Topic: Immigrant Strike (Read 12111 times)

The Mysterious Q! · « **on:** May 01, 2006, 01:51:24 PM »

Well let me inform you on how it is in my neck of the woods today. Well it started by my mason informing me that of his 25 man crew only 3 showed up to work today. I have a deadline on the job he's doing for me and this doesn't help. As I drove to get my coffee I passed several jobsites which are always bustling with workers looking abandoned. No machines running, no stone walls being built and no framers framing. When I got to the deli I noticed it was rather empty so I asked the owner "How's business today?" to which she replied "I have only rang out 23 dollars so far today." This is in a deli that usually has lines out the door and probably does $5000.00 a day in sales. So I guess the impact of this work stoppage or strike has proved it's point to me. It will cripple the trades around here and the value of the work now will drastically increase as demand for labor will increase due to a shortage in manpower. If the price of building goes up that means there are less people that will be able to afford the work. That really won't hold true to a point here being that I work in one of the richest areas of the country but the trickle down effect will sure be felt everyelse. I don't claim to have the answers but I do know we have to figure out something favorable for both sides or we are doomed for sure. The only question I raise with any political ramifications is that if an illegal uses a phonty social security number and his employewr pays taxes toward that number, what happens to the monies collected when the govt. finds out that its a bogus number or it doesn't match the name.It seems to go into the governmental abyss I guess. Well this is my .02. Later,Q

MYCVO · « **Reply #1 on:** May 01, 2006, 02:20:29 PM »

[smiley=balloon.gif] [smiley=balloon2.gif] [smiley=balloon3.gif] [size=16]HAPPY ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS DAY EVERYBODY !!! [/size] [smiley=balloon3.gif] [smiley=balloon2.gif] [smiley=balloon.gif] [smiley=2vrolijk_09.gif] [smiley=drink.gif]

Oh I thought it was a party [smiley=nixweiss.gif] my bad-- kinda goes along with the rest of this strange azz bullchit

grc · « **Reply #2 on:** May 01, 2006, 02:52:21 PM »

Well, like the dumbass I am, I forgot that I am descended from immigrants and could have blown off work today. Chit!

Oh well, some of us have to work to pay the taxes for the extra police, trash pickup, etc.

Jerry

The Mysterious Q! · « **Reply #3 on:** May 01, 2006, 03:27:08 PM »

My pops is off the boat and mom is 2nd generation so I guess i should have stayed home and rode its gorgeous out too

SPIDERMAN · « **Reply #4 on:** May 01, 2006, 04:06:20 PM »

Unless your name is Pochahontas or Cohise, you're descended from immigrants. Thing is our ancestors were LEGAL. Sorry to hear about your job site Big D, sounds like you got more Mex workers to deal with than I do and I'm 20 miles from the border. S'anyway, I'm boycotting everything owned and run by Mexicans for the entire month of May and urging everyone else to do the same.

MYCVO · « **Reply #5 on:** May 01, 2006, 04:37:00 PM »

Quote

Unless your name is Pochahontas or Cohise, you're descended from immigrants. Thing is our ancestors were LEGAL. Sorry to hear about your job site Big D, sounds like you got more Mex workers to deal with than I do and I'm 20 miles from the border. S'anyway, I'm boycotting everything owned and run by Mexicans for the entire month of May and urging everyone else to do the same.

There you go Big B-- We'll have to do the same to Dunkin Donuts up here!!

arcticdude · « **Reply #6 on:** May 01, 2006, 04:53:09 PM »

That's not a bad idea- boycott the 5th of May celebrations at every mexican restaurant in the country. Just maybe, they'll realize that without OUR money, they should go back to their own country. The whole situations has only made me realize that I have no desire to travel into Mexico for any reason. Since I've ridden to Alaska, I'd toyed with riding to the equator. It ain't happening now. My money stays home. period.

EZRIDN · « **Reply #7 on:** May 01, 2006, 05:15:31 PM »

I wouldn't worry too much...they'll all be back at work soon.
Where else are the illegals going to find a gig as good as they've got?
They sure as hell aren't going to head back South for work.

Though not politically correct...take out your temporary frustrations here:
http://nerdnirvana.org/g4m3s/borderpatrol.htm

The Mysterious Q! · « **Reply #8 on:** May 01, 2006, 05:45:19 PM »

Quote

There you go Big B-- We'll have to do the same to Dunkin Donuts up here!!

Ain't that the truth.

WaSEEG · « **Reply #9 on:** May 01, 2006, 07:22:53 PM »

I had a 4:30 that my receptionist called to confirm. She was advised that they wouldn't be there as they were going to the local rally. I guess that's more important than the state threatening to take away their kids. They wanted to re-schedule to a more convenient time. I declined because they hadn't bothered to call and it was to late to fill that slot. Oh well!

Dan

SPIDERMAN · « **Reply #10 on:** May 01, 2006, 08:39:29 PM »

This thread should have been titled Illegal Immigrant stike but be that as it may, sure was nice coming home on the SoCal freeways and only dealing with 1/2 the normal traffic. Maybe they can stay home every day. Actually, maybe they can just Go Home

EAGLE1 · « **Reply #11 on:** May 02, 2006, 12:04:22 AM »

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[highlight]I'm boycotting everything owned and run by Mexicans for the entire month of May and urging everyone else to do the same.[/highlight]

you got the right idea there spider, but why stop at a month, and boycott all products
from mexico, that means no shots of tequila or Mescal, and definitely no corona's to wash down the salsa and chips, it just piss water anyway. Im mowing my own lawn from now on, and i'll even bus my own dishes next time i eat out at my favorite American Resturant!

Quote

This thread should have been titled Illegal Immigrant stike but be that as it may, sure was nice coming home on the SoCal freeways and only dealing with 1/2 the normal traffic. Maybe they can stay home every day. Actually, maybe they can just Go Home

yea, but before they go, lets have them help build this border wall for cheap

DCFIREMANN · « **Reply #12 on:** May 02, 2006, 07:19:11 AM »

Quote

yea, but before they go, lets have them help build this border wall for cheap

For cheap?

? Bull%hit how about build it for free!!!!!! I think we have given them enough. No I meant THE LIBERALS have given them enough!!!!!!

SEND THEM ALL HOME!!!!! I'll do my own work around the house. (hell I do anyway)

Be Safe

THE DAWG

The Mysterious Q! · « **Reply #13 on:** May 02, 2006, 10:03:40 AM »

Well its Tuesday and all the Amigo's are back to work doing the same chit they were doing on Saturday.Did what they tried to do work I guess we'll have to see on that one.

EZRIDN · « **Reply #14 on:** May 02, 2006, 10:15:18 AM »

Quote

Well its Tuesday and all the Amigo's are back to work doing the same chit they were doing on Saturday.Did what they tried to do work I guess we'll have to see on that one.

