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[TCinVA]

Yeah.  And, that no mad b@st@rds assembled it. :-/

Now ain't that the truth???
TC

[Twolanerider]

Yeah.  And, that no mad b@st@rds assembled it. :-/

Amen to that brother, amen to that.  Don't want to get one of those first machines back as folks are just getting back in the swing of things, as they're hands are remembering what they're brains haven't quite re-learned yet, and as folks are still taking out a few grudges.  The red bike just looks sweeter and sweeter every day.

[SPIDERMAN]

I'd like to think that the folks at H-D that are going out on strike would find more novel ways of displaying their displeasure with management upon their return than the quality of the product, but the truth is human nature being what it is, the first few weeks of vehicles built after this strike is settled are more than likely going to be clunkers. I suppose that QA will redouble it's efforts to try to catch anyone deliberately producing poor quality, but the line moves on and the push from the top will be to recapture schedule. My advice would be not to buy from any dealer with a poor reputation for processing warranty issues. We've talked about this before, but now would be a good time for folks on the site to post those dealers with a good or bad reputation for warranty. My dealer San Diego H-D has been excellant in the past on processing claims, but as Beagle has pointed out, the execution of the warranty repair can be somewhat lacking depending on the tech assigned to your bike. Beyond that however, is that once again demand is going to exceed supply and the wait for CVO models is only going to get worse. I would imagine that the 08 model year release could be affected as well. All is speculation at this point, but as I pointed out in an earlier post, my gut feeling is that this strike is being driven by managements fear of becoming overburdened with entitlements as have the automakers. If that is the case, management will not back away from their original offer until some serious pain has been inflicted upon the company by the strike. Because of the skill level involved, this is not a situation where replacement workers ( Scabs in union parlance) can be brought in nor is it possible for management to continue building motorcycles by staffing the line with lower and mid level management employees. In my opinion, this strike is going to be ugly. The only saving grace as I stated earlier is that as it lengthens, the value of used vehicles is going to rise as dealers look for product to put on the showroom floor to sell.

B B

[DCFIREMANN]

I have been trying to keep up with this tread. Actually I wasn't going to reply. BUT I just couldn't resist.

Not knowing all of the facts it is hard to take sides in this matter. As a lot of you know I am a very proud UNION FIREFIGHTER. I thank the International Association of Fire Fighters everyday. Yes I get paid a decent salary to RUN into buildings that most others are running out of.  I also have a GREAT WORK SCHEDULE. Just ask "V", she loves it also. This is also a little different matter for me as we have a NO STRIKE CLAUSE. By law we cannot strike and I would not even think about it. I have worked without a contract for 2 years I also worked wiothout a pay raise for SIX years. I also had to give up a step increase all because of Governmental Budget Cuts! Still I come to work everyday and DO NOT BITCH. I know I could somewhere else where it could be worse and worknig a job I may not love.

One of the problems with the Unions is the HIGH PRICE we must pay for our HD's along with a lot of other goods and services. I also know they (HD Employees) can buy a bike AT COST every two years (I think it is ) Then they can sell it and most make a very good profit. A friend of mine who works for the MOCO trades up to a new bike every other year. He has done so well after the first couple he is riding a new HD for FREE!!!!! Now that is a very good benifit I think. I am not sure about the pay scale though . The starting salary for a line worker sounds fair to me.  Even though I work for the Government I still have to pay for health insurance. Yes they ( the Government)pays a precentage but I still have to pay for my benefits. So I think with the cost of health care rising like it is, it is a very big cost cutting measure. I think Harley is looking into the future and looking to survive. The run of bikes has and will continue to slow down. Without the bikes dealers will start to fail ( some of them need too) and they may in fact hurt us in the long run. I also know that the MOCO and Dealers are warehousing new bikes still in the crate. There too many bikes being produced now days. So this strike I don't think is going to hurt The MoCO too much. The economy is still slowing down despite what we are being told. I see it everyday in my part time business.

I guess all we can do is sit back and watch.

Be Safe

THE DAWG  

[KentuckyHarleyDude]

I have been trying to keep up with this tread. Actually I wasn't going to reply. BUT I just couldn't resist.

Not knowing all of the facts ... Without the bikes dealers will start to fail ( some of them need too) and they may in fact hurt us in the long run.
I guess all we can do is sit back and watch.

Be Safe

THE DAWG  

Dawg just curious ...how will it hurt "us" in the long run?

Bubba

[MJZ]

Dawg, I agree in the long run it might hurt the dealer but IMHO, I think for the most part they are over priced T-Shirts shops. Have often pondered where the real profit center is in the dealerships. I walk in and see a 10 million dollar building with 25+ employees year round. That is a pretty big nut to crack but what t-shirt shop has 4 or 5 sales people checking out buyers all day 7 days a week all year long. JMHO but I think the bikes are there just to suck the john in, the real money is derrived from motor clothes and second I'd guess would be the service deparment. Billing out 85 an hour for a 3 hour job while the 10.00 tech spent less than 15 minutes doing it.
Parts and accs. are a different story, for those of us that have been enlightened by good dealers like Chicago and Benjy's have been broke of that scam but I think the vast majority of owners don't know all dealers don't sell at list. So I guess that is number 3 profit center. Yep, I think they could give the bikes away at cost and not really effect the bottom line.
What do you think?

[SBB]

Dawg just curious ...how will it hurt "us" in the long run?

Bubba

Just to help clarify your question,,,,

When you ask "US" do you mean yourself as an individual.
Or do you mean "US" as a dealer, the one you work for?

I to look forward to Dawg's answer!
Go Dawg,, you da man!

