www.CVOHARLEY.com
CVO Technical => Milwaukee-Eight => Topic started by: UUNetBill on November 23, 2017, 06:14:23 PM
-
So my new RG is a ticking machine. From the day I bought it it’s been ticking...sounds like valvetrain to me, but of course the dealer says it’s normal, it’ll quiet down after the 1K service, they all do that, the M8 is inherently noisy, etc.
Bottom line - it’s getting annoying, it’s no worse but it’s no better, either. Just had the 1K done and the tech said it’s normal. I don’t know if I’m just paranoid because of the lifter stories online or if I really need to start pushing to get someone higher up the food chain to give it a listen. Doesn’t seem to be temp related, and it’s most noticeable at around 2,000-2,500 steady cruise or slight acceleration. It quiets down under heavier throttle. It seems a bit noisier than my older 103, but that one had louder pipes and an intake, so maybe I just didn’t notice it?
Anyone else have any noise issues? I’ve told the dealer that if it IS a lifter issue, it’s a helluva lot cheaper and easier to fix now than after the mill grenades.
Thoughts?
-
Have heard about oil pumps failing, but the valve train on the M8 has been quiet. Ask dealer to start up one from inventory for you to compare.
-
What he said.^^^ Many dealership people are so used to blowing people off with the old "that's normal" or "they all do that" they often fail to even check simple things. So far all the reports I've seen from people with M8's indicate the engine is MUCH quieter than their previous Twin Cams. Have the dealership fire up a few other M8's and both they and you compare those to yours. If the others are quiet and yours isn't, tell them you want yours to be just like those "normal" ones. Btw, the expression "normal" is pretty much meaningless, but they still love to use it.
Jerry
-
I took a new CVO Limited for a test ride a few months back, one thing the salesman said about the M8 was how much quieter the new engines are.
It didn't sound any quieter than my 15.
My 15 is much quieter than any of my previous Harley's, and for
the last month so quiet you would think it was in storage.
But like others have said, have the dealer start up a new bike next to yours to compare.
Also get copy from service department each time you have expressed concerns, on everything. So you have records, and if something comes up they can't say they don't have history of your concerns.
-
Good advice, all. Thanks. I’ve made sure to have them document every time I have them check the ticking. Want that paper trail!
This one is a bit noisier than the other 107s they have on the floor, but I wasn’t sure if the 117 had any changes to the valvetrain (cam profile, spring rate, etc) that would cause the 117 to be louder than a 107. And of course the dealer doesn’t have any other 117s in stock right now. I’ll keep after them. Thanks!
-
My M8 started as a 107, had the stage IV 117 kit installed and it is quiet. Have had five 110 TC's so I know about top end noise :nixweiss: Still have a 2014 CVO limited it has been the quietest of the 110's I've owned but it still has valve train noise. The 117 is QUIET!!!!! compared to the TC's ::)
-
I only ride tried and true S&S Big motors. V111 and V124 .
-
I have a 17 114 and was really impressed with how quite the motor was over my prior 110 twin cam. honestly cant say anything one way or the other on the 18s
-
Not sure where you are with this as it has been several months but my 2018 117 M8 is quiet. Of course my 16 114 was so loud it was ridiculous. And if you can believe this Harley said "it's normal, they all sound that way". I was impressed that they were able to get a brand new 2016 CVO to sound like a Model A. I actually had people roll down their car windows to ask me if the bike was having issues at red lights. i let them know "it's normal, they all sound that way"...
So compared to that my 2018 117 is a dream both in lack of motor noise and in power.
-
Have not heard a ticking sound from any of the 117s. Dealers like to say 'they all do that.' When you find out what it is, appreciate a report.
-
When the dipstick(s) at the dealership tell you the sound is "normal" say "prove it." Have them start a half dozen bikes on the dealer floor and see if they all sound like they've got rocks in their pocket.
-
Are you sure the noise isn’t pinging especially since it quiets after a range? If you hammer it down low say 2300 rpm to 5000 do you hear it every time?
What octane gas/brand do like to run? Have you tried an octane booster safe to sensors?
Dealership numbnuts don’t usually want to investigate they wanna change parts.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
-
Just a quick update on this - the ticking hasn’t gotten worse but it sure hasn’t gotten better. It’s not pinging, it sounds more like valvetrain noise but it’s coming more from inside the case, not from the cam side. But I finally had the service manager listen to it after I insisted it wasn’t normal and they finally agreed that there’s something wrong. They sent some video to the MoCo and got the go ahead to open it up and see what’s wrong with it. They’re guessing oil pump but we won’t know until we’re in there. I’m dropping it off tonight.