Like I said earlier...
[highlight]I wouldn't worry too much...they'll all be back at work soon.
Where else are the illegals going to find a gig as good as they've got?
They sure as hell aren't going to head back South for work. [/highlight]

arcticdude · « **Reply #15 on:** May 02, 2006, 10:27:05 AM »

I always thought that being illegal meant you didn't have any rights??!?!!? I think we missed a good round up opportunity here, folks. Extreme in my thinking, maybe. But, when people come into the country legally I have no problems with that. When they come into the country illegally- and I don't care WHERE they came from- they need to get the hell out. Unfortunately we're not the only country with these problems. There was a large "silent" majority of Germans back in the late 80's that had issues with the Turks that were coming into the country. It started with the Turks taking only the crap jobs, living 10 to a house. Soon, there were a few becoming business owners and being able to buy a good house ( a MAJOR accomplishment in Germany at the time) and so on. The question then becomes- As voters, what are we going to do about it?

I can't say as that I've got a good answer, yet.

BK · « **Reply #16 on:** May 02, 2006, 10:52:21 AM »

Amnesty is not the way to go. It should be a felony and the employers supporting it be charged heavily. That is just my point of view.

arcticdude · « **Reply #17 on:** May 02, 2006, 10:56:54 AM »

I'll second that. College shouldn't be a "get out of jail" card either.

MYCVO · « **Reply #18 on:** May 02, 2006, 11:04:08 AM »

Quote

Amnesty is not the way to go. It should be a felony and the employers supporting it be charged heavily. That is just my point of view.

INDEED !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

seultrarider · « **Reply #19 on:** May 02, 2006, 11:08:49 AM »

No where but in America can illegal persons protest for rights....WOW [smiley=nixweiss.gif]! NO AMNESTY, it did not work in 1986!

The Mysterious Q! · « **Reply #20 on:** May 02, 2006, 11:17:48 AM »

Obviously we can sit here and come up with all good reasons for why itss wrong but lets try to figure out how to rectify the problem and the trickle down effects it will have on certain industries.I for one think we should clamp down on illegals even though it would be like shooting myself in the foot.My father came here and went through the proper channels to become a citizen so why shouldn't everyone else.I think it will get worse before it gets better.

hogasm · « **Reply #21 on:** May 02, 2006, 11:24:13 AM »

I was audited by the IRS 2 years ago. In a conversation with Mr. IRS he informed me that in his jurrisdiction 70% of all workers will receive a 1099 at the end of the year. This is only 1 county in NC. He said probably 20% of those 1099 were sent to a false social security number, and The IRS does not have the man power to track down those using false numbers.
It is a shame that a law abiding citizen like myself

, that tries to be honest with the IRS, has to go through the scrutiny that I endured, when they should be going after the ones with the false numbers. We as buisness owners are informed by the IRS when a 1099 comes back with a false social security number. It is our responsibility th turn in those who are using these numbers.
I can tell you that when someone mentions "IMMIGRATION" in these parts, it becomes a ghost town. There were a few buisnesses that told their imployees if they did not show up for work yesterday then they would not have a job today. My feelings are GOOD FOR THEM!
Yes most of us all are decendents of immigrants, LEGAL IMMIGRANTS, from people who earned their citizenship.
Sorry to ramble on. This only touches the tip of the iceburg with me.

grc · « **Reply #22 on:** May 02, 2006, 11:26:25 AM »

Quote

Amnesty is not the way to go. It should be a felony and the employers supporting it be charged heavily. That is just my point of view.

I fully agree. If the American economy just can't operate without them, then set up a regulated guest worker system, and stop rewarding law breakers. Throw them in jail and deport them, and maybe the folks in Mexico will think twice about entering illegally.

Jerry

MYCVO · « **Reply #23 on:** May 02, 2006, 11:34:31 AM »

And to tell you the truth brothers I for one I'm kinda broke right now from paying all the daily school problems and taxes from every angle, to be handing more of my tax dollar to people that sneak into this country in the dark, hidden away in a trunk, only to emerge [highlight]as what [/highlight]our [highlight]equals[/highlight] in rights that we had to go through all of what we did to get them!!
If you want to be here do it the right way!!
The following is for those who sneak in not those who are here with approval!!
Here's a thought, --Just came across the border did you? You must be tired from that long ride in the trunk! Let me feed you, and when your done, here's a nice house you can have free of charge, and when you want to start work just pick any profession you want.. presto.. here's your licence to do it..NO NO you don't need to go through the classes that our born and raised citizens had to!! your our special guests!! BTW here's a F/C drivers licences as well.. again don't worry about the classes -- your special!! My own children are having a tough time getting their dreams started-but hey who gives a good rats chit about them, they've had it easy all this time living off the fat of the land so to speak ( you know the fat lazy Americans that they think were are) cause who's going to do the work they do?? WTF is that thinking!!!! But know we have to say-Well your here now, I guess well have to just make room for you, and maybe our kids won't mind giving up their possible jobs that they were going to do, to make it through the college that you folks don't need to go through. And then on top of that we now have to give you people medical and dental as well I'm sure!!
Is there no end to what we have to put up with??
1 more thought here-- so when this blessed day that you think may come, happens-
Will you still be doing this work that us FAT, LAZY AMERICANS won't do - for the same pay? Or are you then going to demand that you get the MINIMUM wages that we need?

ultrafxr · « **Reply #24 on:** May 02, 2006, 12:18:04 PM »

Yep, unless Native American, we're all descended from immigrants - immigrants who came here to become AMERICANS, speak English, pay their own way and have their allegiance HERE not back home. I heard Dr. Laura on the way in today. She suggested that if their government is so bad and can't provide a decent economy that they have a little revolution and get their chit together. Then they won't need to come here for all the goodies us hardworking taxpayers provide them thanks to our noble, goodhearted, spineless politicians. I'm all for anyone who want to come here leagally and assimilate into our culture to do so. But many of these folks have no desire to do that. They're here for the goodies but their heart is back home. When we are disrespected like this I just get p o'd. There, I feel better now.

DCFIREMANN · « **Reply #25 on:** May 02, 2006, 12:37:30 PM »

Quote

Yep, unless Native American, we're all descended from immigrants - immigrants who came here to become AMERICANS, speak English, pay their own way and have their allegiance HERE not back home. I heard Dr. Laura on the way in today. She suggested that if their government is so bad and can't provide a decent economy that they have a little revolution and get their chit together. Then they won't need to come here for all the goodies us hardworking taxpayers provide them thanks to our noble, goodhearted, spineless politicians. I'm all for anyone who want to come here leagally and assimilate into our culture to do so. But many of these folks have no desire to do that. They're here for the goodies but their heart is back home. When we are disrespected like this I just get p o'd. There, I feel better now.

SPINELESS POLITICIANS?

I could not have said it any better. Why are they trying to help them anyway?

?? THEY CAN'T VOTE!!!!! Send them back home. Our economy will make the adjustment. The rich business owners are the ones that will suffer and they should!

Be Safe

THE DAWG

MYCVO · « **Reply #26 on:** May 02, 2006, 01:22:00 PM »

Quote

SPINELESS POLITICIANS? I could not have said it any better. Why are they trying to help them anyway??? THEY CAN'T VOTE!!!!! Send them back home. Our economy will make the adjustment. [highlight]The rich business owners are the ones that will suffer and they should![/highlight]
Be Safe

THE DAWG

Got that chit straight!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

hd-dude · « **Reply #27 on:** May 02, 2006, 01:57:24 PM »

This whole thing really makes my blood boil. I am not against immigration, I am all for doing it legally. As others have said unless your an American Indian we are all immigrants.