 [smiley=xyxthumbs.gif]

[DCFIREMANN]

[highlight]Dawg just curious ...how will it hurt "us" in the long run?[/highlight]
Bubba

If the strike continues and we have no bikes then we will have to worry about SUPPLY and DEMAND!!!!

No bikes and when it gets warm demands goes up and so does the prices!!!!!

Be Safe

THE DAWG

[DCFIREMANN]

Just to help clarify your question,,,,

When you ask "US" do you mean yourself as an individual.
Or do you mean "US" as a dealer, the one you work for?

[highlight]I to look forward to Dawg's answer!
Go Dawg,, you da man![/highlight]
 [smiley=xyxthumbs.gif]

CHIP I did learn form one of the best!!!!!!

Oh and BTW it will hurt us all, DEALERS and  THE DEDICATED CUSTOMER!!!!!!

Be Safe

THE DAWG

[DCFIREMANN]

Dawg, I agree in the long run it might hurt the dealer but IMHO, I think for the most part they are over priced T-Shirts shops. Have often pondered where the real profit center is in the dealerships. I walk in and see a 10 million dollar building with 25+ employees year round. That is a pretty big nut to crack but what t-shirt shop has 4 or 5 sales people checking out buyers all day 7 days a week all year long. JMHO but I think the bikes are there just to suck the john in, the real money is derrived from motor clothes and second I'd guess would be the service deparment. Billing out 85 an hour for a 3 hour job while the 10.00 tech spent less than 15 minutes doing it.
Parts and accs. are a different story, for those of us that have been enlightened by good dealers like Chicago and Benjy's have been broke of that scam but I think the vast majority of owners don't know all dealers don't sell at list. So I guess that is number 3 profit center. Yep,[highlight] I think they could give the bikes away at cost and not really effect the bottom line.
What do you think?

[/highlight]

I actually think you are right. But we all know that the dealers are not going to give away anything.


I really like your post. OVER PRICED TEE SHIRTS SHOPS!!!!! Yep a 10.00 Tee for 25.00 plus!!!!!!

Be Safe

THE DAWG

[KentuckyHarleyDude]

Just to help clarify your question,,,,

When you ask "US" do you mean yourself as an individual.
Or do you mean "US" as a dealer, the one you work for?

I to look forward to Dawg's answer!
Go Dawg,, you da man!

 [smiley=xyxthumbs.gif]

Chip as usual your right on the ball and I appreciate you wanting to help me "clarify" my question but it was directed at Dawg and not you... when I said us I used quotation marks  I was referring to the "us" Dawg was referring to ...

Bubba

[FR8TRN]

Because of the skill level involved, this is not a situation where replacement workers ( Scabs in union parlance) can be brought in nor is it possible for management to continue building motorcycles by staffing the line with lower and mid level management employees.

I disagree, there isn't alot goin on there that you couldn't train somebody to do in short order.  All the tools to torque bolts are preset and hanging within arms reach, puttin the parts in place is pretty simple.  I've seen the production line many times, and there just isn't much involved in putting one together.  Now the CVO line, thats a different story, mainly because they don't have the automation, it's a frame on a manual rolling platform being moved from station to station along about a 100' production line, with the different parts on shelves along the line where they are required.  The same 2 techs working on the bike from start to finish.  If they were to start producing bikes again without the union workers, the CVO line may just stay defunct for a while.

Right now, I don't think the MoCo is even thinking they need to start production back up.  With the comments from KHD about the dealer show before this even happened, I had a feelin something along this line was coming, just didn't know it would be so soon.  With the inventory sitting in dealerships around here, they probably aren't too worried, and won't be for a while.  And like someone else (and you I think) mentioned, this certainly ain't hurtin our resale any either.  I went by the plant last night, strike efforts are half-hearted at best, they play up for the camera's my son said (he lives near the plant) but when their gone, it's back to standin around talkin and smokin, very little picketing.

[SBB]

CHIP I did learn form one of the best!!!!!!

Oh and BTW it will hurt us all, DEALERS and  THE DEDICATED CUSTOMER!!!!!!

Be Safe

THE DAWG

This response is directed to the "Dawg"

Thanks Dawg!

As I have said before, but it bears repeating!

You are da man!


 

[KentuckyHarleyDude]

If the strike continues and we have no bikes then we will have to worry about SUPPLY and DEMAND!!!!

No bikes and when it gets warm demands goes up and so does the prices!!!!!

Be Safe

THE DAWG

So I suppose if the new bikes stay strong and the demand gets stronger because of a shortage of bikes and they start to bring a premium again that it will not be a benifit to owners of used bikes as their's go up in value .....
Seems to me it would be a win win situation for the dealer and current Harley owners ...but then what do I know?

Dude

[DCFIREMANN]

So I suppose if the new bikes stay strong and the demand gets stronger because of a shortage of bikes and they start to bring a premium again that it will not be a benefit to owners of used bikes as their's go up in value .....
Seems to me it would be a win win situation for the dealer and current Harley owners

...but then what do I know?

Dude

I don't know what the economy is like where you live but here in the DC Metro area it is bad. The once very strong dealers are sitting on 300 plus units. The price can go where ever it wants IF THE PUBLIC DOESN'T HAVE THE FUNDS THEY ARE NOT BUYING!

If the price moves much higher the MOCO will have to cut production. If you the Dealer starts to sit on and pay floor plan on 300 plus units how long will you last. If the Motor Clothes and service slow down and now your cash flow is hurting. What is going to happen to your business. If the price of my bikes go higher and I need to unload one for funds and can't sell it. How is going to affect me?

I am in an area that is supposed to be very strong economy wise. But we are seeing the slow down here.

Be Safe

THE DAWG