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[CVOmedic]

After HOURS AND HOURS of research, I finally decided on a new tuner for my '12 CVO street glide.  Tonight, I was talking with some buddies about my plans and mods.  I KNOW I will be adding an X Pipe from Fullsac along with a set of CFR slip ons.  Beyond that, I have no plans to do any future engine work or mods to my scooter.

That said, my friends suggested I save all my money and simply have the dealership remap the stock ECM with a map fitted to the headers and exhaust and call it a day.  They advised there is no reason to buy an aftermarket tuner if all I plan on doing is adding headers and slip ons.

So my question to you guys.....IS there really a reason for my to buy a tuner if all I am doing is switching headers and slip ons?  The guys were not sure if Harley is still able to remap the stock ECMs without adding a SEPST or SERT or whatever the hell they are called now (Harley race tuner), but they all suggested that I look into it before I sink a ton of money into a tuner I may have never really needed in the first place.

Thanks so much for any input!!!!!

[FLSTFI Dave]

I would add a tuner for just doing the x pipe and slip ons.  They let way more air though the engine, so the ECM needs to be set up for that.  A map from HD will still be very lean as mandated by EPA.

I and many on this site like or prefer the TTS Master Tune version.  Fulsac sells them and will have a map for your set up.

[grc]

After HOURS AND HOURS of research, I finally decided on a new tuner for my '12 CVO street glide.  Tonight, I was talking with some buddies about my plans and mods.  I KNOW I will be adding an X Pipe from Fullsac along with a set of CFR slip ons.  Beyond that, I have no plans to do any future engine work or mods to my scooter.

That said, my friends suggested I save all my money and simply have the dealership remap the stock ECM with a map fitted to the headers and exhaust and call it a day.  They advised there is no reason to buy an aftermarket tuner if all I plan on doing is adding headers and slip ons.

So my question to you guys.....IS there really a reason for my to buy a tuner if all I am doing is switching headers and slip ons?  The guys were not sure if Harley is still able to remap the stock ECMs without adding a SEPST or SERT or whatever the hell they are called now (Harley race tuner), but they all suggested that I look into it before I sink a ton of money into a tuner I may have never really needed in the first place.

Thanks so much for any input!!!!!

So basically you are getting advice from some guys who aren't sure anyone can actually do what they recommend you have done.  Hmmmmmm.  Sounds like they aren't exactly a good source for your research.

The only type of calibration (map) that the dealer can directly download to your ECM without a tuning device are the street legal canned maps they offer for the street legal stage I mods they sell.  That would be air cleaners and street legal mufflers.  Those maps do not address the lean mixture in closed loop operation, which will remain at the standard EPA mandated ratio.  Those maps also will not compensate for the difference in air flow caused by eliminating the catalytic converter when you change headpipes.

Almost without exception, people who have tried to remain stock and were later convinced to get their bikes tuned properly have come back and sang the praises of a good tune.  Until you've ridden a properly tuned Harley, you don't realize how poor the stock setup is.  And I'm not just talking about power, I'm talking about driveability and smoothness as well.

There are many alternatives on the market, from add on boxes to full blown tuning solutions.  My personal recommendation is to use one of the VCI (Vehicle Communication Interface) tuning packages like the TTS MasterTune to alter the map in the stock ECM.  You can find canned maps that will be close (Steve at Fullsac can help you with that), or you can do your own V-tune if you enjoy playing with the bike and software, or you can pay a professional to tune it on a dyno.  That's one of the nice things about these types of devices, they offer the most flexibility.  As much as we all say we don't plan to modify anything when we first buy the bikes, most of us eventually do.


Jerry

[cvobiker]

If you want to forget your tuner, try Revolution Performance EMS,,  lot of us here using the system and no sad stories I know of.... 

[mjb765]

If you want to forget your tuner, try Revolution Performance EMS,,  lot of us here using the system and no sad stories I know of.... 

If he goes that route he will need to purchase and 2010 or earlier ECM since Rev Perf still has not cracked the code to access the 2011 and later ECM's.

[BUBBLEHEAD]

Get a tuner, have your bike tuned properly, ride the s*** out of it.   NUFF SAID 

[Smitty2u]

IMHO.....  The best money spent during a modification is tied up in getting it tuned.  That would necessitate a good race tuner like TTS or SEPRT.  If it puts the project out of reach......  There's always next year.

