Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[kraut]

as of lately H-D does really try to enforce their policy: latest example.

[grc]

as of lately H-D does really try to enforce their policy: latest example.

That's a different situation than what the OP was talking about.  Just like the previous case in California, this one is related to fraudulent activity by the dealership.  Note that it is about the Non-Retail Sales Policy (NRSP).  Basically the dealership reported bikes sold at retail to collect incentive payments from H-D when they were in fact not sold to legitimate retail customers in accordance with the policy.  So they basically received incentive and PDI payments fraudulently.  By reporting the bikes sold, they also started the time on the warranty, which screws the ultimate retail customer who eventually buys those bikes.

This sort of thing used to be widespread in the auto business every time the economy went in the tank, as dealers reported vehicles sold to collect incentive payments.  I had the fun on more than one occasion of trying to straighten out the mess for customers who got screwed on warranty because of these crooks.  And then we had the opposite problem, where dealers didn't report vehicles sold so they could avoid paying the principal on the floor plan loan for the vehicle.  That one is called selling out of trust, and the finance arms of the manufacturer's or the local banks that financed dealer inventories all had to perform continuous audits of inventory to rein in those crooks.

I have absolutely no problem with H-D enforcing the legitimate policies that are part and parcel of the franchise agreement.  If they didn't, ultimately a lot of customers could be screwed, not just H-D.  Where I have a real case of heartburn is when H-D tries to fix prices or restrict legitimate retail sales to protect their favored dealers from some honest competition, all in the name of "protecting the brand".  That is pure BS.


Jerry

[1abastarsmda]

That's a different situation than what the OP was talking about.  Just like the previous case in California, this one is related to fraudulent activity by the dealership.  Note that it is about the Non-Retail Sales Policy (NRSP).  Basically the dealership reported bikes sold at retail to collect incentive payments from H-D when they were in fact not sold to legitimate retail customers in accordance with the policy.  So they basically received incentive and PDI payments fraudulently.  By reporting the bikes sold, they also started the time on the warranty, which screws the ultimate retail customer who eventually buys those bikes.

This sort of thing used to be widespread in the auto business every time the economy went in the tank, as dealers reported vehicles sold to collect incentive payments.  I had the fun on more than one occasion of trying to straighten out the mess for customers who got screwed on warranty because of these crooks.  And then we had the opposite problem, where dealers didn't report vehicles sold so they could avoid paying the principal on the floor plan loan for the vehicle.  That one is called selling out of trust, and the finance arms of the manufacturer's or the local banks that financed dealer inventories all had to perform continuous audits of inventory to rein in those crooks.

I have absolutely no problem with H-D enforcing the legitimate policies that are part and parcel of the franchise agreement.  If they didn't, ultimately a lot of customers could be screwed, not just H-D.  Where I have a real case of heartburn is when H-D tries to fix prices or restrict legitimate retail sales to protect their favored dealers from some honest competition, all in the name of "protecting the brand".  That is pure BS.


Jerry

Very well said!

[oe542bob]

Don't know about the restriction thing, but I had a HD dealer told me I lived too far for them to sell me a bike. I live about 40-45 miles away. I do need to mention that it was back in 1993! But I will never spend a dime there, ever!

[harley56]

The MOCO Has been trying to enforce that rule for 30 years. Never worked, never will....

Harley has never had a policy like this!  As said earlier, this was done by dealers when their was a shortage of motorcycles.  Dealers did not have enough motorcycles for their market and did not want to sell a bike to a person that they would never see again. 

[Puzzled]

I'm driving 285 miles to a dealer on the opposite side of the state to pick up my new bike Saturday. I'm glad they didn't stick to the 150 mile radius. 

[Puzzled]

Harley has never had a policy like this!  As said earlier, this was done by dealers when their was a shortage of motorcycles.  Dealers did not have enough motorcycles for their market and did not want to sell a bike to a person that they would never see again. 

That is the way I understand it.

We do something similar in my line of work when supplies get low.

[tweeter13]

I live in Ohio,  do you know how hard it is to find a brand new cvo ultra when they come out.  Plus having a dealer tell you that since you have never bought a bike from them before and wanting a new cvo ultra would be like finding a needle in a haystack.  I told him I relized that.  But I would like to order one.  Here Is 15 grand down.  Order it.  He pretty much just laughed in my face  and said there is no way I was going to get one.  Pretty much Bumed out when I left there.  Then happened to be on vacation in Myrtle Beach so my girlfriend and I stopped in to get her a teeshirt and low and behold it was there.  My baby a brand new 2011.5 FLHTCUSE6.  Had no problem buying it that day even with Harley Credit.  I am sure if there was a policy against it Harley Credit would have bounced it back cause of the distance.  But I have to admit getting warranty work and stuff repaired close to home has been a bit rough so I drive about 80 miles away. 

