yes. Ive reprogrammed pin a few times, programming is not the problem.
With FOB out of range, i turn ign & push BOTH turn signals at the same time within 2 sec. Tried multiple ways, when i hold turn signals, alarm will sound in apprx 3-4 secs.
& lucky for you Daynee66.
I just want to make sure i can disable in case i do the same thing.
Title: Re: start without fob
Post by: bradthomas1965 on October 16, 2018, 08:11:39 PM: Ive even tried holding left turn button in then turning on IGN, alarm beeps.
Title: Re: start without fob
Post by: smkymtnboy on October 16, 2018, 08:23:13 PM: check battery charge on the bike itself. the one that turns the motor over.not trying to be smart just wanted u to know which battery. check fob battery ,also.
Title: Re: start without fob
Post by: smkymtnboy on October 16, 2018, 08:25:23 PM: Quote from: dayne66 on October 16, 2018, 12:02:00 PM
I have a video on my phone of ME doing the little song and dance to get it started without the fob. I have had the fob near the bike in the garage......started it....went for a two hour ride....stopped for fuel...and find out I don't have a fob!!
did the same thing. hanging on a coat hangar near bike in garage. stopped at an overlook. oh well!! :-\
Title: Re: start without fob
Post by: bradthomas1965 on October 16, 2018, 09:05:22 PM: Yes, bike battery fully charged, I keep it on a tender. & yes just replaced fob battery.
Title: Re: start without fob
Post by: skratch on October 16, 2018, 10:00:48 PM: Quote from: bradthomas1965 on October 16, 2018, 09:05:22 PM
yes just replaced fob battery.

not to be a smart ass, but did you put the battery in upside down? been more than one post from someone who has.

of course, whether or not the battery is in your fob correctly would have no bearing whatsoever on your inputting the override code.

this is very interesting. seen lots of posts of self-induced pain with the harley security, but i've yet to see one where the security itself was actually the problem. there's always the first one though....
Title: Re: start without fob
Post by: 14 CVO King on October 17, 2018, 12:27:54 AM: Just to check something try pushing both turn signals then just the left, don't hold anything in for a long period just push the buttons and release, then just the left.
Title: Re: start without fob
Post by: bradthomas1965 on October 17, 2018, 07:41:44 PM: Nothing. >:( :soapbox:
Title: Re: start without fob
Post by: bradthomas1965 on October 17, 2018, 07:58:02 PM: https://youtu.be/EqRi_Wy_3ME
Title: Re: start without fob
Post by: bradthomas1965 on October 17, 2018, 08:05:44 PM: https://youtu.be/OT3YNUDUKMA
Title: Re: start without fob
Post by: skratch on October 17, 2018, 09:06:23 PM: just throwing this out there.... do your turn signals work? independently of each other?
Title: Re: start without fob
Post by: bradthomas1965 on October 17, 2018, 11:25:24 PM: yes , as do hazards
Title: Re: start without fob
Post by: ScottAL on October 18, 2018, 01:33:59 AM: Keep holding the turn signals. It looks like you're letting go too soon.

"Quickly (within 2 seconds of turning ignition switch) hold both turn signal switches in until confirmation."

The chirps are not the alarm going off, they are a pre-alarm warning.

"Once armed, if the motorcycle is moved or lifted up off of its jiffy stand or if the ignition switch is turned to IGNITION and the fob is not present, the alarm will warn the operator with three alternate flashes of the turn signals and a chirp of the optional siren."
Title: Re: start without fob
Post by: 14 CVO King on October 18, 2018, 11:37:09 AM: Quote from: ScottAL on October 18, 2018, 01:33:59 AM
Keep holding the turn signals. It looks like you're letting go too soon.

"Quickly (within 2 seconds of turning ignition switch) hold both turn signal switches in until confirmation."

The chirps are not the alarm going off, they are a pre-alarm warning.

"Once armed, if the motorcycle is moved or lifted up off of its jiffy stand or if the ignition switch is turned to IGNITION and the fob is not present, the alarm will warn the operator with three alternate flashes of the turn signals and a chirp of the optional siren."

After re-watching the video, I completely agree. Not holding the turn signals in long enough to get confirmation. I went out and tried it on mine and it does chirp prior to letting me put in the code.
Title: Re: start without fob
Post by: bradthomas1965 on October 18, 2018, 07:57:39 PM: Oh trust me, i did that....many times. Like i said before, tried holding them in.
When i do that, alarm does chirp once, will chirp again sec or two later & a few more seconds, full on alarm. Again, speedometer never shows or gives oppurtunity to in put code!!! :soapbox:
Starting to believe my HFSM/TSM could be faulty. Maybe module was never programmed all the way? Defect from module manufactuerer??
Just curious, & maybe it doesnt matter, but do any of you have the same speedometer/tach that i do??? I havent seen any other bikes with the same as mine.
Title: Re: start without fob
Post by: bradthomas1965 on October 18, 2018, 08:13:45 PM: https://youtu.be/5TqYuXp0HTs
Title: Re: start without fob
Post by: KGB on October 18, 2018, 08:18:02 PM: Check to see if you have any fault codes
Title: Re: start without fob
Post by: Cat Eye on October 18, 2018, 08:53:27 PM: Quote from: bradthomas1965 on October 14, 2018, 08:16:21 PM
Yes Jerry, I tried "on off on off on" then turn signals. Alarm beeps instantly. Thanks but still nothing.

The above procedure is to reprogram the pin and the FOB need to be in range.
Title: Re: start without fob
Post by: bradthomas1965 on October 18, 2018, 09:35:48 PM: Checked fault codes, no stored fault codes in any of the programs.... ran code throuh all checks P55Ptb none on any of them
Title: Re: start without fob
Post by: 14 CVO King on October 18, 2018, 10:50:28 PM: Try this, flip the ignition and watch the ODO. if you see the word ENTER appear hit the left turn signal. If this works a 1 should show up. If that does not work try pausing a second between turning on the ignition and holding the turn signals.