[CVOmedic]

So basically you are getting advice from some guys who aren't sure anyone can actually do what they recommend you have done.  Hmmmmmm.  Sounds like they aren't exactly a good source for your research.

The only type of calibration (map) that the dealer can directly download to your ECM without a tuning device are the street legal canned maps they offer for the street legal stage I mods they sell.  That would be air cleaners and street legal mufflers.  Those maps do not address the lean mixture in closed loop operation, which will remain at the standard EPA mandated ratio.  Those maps also will not compensate for the difference in air flow caused by eliminating the catalytic converter when you change head pipes.

Almost without exception, people who have tried to remain stock and were later convinced to get their bikes tuned properly have come back and sang the praises of a good tune.  Until you've ridden a properly tuned Harley, you don't realize how poor the stock setup is.  And I'm not just talking about power, I'm talking about driveability and smoothness as well.

There are many alternatives on the market, from add on boxes to full blown tuning solutions.  My personal recommendation is to use one of the VCI (Vehicle Communication Interface) tuning packages like the TTS MasterTune to alter the map in the stock ECM.  You can find canned maps that will be close (Steve at Fullsac can help you with that), or you can do your own V-tune if you enjoy playing with the bike and software, or you can pay a professional to tune it on a dyno.  That's one of the nice things about these types of devices, they offer the most flexibility.  As much as we all say we don't plan to modify anything when we first buy the bikes, most of us eventually do.


Jerry

No, these guys are great and know what they are talking about.  The part they were not sure about is the ability of the dealership to still remap.  Their actual suggestion was to at least investigate the matter before I purchase a $500-900 tuner.  From the posts here, it seems as though they were correct, however, you guys have made great points to the fact that the factory maps would still be very restrictive and not allow the bike to run to it's full potential.  I did not really think about it from that perspective and has made me decide that purchasing a tuner will be a very smart investment.

I REALLY wanted the EMS solution from RevPerformance but as stated, they have yet to crack ECMs produced after 2010.  I have an email off to them to see where they are in development, but given they were "only a few weeks away" from cracking the '11s early last year, I am not too hopeful.

Of all the products, the TTS is what I am leaning towards.  I am glad to have the input here to push me into the buying pool and feel comfortable about spending the money, knowing this solution far exceeds what Harley may be able to provide.

Thanks guys!

[FUNGOUL]

take it here


http://www.hdmdtuningcenter.com/index.html

[darth davidson]

take it here


http://www.hdmdtuningcenter.com/index.html


[/quote

X2 

[willyB]

YES!

[glens]

No, these guys are great and know what they are talking about.  The part they were not sure about is the ability of the dealership to still remap.  Their actual suggestion was to at least investigate the matter before I purchase a $500-900 tuner

Forget about "the stage one downloads are too lean".  Yes, they're lean, but not that much more than any other setup running closed-loop using the stock O2 sensors.  I run closed-loop and recommend it be done whenever possible, especially if you intend to travel very much.  If you'll always be using the same fuel it's not so important to run closed-loop.

Even if you could get a dealer to load a stage one calibration into your bike, you're not addressing the intake breathing and that's the major player in the downloads.  On top of that, H-D will not have a calibration download (very) suitable for any set of headpipes that they didn't make, and they'd have to be "street legal" to boot, which means for your bike they'd have a cat inside.

In short, based upon your stated plans, you'd be just as well off running your stock calibration as having an H-D "stage one download" installed.  It's six of one and half a dozen of the other in terms of how the calibrations are unsuitable for your purposes.

I say the best money is currently spent on a TTS tuning kit with some cables.  Do a few v-tune runs as comprehensively as you can and your bike will run very well indeed.  You will quickly forget all about the ~$500.

[CVOmedic]

Thanks Glens.  I believe the TTS is gonna be the way to go.  If I get time tomorrow, I am going to go ahead and place my order for the headers and TTS from Steve.

Anyone know of a vender on the site for the CFRs?  Harley Direct has had the best price I could find so far.

Again, thanks everyone for the input!

[kiwihog]

If u r gonna get the headpipe and tuner from Steve get the 2.0 baffles from him also very easy install and great sound and you get to keep the muffler cans with all the CARB emissions disclaimers info stamped on em.

[Fattbaggernknox]

You don't really have to have a tuning device if you can find someone  who's knowledgeable with direct link tuning. I had mine tuned via direct link & i could'nt be happier!