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[RJ749]

French shoulder fired rocket firing.



Watch the above French version first.

[Gettinold]

ROG, ID SAY WE WOULD WIN THAT WAR

[SPIDERMAN]

Hmmmmmmm I don't think the British would agree with this. Remember the Faulkland Islands ?  Dollar for dollar the most effective missle in the world is the French made Exocet which can fly below radar, do incredible damage and costs about $30k on the world weapons market.

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[ronshood2000]

Not sure where your  $$$$ figure comes from.  Regardless, you are right, it's cheap and effective, especially regarding certain versions of the Exocet. Almost impossible to defeat other than shooting down the plane that carries it before launch. The only problem I have is that the French Gov't will sell to anyone and do not discriminate, which they should. The are people out there who should not be allowed to purchase this item just because they have the Euro's to do it.

[Farmer]

I wouldn't say the French will sell advanced weapons technology to just anyone . . . . it's just anyone who has OIL.

Farmer

[Twolanerider]

Hmmmmmmm I don't think the British would agree with this. Remember the Faulkland Islands ?  Dollar for dollar the most effective missle in the world is the French made Exocet which can fly below radar, do incredible damage and costs about $30k on the world weapons market.

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That was a weird day for battle history Brian.  A US manufactured Lockheed Neptune made the first sighting of the British ships.  French Etandards were dispatched carrying French missiles.  The French planes docked with an American manufactured KC-130 tanker before completing the attack.  There was even a Lear jet flown as potential decoy.  The only thing Argentinian in the entire attack was the pilots.

The Brits never saw it coming either.  At least not until the last few seconds.  The old almost useless radar on the Sheffield probably never saw the plane and never tracked the missile.  Though sailors on board at the time disagreed the later Defence Ministry report said the missile warhead didn't even detonate.  But the impact broke the water main and crippled her generators.  So no real damage control was mounted to the fire started by the rocket motor that consumed the ship.  Then, to top it all off, while waiting for rescue the sailers on board Sheffield sang Monty Python's "Always Look on the Bright Side of Life."  That was a weird nasty little war.

[RJ749]

That was a weird day for battle history Brian.  A US manufactured Lockheed Neptune made the first sighting of the British ships.  French Etandards were dispatched carrying French missiles.  The French planes docked with an American manufactured KC-130 tanker before completing the attack.  There was even a Lear jet flown as potential decoy.  The only thing Argentinian in the entire attack was the pilots.

The Brits never saw it coming either.  At least not until the last few seconds.  The old almost useless radar on the Sheffield probably never saw the plane and never tracked the missile.  Though sailors on board at the time disagreed the later Defence Ministry report said the missile warhead didn't even detonate.  But the impact broke the water main and crippled her generators.  So no real damage control was mounted to the fire started by the rocket motor that consumed the ship.  Then, to top it all off, while waiting for rescue the sailers on board Sheffield sang Monty Python's "Always Look on the Bright Side of Life."  That was a weird nasty little war.

What a "Charlie Fox" that was, but it lasted as long as I care to see most conflicts that come to live fire last.

[Twolanerider]

What a "Charlie Fox" that was, but it lasted as long as I care to see most conflicts that come to live fire last.

Too true.  The British started their counter with an air strike from a joint use base flying long range bombers that were slated to have already been decommissioned but were still flying.  They fought their air battle with airplanes really not appropriate to the job.  Carried troops on luxury liners that laid down plywood to protect the carpets because they didn't have enough troop lift capability.  Were getting regular resupply from us of air to air missiles and other supplies on an urgent basis because they didn't have war stocks in reserve.  And still the Argentines couldn't handle them in Argentina's own backyard.  And it was a nasty little war.  Maggie Thatcher got her victory though.  I don't even suggest that it wasn't necessary after the Argentine troops landed on the Falklands.  But from the diplomacy (and lack of) before the war to everything that happened during it was just a weird nasty screwed up little war.

[SPIDERMAN]

Not sure where your  $$$$ figure comes from.  Regardless, you are right, it's cheap and effective, especially regarding certain versions of the Exocet. Almost impossible to defeat other than shooting down the plane that carries it before launch. The only problem I have is that the French Gov't will sell to anyone and do not discriminate, which they should. The are people out there who should not be allowed to purchase this item just because they have the Euro's to do it.

I am the NAVSTA San Diego Homeport Engineering Rep for Bath Iron Works. Look us up on the I-NET and you'll see how I know what I know.

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[CVOwner]

Did you ever see the Ebay ad, Will sell cheap, French rifle, never fired, only dropped once! funny chit. As someone on this site says!

[RJ749]

I am the NAVSTA San Diego Homeport Engineering Rep for Bath Iron Works. Look us up on the I-NET and you'll see how I know what I know.

