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CVO Technical => Intake/Exhaust/ECM => Topic started by: Fullsac Performance on June 10, 2009, 09:42:52 AM
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Everybody knows, if we are talking about our garages or cubic inches, bigger is better.
If we are talking about mufflers cores in our Harley, maybe not?
Here's a comparison of our 3 core sizes dynoed on a
2009 CVO RG with non cat headpipe. Fullsac Base map installed with TTS Mastertune
Top run # 59..............2.0 cores
Middle run # 77...........1.75 cores
Bottom run # 64..........2.25 cores
The 1.75 and 2.0 are very close.
The 2.25s give up a couple of points across the board. Enough that you could feel it? Not likely.
I still encourage people to buy what they want to listen to all day. If you like loud, go big. If you like quiet, go small. At the end of the day, after having the cruise set at 75 for 10 hours straight, a comfortable sound level and a happy wife is all that will matter.
Steve
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What was the motor?
Thanks jb
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Im glad I ordered the 2". They seem like a great compromise between power and sound. I cant wait for them to get here.
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What was the motor?
Thanks jb
2009 CVO RG, non cat headpipe.
Steve
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I just installed the 2.25 I don't think it's loud as the Rinehart's, but I don't know the performance value's. But by your numbers is 2.25 poor chose?
Trey
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I have the exact 2.0 set up as shown and am very pleased.. To me the sound is perfect, loud enough but not obnoxious, the harder you twist the grip the louder it is, cruising is fine and you can hear the radio.. More importantly than all of that is that it runs real strong...
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I have the 2.25's with non cat. I'm running around 96 and 118. I am very happy w sound and performance of bike.
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I just installed the 2.25 I don't think it's loud as the Rinehart's, but I don't know the performance value's. But by your numbers is 2.25 poor chose?
Trey
Poor choice? If your happy with the sound level, you made the right choice. Power difference is very little. With out the dyno we would never know there was a difference in performance. This is a WOT comparison. How often do we snap the throttle wide open at 2000 RPM? In the real world, I don't think anyone could really tell the difference.
Steve
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You guys at fullsac should have provided the dyno run with the stock pipes, so that all of us could have seen the benefit of both the non-cat head pipe, and your fullsac cores, the cores that you are trying to market on this site. I think that would certainly have helped me make a decision between your cores and the rest of the after-market exhaust systems.
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It's pretty well documented that stock bikes make low 80's horsepower. Look for the thread titled stock cvo horsepower.
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My '07 made 80 stock and 87 tuned with the supertrapp seII slip-ons. I have to say that had I know I could have made 97 with the fullsacs that I would have gone that route. All I am saying is that every bike, every engine is an individual entity. If this one is picking up 15 to 17 horsepower with these baffles then this is the highest increase I have ever seen for this engine with only an exhaust change. I would just like to see the progression from stock as the changes were made. Certainly the fullsacs have been known on this board for their great sound, but with a performance increase like this they should also be known for their performance. This should make Hot Bike, Bagger Magazine etc...
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My '07 made 80 stock and 87 tuned with the supertrapp seII slip-ons. I have to say that had I know I could have made 97 with the fullsacs that I would have gone that route. All I am saying is that every bike, every engine is an individual entity. If this one is picking up 15 to 17 horsepower with these baffles then this is the highest increase I have ever seen for this engine with only an exhaust change. I would just like to see the progression from stock as the changes were made. Certainly the fullsacs have been known on this board for their great sound, but with a performance increase like this they should also be known for their performance. This should make Hot Bike, Bagger Magazine etc...
It wasn't just a baffle change that achieved those numbers. There are header pipe and tuning map modifications as well. I wouldn't want to see it in a national publication because of the scrutiny it would invite from regulating agencies.
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My '07 made 80 stock and 87 tuned with the supertrapp seII slip-ons. I have to say that had I know I could have made 97 with the fullsacs that I would have gone that route. All I am saying is that every bike, every engine is an individual entity. If this one is picking up 15 to 17 horsepower with these baffles then this is the highest increase I have ever seen for this engine with only an exhaust change. I would just like to see the progression from stock as the changes were made. Certainly the fullsacs have been known on this board for their great sound, but with a performance increase like this they should also be known for their performance. This should make Hot Bike, Bagger Magazine etc...
You would not see the 97HP on your '07 without a head pipe change. The 09's have a better design, but even they won't see the full 97HP without removing the catalytic converter material from the head pipe. Far more important than the peak HP is the broad flat torque curve that delivers rewarding everyday street riding performance.