All are welcome here since the founding of this great country. Come here legally, learn the language, work, pay taxes and live long and prosper. Those who do not want to do it this way should get the F*$K out!

This item and the Anthem being sung in Spanish really sucks. I can't believe the direction that this country is going.

The Mysterious Q! · « **Reply #28 on:** May 02, 2006, 02:03:51 PM »

I agree with you Dude.And beleive it or not most european countries teach english mandatory in their curriculum.I think immigrants should try to learn the language and we shouldn't baby them by making everything"multi-lingual"Learn it or don't function in every day society.

DCFIREMANN · « **Reply #29 on:** May 02, 2006, 02:05:16 PM »

Quote

This whole thing really makes my blood boil. I am not against immigration, I am all for doing it legally. As others have said unless your an American Indian we are all immigrants.

All are welcome here since the founding of this great country. Come here legally, learn the language, work, pay taxes and live long and prosper. Those who do not want to do it this way should get the F*$K out!

This item and the Anthem being sung in Spanish really sucks. I can't believe the direction that this country is going.

You can blame it on the political system. The rich business owners are padding the pockets of this countrys politicians. I don't trust any of them period!!!!

Be Safe

THE DAWG

hd-dude · « **Reply #30 on:** May 02, 2006, 02:44:56 PM »

Quote

I agree with you Dude.And beleive it or not most european countries teach english mandatory in their curriculum.I think immigrants should try to learn the language and we shouldn't baby them by making everything"multi-lingual"Learn it or don't function in every day society.

I do not know how it is in other states but here in CA you can take your driving test in just about every language out there. Are the road signs printed in all these languages? I think not. I also am getting more and more advertisements in Spanish for the major chain stores, billboards are also popping up in Spanish. THIS IS AMERICA!!!!! English is the language. Why do we keep catering to this kind of BS? I know the answer, MONEY. Its a shame

Twolanerider · « **Reply #31 on:** May 02, 2006, 03:18:58 PM »

Quote

Its a shame

Oh bullchit; we're just lazy. For decades for the rest of the world to function it had to be multilingual. English and whatever for business and French and whatever for diplomacy and politics. English has supplanted French for diplomacy and politics now too. English is the predominant international language. But everyone who wants to be functional (in a business sense) needs it and whatever else they need to work locally.

We've been spoiled. Since we already had English in our pockets everyone had to come to us (linguistically speaking). Now it's not that easy anymore. But rather than being the Americans of generations before that adapted to the challenges of the day and ran over them we whine because those who slog through their own language and at least some English make it harder on the rest of us who only have shown the initiative or exercised the intelligence to slog through our own single language.

It's not about immigrants (illegal or otherwise) having no English skills. Immigrants today have a significantly higher statitical probability of having some basic English skills than did immigrants before. That's obvious as the language is now broadcast all over the world in various media so everyone but the most remote at least hear it in the background all the time. It's about us complaining because there's now a competetive sector of the society and economy we're too lazy to compete with. So we complain that they won't come to us (again, linguistically speaking) because it's just oh so difficult to make the effort to compete with them on their own terms.

byronrb · « **Reply #32 on:** May 02, 2006, 03:55:12 PM »

All this "class envy" bullchit I'm reading is really disheartening. I'm a farmer with probably quite a few wetbacks. I say probably, because they have forged docs. Am i supposed to investigate each worker. Also, almost everybody is well over minimum wage and NOBODY under it. I think a guestworker program is the way to go. Americans may be willing to do a lot of jobs but farmwork isn't one of them.

BK · « **Reply #33 on:** May 02, 2006, 04:10:26 PM »

Quote

You can blame it on the political system. The rich business owners are padding the pockets of this countrys politicians. I don't trust any of them period!!!!

Be Safe

THE DAWG

I got to agree with you DAWG [smiley=xyxthumbs.gif]

Twolanerider · « **Reply #34 on:** May 02, 2006, 07:51:53 PM »

Quote

All this "class envy" bullchit I'm reading is really disheartening.

Amen Byron. We're starting to sound like the French whining because people won't speak our language and whining because people won't do what we want them to just because we think they should. And we know how long it's been since France has been a true great power. Hell, they can't even do what's in their own best interest right now when they know it's in their own best interest.

When Sputnik went up our students learned math and the sciences. In WWII we learned types of warfare on a global scale barely imagined in the war colleges before that time. Between the two we mastered modern capitalism and brought the world to its table. We took the industrial revolution away from Europe, made it our own, and our still exporting the benefit of it. We did what the British had done to adversaries for centuries, when faced with challenges or challengers we rolled over them or dodged and dived and eventually assimilated them. We're America; resistance should in the end game still be futile. It used to be easier than it is now; that's the only difference.

That that prior ease lasted so long changed us a bit along the way. It wasn't easy to be the nation that elevated itself in the space of less than one century from a debtor nation to the world with no real influence to speak of to having been the broker of one world war, the winner of two others and the victor or better survivor of any number and type of skirmishes in between.

That it got easier is something we're suffering the fate of now. We've gotten lazy. So rather than boning up, competing and rolling on to yet another successful assimilation of peoples and strengths in to American culture we whine.

New Hampshire's license plate doesn't say "Live Free or Whine." So how about we just quit our bitching and get on with it? If we don't start doing that relatively soon the 21st century will most assuredly not be another American Century.

We start with tremendous advantages simply being Americans at this place in history. If another group of people can inculcate this culture and through something as simple as annoying us by speaking Spanish really in some way diminish the American culture than, quite frankly, we deserve it. You don't blame the victors for winning. You blame the losers for letting them do it. Actually, that's not true. There is always one group that blames the winners. It's the losers when they whine about what was done to them.

SPIDERMAN · « **Reply #35 on:** May 03, 2006, 01:43:02 PM »

To me, there is no class envy or predjudice toward anyone's ethnicity. It is the difference between Legal and Illegal. In my view of America anyone of any national origin is welcome to come to America and become a citizen of our country. Once he has done that I do not begrudge him the language he speaks, the traditions of his native country he seeks to preserve nor any job he is willing to work to be qualified for, apply and be chosen. I do begrudge anyone who operates outside of this. I begrudge the guest workers, I begrudge the resident aliens, I begrudge the illegals. One of the reasons I begrudge the illegals so much is because I come from a generation exposed to a military draft. Were such a draft reinstated, these people would not be exposed to it. Also, I believe that aprx 1% of our legal population volunteers for military service. The media says there are 12 million illegals in the country. If 1% of them were in our military that would be 120,000. Maybe some of our guys doing two and three tours of Iraq could come home and we could still try to end that mess over there without bailing out completely. Lastly and this is really galling is taxes. Illegals do not pay taxes yet they are a drain on our social service, our hospitals, our schools. everything you and I pay for. This is why I am so anti Illegal. Not because I hate Mexicans, or Asians, or any other ethnic group, but because I believe we are a nation of laws. There have been times in my life where I disregarded or blatantly broke some of those laws. I might have even done so with my middle finger pointed at those who make and enforce the law. BUT and this is the big thing. There was never a time when I felt that I should not be held accountable for my actions. At the end of the day, the illegals do not want to be held accountable for their actions. In my view of life that is dispicable.

grc · « **Reply #36 on:** May 03, 2006, 02:00:32 PM »

FYI

excerpt from: http://www.uscis.gov/graphics/services/natz/index.htm

Welcome to the naturalization home page. Naturalization is the process by which [highlight]U.S. citizenship is conferred upon a foreign citizen or national after he or she fulfills the requirements established by Congress in the Immigration and Nationality Act (INA). The general requirements for administrative naturalization include[/highlight]:

-a period of continuous residence and physical presence in the United States;
-residence in a particular USCIS District prior to filing;
-an ability to read, write, and speak English;
-a knowledge and understanding of U.S. history and government;
-good moral character;
-attachment to the principles of the U.S. Constitution; and,
-favorable disposition toward the United States.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Pretty straightforward, as best I can see. Of course, breaking Federal law probably blows you out on the "good moral character" part.