I probably didn’t do too good of a job explaining the sound, but it’s fairly random...it happens both on and off throttle, more than just valvetrain clatter but not quite a knock. And I did have them start a few other M8 bikes to compare with and they were all more quiet than mine...that’s when they’d say, “Oh the CVOs have a bigger cam, they’ll be louder”. I’d have to have lobes the size of my fist to make that kind of noise.
I’ll update once we know more.
Thanks to all for your input.
-
the dealer says:
it’s normal....BS
it’ll quiet down after the 1K service....BS
they all do that....BS
the M8 is inherently noisy....Complete BS
it sounds more like valvetrain noise but it’s coming more from inside the case, not from the cam side....They’re guessing oil pump but we won’t know until we’re in there.
I wonder if they know where the oil pump is? :nixweiss:
Dealerships....They all do that. >:(
-
so this is going to be interesting.... waiting to hear about there findings ???
-
Just a quick update on this - the ticking hasn’t gotten worse but it sure hasn’t gotten better. It’s not pinging, it sounds more like valvetrain noise but it’s coming more from inside the case, not from the cam side. But I finally had the service manager listen to it after I insisted it wasn’t normal and they finally agreed that there’s something wrong. They sent some video to the MoCo and got the go ahead to open it up and see what’s wrong with it. They’re guessing oil pump but we won’t know until we’re in there. I’m dropping it off tonight.
I probably didn’t do too good of a job explaining the sound, but it’s fairly random...it happens both on and off throttle, more than just valvetrain clatter but not quite a knock. And I did have them start a few other M8 bikes to compare with and they were all more quiet than mine...that’s when they’d say, “Oh the CVOs have a bigger cam, they’ll be louder”. I’d have to have lobes the size of my fist to make that kind of noise.
I’ll update once we know more.
Thanks to all for your input.
funny stuff for sure. it its the so called big cam which it is not why does it take so long for it to get loud as you say these people think the razzle is going to fool the public,, it is not going to with what is going on these days
-
Just a quick update - MoCo gave the OK to open the engine and see what’s what...near as we can tell, I had an early model pump and even though it wasn’t sumping there was inadequate oiling. Valvetrain was shot...rocker shafts, bushings, vam, lifters - all hosed. Minor scoring on the cylinders and pistons.
So they’re basically rebuilding the entire mill except for the cases and crank. Everything spec’d good on the bottom end so we’re not going with a new motor...this time. To be honest, I’m not 100% sure this will be a one-and-done fix.
Should have it back soon, all of the parts are in. Stopped by today and they had the cam chest buttoned up, new jugs mounted, heads on, just waiting for the rocker boxes, pushrods, etc. and then bolt everything else back on. And of course, rain in the forecast for the next 8-10 days.
Let’s see if this one will hold together for more than 3,000 miles...
-
Just a quick update - MoCo gave the OK to open the engine and see what’s what...near as we can tell, I had an early model pump and even though it wasn’t sumping there was inadequate oiling. Valvetrain was shot...rocker shafts, bushings, vam, lifters - all hosed. Minor scoring on the cylinders and pistons.
So they’re basically rebuilding the entire mill except for the cases and crank. Everything spec’d good on the bottom end so we’re not going with a new motor...this time. To be honest, I’m not 100% sure this will be a one-and-done fix.
Should have it back soon, all of the parts are in. Stopped by today and they had the cam chest buttoned up, new jugs mounted, heads on, just waiting for the rocker boxes, pushrods, etc. and then bolt everything else back on. And of course, rain in the forecast for the next 8-10 days.
Let’s see if this one will hold together for more than 3,000 miles...
you better have you shop take a good look at the lower end a bit more closely. imagine if the top end is smoked like you say that lower end is junk and you will be back, you better have warranty cause its there had to be some serious heat,
and that is killer.
-
Well, picked the bike up this morning. Parts list ran to two pages. The weather didn’t cooperate with me, it started raining as soon as 8 got home. I’m hoping for some clear time tomorrow to roll some miles on it.
My initial feeling is that it’s a lot quieter than it was, but I’m still not sure that it’s as quiet as it should be. Maybe I’m just paranoid, I don’t know. I’ll put about 500 easy miles on it and then change the oil and dissect the filter looking for any shavings or sludge.
It’s really a shame that there are so damn many $40,000 bikes out there going through engines like M&Ms. It’s a real problem.
-
hope it goes well from here, keep us posted
-
Just picked up my 2017 CVO Streetglide
Thebike makes a loud high pitched ticked noise as well .
It cant be normal .I also approached my dealer and got no answers
Much louder than my twin cam Road King
-
i just picked up my 2018 CVO Street Glide and it makes the same exact high pitched ticking noise from the motor
I t occurs at rpms between 2000-and 2500
the dealer said it is normal ,I know it is not!
he said the 2018 117 is a noisy motor but this noise is abnormal
-
i just picked up my 2018 CVO Street Glide and it makes the same exact high pitched ticking noise from the motor
I t occurs at rpms between 2000-and 2500
the dealer said it is normal ,I know it is not!
he said the 2018 117 is a noisy motor but this noise is abnormal
Default response from an HD Service Dept. Pretty soon, when confronted with a sumping engine, they'll tell you they all do that.