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I went with Steve's reccomendation for the 2" baffles in my 09 Street Glide (Stage II 103 motor).. I could not be happier with the performance or sound. I also got the TTS from Steve and after a lot of input from here and other boards, using V-Tune has my bike dialed in really well. I was a little slower on the clutch the other day than I was on the throttle and felt the bump of a front tire hitting the pavement. The TTS, Fullsac cores, seem to work really well with the 255 cam. Took it on a 2700 mile trip so far and loved every minute of it.
Thanks for posting the dyno results comparing the baffles. It is excellent info regardless of what some replies seem to suggest. :deal2:
jimbob
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I will be looking for some new baffles or mufflers now that I have my non-cat head pipe. It sounds better but it is still too quiet. This is why I would love to see the changes that were made to attain those power levels. Does the example bike have a different backing plate and air cleaner, and what programmer and map is being used?
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I will be looking for some new baffles or mufflers now that I have my non-cat head pipe. It sounds better but it is still too quiet. This is why I would love to see the changes that were made to attain those power levels. Does the example bike have a different backing plate and air cleaner, and what programmer and map is being used?
I haven't dyno'ed my '09, but I put the 1 3/4" Fullsac baffles in and I am very pleased with the sound. A nice healthy bark but you can still hear the stereo and not offend people around you. At about $120. shipped and about an hours work to install, you really should try them before you dump a bunch of money on some slip-ons.
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I will be looking for some new baffles or mufflers now that I have my non-cat head pipe. It sounds better but it is still too quiet. This is why I would love to see the changes that were made to attain those power levels. Does the example bike have a different backing plate and air cleaner, and what programmer and map is being used?
Fullsac Base map installed with TTS Mastertune
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Steve,
You have a great product there with the CVO Baffles.
Below is a 2009CVO with 1.75 Fullsacs, Non-Cat Hd Pipe, ANBS, TTS Mastertune.
John
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Steve,
You have a great product there with the CVO Baffles.
Below is a 2009CVO with 1.75 Fullsacs, Non-Cat Hd Pipe, ANBS, TTS Mastertune.
John
Thanks John!
Steve
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Steve,
You have a great product there with the CVO Baffles.
Below is a 2009CVO with 1.75 Fullsacs, Non-Cat Hd Pipe, ANBS, TTS Mastertune.
John
I'll ditto that!!!!!!!
Just tuned an 09 CVO with the 2" Fullsacs and ceramic coated non cat pipe with TTS. 95hp with 116 ft/lbs. Graph is a duplicate of Herkos. Best part is the lack of heat radiating from the pipes. And they sound great to boot!!
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I just ordered a non cat header piper for my 09 SERG and plan on putting Fullsac baffles, interested in the Ceramic coating the header pipe, is it worth it? what cost should I expect? Do the inside and out?
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had mine done locally for 160 including the crossover pipe
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:drink: :drink:
mY non-cat stage 1 AC, rinehart slipons with quiet baffle material (works great), PC V with autotune generated 93hp and 111ft-lbs of torque at 88 degrees 65 % humidity. Not bad. Would like to check it on a cooler day less humod day.
:coolblue: :coolblue:
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I have a 2010 CVO Ultra and was thinking about upgrading the exhaust system. I found this thread about fullsac's from a year ago. Can anyone chime in with opinions after riding for a while with the fullsac cvo stage 1 setup. I see the power benefits are just about the same for both cores. I am curious about the sound difference between the 1.75 and 2.0 muffler cores? I am leaning towards the 1.75 core because I don't want the sound to get annoying on long trips. Your opinions would be greatly appreciated. tks
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I have a 2010 CVO Ultra and was thinking about upgrading the exhaust system. I found this thread about fullsac's from a year ago. Can anyone chime in with opinions after riding for a while with the fullsac cvo stage 1 setup. I see the power benefits are just about the same for both cores. I am curious about the sound difference between the 1.75 and 2.0 muffler cores? I am leaning towards the 1.75 core because I don't want the sound to get annoying on long trips. Your opinions would be greatly appreciated. tks
I put the Fullsac X pipe and 2" cores, with TTS, on my 2011 SERGU and am very happy with the results. Good sound, not too loud when cruising down the interstate at 80mph, but loud enough when you get on the throttle, for my tastes. Sound is very subjective though, so what's right for me might not be for you. I probably would have been fine with the 1.75" cores too...I'm way over loud pipes...been there, done that. The nice thing about the Fullsac cores is that you can always change them out and sell the old ones without losing your azz in the process. The 2" with the packing left in the mufflers is just about right...I would not want anything louder at this point in my life.
