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CVO Technical => Drive Train => Topic started by: 2001CVORG on October 23, 2013, 02:00:36 PM
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Can my bike handle a 6 speed transmission? If so which one should I consider? Have any of you guys installed a 6 speed in your 2001 RGs? Did you have any problems with lack of power? Also What cams did the 2001 RGSE come with? Is worth upgrading them with better cams or did it already come with the best cams available? I’m just curious if there is any worth while upgrades I could do to my bike to help its performance but not break the break.
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Others might know more, but I believe your bike came with an SE95" kit with.203 cams. A 6 speed is a nice addition, but I have heard that 95" is pushing the limits of use-ability. Some say the 6 speed is better suited for the 103 on up.
There are a lot of things you can do to your bike to bring up HP numbers. Some of the builders here can tell you a good combination of cams and heads. Just know that your bike has the older Magnetti Marelli fuel injection. The dual throated throttle body has some build limitations.
As for 6 speeds, I'm running the Baker DD6 and love it!
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Mark is right on the engine and cam. The engine's power curve versus the gear ratio on that bike does scream for one more gear. The Screaming Eagle and Baker gear sets are the most commonly knownand while some have religious convictions towards one or the other personally to me either just work. The Screaming Eagle set will require an alteration to the case that is permanent and from which you can't go back.
There are aftermarket options besides Baker that are considerably less expensive. Personally I'm not a fan as they sometimes require other alterations and I've seen them fail more often than I've seen the Baker or screaming eagle gear sets fail. Though I've seen failures in both the Baker and SE sets also.
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I upgraded to the DD6 that was installed by the local dealer. I've had a few issues, some of them the dealers fault, and some were Bakers, but while Baker stood behind the repair, the cost to bring the bike to another place to sort it out, remove and ship the trans and reinstall correctly, ended up costing more than the original cost of the install. I've probably got the only $5K 6 speed trans on the planet. My bike was layed up almost all summer with this nightmare.
Nope, if I had a bike with the old 5 spd, I'd go with a Harley upgrade, so you don't fall into the finger point trap, and have to deal shipping, backlogs, and all that nonsense.
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It all depends where you do your riding and who you ride with. I now have a 2011 Streetglide with the 6-Speed and I can say that I hate it for back road riding. Works great out on the interstate.
I had a 2003 Deuce with the 5-Speed and it worked significantly better on back roads and such. Sure, I thought I always needed another gear out on the interstate but it never put any damper on that. Heck, I rode for, Chicago to St. Louis at 80-85 mph with 5 gears and the bike ran just fine.
If somebody made a 5-Speed tranny with a TRUE overdrive 6th gear then I'm all in. For now, dropping an extra 300 rpm with 6 gears is more of a pain then wanting anther gear with a 5-Speed.
Rent a bike with a 6-Speed and the spend a day riding behind your buddies with a 5-Speed and you'll quickly understand my point.
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Rent a bike with a 6-Speed and the spend a day riding behind your buddies with a 5-Speed and you'll quickly understand my point.
The current six speed bikes he could rent won't tell him a thing about his 2001 95" Road Glide. Different engine with the torque curve in a different area in a bike with a different gear ratio. Losing 300-ish RPM and its resultant exhaust note for hour after hour highway cruising on those old bikes makes a real difference in how you feel at the end of the day. Has nothing to do with gas mileage nor any of the other nonsense that gets bandied about as a reason to go to a six speed. Just that the gear ratio on those bikes makes it a more pleasant ride.
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I had a 2000 Rk with the 95 kit and SE heads and 203 cams. Great trailer puller but I agree with Twolane it screamed for another gear a sixth gear would have been perfect especially where the speed limits are higher.
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I do not do a lot of interstate driving but I live in a small town in the middle of no where with long straight road/highways. When Im by myself or riding with my brother we cruise along at a nice comfortable speed that is enjoyable and I feel like doesn’t put a lot of unnecessary stress on my bike. This makes up about 75% of my everyday riding. The other 25% is what I’m worried about. When I get with my buddies with their newer bikes they drive a lot faster and we do a lot more interstate driving. Its during those times that I feel like I need that 6th gear because the bike seems to get wound out you might say. My intent is not to so much keep up with them cause I keep up with them just fine with my 5 speed. I just do not want to put a lot of undue stress on my bike. This bike has to last me awhile and I want to do everything I can to do make sure that happens.
After reading your guys advice it sounds like I might be better off just enjoying my 5 speed and buying a GPS so I can catch up to them guys later :D
Just an after thought. I have a 2005 Sportster w/1250 conversion. I swapped the out the pulley on it with a 30t and it made it much more enjoyable to ride at higher speeds. Could this be an option for my 2001 RG?
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You are not hurting it......hurting it will be when you drop the rpm's below 2250 or so....then you might as well take a sledge hammer to your crank
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I've been running the S/E 6-speed for 4 years behind an overachieving 103 in my Night Train. Couldn't be happier with it. Everyone I know who had a Baker has ended up pulling it out, as (in the admittedly small sample of people I personally know) they've all failed.
