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[mjb765]

Got an email back from Brian at Ref Performance tonight, he said No re-flash is necessary for a cam change, the EMS will self adjust.   

That's very good to know....Thanks for the correct info.

[Fired00d]

Got an email back from Brian at Ref Performance tonight, he said No re-flash is necessary for a cam change, the EMS will self adjust.   

Thanks for finding this out.

Did he mention if any or what changes would require the unit being sent back for a re-flash??.... something still sticks in my mind that it would have to be returned for some reason.

 
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
 

[Fired00d]

Ok, I'm not completely crazy I knew I'd read there were reasons it had to be returned...

Wurk,

You actually don't have to send it back to us to "return to stock".  Here's how it would work and we'll say for the point of argument that you want to return to using the TTS.  What you would do is have the dealer, any dealer simply flash a base calibration back into your ECU just like if you had to buy a replacement for some reason.  Then you can upload your previous TTS, or SERT, or basic motor company Stg. download in it as normal and you are ready to go.  Obviously removing the LSU's and controller as well. This can be done by any dealer at any time now or in the future.  The only reason(s) that the ECU absolutely must come back to us is for two reasons.  1.  You change to different injectors from the original cal or 2. You exceed 20% increase in displacement from the original base cal.

Hope this answered your questions and if we can help you out we will be glad to.

Brian

Depending on how radical cam replacement a person went could that not be more then a 20% increase in displacement?

 
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
 

[Twolanerider]

Ok, I'm not completely crazy I knew I'd read there were reasons it had to be returned...

Depending on how radical cam replacement a person went could that not be more then a 20% increase in displacement?

 
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
 

Cam doesn't change the cubic inch displacement of the engine Gary.  That's just bore size and stroke.

I'll admit that if a radically different cam were used I'd have a conversation with them about a map change.  Because of the timing curves.  But cams don't change engine displacement.

[Fired00d]

Cam doesn't change the cubic inch displacement of the engine Gary.  That's just bore size and stroke.

I'll admit that if a radically different cam were used I'd have a conversation with them about a map change.  Because of the timing curves.  But cams don't change engine displacement.

Thanks.

 
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
 

[cvobiker]

I asked Brian for better explanation, i.e. limitations on cam variations and even throttle body swap outs.. still waiting for his reply.  There are some modifications that require you to send the ECU in for a free re-flash but i cant remember.. Brian,, if you are following this thread,, make it easier,,, chime in   

[Badger Mike]

Seems like everyone bags on PC, but a lot of people are using them on all sorts of bikes.  Personal preference...

[Twolanerider]

Seems like everyone bags on PC, but a lot of people are using them on all sorts of bikes.  Personal preference...

I had no complaint with Power Commanders.  Used them for years and many many miles.  Had one fail.  But any part can.  Even a stock ECM.  If it can't break we probably can't ride it.

[revperf]

Hey Guys,

Sorry about the delay in responding.  We(I) have been out of the office at the Indy Powersports Expo since Wednesday of last week.  Thanks for the questions and the consideration of our product.  We are having fun with it and enjoying the responses of people having good luck with it.  Let's address a couple of questions that were specific first.  With regards to a cam change the answer is no, you don't have to send the ECM back to us.  One of our first testers, and subsequently, endorsers of the product was Dan Thompson of Hotshot Motorworks.  He got a unit and installed it on his bone stock '09 Street Glide and rode it for evaluation.  He then came back and installed a full exhaust, .615" Crane cams, a 103" kit and a set of his ported heads.  He went through the start up procedure again, confirmed that the system did, in fact, re-adjust itself for the new combination and left on it for Fla.   Only after this test would he endorse the system.  The system has a 20% cubic inch displacement window and if you change the numeric value of the injectors we need it back.  All you have to do is get it to us and we re-cal for free.  Most of the time the increase in displacement and an injector change go hand in hand so that gets it done.  Thanks again and feel free to call if you have any questions before I get a chance to get over here and answer them.

