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[RedDevil]

Jorge...

Not only is Bush and his "crew" liars, but Bush will go down in history as one of the worst presidents this country has ever had...the man is an absolute idiot.

Terry,
Could be true, but he'll still be ranked higher than Jimmy Carter and Lyndon Johnson...(only use those two as they are in my lifetime).  All politicians are liars, it's a prerequisite for the job.  Doesn't matter what party you happen to populate.  We all fall prey to the finger pointing when something goes amiss.  Yet those same finger pointers were given the same information that the supposed "big liar" of the time were given.  They all got the same intelligence briefing...and that there my friends is where the problem lies.   We were sorely missing a very important part of intelligence gathering in Iraq.  It's called HUMINT, or human intelligence.  We didn't have any reliable human intelligence in Iraq to give us any indication of what was really going on in that country.  A lot of our decisions were based on what Saddam had done, i.e., used weapons of mass destruction (nerve gas) previously in his battles against the Kurds.  One would have to believe that he had weapons of mass detruction based on imperical data collected during the aftermath of that bloodbath.  So how do people say that he stated falsely that Saddam had weapons of mass destruction when there was proof positive that he not only had them, but used them?  Maybe he didn't have any more left and hadn't figured out how to make them yet, but we once again didn't have the current HUMINT to dispute that.  Both parties believed the "current intel of the time.  Both parties approved the war...so don't just blame Bush, blame the whole damned lot of them on Capital Hill.   JMHO.

[VAZHOG]

I'm kinda with Wayne here. With the technology today, there's no reason we shouldn't be going back to coal. Coal that's mined right here in America. There's no reason that the oil hasn't been tapped in Alaska either. And there's no reason to fight terrorism and include that in the guise of Middle East Energy interests. If we had no Middle East Energy interests, our policies there would look completely different than they do today. I'm all for wiping terrorism off the face of the earth. And doing that with a wrath that's never been seen before by mankind. But don't use energy as any part of the reason or the excuse. Especially when we have plenty of our own!!!

Hoist!

We do have and are using the technology currently, but there are too many tree huggers and welfare rights groups to enable the USA to stand alone and keep our Country running strong and not depending on foreign entanglements.

[amigo Jorge]

I'm kinda with Wayne here. With the technology today, there's no reason we shouldn't be going back to coal. Coal that's mined right here in America. There's no reason that the oil hasn't been tapped in Alaska either. And there's no reason to fight terrorism and include that in the guise of Middle East Energy interests. If we had no Middle East Energy interests, our policies there would look completely different than they do today. I'm all for wiping terrorism off the face of the earth. And doing that with a wrath that's never been seen before by mankind. But don't use energy as any part of the reason or the excuse. Especially when we have plenty of our own!!!
Hoist!

Agreed with you.....after several years of war and thousand of young lives the oil prices is higher than before 

[VAZHOG]

Are you sure this is Howie?

But I kinda agree! If it wasn't for oil companies and other big business owning our congress, we'd have alternate fuels, I'm not talking about corn! We'd also have cars that got twice the mileage they get now!

You can have that now for anywhere from 50K to 80K per car should pay for itself in about 25 years of use. CONGRESS has been held captive by the environmentalist for the past 30 YRS that why you NOT had a refinery built, or a new power plant built in that 30 years, More Folks are using the oil that use to come here (USA) now we must compete with them and that and the futures market drives the price.

[Hoist!]

Are you sure this is Howie?

But I kinda agree! If it wasn't for oil companies and other big business owning our congress, we'd have alternate fuels, I'm not talking about corn! We'd also have cars that got twice the mileage they get now!

Interesting discussion here guys. And don't think I'm going soft on ya Talon. I still say we should be taking care of things much differently than we are over there. And you know my feelings on that already. Nothing's changed on that. Drop the "what will the world think of us" mentality, and TCOB! And an American Flag on every oil well there before there's a Chinese Flag on them, is imperative!

What I said earlier still holds also. We need to control "everything" we can to stay the strongest force on the earth!

Hoist!

[HogBreath]

I'm kinda with Wayne here. With the technology today, there's no reason we shouldn't be going back to coal. Coal that's mined right here in America. There's no reason that the oil hasn't been tapped in Alaska either. And there's no reason to fight terrorism and include that in the guise of Middle East Energy interests. If we had no Middle East Energy interests, our policies there would look completely different than they do today. I'm all for wiping terrorism off the face of the earth. And doing that with a wrath that's never been seen before by mankind. But don't use energy as any part of the reason or the excuse. Especially when we have plenty of our own!!!

Hoist!

Hoist,

I've driven through parts of Ky where the coal fields are. It's really pathetic and sad looking. They take acres and acres and although reclaimed, it's ruined for our lifetimes.

I have a better idea. We turn our trunks into generators powered by garbage. Garbage is one thing we've got plenty of. Open up our trunks, toss in the garbage, before it even gets to stinking...wa-la! Energy! We could even put automatic trash collectors so we'd clean up the interstates as we drive, and convert it into energy to power our cars! I get 120 miles per pound of garbage.

[Hoist!]