Jerry
[highlight][/highlight]

WaSEEG · « **Reply #37 on:** May 03, 2006, 08:52:49 PM »

The problem is twofold: 1) the 12 million (estimated) illegals currently in the country and 2) our relatively porous borders. With regard to the 12 million here does any one realistically think we have either the national will or the resources to round these folks up and send them off to wherever they came from. I seriously doubt it. We had an amnesty program a few years back. Toward what end? We didn't seal the borders and the problem continued to escalate. If we don't do something about making it more difficult to get into this country the numbers will continue to rise. Of course that gets expensive and where will the money come from. I don't believe merely making it illegal to enter this country w/o a visa or papers is sufficient. You have to stop the influx at the border. I can't think of any reason why the most powerful nation on earth can't do this except that it's not a priority. The 12 million currently here are likely to stay. However, we don't have to keep repeating the cycle.

Dan

grc · « **Reply #38 on:** May 03, 2006, 10:11:35 PM »

FYI

According to one of the national news reports, illegals now comprise 5% of the labor force in this country.

Jerry

SPIDERMAN · « **Reply #39 on:** May 04, 2006, 01:20:13 PM »

Quote

FYI

According to one of the national news reports, illegals now comprise 5% of the labor force in this country.

Jerry

And they pay NO taxes and serve NO military service To any of you for whom these people are working, it is a tough world and I understand the pressure to compete. All I would ask is that you insist on a SS card and that you deduct income taxes and SS taxes from their checks. At least that way, they are paying their own freight and the people in your area who do pay taxes are not subsidising your business by paying for social services for your illegal workers.

byronrb · « **Reply #40 on:** May 04, 2006, 01:35:50 PM »

Quote

And they pay NO taxes and serve NO military service To any of you for whom these people are working, it is a tough world and I understand the pressure to compete. All I would ask is that you insist on a SS card and that you deduct income taxes and SS taxes from their checks. At least that way, they are paying their own freight and the people in your area who do pay taxes are not subsidising your business by paying for social services for your illegal workers.

We, and every other employer that I know, do get a copy of their SS card, and a copy of their ID card, and DO deduct income taxes from their checks ..... We are REQUIRED to do these by law.

grc · « **Reply #41 on:** May 04, 2006, 01:41:12 PM »

I wasn't aware that an illegal immigrant could get a Social Security card. Don't tell me my knee-jerk government is doing that now. Damn, does that mean I get to pay for their retirement too?

??

Jerry

Twolanerider · « **Reply #42 on:** May 04, 2006, 02:05:17 PM »

Quote

I wasn't aware that an illegal immigrant could get a Social Security card. Don't tell me my knee-jerk government is doing that now. Damn, does that mean I get to pay for their retirement too???

Jerry

You ask for one anyway Jerry. A prospective employee who is illegal will either offer nothing (in which case he's not supposed to be hired) or he'll offer phony papers. If he offers phonies than you make all the standard deductions, the illegal employee never makes a tax claim, and "his" tax payments stay in the US Treasury or SS trust fund.

SPIDERMAN · « **Reply #43 on:** May 04, 2006, 02:09:31 PM »

Don,
So what your saying sounds like that our own government perpetuates this fraud because it nets them money ? Meanwhile these illegals that from what I hear work for far less than the prevailing wage drive down wages for legal citizens. Recent government reports indicate that actual wages have fallen by 2 -5% in the food service, construction and food processing industries. Yet real estate is one of the best hedges against inflation in our current economy and food and restraunt prices are certainly not going down. Costs are down, prices are up. Who's gettin fat ?

arcticdude · « **Reply #44 on:** May 04, 2006, 02:19:31 PM »

To some degree that's a correct observation, Spiderman. TWO (2) years ago, I filed a W2 for an employee with an incorrect #. I'm just now getting a letter about it. Turns out it was nothing more than a simple transcription error on my part. But if you're dealing with migrants and it takes 2 years to get a response, how are you going to track them down?? Many employers may not realize the SSA has a website that does allow for fairly quick # verification. But how many have the time/energy to check it?? Right or wrong on their part. I whole heartedly agree with your prior statements. If you're in this country, you need to pay the taxes, be eligible to do the time and be able to speak the language; otherwise you don't get ANY services! There needs to be some accountability for the employer to verify a SS#. I'm not sure the aforementioned website is fast enough to make it a viable option.

Twolanerider · « **Reply #45 on:** May 04, 2006, 02:21:43 PM »

Quote

Don,
So what your saying sound like that our own government perpetuates this fraud because it nets them money ?

Brian,
Assuming this hypothetical illegal worker is supplying the Social Security number that he's supposed to supply to get on someone's employment roll that's the way it would work out. Obviously if the person is in some way self-employed or a private contractor he'd be outside of normal payroll deductions from an employer. There are a very few other types of hire that don't require withholding and deductions to be done as well. All that notwithstanding, however, most hires require a SS#. If there's one given it's just a case of connecting the obvious dots:

1) Supply SS #
2) Have the various taxes withheld
3) File a tax return
4) Get any overpayments back
5) Make various other claims against the Treasury or SS Trust fund as your circumstances might warrant

So if you're hired and supply a fake SS#, and if your employer is not also crooked, the first two are happening. If you never file a tax return that money withheld stays with the state and Federal treasuries. Don't get me wrong; it's not clear profit. Other governmental expenses are incurred by way of costs via emergency room health care, certain welfare programs, etc etc etc. But an illegal is often avoiding as much of a paper trail as possible. So their taxed deductions often just go to the treasury without any tax refund being requested and without as high a percentage of other drains on the system as is someone who is a citizen or a legal guest and really trying to milk it.

Twolanerider · « **Reply #46 on:** May 04, 2006, 02:24:57 PM »

Ooops, to finish the thought. No, I don't blame any level of government for establishing a system that allows them to avoid looking at illegals because their taxes might (or might not) be more profitable. The tax system is setup for the normal taxpayer. It has to be. That an illegal might never claim a refund on his paid taxes is just a positive byproduct.

grc · « **Reply #47 on:** May 04, 2006, 02:33:51 PM »

Don,

Wouldn't the government notice a problem when they tried to credit the SS money to the bogus account number? Yeah, I know - it's the government were talkin' about, dumb question.