Honestly, my RK was a pain in the backside and the last time i left without the fob I had to have the wife bring it out to me. I could get it to work for me in the garage but hit or miss on the road. I do practice now a lot and wonder if your bike works like the newer models rather then the regular alarm of a 13.
Title: Re: start without fob
Post by: bradthomas1965 on October 18, 2018, 11:20:12 PM: At this point, ill try anything. Ill try it like a 14 & newer
Title: Re: start without fob
Post by: bradthomas1965 on October 19, 2018, 10:59:00 PM: 2014 & newer says turn IGN on then push & hold LEFT turn signal.
Tried this as well.....no luck
Tried turning just ignition, no luck either...... alarm goes off after a couple chirps & sirens
both ways.....every way!!!
2014 & older & 2014 & newer procedure... ive tried all.
Itll be a good story if i EVER figure it out !!!
Title: Re: start without fob
Post by: grc on October 20, 2018, 08:45:41 AM: Quote from: bradthomas1965 on October 18, 2018, 07:57:39 PM
...............................................
Starting to believe my HFSM/TSM could be faulty. Maybe module was never programmed all the way? Defect from module manufactuerer??
Just curious, & maybe it doesnt matter, but do any of you have the same speedometer/tach that i do??? I havent seen any other bikes with the same as mine.

What you have sure looks like the one shown in the parts catalog for the 2013 CVO RK. Standard RK's did not come with that same gauge and console setup, so unless you compare just to other CVO's it won't be the same.

Jerry
Title: Re: start without fob
Post by: bradthomas1965 on October 21, 2018, 01:58:12 PM: It is Jerry. & it is factory. Just curious if any other 2013 cvo rk people have similar issues.
Thanks for the input.
Title: Re: start without fob HELP!!
Post by: bradthomas1965 on November 19, 2018, 10:31:19 PM: STILL NOT WORKING!!!! :soapbox:
Title: Re: start without fob HELP!!
Post by: skratch on November 19, 2018, 11:19:04 PM: have you tried going by the dealer? let them try it, one of two things will happen. they'll either get it to work, at which point you will have seen the process. or, it won't work, and you'll end up getting a new hfsm for $50 (you do have the esp don't you?)

out of curiosity, does the security keep the bike from starting if you are not within range with a fob?
Title: Re: start without fob HELP!!
Post by: bradthomas1965 on November 19, 2018, 11:28:05 PM: Yes, purchased extended warranty.( So glad, cam went to chit with only 16,000 mi).
& correct, it won't start without fob in range.
I've tried everything, so I'm thinking you're right, I'll run it by Harley.
Title: Re: start without fob HELP!!
Post by: bradthomas1965 on November 19, 2018, 11:31:41 PM: Interesting, when I had it in the shop for the new cam, mechanic told me 4 other bikes where in with bad cams!!
Title: Re: start without fob HELP!!
Post by: skratch on December 31, 2018, 10:05:02 PM: but, what about the fob start thing?
Title: Re: start without fob HELP!!
Post by: bradthomas1965 on January 01, 2019, 10:42:02 PM: Stil no luck.
Haven't been back to dealership yet.
Title: Re: start without fob HELP!!
Post by: hd-dude on January 08, 2019, 06:01:12 PM: I had a similar bike towed into the shop recently, the customer had lost the keys and fob. I ordered new keys and a replacement fob. In order to program the fob the security system must be disarmed. I was able to retrieve the PIN using my software but when I tried to get the system to allow me to enter the PIN it did exactly as you have described. I tried everything to get to the PIN menu with no luck. I had a hunch that it may be something to do with the tach / speedo combo so I swapped it for a stock road king speedo. The PIN menu came right up on the first try. I then successfully did the required programming for the new fob.

So, there must be something in some of the combo speedo/tach units that do not allow the PIN entry. Perhaps there is a software issue in the speedo/tach that prevents it or there is a different method to get into the menu? The dealer should be able to shed some light on this issue for you......
Title: Re: start without fob HELP!!
Post by: bradthomas1965 on January 08, 2019, 08:42:57 PM: Thanks so much.
Title: Re: start without fob HELP!!
Post by: bradthomas1965 on February 03, 2019, 04:43:24 PM: FINALLY, figured it out.
After turning ign on, press both turn signals fast & realease, dont press & hold like manual says, holding turn signals in makes alarm go off.
I turned ign & lightning fast pushed both turn signals & released fast, ability to enter code popped up. I entered code & it worked!
Title: Re: start without fob HELP!!
Post by: 14 CVO King on February 03, 2019, 05:26:52 PM: Quote from: bradthomas1965 on February 03, 2019, 04:43:24 PM
FINALLY, figured it out.
After turning ign on, press both turn signals fast & realease, dont press & hold like manual says, holding turn signals in makes alarm go off.
I turned ign & lightning fast pushed both turn signals & released fast, ability to enter code popped up. I entered code & it worked!

Awesome, took a while but good to see everything worked out.
Title: Re: start without fob HELP!!
Post by: bigC on February 03, 2019, 05:40:50 PM: Glad you finally got it figured out!
Title: Re: start without fob HELP!!
Post by: skratch on February 03, 2019, 05:55:59 PM: and it only took 4 months :bananarock:

glad you got that taken care of. now, i bet you'll never forget how to do it.
Title: Re: start without fob HELP!!
Post by: bradthomas1965 on February 03, 2019, 10:52:49 PM: Yes, thanks!