Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

Author Topic: 2014 CVO Limited TTS Tuning  (Read 3409 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

AMEDD_SFC

  • Senior CVO Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 479
  • 2014 CVO Limited
    • TX


    • CVO1: 2014 CVO Limited - The Big Red One
2014 CVO Limited TTS Tuning
« on: November 05, 2013, 09:25:16 PM »

Hi All:

I created my first tune file using the Flight Recorder over three runs today.

I pretty much have no clue what is going on, but managed to follow the instructions and create a tune and download it to my bike.

I used the Base Cal provided with the TTS program - EWA614-02 and converted it according to the instructions and downloaded it to the bike.
I did three runs and combined them with the cal and got the attached.  Saved it as a new CAL and downloaded it back to the bike.

According to the instructions, it will take a few iterations before getting a final cal. 

My question is: Is there any hints about HOW to ride the bike to get more, better data? i.e. How does one get more data in the yellow cells?

From what I can tell, there isn't a lot of change on this first run?  Pink is in the < 5% area and there is some red.  I am thinking those cells will be white next time?

Any thought on the process are welcome.  Looking forward to collecting the next runs.

I apologize for the wordy and incoherent post, but my brain is fried....

Regards,

Mark
Logged

Mark B.
SFC, USA (RET)

old_dirt

  • Banned
  • Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 33
Re: 2014 CVO Limited TTS Tuning
« Reply #1 on: November 06, 2013, 10:37:39 PM »

Do you know how to open up your v tune data and view and replay the histogram? What you do, like I just did to view your data runs, is to open up the file. Then click 'view'. Then click 'v tune histogram'. Once you click that, another box opens. This is the Histogram Screen. Hit 'Start" and watch that play out. The very light green squares are the squares that you have collected the minimum amount of data that is satisfactory for the TTS software. Make sure that the vertical line in the graph is all the way to the left., BTW.

Quick question... do you have TTS2 with the blue dongle? Or TTS with the black dongle? If you have the blue? Are you using flight recorder to save the data? Or... are you carrying around a laptop while you ride? I will have some advice depending on how you collect data.

OK... back to the histogram. You can click on any square (when the recording is finished) and see how many 'hits' are in each cell, and also how much MAP was recorded in KPAs.

What I see right now? You are not collecting enough data.

Here is what I mean.






Looking at yours, you did not collect enough data and... it is hard to do so, right out of the box. The easiest thing to do is ride a little, and try to target ONE section very well. Pull over, look at laptop and SEE if you did. Adjust thee riding style until you CAN hit the targets you wish.  Data collecting is the KING of this whole 'tuning' deal.

What you need to start accomplishing the ability to get 'purple squares' like this.



What this means is you have collected enough data to satisfy TTS that you have hit 80 KPA in each row you can.

Now... to piss you off... here is a really good data recording. I cheated and did this on a dyno. But you get the idea.



So, work on data collection. ( I have posted TPS data for you to see, except this is DBW and it doesn't collect below 4%, where you have a cable and you collect at 0%). Lambda Histograms look like a green brick. TPS kind of misses the top right and bottom left, which is fine.

Then when making your tunes from the data recorded... you have a box that says accept of not. It shows colors that represent the amount of change from a previous run(s). THIS box fools most people when they start to learn about data collecting.

Most will see a whole bunch of white areas and feel that there data is really good in those spots. nothing could be further from the truth! What is usually happening is we all miss areas when collecting data, and if we miss the same area over-and-over... it will show white, which actually means... yes, there hasn't been changes, but the true reason there are no changes is because no data has NEVER been collected. The software does not differentiate this. This acceptance change of VE box must always be viewed along with a histogram. WIth the histogram, you could see if ANY data has ever been collected, or it was a spot that has been skipped over and over.

Once we get you better at collecting data... I can see you have some EGR issues. But FIRST, learning proper data collection is whats happening.

Even on the dyno, I do NOT bother to collect data above 4500 rpms. Hopefully. there should be some really nice steep long hills that you can run up. Using hills and 5th gear or maybe 4th. climb the hill around 2500 rpms and then see if you got the purple check marks. To hit 80 kpa... it takes a load on the engine. It just takes some practice, my Friend.

Oh... you will see in some of my data collecting that I am near 300*F. That was me playing with timing, etc. YOU will want the bike at 260ish* to v-tune with. Also, it's best to collect data at above 200- or so.

And... Once you kind of get data collection better, we can work on idle and sub idle tuning. I ALWAYS get all the VEs I can BELOW 2000 rpms. But... the 2000 row and 2250 rows need to have the VEs nice and solid, first.
__________________

Logged

warwick

  • Junior CVO Member
  • **
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 56
Re: 2014 CVO Limited TTS Tuning
« Reply #2 on: November 07, 2013, 02:08:32 AM »

Very useful information.
Thanks a lot :)

warwick
Logged

AMEDD_SFC

  • Senior CVO Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 479
  • 2014 CVO Limited
    • TX


    • CVO1: 2014 CVO Limited - The Big Red One
Re: 2014 CVO Limited TTS Tuning
« Reply #3 on: November 07, 2013, 07:12:19 AM »

Dear OD:

First of all, Thank you!