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I used the 2" cores and very happy with them. Quiet enough when touring long distance, but loud enough that the moose and bears get off the road when they hear me coming. Well, except for one really big black bear day before yesterday. A guy in a pickup pulling a large trailer ran interference for me and it took him to blow the horn continuously while headed directly towards the bear. I slide by them on the outside (I think that bear wanted to munch on me)..
jb
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I just installed the 2.25 I don't think it's loud as the Rinehart's, but I don't know the performance value's. But by your numbers is 2.25 poor chose?
Trey
Trey,
I have been running the 2.25 cores for almost 2 years now... just put the 2.0 cores in this weekend for a change of pace. Trust me, you will NOT notice the difference. No bad choices here...
CAP
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I'm running the 1.75" on my 09 CVO. Just loud enough for me.
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I appreciate everyone's feedback it was very helpful. I am going with the 1.75 cores. Looking forward to waking her up. Very exciting!
Ira
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Just added the Fullsac Stage I and II kits (1.75" cores, header pipe, and Andrews 54 cams) to my 2011 FLTRUSE and what a HUGE difference! My local shop was impressed enough with the product, peformance, and service that he signed up with Fullsac as well. Also changed to Torrington bearings at the same time (recommended by shop).
Was on the edge about the cams since they are almost the same size as the stock SE 255s, but the power curve is a bit different. I LOVE the sound (nice deep grumble but not obnoxious like my Rinehart duals were) and the power is so much smoother than stock.
Heat was also dropped considerably around my right thigh without the cat present.
Dollar for dollar this has been the best upgrade I have done on any of my bikes and I can't see another bike without it.
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:2vrolijk_21: :2vrolijk_21:
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I have a 2010 CVO Ultra and was thinking about upgrading the exhaust system. I found this thread about fullsac's from a year ago. Can anyone chime in with opinions after riding for a while with the fullsac cvo stage 1 setup. I see the power benefits are just about the same for both cores. I am curious about the sound difference between the 1.75 and 2.0 muffler cores? I am leaning towards the 1.75 core because I don't want the sound to get annoying on long trips. Your opinions would be greatly appreciated. tks
I have the same bike you do...*S
I did the x pipe and 2.0 baffles with the Master Tune!! You will Love it Best Bang for the Buck by Far!!
and you get to keep those nice muffler cans keeps the Stock look which I think is Great!! I might do the Cams and head gasket, but to tell the truth it really runs Great with out them!!
I am sure that you will love it!!
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Install is almost complete. I am up to loading the 1.75 map. I noticed after loading the map onto the ECM the file name was FP-2010-11-CVO110-Stg-I-XPipe-2.0.MT7 (74K). Steve is unavailable today so I was hoping someone that ordered the 1.75 cores for their bike could look to see what the file name of their map that Steve sent. Just want to make sure Steve sent me the correct map. I would think he would use 1.75 in the file name for 1.75 cores. Maybe it's the same map for the. 2.0. Thanks for your help.
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Install is almost complete. I am up to loading the 1.75 map. I noticed after loading the map onto the ECM the file name was FP-2010-11-CVO110-Stg-I-XPipe-2.0.MT7 (74K). Steve is unavailable today so I was hoping someone that ordered the 1.75 cores for their bike could look to see what the file name of their map that Steve sent. Just want to make sure Steve sent me the correct map. I would think he would use 1.75 in the file name for 1.75 cores. Maybe it's the same map for the. 2.0. Thanks for your help.
If this is the map he sent you, it will probably be just fine, there is little difference between the muffler cores as far as flow. I would start with that map if you planned to go riding until next week when everyone gets back to work.
JMHO 8)
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:2vrolijk_21: :2vrolijk_21:
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Mike,
Thanks for your response yesterday. Steve was also nice enough to respond over the weekend and confirm the 1.75 and 2.0 cores share the exact same map changes. Finishing up today and will take her out for a spin later. Can't wait :)
Ira
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:2vrolijk_21: :2vrolijk_21: :2vrolijk_21:
Enjoy the ride.
More power, better throttle response, less heat, better gas mileage and it will sound like a Harley.
:coolblue: :coolblue:
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Completed the install and map download yesterday. Fullsac 110 Stage 1 is a wonderful product just as everyone says. Instant seat of the pants difference :)
Also, unbelievable support from this forum. Thanks to Steve & Alice from Fullsac and everyone on the forum that has helped me through the process. I highly recommend it as well.