Jerry

Twolanerider · « **Reply #48 on:** May 04, 2006, 02:37:57 PM »

Quote

Don,

Wouldn't the government notice a problem when they tried to credit the SS money to the bogus account number? Yeah, I know - it's the government were talkin' about, dumb question.

Jerry

Mrs We would likely be our best source for hard data on this. But the few times I've had to research the general topic, yes, some auditing error might or might now show up. But if the SS # is bogus then contact information might be as well. And, since they've already got the money in hand, there's little beyond perfunctory follow up letters done track it down. They get pissy when you don't pay a tax. But if you've actually paid it and then might not be making a claim against it that's something they whine less about

.

DCFIREMANN · « **Reply #49 on:** May 04, 2006, 11:52:27 PM »

Quote

We, and every other employer that I know, do get a copy of their SS card, and a copy of their ID card, and DO deduct income taxes from their checks ..... We are REQUIRED to do these by law.

That is BULL S%^T!!!! You 1099 them and they have a bogus SS number so therefore they pay no taxes.

Be Safe

THE DAWG

Twolanerider · « **Reply #50 on:** May 05, 2006, 12:55:29 AM »

Quote

That is BULL S%^T!!!! You 1099 them and they have a bogus SS number so therefore they pay no taxes.

Be Safe

THE DAWG

Dawg, that depends on how you hire. If an employer chooses to hire only independent contractors and then 1099s, especially in an employment market heavy in illegals, that employer may be looking for ways to attract just those illegals. If, on the other hand, that employer hires traditionally he does take withholdings and taxes are collected and sent to the treasury. The prospective illegal employee may very well be looking for the employer that will make it easier for him to put the most money in his pocket (who wouldn't?). But that doesn't mean it's ok for the employer to, with a wink and a nod, be willing to in fact make it easy for him.

DCFIREMANN · « **Reply #51 on:** May 05, 2006, 07:11:14 AM »

Quote

Dawg, that depends on how you hire. If an employer chooses to hire only independent contractors and then 1099s, especially in an employment market heavy in illegals, that employer may be looking for ways to attract just those illegals. If, on the other hand, that employer hires traditionally he does take withholdings and taxes are collected and sent to the treasury. The prospective illegal employee may very well be looking for the employer that will make it easier for him to put the most money in his pocket (who wouldn't?). But that doesn't mean it's ok for the employer to, with a wink and a nod, be willing to in fact make it easy for him.

DON I understand that comnpletly. Around here they play the 1099 deal. The employers should be shot. I know that some employers try but they (the immigrants) seem to get around the system. The best way to prevent this is NOT HIRE ANY OF THEM till our great government gets a handle on it.

Be Safe

THE DAWG

SPIDERMAN · « **Reply #52 on:** May 05, 2006, 09:10:45 AM »

This is the kind of topic I really enjoy. Back and forth and informative for those participating and those just reading. What I'm getting here is a sense that a reasonable person could conclude that the employers on the whole are fully aware of the fraud they are perpetrating, but choose to turn a blind eye either because the competative market is forcing them to do so OR because they know they can get away with it and the practice improves their bottom line. Either way, it is easy to understand why a lot of small business people are either supportive of ILLIGALS or are willing to ignore the problem. Seems like people are willing to adjust their morality to what best serves their self interests. No surpise there, I would guess that is a somewhat hardwired trait of homo sapiens. Some might even call it self preservation.

yellowsedeuce · « **Reply #53 on:** May 05, 2006, 11:15:11 AM »

Quote

We, and every other employer that I know, do get a copy of their SS card, and a copy of their ID card, and DO deduct income taxes from their checks ..... We are REQUIRED to do these by law.

I also am in the immigrant heavy employee business. I own & operate two landscape contruction and maintenance companies. I interview all prospects and only hire those with documents. SSN cards, INS (green cards). I turn away those who don't have these docs. All are on payroll, workers' comp. and general $2M liability ins. policies.

My beef is with all of the customers who will hire the illegal or even the legal without getting proper id to take care of their gardens, install landscaping and many other trades that they do. The latin immigrants (legal/illegal) are migrating into our society because they are learning and refining their skills. Those that are independant contractors don't report all (if any) of their revenues. These are the people whom we are subsidizing with their medical bills, their children's public education, insurance premiums,etc.

Yesterday, I was at the DMV and removing the lienholder on one of my trucks. While I was there, three immigrants were trying to register their cars and were told to come back with liability insurance. At least when CA gave illegals DLs, many got insurance and most of the time the local government knew where they lived. Now we have millions of the illegals on the road without licenses and insurance, resulting in so many hit and run incidents. Many of these victims are left for dead. How many lives are lost due to this?

We need to come up with a system to document the illegals and make them own up to their actions while they are here. I am against blanket amnesty, etc. but, we're never going to be able to deport all of them. Their being here is driving up the costs of ALL of us here.

Just my .02 and just scratching the surface of this issue!

Yellowsedeuce

Twolanerider · « **Reply #54 on:** May 05, 2006, 11:34:49 AM »

Quote

I also am in the immigrant heavy employee business. I own & operate two landscape contruction and maintenance companies. I interview all prospects and only hire those with documents. SSN cards, INS (green cards). I turn away those who don't have these docs. All are on payroll,

Perhaps the most on-point thing so far Yellow. Yes, those hired as independent contractors and issued 1099s are far more likely to not report and under-report (for that matter the same is true of legal workers and citizens who are paid the same way--though the statistical prevalence is quite a bit less).

All the illegals can't be deported. Whether someone would want them to be or not; they just can't. Government can't (and can't realistically be expected to) find everyone. The one thing everyone has in common is they have to eat. So they have to work or steal. Most work. So the first lines of defense against illegality in the work force and as a segment of society is to make that illegality both not so easy and make it not pay. In other words, it's the employers.

Government has to crack down on employers who bend or break the rules (not to be vindictive, there's just no other enforcement tool that applies so effectively). Employers have to be responsible at greater than an individual selfish level. Should such a thing occur on a truly national and effective level different things would happen. Government also has to document; through things like enforcing almost draconian penalties for someone found to be avoiding things like drivers licenses or payments to ERs for purposes of evading identification and immigration or, working from the other side, finding ways to give incentive to "entering the system."

Employers have to be diligent and government has to help with both carrots and sticks. If such things were to occur on truly effective and national levels a few things would happen:

Word would slowly start to get out it's not as "easy" anymore.
More would enter the system legitimately because it wouldn't be easier or money saving to stay out of it anymore.

Having said all that, in the current climates and with the current budget applications it's pie-in-the-sky......

byronrb · « **Reply #55 on:** May 05, 2006, 02:53:08 PM »

Quote

That is BULL S%^T!!!! You 1099 them and they have a bogus SS number so therefore they pay no taxes.