-
Seems like the issues with the M8 aren't really going anywhere. Kinda glad I still have my twincam... The sumping really concerns me. Think that has alot to do with most of the problems. :nixweiss:Stuart
-
i just picked up my 2018 CVO Street Glide and it makes the same exact high pitched ticking noise from the motor
I t occurs at rpms between 2000-and 2500
the dealer said it is normal ,I know it is not!
he said the 2018 117 is a noisy motor but this noise is abnormal
Dealer is feeding you a load of BS. M8 is much quieter than the TCs. Stay on top of that service dept.
-
So, I buy the 2018 CVO 117 and have all options I could think of including stage IV. I have the bike 3 days, about 400 miles, and the tappet gets loud. The dealership fixes it and I'm on my way. Still a happy customer. 9,400 miles later, because I ride it, same thing only now I hear things flying around the motor. Then the compression relief valve opens and it sounds like the head blows. I pull off of the 1st exit, having no power, and she dies. The tappet disintegrated! Dealership cracks her open and the tappet won't come out. After further break down, the needle bearings are inside my oil pump meaning they passed through the entire motor. Corporate approves a short block but is hesitant to approve a stage IV kit. I'm looking at the marks on my sleeves, gouges on my pistons, An oil pump with grooves cut into the aluminum from circulating bearings and debris, a tappet that no longer resembles one as the roller has gone through my baby. Then I find out that the computer mapping for the 117 stage four was not available so corporate told the dealer to map it for a 110ci. WTF! I just handed them $52,000 and you deceive me on top of my mechanical problems? Now the dealership is building my M8 rather than the factory.
-
So, I buy the 2018 CVO 117 and have all options I could think of including stage IV. I have the bike 3 days, about 400 miles, and the tappet gets loud. The dealership fixes it and I'm on my way. Still a happy customer. 9,400 miles later, because I ride it, same thing only now I hear things flying around the motor. Then the compression relief valve opens and it sounds like the head blows. I pull off of the 1st exit, having no power, and she dies. The tappet disintegrated! Dealership cracks her open and the tappet won't come out. After further break down, the needle bearings are inside my oil pump meaning they passed through the entire motor. Corporate approves a short block but is hesitant to approve a stage IV kit. I'm looking at the marks on my sleeves, gouges on my pistons, An oil pump with grooves cut into the aluminum from circulating bearings and debris, a tappet that no longer resembles one as the roller has gone through my baby. Then I find out that the computer mapping for the 117 stage four was not available so corporate told the dealer to map it for a 110ci. WTF! I just handed them $52,000 and you deceive me on top of my mechanical problems? Now the dealership is building my M8 rather than the factory.
What is the latest on your saga??
-
What is the latest on your saga??
Another one who hasn't been here for awhile...although it's just since Sep 1 for him. HD might be losing customers faster than they can be born. lol
-
I had to reply to this forum because I also have a 2018 117 inch CVO that is very noisy before I had the stage 4 kit installed and after. The noise is persistent and not getting any better. I have gotten the same answer every time I bring it to be serviced, " That's Normal ". Is there a positive answer to what is making this ticking noise. Did I buy a very expensive piece of engineering screw up.
-
Where are you from Fusion? Maybe we can guide you to a good independent in your area to listen to the motor. Might be the same answer but couldn’t hurt for peace of mind.
-
One of the key reasons I bought the 117 was because of how much quieter than the 110 the 117 was, and how much cooler it ran.
I opted to leave it 100% stock because the bike was going to reside at the dealer for 9 months after purchase and I didn't want anyone monkeying around with it. (Even though it was on display upstairs)
Once I picked the bike up no issues (Thus far) but with stock exhaust I do note a little bit of a tick I did not note when I first bought it.
7300 miles and no major issues other than those Damn boom 2 speakers.
Time will tell I guess.. I'm waiting for it to blow up.. and it will.
:soapbox:
Bike is early production, no issues with sumping yet.
-
2018 CVO RG
6300 MILES
Stag 4 since new Sumped!
Engine oil temperature 340 ! Shut down engine no oil on dipstick!oil showing in exhaust! Loss power!Harley sending engineers to look Boston ma.
Will advise when I get info!!
Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk
-
So my new RG is a ticking machine. From the day I bought it it’s been ticking...sounds like valvetrain to me, but of course the dealer says it’s normal, it’ll quiet down after the 1K service, they all do that, the M8 is inherently noisy, etc.