[lilcoot]

I bought my 2012 SG at Skip Fordyce, and in addition to collecting incentives, I was told (by an employee there) that they also were in trouble for claiming they were getting bigger down payments from customers than they actually were getting, so they could get more buyers to qualify for HD financing.  HD's version of sub prime mortgages?

Don't know if it's true, but I wouldn't be surprised.  They frequently mark up prices $2000-$5000 on CVOs, as do several other local dealers.

[Super_Viking]

Wonder what Black Hill's Harley Davidson going to do during Bike Week?   

[Eagle Eye]

I live in Ohio,  do you know how hard it is to find a brand new cvo ultra when they come out.  Plus having a dealer tell you that since you have never bought a bike from them before and wanting a new cvo ultra would be like finding a needle in a haystack.  I told him I relized that.  But I would like to order one.  Here Is 15 grand down.  Order it.  He pretty much just laughed in my face  and said there is no way I was going to get one.  Pretty much Bumed out when I left there.  Then happened to be on vacation in Myrtle Beach so my girlfriend and I stopped in to get her a teeshirt and low and behold it was there.  My baby a brand new 2011.5 FLHTCUSE6.  Had no problem buying it that day even with Harley Credit.  I am sure if there was a policy against it Harley Credit would have bounced it back cause of the distance.  But I have to admit getting warranty work and stuff repaired close to home has been a bit rough so I drive about 80 miles away. 

Hey Tweeter:  Congrats on the new bike!  You should ride right up to the showroom and give that idiot who told you that a bit of fun.  Rub it in their noses, per say.  They could have sold you a bike and refused?  If they couldn't order one for you, it must be because they have some kind of restrictions on their purchasing...?  What they told you just doesn't make sense from a sales standpoint at all.  You walk in with a fist of bills, by golly you should be able to buy whatever you want; even if you have to order it.  I'm just dumbfounded at some of the stories going around about poor treatment of customers at the dealerships.   

[tweeter13]

Eagle Eye I did just that.  I dont even take the bike there for service.  I have had friends bikes leave there and blow up not even 1 mile down the street cause they forgot oil.  They did take care of it.  Another the belt started slipping cause they didnt do something right changing tires.  I could keep going.  So I just dont risk it.  There is one dealer I havent tried.  But I am working with one now that is about 80 miles away.  I have Had a problem with so far but the manager there seems to be taking care of me.  But we will see.   By the way the salesmen said that I was very lucky to get one and was happy for me.  I told him he sure lost a pretty big deal and commission check on it.  He said they dont work on commission there.  I just laughed when I walked out the door.  I wont even buy a bolt from them if I had to.  I would drive to another state first.   
thanks     Todd

[1abastarsmda]

Back to my original post: "Dealer obligation to the tri-state area mandates that NEW bike sales are restricted to a 150 mile radius of the dealership!"

I read that again and realized that it is not mentioning the mother company, but rather the "tri-state area madates".  I know that the dealers around here have a local association, for which all but one of the local dealers belongs to (as far as I am aware). Certainly a "mandate" more than implies that this is something that would be required of all dealers in the association.  However, I have not seen this from any other local dealers.  I'll probably be visiting at least a few of those dealers this weekend, and maybe the one that posted this.  I guess I'll have to ask some questions. If it's not really something mandated to all of the dealers in the area, then they should probably remove this from their website, as it's simply made up BS and probably breaks some sort of truth in advertising laws.

Or perhaps this is their own self-made and self-serving obligation that the principals of the dealer have decided to abide by, to only sell new bikes to those that have a higher probability of returning there for parts and service. Maybe they just worded it inappropriately.  Maybe it should have said. "With the dealer obligation to supply bikes to the local area, then it only makes sense that NEW bike sales are restricted to a 150 mile radius of the dealership!"  That still may not be totally just, but at least then they could defend themselves by saying that they were doing this as a service to their local customer base.  In the end, it really doesn't matter since it seems that nobody else follows this rule.

[hogasm]

Back in 2009 boat manufactures had rules that you had to purchase  new boat from the dealer closest to you. I thought I wanted a new 31' Contender, 2 other friends of mine also wanted new ones. We contacted Contender and they said we must deal with Power Marine in Sneads Ferry NC. Since we did not like one of the owners of that dealership we did not purchase the 3 boats. Each of us went another route. They lost new boat sales from their policy.