Be Safe

THE DAWG

So you're calling me a liar, because you know more about farming in Ca than I do. I'm guessing you're a fireman, tell me if I'm wrong.

naitram · « **Reply #56 on:** May 05, 2006, 03:19:29 PM »

this has been a heated and lively discussion, nothing wrong with that but its leaning towards getting personal, between a couple of members.

no one should be second guessing how another member is or isnt employing illeagles

SPIDERMAN · « **Reply #57 on:** May 05, 2006, 03:33:52 PM »

Well Naitram, in my mind I've been participating in a debate on an issue with Nationwide resonance. I've enjoyed the give and take on this thread a lot as I've gained a lot of knowlege I did not previously posses. This issue is extremly complex and the more we all understand about the various positions in the debate, the more informed we will be if the time comes to vote on a referendum or other voter initiative type legislation. I fully expect it to come to that prior to the 08 Presidential election. I'm not targeting anyone specific because I don't know what 99.999999% of you do. I do know what DC does since he reminds us all the time (LOL) and of course Beags is my best friend and bro. I digress- - - anyway, If I've offended anyone or said anything that was taken in a personal way then I sincerely apologize.

JCZ · « **Reply #58 on:** May 05, 2006, 04:32:22 PM »

Quote

We, and every other employer that I know, do get a copy of their SS card, and a copy of their ID card, and DO deduct income taxes from their checks ..... We are REQUIRED to do these by law.

I'm in the property management industry and I've hired my share of minoritys. I photocopy their SS card, driver's license, etc. however, those can be bought at a local illegal immagrant hangout for a few bucks. Now, our industry runs a background check on new hires, along with the drug test.......that comes back and tells us if the SS# is valid for the name that's being used with it. But I know of one case, where the guy still got by all the checks and balances by using his friends ID and SS# and the friend (I was told it was a cousin, after he was terminated) was cashing the check and giving the money back to the employee, minus his cut. You almost have the access that law enforcement has, when you hire.

I will throw a stick in the spokes right here. A contractor asked me once......."why do you hire so many minoritys?". My answer, without thought, was quite simple...."because they're willing to do work that I can't get white guys to do and they're willing to work harder without whinning about how hot or how cold it is outside (I don't make the weather and can't change it)" (housekeeping and porter/groundskeeper type work). That's been my observation in this industry. Do I not hire whites anymore? The majority of my guys are white but I do and have had Hispanics, Phillapino, blacks, Asian, Samoian, Russian, Aremanian, Romanian and probably a few others that I'm just not thinking of. I do my part to try to make certain that they're legal if for no other reason then I hate to have to hire......I want to keep employees long term. Fortunately, for me, it's been awhile since I've had to hire and I've got some long term employees.

JCZ · « **Reply #59 on:** May 05, 2006, 04:41:36 PM »

Quote

That is BULL S%^T!!!! You 1099 them and they have a bogus SS number so therefore they pay no taxes.

Be Safe

THE DAWG

When the employer sends in the taxes for an emplyee, if the employee gave a wrong number, the taxes still went in under somebody's number......they're not returned because the name didn't match the number.

I used to work for a large nation wide property management company a few years back. We got notified by the IRS that a whole grip of employees on the west coast (I think it was about twenty or twenty five up and down the west coast) all had SS # that did not match names. We gave them the benefit of the doubt and allowed them a couple days to bring correct information and all of them were terminated within a few days. That hurt our company but I can assure you that the federal government did not return any of the taxes that had been paid by the company for how ever long these employees worked for us. Some had been with us for several years.

It got so bad that this industry (property management) now runs background checks on each emplyee applicant. It's not mandatory for employers to do it but I think that most in our industry do it now......along with drug testing. It's all just normal protcol now.

byronrb · « **Reply #60 on:** May 05, 2006, 06:20:28 PM »

DC, if you come out to cali sometime, look me up, we'll have a couple [smiley=drink.gif] [smiley=drink.gif] and laugh about this.
still your riding brother, Byron

BK · « **Reply #61 on:** May 06, 2006, 08:15:08 AM »

Quote

It got so bad that this industry (property management) now runs background checks on each emplyee applicant. It's not mandatory for employers to do it but I think that most in our industry do it now......along with drug testing. It's all just normal protcol now.

Good point JCZ, this is why I feel we need some laws changed. Most of the large corperations do this but like you said it is not mandatory. That opens the door to the small businesses to hire illegals.

yellowsedeuce · « **Reply #62 on:** May 06, 2006, 11:00:05 AM »

Quote

Good point JCZ, this is why I feel we need some laws changed. Most of the large corperations do this but like you said it is not mandatory. That opens the door to the small businesses to hire illegals.

I agree that many small businesses hire these illegals, I did it not knowing any better back when I started my first business 15 years ago. If employers are going to get penalized, then I believe all those who hire illegals for gardening, housekeeping, babysitting, plumbing and all other construction trades without the proper licenses should also be held accountable. This is an impossible task but, just imagine how much revenue could be generated by the local and federal governments. It sure could fund a growing number of inspectors as long as their not willing to get paid off like some unscrupulous gov. EEs can get. I know this is a whole topic in itself.

Just my .02

Yellowsedeuce

cigarmike · « **Reply #63 on:** May 06, 2006, 02:28:38 PM »

Yesderday, I went to the Home Depot, there are a bunch of laborers who wait just inside the parking lot for contractors to pick them up for jobs....I never hire any illegals...but yesderday I decided to drive up to them, they all ran up to my truck, I asked "who speaks English"...a few said "ME ME !". I told them to tell the others who dont speak english to take another day off along with themselves, as the strike day didnt work , and now get the F*** away from my truck. Being the nice guy that I am, I also threw in a "Happy Cinco de Mayo"

Puzzled · « **Reply #64 on:** May 06, 2006, 02:33:32 PM »

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/12631015/

The Mysterious Q! · « **Reply #65 on:** May 06, 2006, 02:35:19 PM »

Mike you sound a little disgruntled

But I share the same sentiments. My only deal is that I hire legal sub-contractors who provide me with liability and workers comp certificates but I can't be sure if all their employees are legal. Thats the extent of what I do to try to curb the flow of illegals. If anyone has any suggestions LMK.Later.

EZRIDN · « **Reply #66 on:** May 07, 2006, 10:52:47 AM »

Quote

Yesderday, I went to the Home Depot, there are a bunch of laborers who wait just inside the parking lot for contractors to pick them up for jobs....I never hire any illegals...but yesderday I decided to drive up to them, they all ran up to my truck, I asked "who speaks English"...a few said "ME ME !". I told them to tell the others who dont speak english to take another day off along with themselves, as the strike day didnt work , and now get the F*** away from my truck. Being the nice guy that I am, I also threw in a "Happy Cinco de Mayo"

Good one, Mike.

fxdjerry · « **Reply #67 on:** May 07, 2006, 08:52:18 PM »

Homeland Security my arse! The doors are wide open. The more that comes to light the worse it gets. Seen a show about Oregon one State Police guy for the whole coast. Think they said there was only 20 in the whole State.

UltraPolecat · « **Reply #68 on:** May 08, 2006, 06:17:11 AM »

I sense the frustration of all of us. That happens when we all feel helpless to right something so obviously broken. We all admit we need imigration. Most of us are only a few generations removed from that status.

But we are a nation of laws. The hard part of this from the prez on down is we all look the other way. Have been doing so for years. I freely admit that in NC, I always figured it to be a border state issue. NOT MY PROBLEM. Now I look around and we have the problem here. Now I have been awakened.