As mentioned, the only thing the S/E 6-speed and the CruiseDrive 6-speed have in common is 6 gears.
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The old SE 6 speed trans (or gear set) was totally different than the current Harley 6 speed, apples to oranges. The old version still had a 1:1 trans ratio in 5th and an overdrive ratio in 6th. For normal riding you could ride in 5th just like with the stock 5 speed and get the same results you get with that stock 5 speed. For those occasions when you want to drone down the superslab, then click it into 6th.
I don't know if those transmissions or gear sets are still available, but if they are and you really think you need a 6 speed then that's the one I'd recommend. Baker also made a similar 6 speed (not the DD6), but once again I'm not sure if it's still available. It was more expensive, but Baker also makes a better product than Harley does.
Jerry
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The old SE 6 speed trans (or gear set) was totally different than the current Harley 6 speed, apples to oranges. The old version still had a 1:1 trans ratio in 5th and an overdrive ratio in 6th. For normal riding you could ride in 5th just like with the stock 5 speed and get the same results you get with that stock 5 speed. For those occasions when you want to drone down the superslab, then click it into 6th.
I don't know if those transmissions or gear sets are still available, but if they are and you really think you need a 6 speed then that's the one I'd recommend. Baker also made a similar 6 speed (not the DD6), but once again I'm not sure if it's still available. It was more expensive, but Baker also makes a better product than Harley does.
Jerry
It's still available. For 2001 the gear set part number is 33102-03A.
I'm not sure this is a place where the aftermarket is truly better than the MoCo product either Jerry. This is purely anecdotal to my own experience of course. But of the 12 bikes I know of that I've had personal contact with using Baker gears or transmissions three have failed in some way requiring work from Baker. One was a catastrophic failure and one was a piece I just learned of two days ago. Of nine bikes (I can think of) with SE gear sets there's been one catastrophic failure and one more that needed repair short of that.
Neither are great batting averages. Though they do seem more robust than the Ultima or other aftermarket sets I don't get the feeling either are anywhere near bulletproof. Nor does one seem significantly better than the other.
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Mine is at Baker right now. Lost 4th gear and would come out of first when moderate to heavy power was applied.
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I have a Rivera-Primo 6 speed Over Drive gear set with over 35,000 miles without a single problem. Flash Motor Works was impressed with the gearset. He prefers them over the S.E. gearset because they are stronger. He has installed several with no issues. I just ordered one for my son's SoftTail. I have a S&S V111 with116HP@560rpm/123tq@3800 in my FXR4 CVO. My Bike has the 5 gear as 3.26 and 6th as 2.85 I think. It is fast 1st through 5th and 6th on the open highway. Done 140mph at 5400 rpm!
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I have a 2000 SERG and am very happy with the five speed. Rented a 2012 RG Ultra 103 with a six speed and the only time it was useful was 75+ mph. I don't like to lug my motor and have no trouble at 80 mph all day. If your friends ride faster than that I would just let them go.
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My main reason for going to a six speed was that I did not like the stock ratios. At 65 my 5 speed was revining in 4th or chugging in 5th. I changed my transmission pulley from 32 to 30 and rear pulley from 65 to 68 then installed the over drive 6 speed. My stock 5 speed was geared tall. My new 6 speed final ratio is slightly more than stock but have more gears to pick from when riding under 70. It is much more enjoyable. When at lower speeds. My favorite speeds are between 65 to 80 MPH. I live close to Texas and the speed limit is 75 on lots of the roads.
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Don't know if it is valid to the OP, but when I bought my Baker DD6 I had a choice of 1st gears. Useful if I was planning on a trailer.
Besides the 1st gear option, 3 different comp sprockets are available. In the simplest terms they offered the following rpm reductions when compared to a stock 5 speed.
Theses are approximate
At 70 mph - 400 rpm drop (standard sprocket)
At 70 mph - 200 rpm drop (1 tooth under)
At 70 mph - 0 rpm drop (2 teeth under)
I opted for the standard 1st gear and sprocket.
After a year of riding I swapped the sprocket for the 1 under to tailor the trans range more to my riding style.
I did have some issues with the way my trans shifted. I sent it back under warranty this year and Baker rebuilt it and supplied everything I needed except lube to reinstall.
Very happy with it now.
Would I do it again? Even if I could still buy the kit for 2K delivered I doubt i would go through the trouble again. I would just buy a newer bike with the 6 speed.
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My gear set installation was 500 bucks. Gearset was 1000. That's a whole lot cheaper than a new bike.
It took a lot of work and money to get my bike the way I like it. This is my last bike. Its perfect. When I get old I will get a trike kit.
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'Put the SE 6sp gearset in the '01 Switchblade when we stroked it to 103, I was impressed with the way it shifted ~ smooth & very quiet. We put the underdrive comp in (wanted acceleration through the gears) so comparable rpm / mph between the '01 Switchblade and the '05 SEEG (stock 5sp) the '01 is turning about 300rpm more in 6th than the '05 is turning in 5th at say, 70mph.
I rode my friends 113 Skunk with the DD7 and I really want a DD7, but don't have $3k burning a hole in my pocket for the '09 SERG right now