The HOW was what I was after.  The data I showed was a fairly short Flight Recorder run and I knew I wasn't getting it right  From what you said, I see that hills and load are key to getting god data.

Another thing I didn't get was playing back the record to see the TPS graph.  Thanks, that should help me get in the right ranges.
I have the TTS II (Blue), but plan on throwing the laptop in the tour pack so I can see what's going on while I am out at the riding area.

I can't thank you enough for taking the time to break down the process so even a caveman can understand!   :P  The process is starting to gel for me.

I have read the manual over and over and every bit of info I can find on the subject, but your explanation was the most useful so far.

One more stupid question:

In the manual it says to take the last generated tune and set the AFR back to original along with the PE then download the tune to the bike.  That seems counter intuitive to me.   What is it then that is changed in the CAL if the AFR is reset to original?

Best Regards,

Mark

« Last Edit: November 07, 2013, 11:05:44 AM by AMEDD_SFC »
Logged

Mark B.
SFC, USA (RET)

old_dirt

  • Banned
  • Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 33
Re: 2014 CVO Limited TTS Tuning
« Reply #4 on: November 07, 2013, 09:28:37 AM »

Mark;
When you change it back to original AFR (or Lambda), what you are doing is setting what sections of the tune will be in open or closed loop.  VEs are whats happening.  Once the VEs are finally figured out from extensive data collection, then the AFRs can be changed, because it's all math in the end.

The reason you set everything to 14.6 AFR (or.981 Lambda) in the first place is because that is actually a signal to the ECM to switch the whole map to closed loop.  Once VEs are set, then one can alter (to a certain degree) what the AFRs are desired to be... the software and the ECM will figure things out internally to get those 'new' AFRs you enter.

To do this, and have it work properly...  the VEs need to be as close as possible to being 'correct' for the engine's needs and its airflow.

The reason to change back to original... when this is ALL done, is because your engine will really need more fuel that the 14.6 can provide in certain areas.  You set everything to 14.6, in the beginning, to... like I sated to turn 'ON' closed loop everywhere...  the internal software of the TTS uses closed loop to dial in the VEs by your data collecting.  WHat is does is figure out how far away you are from 14.6 and alters the VEs to match.  Once the VEs are done with (you have awhile yet... with EGR and Timing to do AFTER wards)... You NEED those lower AFR numbers (more fuel in the mix) for a proper running engine.

To not waste TOO much time... once you get the handle of this...  go get a Box-Net account and upload your DM3 files and MT8 file.  Folks here can look AND help you start on the EGRs.  Those are worked from the get go, but in your case... and a lot of other folks,too....  I want you to learn how to gather good data first.

This will make more sense as time goes along.
« Last Edit: November 07, 2013, 09:40:56 AM by old_dirt »
Logged

AMEDD_SFC

  • Senior CVO Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 479
  • 2014 CVO Limited
    • TX


    • CVO1: 2014 CVO Limited - The Big Red One
Re: 2014 CVO Limited TTS Tuning
« Reply #5 on: November 07, 2013, 11:24:07 AM »

Thanks, again for the explanation.  I understood the closed/open loop concept.  It just looked like returning the AFRs to original would reset everything - which would make no sense.  I figured there was something behind the scenes, so to speak, that was changing to get the tune right. 

It is just a little confusing - not being comfortable with the software - yet.  There are little things missing from the manual, like how to play back a FR file to actually see the AFRs.  Originally, I looked at the graph, but it was blank.  I didn't want to mess with things for fear of messing something up.  Until I read your first post, I thought START would try to start a data run and erase my file, if that makes sense.

Now that I understand how to get to the graph, I can hopefully gather better data in the correct cells.  I ran one of the FR files this morning and looked at the graph.  That REALLY helped me see what's going on. 

I have a good place picked out with long, steep grades to go try out this Saturday.  I think by looking at the graph after each run, I can get more and better data.  I am fired up, now!

Best Regards,

Mark
Logged

Mark B.
SFC, USA (RET)

old_dirt

  • Banned
  • Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 33
Re: 2014 CVO Limited TTS Tuning
« Reply #6 on: November 07, 2013, 11:37:28 PM »

You will 'get it' Mark.  And parts you don't?  Somebody here will help you, too!
Logged

AMEDD_SFC

  • Senior CVO Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 479
  • 2014 CVO Limited
    • TX


    • CVO1: 2014 CVO Limited - The Big Red One
Re: 2014 CVO Limited TTS Tuning
« Reply #7 on: November 08, 2013, 10:24:34 AM »

Allcon:

I was going back and forth with a DIY vs. Dealer install.  I like to do things myself, but I was a little nervous about getting into a $40k + bike
The expertise and friendly attitudes on this forum gave me the courage to go for it.  Thanks to everyone for the encouragement, know-how and kind words.

Regards,

Mark
Logged

Mark B.
SFC, USA (RET)
 

Page created in 0.13 seconds with 22 queries.