Many parts of the problem have already been mentioned. Our current laws address all of them. BUT THEY ARE NOT ENFORCED. There is no point in making new laws that we do not enforce. The police catch illegals doing crime, and after processing them, let them go. ICE did a raid last week in Charlotte, arresting about 50 illegals, then let them go. Gave them a court date in Atlanta next month. HA, I'm sure they will all show up with their attorneys. Companies are selectively audited and even then their hands tied. Way too much PC.

So if you think the problem is the Mexicans, you have not looked carefully enough. The problem is US. We can't say Get the business guy! Get the Police! Get the Border Patrol! Get the government! Its all of them, and us too.

We have to get the national will to fix this. At this point as much as I would wish it, I don't believe it.

I can't speak Spanish yet, but I spect I better learn.

Viva La Harley!

WFP · « **Reply #69 on:** May 08, 2006, 06:42:46 AM »

Quote

I can't speak Spanish yet, but I spect I better learn.

Here is enough to get you in trouble:
Dos Cerveza por favor
?Donde' esta' las chicas bonitas?
and
?Que' Carajo?

Not sure of this last one, never saw it spelled out! Supposed to mean WTF? it was pronounced to me as:
Kay Ka-Rah-Ho ....roll the R!

naitram · « **Reply #70 on:** May 08, 2006, 08:19:32 AM »

Quote

Here is enough to get you in trouble:
Dos Cerveza por favor
?Donde' esta' las chicas bonitas?
and
?Que' Carajo?

Not sure of this last one, never saw it spelled out! Supposed to mean WTF? it was pronounced to me as:
Kay Ka-Rah-Ho ....roll the R!

let me see how my broken spanish is,

you would like 2 beers
and want to know were the women are?

WFP · « **Reply #71 on:** May 08, 2006, 08:33:12 AM »

Quote

let me see how my broken spanish is,

you would like 2 beers
and want to know were the women are?

PRETTY women!

Or in Columbia...where can a sailor find a good time...

The Mysterious Q! · « **Reply #72 on:** May 08, 2006, 09:00:06 AM »

I think what he meant to say was "Where the ho's at?"

UltraPolecat · « **Reply #73 on:** May 08, 2006, 09:28:26 AM »

Hey, this Spanish thing ain't gonna be so bad after all!

SPIDERMAN · « **Reply #74 on:** May 08, 2006, 09:55:01 AM »

Quote

I think what he meant to say was "Where the ho's at?"

donde esta la "punta"

kinda lets em know you're not looking for the Virgin Mary

The Mysterious Q! · « **Reply #75 on:** May 08, 2006, 10:01:25 AM »

I guess you have asked that question to some of the locals in Dago. [smiley=huepfenlol2.gif]Did you find what you were looking for. Donde esta la where the ho's at!

Puzzled · « **Reply #76 on:** May 08, 2006, 05:47:20 PM »

Dear President Bush:

I'm about to plan a little trip with my family and extended family, and I would like to ask you to assist me. I'm going to walk across the border from the U.S. into Mexico, and I need to make a few arrangements. I know you can help with this.

I plan to skip all the legal stuff like visas, passports, immigration quotas and laws. I'm sure they handle those things the same way you do here.

So, would you mind telling your buddy, President Vicente Fox, that I'm on my way over? Please let him know that I will be expecting the following:

1. Free medical care for my entire family.

2. English-speaking government bureaucrats for all services I might need, whether I use them or not.

3. All government forms need to be printed in English.

4. I want my kids to be taught by English-speaking teachers.

5. Schools need to include classes on American culture and history.

6. I want my kids to see the American flag flying on the top of the flag pole at their school with the Mexican flag flying lower down.

7. Please plan to feed my kids at school for both breakfast and lunch.

8. I will need a local Mexican driver's license so I can get easy access to government services.

9. I do not plan to have any car insurance, and I won't make any effort to learn local traffic laws.

10. In case one of the Mexican police officers does not get the memo from Pres. Fox to leave me alone, please be sure that all police officers speak English.

11. I plan to fly the U.S. flag from my house top, put flag decals on my car, and have a gigantic celebration on July 4th. I do not want any complaints or negative comments from the locals.

12. I would also like to have a nice job without paying any taxes, and don't enforce any labor laws or tax laws.

13. Please tell all the people in the country to be extremely nice and never say a critical word about me, or about the strain I might place on the economy.

I know this is an easy request because you already do all these things for all the people who come to the U.S. from Mexico. I am sure that Pres. Fox won't mind returning the favor if you ask him nicely.

However, if he gives you any trouble, just invite him to go quail hunting with your V.P.

Thank you so much for your kind help.

Sincerely,
(Your name here)

grc · « **Reply #77 on:** May 10, 2006, 09:53:05 AM »

Arrests Target Use of Illegal Workers
Washington Post 05/10/06
by Spencer S. Hsu
Copyright 2006&044; The Washington Post Co. All Rights Reserved

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Federal authorities announced the arrests yesterday of four construction supervisors and 76 illegal immigrants at a Kentucky home-building company, continuing a promised government crackdown on employers that rely on illegal labor.

The arrests at Fischer Homes, a leading builder in Kentucky, Indiana and Ohio, followed the April 19 arrests of seven current and former managers and more than 1,100 workers for Ifco Systems North America Inc., a subsidiary of a Dutch manufacturer of plastic crates and wooden pallets.

The effort comes as Congress debates plans to overhaul the nation's immigration laws.

We will continue to bring criminal actions against employers who are consistently harboring illegal aliens, said Homeland Security Secretary Michael Chertoff.

The four Fischer Homes managers were charged in a criminal complaint with aiding and abetting or harboring illegal immigrants for commercial or private financial gain. They face a maximum penalty of 10 years in prison and a $250,000 fine. Calls to company headquarters last night were not returned.

In recent weeks, Immigration and Customs Enforcement also has charged the owner of an Indiana stucco company in connection with an illegal employment scheme, won guilty pleas and the forfeiture of more than $1 million by operators of three Baltimore restaurants for conspiring to harbor illegal immigrants, and indicted two Ohio temporary-employment agencies and nine people on charges of hiring and harboring illegal immigrants.

The arrests have attracted employers' attention and sparked rumors of sweeps of illegal workers nationwide. But advocates on both sides of the debate said recent U.S. practice makes them skeptical that the arrests are more than a public relations effort.

From 1999 to 2004, the number of criminal employer cases referred for prosecution by the federal government fell from 182 to four, and the amount of fines collected dropped from $3.7 million to $212,000, according to a congressional report.

These are cosmetic efforts to persuade Congress to pass an amnesty, said Mark Krikorian, executive director of the Center for Immigration Studies, an advocate of stronger workplace enforcement.

He was referring pejoratively to White House-backed Senate legislation that would create a guest-worker program for foreign nationals, offer a path to citizenship for illegal residents and toughen border enforcement.

UltraPolecat · « **Reply #78 on:** May 10, 2006, 12:08:37 PM »

The company mentioned in the article (IFCO) has an operation here in Charlotte NC. I spoke with one of the workers yesterday that was arrested there. He was seeking a job here at my company.