Brian

[cvobiker]

Hey Guys,

Sorry about the delay in responding.  We(I) have been out of the office at the Indy Powersports Expo since Wednesday of last week.  Thanks for the questions and the consideration of our product.  We are having fun with it and enjoying the responses of people having good luck with it.  Let's address a couple of questions that were specific first.  With regards to a cam change the answer is no, you don't have to send the ECM back to us.  One of our first testers, and subsequently, endorsers of the product was Dan Thompson of Hotshot Motorworks.  He got a unit and installed it on his bone stock '09 Street Glide and rode it for evaluation.  He then came back and installed a full exhaust, .615" Crane cams, a 103" kit and a set of his ported heads.  He went through the start up procedure again, confirmed that the system did, in fact, re-adjust itself for the new combination and left on it for Fla.   Only after this test would he endorse the system.  The system has a 20% cubic inch displacement window and if you change the numeric value of the injectors we need it back.  All you have to do is get it to us and we re-cal for free.  Most of the time the increase in displacement and an injector change go hand in hand so that gets it done.  Thanks again and feel free to call if you have any questions before I get a chance to get over here and answer them.

Brian

Brian,

Thanks for clearing some of these questions up. I have one more.. I've read on other forums where users have done dyno comparisons on same bikes with SERT and/or TTS and with EMS and seeing equal or better results with EMS. Have you done any of these tests? And if you have can you post some comparison charts? The point that EMS can equal or match a dyno tune would interest a lot of potential users.   

[SBB]

Brian,

 I have one more.. I've read on other forums where users have done dyno comparisons on same bikes with SERT and/or TTS and with EMS and seeing equal or better results with EMS. Have you done any of these tests? And if you have can you post some comparison charts? The point that EMS can equal or match a dyno tune would interest a lot of potential users.    

From what I hear and have read about the Rev Perf EMS it does provide an increase across the entire rpm range.
I would hope that Brian is smart enough to not get caught up in the "mine is bigger and better than yours" dyno debate.
I'm sure as time progresses there will be plenty of dyno comparisons by installers that speak to the efficiency of the EMS.
The facts may be what they are but so often manufacturers will make outlandish claims and by doing so, loose credibility..
I think (IMHO) the EMS will speak for itself through the customer responses.
Time tells most tales and with 4 bikes I have plenty of time to view results before I pull the trigger.
Brian, hurry up, the 01 SERG is calling your name.

SBB

[revperf]

CVO,

I have a couple but I haven't posted them because of the exact reason(s) that SBB brought up.  Right or wrong from a marketing stand point, I don't want this to turning into a dyno war because, honestly, that's not why we created the product.  I have a couple of sheets that I can send in a PM though which is what we have been doing for other customers upon request. 

Thanks for your support guys!

Brian

[cvobiker]

CVO,

I have a couple but I haven't posted them because of the exact reason(s) that SBB brought up.  Right or wrong from a marketing stand point, I don't want this to turning into a dyno war because, honestly, that's not why we created the product.  I have a couple of sheets that I can send in a PM though which is what we have been doing for other customers upon request. 

Thanks for your support guys!

Brian

I wasnt looking at it so much as a 'dyno war' but more for curiousity because it seems to be a factor with a lot of guys... personaly it's something i would like to see and i dont want to discourage anyone posting their numbers related to before afts with your system.. at some point 'dyno war' or not.. these numbers will be posted   

[revperf]

CVO,

I went back and looked at my post and I realized that I really should have been more clear.  What I meant was that I am encouraging customers to post their sheets rather than us.  Much, much more credible when it doesn't come from us.

Brian

[Spiderman]

CVO,

I went back and looked at my post and I realized that I really should have been more clear.  What I meant was that I am encouraging customers to post their sheets rather than us.  Much, much more credible when it doesn't come from us.

Brian

For those of us still stuck in the stone age of 2006 technology as am I, could you please explain who "us" is ? There's a good baker's dozen of aftermarket ECM modifiers and tuners (whatever you want to call them) on the market these days and I don't know one from another WHICH, I think was one of the things the member who started this thread was looking to find out. The thread has morphed into a discussion between several people who seem to be in the know about a particular product of which I am not ashamed to admit am clueless. Basically picture Gibbs on NCIS asking McGee to explain some computer gobbledy-gook to him in English and that'd be me (Gibbs)

Thanks
          B B