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I love that 

[mr_magoo]

Thought thats what the MK15 Phalanx defense system was to shoot those down.

[ronshood2000]

MK15 AKA CIWS (Christ It Won't Shoot)?

[Twolanerider]

Thought thats what the MK15 Phalanx defense system was to shoot those down.

That's what the guys on the Stark probably expected too.

[ronshood2000]

I could really get into this. The Stark had other issues. One, keep in mind that the Exocet RCS (radar cross section) is very small. So that makes it very hard to see with radar, espcially with the SPS-49 radar. So the ability to see skin seperation from the F-1 was more than likely not seen by the operator. Then, also, especially in mid 80's, ships did not run the CIWS in full auto and probably still don't to this day. This is not to mention the SLQ-32 ESM operator would have a very short reaction time once Exocet radar lit off. So with all of our expensive systems to keep ships safe, a $30k missile can pretty much ruin your day.

Also, Iraq was our friend then, and who shoots at their friend?

[SPIDERMAN]

I could really get into this. The Stark had other issues. One, keep in mind that the Exocet RCS (radar cross section) is very small. So that makes it very hard to see with radar, espcially with the SPS-49 radar. So the ability to see skin seperation from the F-1 was more than likely not seen by the operator. Then, also, especially in mid 80's, ships did not run the CIWS in full auto and probably still don't to this day. This is not to mention the SLQ-32 ESM operator would have a very short reaction time once Exocet radar lit off. So with all of our expensive systems to keep ships safe, a $30k missile can pretty much ruin your day.

Also, Iraq was our friend then, and who shoots at their friend?

Ronshood
             Your posts sounds like an argument between an FC and an EW. Anyway, you failed to mention that the Aegis system would pick up the Exocet as soon as it lit off. Aegis is not operated by human hands. Also, CIWS is linked to the Director Illuminators which are also not controlled by human hands. The software for CIWS is classified and I'm sure as hell not gonna post what it does and doesn't do here, but suffice to say that one of the ships that my company builds would not be hit by an Exocet or any other missle so long as all systems were operating properly.

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[Twolanerider]

I could really get into this. The Stark had other issues. One, keep in mind that the Exocet RCS (radar cross section) is very small. So that makes it very hard to see with radar, espcially with the SPS-49 radar. So the ability to see skin seperation from the F-1 was more than likely not seen by the operator. Then, also, especially in mid 80's, ships did not run the CIWS in full auto and probably still don't to this day. This is not to mention the SLQ-32 ESM operator would have a very short reaction time once Exocet radar lit off. So with all of our expensive systems to keep ships safe, a $30k missile can pretty much ruin your day.

Also, Iraq was our friend then, and who shoots at their friend?

Ron, that was a CF beyond nearly all recognition.  The ship's Captain claimed that all defensive systems were functioning though there were conflicting reports during the investigation as to what mode systems were prior to the attack.  The same day the Stark was hit a different Iraqi aircraft also flying from Shaibah had put missiles in a Cypriot ship not too far from where the Stark was then steaming.  So they knew there'd been activity.

Still no one caught it all.  An AWAC caught the Mirage leaving Shaibah at 20:00 local, both the AWAC and the Stark had monitored the flight, the Stark had verified and, if I remember correctly, done an IFF request of the Mirage without getting any kind of a response.  The AWAC saw the Mirage take a sudden turn for home.  But none of them ever caught the plane fire off its missiles.  First report of the inbounds was a watch with binos just seconds before impact.

Gents, I'm not a conspiracy theorist and don't go looking for boogeymen behind every incident.  I recognize that Oliver Stone creates fiction and I think that, generally, the Warren Commission didn't screw the pooch.  To this day, however, I am absolutely convinced that Mirage knew its run was on a US warship and, with only somewhat less belief, think the plane was piloted by a Russian.  That we screwed the pooch completely on monitoring and missing any attempts at defense (all of which we certainly did) is entirely separate from the attack itself.  But I've always thought we got sucker punched on that one.

[ronshood2000]

BB and TLNR,
Im really not pitting one group/rate against another and am fully aware of the operating systems and their integration. AEGIS and NTU are very formidable and can take care of themselves. The other units are less capable. Yeah I know, there are no more NTU's. Every ship is built to do a certain mission (preaching to the chior, now). I too don't wish to get into too many specifics due to classification.

Additionally, you both make some very good points.
 
I'll leave it at this, for a cheap weapon, the Exocet is a nasty little SOB.

Cheers.

[SPIDERMAN]

I'll leave it at this, for a cheap weapon, the Exocet is a nasty little SOB.

Cheers.

Didn't I say that ?

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