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[PHAZE]

If the plant is on strike, how do they plan to ship CVOs.  I thought that I read somewhere about management building the CVO bikes.  Is that what's going on? 

[sooiee]

Bubba,

What is SPOCK?  (OK, besides the pointy-ear dude on Star Trek

John

John, SPOCK is actualy SPOC.  It stands for Single Point Of Contact.  It's a divison the HQ has for dealers to call.  It's the one place they can go to get all the answers instead of trying to call a million different divisions.  No, it's Not like the SPOCK on Star Trek.     Live Long and Prosper

[KentuckyHarleyDude]

Soiee is right but I was trying to be a little incognito with the spelling ....

Bubba

[TCinVA]

The York Daily Record reported today on their web site that the union and management had planned to meet today, but weather forced a postponement.  The plan to meet Thursday.  No mediator - just union reps and the  MoCo folks.
TC

[RedDevil]

The York Daily Record reported today on their web site that the union and management had planned to meet today, but weather forced a postponement.  The plan to meet Thursday.  No mediator - just union reps and the  MoCo folks.
TC

Maybe someone will break the picket line long enough to ship out your Jester Tony .  I'm being the optomist for you.
Cheers ,
Red

[TCinVA]

Maybe someone will break the picket line long enough to ship out your Jester Tony .  I'm being the optomist for you.
Cheers ,
Red

Thanks, Red.  Haven't checked the YDR today to see if the union/management met as planned.  Maybe they'll settle it soon and I won't be waiting much longer... .  Appreciate your optimism.
Tony

[mr_magoo]

I for one wouldn't want a scab built bike. JMO In a time when they have record profits why do they always want to f**k the little guy that does all the work.

[Twolanerider]

I for one wouldn't want a scab built bike. JMO In a time when they have record profits why do they always want to f**k the little guy that does all the work.

Dave, please note I'm only asking the question here and not suggesting what my own opinion might be one way or the other.  Your statements beg a couple of questions though.

First would be do you buy a bike from Harley Davidson, Inc. or from some subset of it's employees?

Second would be (and this has seemed at the core of much of the discussion here so far) is a pay package offering roughly $40k per year (give or take just a bit) to start plus what is what is pretty decent bennies compared to the rest of the market really "f**k"ing the employees in a market where the average start is just only slightly more than half that?

[Midnight Rider]

The profit margins of a company should have no relationship to what they pay their staff.  Total compensation should have a direct relationship to the prevailing wage for job titles requireing similar skill sets, and NOT just Union jobs should be compared.  Though I have nothing against collective bargaining, when the relationship between skills required to perform essential functions of a job, and pay, becomes skewed to the point of being outside what would be considered normal and appropriate for the geographic area, corrections MUST occur.  The company has a right, and even an obligation to both itself and the community, to make corrections in it's compensation plan, if it is based on sound compensatory factors and marketplace analysis.

This chit ain't f'ing rocket science.  Determining pay scales/ranges is not something difficult to accomplish.  Paying someone an appropriate wage or salary within reasonably established ranges can and should be a fairly objective process.  I have not seen a job description or typical duties and responsibilities for a beginning line worker at HD, but based on my knowledge of both the Trades and sound HRM policy/procedure, I'd bet my next paycheck that 40K a year job, plus an additional cost to the company of 10-15K for benefits, is REALLY good pay.  If the workers at HD wanted to propose a reasonable incentive pay plan, based on measureable factors like quality vs. production vs. profit, etc, etc, paid out every quarter or so, THAT would be a reasonable proposition for pay above and beyond fair and equitable wages.