Bottom line - it’s getting annoying, it’s no worse but it’s no better, either. Just had the 1K done and the tech said it’s normal. I don’t know if I’m just paranoid because of the lifter stories online or if I really need to start pushing to get someone higher up the food chain to give it a listen. Doesn’t seem to be temp related, and it’s most noticeable at around 2,000-2,500 steady cruise or slight acceleration. It quiets down under heavier throttle. It seems a bit noisier than my older 103, but that one had louder pipes and an intake, so maybe I just didn’t notice it?
Anyone else have any noise issues? I’ve told the dealer that if it IS a lifter issue, it’s a helluva lot cheaper and easier to fix now than after the mill grenades.
Thoughts?
Two things to look at, spark plug boot not all the way on one of the 4 plugs causing the spark to jump which makes a TICK, and a loose compression release will also admit a TICK. Harley sent out a bulletin to the dealers on this so called TICK.
Doc
-
Posting this as a FYI in case any of you find this helpful.
I bought a 2019 ultra limited CVO the 1st week of sept,2019. went back to dealer next day after hearing what sounded like marbles in the top end of the engine. Mind you, the bike was running fine. The tech listened to it and said give it til after break in and then let him listen again. Took it in for the first oli chane a week later with 1000 miles on it. He called me next day and said he does think there is a problem. upon tear down and inspection I was told the front piston had been narrower at it's bottom that at top and the noise was the piston slapping cylinder wall on it's way up the cylinder. it took 3 weeks (due to parts shortages) but he replaced both cylinders and pistons. The engine sounds and runs great now. I had him replace header and mufflers. install pro street and smart tuner as well. I'm not "gettin on it" heavily yet because it needs another break in period due to the new top end parts but It's looking like it will be amazing. I love this thing but not very happy with HD corp. This bike went to 2 dealers before i got it. first HD passed it with this problem. At least 2 maybe 3 dealers let it go with the noise and my dealer (which shall remain nameless) didn't want to lend me a bike after selling me a defective $43000 bike. Then I was also told i would be rid of the catalytic converter if i just replaced my mufflers. That made no sense to me but I stupidly believed it. Then they called to say they couldn't drill my header to replace to 12mm bung with the 18"mm because the header would crack around the drilled out hole. Soooooo another $400 out of pocket!!! Then even tho being paid by HD to repair the engine (which included taking header off) they found it neccessary to charge me for installing the new one.
In my oppinion a $43000 bike SHOULD NOT have a single inferior part on it PERIOD!!! I also found the CAT in the original header NOT the muffler where they told me it was!
Moral of the story? Don't believe everything the sales people tell you. They are selling, The technicians know much more accurately.
Happy riding and keep shinny side up ppl.
-
My new CVO RG I bought new July 19th of this year has ticked bad since day 1!!! Dealer of course says it’s normal!! LOL!!! I have owned lots of bikes and know when something definitely does not sound right, also started the transmission- Primary transfer last week too!! Still ask myself sometimes why I handed them almost 45,000 dollars cash for so many issues!!! I have decided to have Hillside do the 128 big bore kit and the SS oil pump and cam plate, screw the warranty!!!! At least my bike will be getting worked on by a known motor guy who I trust and don’t mind spending my money with!!! I will have him check the entire bike out before I get it back.... And I absolutely love my bike when it’s running fine, does everything I need in a motorcycle, but the headache of being unreliable so far... I will keep you posted on what he finds or says about the ticking problem, He has nothing to hide because he doesn’t work for the MOCO..
-
Actionbill & Scotman,
Sorry to hear about both your problems. You’re absolutely correct that this should’ve never happened with the Moco’s flagship bikes. What’s even more frustrating and disappointing is when the service department tries to pawn it off as” normal “. It’s no different when a person brings there car or truck in for service and you get it back “ no fault found “. or could not replicate problem “. Really sad when a person drops that kinda of coin on a bike and gets treated like a piece of $hit. I don’t own an M8 CVO, I picked up a 2012 CVO Street Glide, that was pretty much brand new as the guy who bought it brand new was a exotic car collector, motorcycles weren’t his cup of tea. I’m still nervous about the 110” lifter failures & other issues but so far so good. Got the extended warranty so hopefully if something does happen it’ll be covered. Hope everything works out for both of you and all of the other M8 CVO owners. Cheers 🍻
-
THX JOE, SUCH IS LIFE!
I only really wanted to share the story because someone else might have like symptoms as my new engine did and this may help them get a handle on it. The spouting off a bit was just a bonus. Hahahaha! Venting u know. Good luck with your CVO.
-
What I’ve found was the dealers won’t mess with a little tick or what we think, there has to be failure to be corrected. I get it but sometimes a lil common sense (which isn’t too common) goes a long way. I’m sure there are good dealers out there but from my experience not in my neck of the woods.
good luck