Hoist,

I've driven through parts of Ky where the coal fields are. It's really pathetic and sad looking. They take acres and acres and although reclaimed, it's ruined for our lifetimes.

I have a better idea. We turn our trunks into generators powered by garbage. Garbage is one thing we've got plenty of. Open up our trunks, toss in the garbage, before it even gets to stinking...wa-la! Energy! We could even put automatic trash collectors so we'd clean up the interstates as we drive, and convert it into energy to power our cars! I get 120 miles per pound of garbage.

Interesting idea Ken! Where the hell do you country boys come up with that stuff from?

Actually, all the technologies exist for that to happen, as you're well aware of now! So why the hell not!

Hoist!

[HogBreath]

Interesting idea Ken! Where the hell do you country boys come up with that stuff from?

Actually, all the technologies exist for that to happen, as you're well aware of now! So why the hell not!

Hoist!

A buddy of mine came up with it. At the time I thought he was nuts, and I asked him what he'd been smoking. But the more I think about it, I think it'll work.

[VAZHOG]

Hoist,

I've driven through parts of Ky where the coal fields are. It's really pathetic and sad looking. They take acres and acres and although reclaimed, it's ruined for our lifetimes.

I have a better idea. We turn our trunks into generators powered by garbage. Garbage is one thing we've got plenty of. Open up our trunks, toss in the garbage, before it even gets to stinking...wa-la! Energy! We could even put automatic trash collectors so we'd clean up the interstates as we drive, and convert it into energy to power our cars! I get 120 miles per pound of garbage.

Yes, and it's brought to by the YOU meaning that everyone here in the usa has been about I gotta get mine because I need to keep things going as they are so I can get mine then I will be gone and someone else will have to deal with it.  SO goes the world CHINA,INDIA are doing this now digging and damning the rivers for engery burning all they can get to be where we are now, because it's all about them, they donot care anymore than the people that have run the usa for the last 60 years how they get there because it's all about THEM. They will destroy the  way we live to get what we have just like the generations that have gone before us, Example SS don't fix it let's just get by then I'll be gone and the problem goes away. They all filled there gas tank and have driven off as I plan to do -nobody cares- about anything except YOU (not meaning you personal) I came into this world American and I will leave it the same way I came in using everything that the USA has to offer and DAMING the Rest just as everyone before me has done.

You may ask what about the Children? Who asked about you before you where born--- NO ONE!!!! It's just BS-- Get yours before it's gone  

Grid the mountains NOW!! and let's go time is running out  

[sadunbar]

Hoist,

I've driven through parts of Ky where the coal fields are. It's really pathetic and sad looking. They take acres and acres and although reclaimed, it's ruined for our lifetimes.

I have a better idea. We turn our trunks into generators powered by garbage. Garbage is one thing we've got plenty of. Open up our trunks, toss in the garbage, before it even gets to stinking...wa-la! Energy! We could even put automatic trash collectors so we'd clean up the interstates as we drive, and convert it into energy to power our cars! I get 120 miles per pound of garbage.

I'll stay out of the political discussion - but take the time to look at this... www.globalresourcecorp.com/

Scott

[HogBreath]

Wow Wayne, you OK there buddy? didn't mean to rile ya up.

[VAZHOG]

Wow Wayne, you OK there buddy? didn't mean to rile ya up.

I'm not Riled up-I don't have a chance to be home alone much!!

Maybe I need a bath to relax 

That's still six months off.

[HogBreath]

I'm not Riled up-I don't have a chance to be home alone much!!

Maybe I need a bath to relax 

That's still six months off.

Smarta$$ 

[Hoist!]

I'll stay out of the political discussion - but take the time to look at this... www.globalresourcecorp.com/

Scott

There was a special on one of the Discovery Channels on this, that Ken and I watched. The technology to convert garbage to fuel is there. The technology to use the fuel to create Hydrogen is there. The technology to use the Hydrogen in Fuel Cells is there. Basically, garbage in, converted to energy, and the byproduct is H2O! It's not inconceivable. Actually, they never looked at it as putting it all together in one package, like Ken said, by dumping the garbage into your trunk. That was my crazy hair-brained scheme! But I don't think it's that far of a reach!

Hoist!

[Midnight Rider]

You can have that now for anywhere from 50K to 80K per car should pay for itself in about 25 years of use. CONGRESS has been held captive by the environmentalist for the past 30 YRS that why you NOT had a refinery built, or a new power plant built in that 30 years, More Folks are using the oil that use to come here (USA) now we must compete with them and that and the futures market drives the price.

Surely you jest...

Were it not for the EPA, we'd all be killing each other right now for a drink of water.  Do you think for one millisecond that the corporations would have EVER cleaned up their dumping of toxins in our rivers, burying cancer causing chemicals so they could leach into the water table, or dumping chit into the air that was (still is) denuding our forests, killing our fish, etc,  on their own?  Go buy you some property on The Love Canal if you believe so strongly in how much corporate America cares about you.  Hell, strip mine the Shenandoah Mountains up to your back door...there might be two days worth of energy in them for us to use.

I don't even HAVE kids, but I hope there is something green for everybody else's to look at 100 years from now.  With some of the attitudes expressed here, there wouldn't be.  I hope I'm dead long before....