[RedDevil]

The profit margins of a company should have no relationship to what they pay their staff.  Total compensation should have a direct relationship to the prevailing wage for job titles requireing similar skill sets, and NOT just Union jobs should be compared.  Though I have nothing against collective bargaining, when the relationship between skills required to perform essential functions of a job, and pay, becomes skewed to the point of being outside what would be considered normal and appropriate for the geographic area, corrections MUST occur.  The company has a right, and even an obligation to both itself and the community, to make corrections in it's compensation plan, if it is based on sound compensatory factors and marketplace analysis.
This chit ain't f'ing rocket science.  Determining pay scales/ranges is not something difficult to accomplish.  Paying someone an appropriate wage or salary within reasonably established ranges can and should be a fairly objective process.  I have not seen a job description or typical duties and responsibilities for a beginning line worker at HD, but based on my knowledge of both the Trades and sound HRM policy/procedure, I'd bet my next paycheck that 40K a year job, plus an additional cost to the company of 10-15K for benefits, is REALLY good pay.  If the workers at HD wanted to propose a reasonable incentive pay plan, based on measureable factors like quality vs. production vs. profit, etc, etc, paid out every quarter or so, THAT would be a reasonable proposition for pay above and beyond fair and equitable wages.

Most importantly, they have an obligation to their stockholders, as any publicly-owned company does.   I'm not very familiar with unions, as I've never been in a union, but most jobs that I know of, don't offer full medical benefits without some sort of a portion being paid for by the employee.  Damn, I'd love to have a 40K a year, blue-collar job, and not have to pay a dime towards my medical/dental.  That's about another $5-10K depending on the plan, that you can add to the overall annual salary.  I have to contribute a 1/3 towards my medical plan, and I consider that a good deal.  I'm all for getting what you can get, but if it's beyond the norm for your economic area, then I don't feel too sorry for them.  Most union jobs are higher paying then their non-union counterparts, but why is it, when it comes to auto building, the non-union plants in the states are putting out a much better product than the unionized ones?   What I'm saying, is there's no incentive for them to go above and beyond to put out a quality product.  Salaries and benefits in that industry, as in many others, should be based on performance and quality.  I'll bet that if they did that at Harley, we wouldn't be hearing all these quality issue complaints that we have been.  JM$.02...
Cheers ,
Red

[sooiee]

  Damn, I'd love to have a 40K a year, blue-collar job, and not have to pay a dime towards my medical/dental.  That's about another $5-10K depending on the plan, that you can add to the overall annual salary.     What I'm saying, is there's no incentive for them to go above and beyond to put out a quality product. 
Cheers ,
Red

Yeppers.  Math class.  22/hr x 40 = 880/wk.
880 x 52 weeks = 45760/yr.  This is before bonuses or the manditory overtime or manditory saturdays and this is for a brand new person coming in off the streets.  Could have a college degree?  Could be high school/GED diploma?  Thow in some seniority...once you're in...YOU'RE IN!

Well, while on strike they have to pay for their OWN healthcare.  I wonder if it'll get any of them thinking that paying 60-100 bucks per family plan isn't such a bad thing.  Plus the end of the month is coming...mortgages are due.  Auto loans/bike loans are due....could get tight REAL quick for those living paycheck to paycheck.  They don't get unemployment either because it's THEIR choosing to strike. 

In all honesty, I hope they come to SOME sort of resolution.  It's not a good thing for anyone but I wouldn't be surprised if the MoCo stands their ground.  York is just ONE of many.   

J

[hard10]

...  Most union jobs are higher paying then their non-union counterparts, but why is it, when it comes to auto building, the non-union plants in the states are putting out a much better product than the unionized ones?   ...  JM$.02...
Cheers ,
Red

The first one that comes to mind is BMW. The State of South Carloina is a "right to work" state. You have a right to work for a company, you do not have the right to strike.

[CVOJOE]

York, Pa. (February 16, 2007) - Harley-Davidson reported today that it has reached a tentative labor agreement with representatives of International Association of Machinists and Aerospace Workers (IAM) Local 175 in York. The agreement is subject to membership ratification and a vote is expected to occur the week of Feb. 19. If approved, the agreement would end a strike by Harley-Davidson’s 2,800 unionized employees in York that began February 2.

The Company has not disclosed terms of the proposed agreement or the timing of a possible resumption of motorcycle production in York.