He told me he was released after being detained overnight.
He told the ICE officials he was here illegally (he said "undocumented")
He had a hearing in Atlanta last week (he said he actually went)
He was released without charges.
I believe he was telling me the truth, his SS and green card looked good (obviously fake, though considering his tale).

Obviously we did not hire him. I suspect he will go to Washington DC to work in Congress or at the White House.

This is UNBELIEVABLE.

BK · « **Reply #79 on:** May 10, 2006, 12:55:15 PM »

SPIDERMAN · « **Reply #80 on:** May 10, 2006, 01:29:05 PM »

Here's one for all of you in Texas.
   On my last trip across our great county I noticed billboards advertising gas stations and motels which proclaimed. - - - " American Owned " So being the curious sort, I stopped at one of these which had a large American Flag painted on the roof and asked the lady at the counter what the deal was. She explained

   " These people come over here from India and the US Govenrment gives them interest free loans to buy a business with a 10 year sunset. At 9 years and 11 months, they transfer the loan to a relative and never pay the interest. I as an natural born American can not get such a sweat heart deal, not will the SBA loan me any money at all to upgrade or expand my existing business. "

Which explains why every dam gas station and motel in this country seems to be owned by Indian Nationals ( and I don't mean Native American Indians)

arcticdude · « **Reply #81 on:** May 10, 2006, 01:37:38 PM »

Sounds like that's reason enough to camp more! I'll certainly consider that in my travels more. I'd recognized the increase in Indian motel ownership, but had not realized they were given the money for free.

Hell, why not just give them the keys to the bank??? Why is this country so hell bent on giving an immigrant the shirt off it's back, yet a citizen has to fight for the smallest penny??

The Mysterious Q! · « **Reply #82 on:** May 10, 2006, 03:00:10 PM »

Quote

[highlight]Sounds like that's reason enough to camp more![/highlight] I'll certainly consider that in my travels more. I'd recognized the increase in Indian motel ownership, but had not realized they were given the money for free. Hell, why not just give them the keys to the bank??? Why is this country so hell bent on giving an immigrant the shirt off it's back, yet a citizen has to fight for the smallest penny??

Funny you should say that.There is a Indian owned gas station in the next town over from me where they have a pop up trailer in the back where the 2 smelly guys live trading shifts back and forth.Also if you want it they sell knock off Rolex's Polo shirts and Oakleys.Plus if you ask they have a secret porn section for sale in the back. I'm not sure about that because I'm a God fairing man

arcticdude · « **Reply #83 on:** May 10, 2006, 03:24:23 PM »

Here in good ole' OK, we could easily get them shut down for the "back o' the store". Hell we're still drinking low point beer!!

SPIDERMAN · « **Reply #84 on:** May 10, 2006, 04:18:21 PM »

Quote

Here in good ole' OK, we could easily get them shut down for the "back o' the store". Hell we're still drinking low point beer!!

"back o' the store" ? sheeeeeeeeeiiiiiiiit dude, if they had that law in SoCal, 1/2 the illegal mezcans would be homeless.

EZRIDN · « **Reply #85 on:** May 10, 2006, 06:49:44 PM »

So much for Homeland "Security". Our government is still searching little old ladies at the airport but they are doing next to nothing to stem the flow of thousands of illegals a day from entering our country. In many cases it looks more like they are being encouraged to do so. Even though our President took an oath of office to protect our borders he is refusing to do so. Enough is enough. If you are as fed up as I am with representatives that represent themselves and not the people that put them in office, then start fighting back. The President and my Senators are all receiving mail from me.

Petition to Secure Our Borders:
http://www.grassfire.org/42/petition.asp?PID=8582760

Check out the following article from the Ontario, California, Daily Bulletin:

'U.S. Government Endangers Law Abiding Citizens Monitoring the Border By Reporting Minutemen’s Activities to the Mexican Government'

http://www.dailybulletin.com/news/ci_3799653

http://www.minutemanproject.com/default.asp?contentID=23

grc · « **Reply #86 on:** May 10, 2006, 10:29:39 PM »

Everyone does realize, I hope, that our government's failure to do anything meaningful about the illegals is due to an unpublicized but obvious policy to provide foreign aid to GW's good buddy President Fox, without actually calling it foreign aid. After all, Mr. Fox doesn't have to worry about taking care of his poor citizens as long as the American taxpayers will take care the problem for him. This isn't the first or only time that politicians and the bureaucrats at the State Department have sold us down the river in the name of foreign relations. Remember how we gave China "favored nation" trading status not so long ago?

Jerry

BK · « **Reply #87 on:** May 11, 2006, 06:23:17 AM »

I guess we will just bomb another country to Get all of our minds off of this broken immigration/ border thing.

SPIDERMAN · « **Reply #88 on:** May 11, 2006, 10:09:40 AM »

Well to keep kicking this dog, Let's tally up how many laws they break in addition to being here illegally Here's my three contributions

1 & 2 -No driver's licenses or insurance
3- The living in the back of the story thing arcticdude mentioned

WaSEEG · « **Reply #89 on:** May 11, 2006, 10:24:34 AM »

Look at the recently released stats on stolen cars. Our little burg (Yakima,WA population about 60,000 )made it into the top 10 in the nation . As I recall all or most of the other top 10 were on the west coast. What struck me was several of the communities listed, for example Stockton,Cal, Modesto Cal, Visalia, Cal are communities like mine with a high percentage of illegals who work in agriculture. Is there a connection? Who knows as auto theft is not a high priority here as the local cops have their hands full with meth labs and drive by shootings and most auto thefts are not solved.

Dan

The Mysterious Q! · « **Reply #90 on:** May 11, 2006, 10:25:33 AM »

Spidey it was me with the behind the store thing. I have another one.Falsified government documents i.e. SS cards ,green cards and work visas. Also no registration on the cars they drive too.

BK · « **Reply #91 on:** May 11, 2006, 10:59:18 AM »

Quote

Spidey it was me with the behind the store thing. I have another one.Falsified government documents i.e. SS cards ,green cards and work visas. Also no registration on the cars they drive too.

Wouldn't that be identity theft.

SPIDERMAN · « **Reply #92 on:** May 11, 2006, 11:10:37 AM »

Ok, in three posts we're up to what 7 or 8 laws they break.

FYI, I go down to TJ, my State Farm Insurance covers me within 50 miles of the border. Some local runs out in front of me and I hit him. If I haven't paid $15 a day for Mexican insurance, they immediately arrest me , put me in jail ( you DON'T wanna go there) and there I stay till I post bail which is usually the amount of money the Mexican Government determines the average Mexican citizen earns in a year. State Farm will not post my bail. They only get involved once the citizen files a claim. Now. there is no law that I have to purchase Mexican insurance and I am there legally as a tourist yet I wind up in jail. Don't know if any of you have ever been to TJ, but without tourist dollars it dies SO, this is the way the Mexican government treats Americans LEGALLY visiting their country and yet we are supposed to give all of these Illegals in the USA who on average have broken at least 7 of our laws a free pass ?

[size=36]NOT ! [/size]

BK · « **Reply #93 on:** May 11, 2006, 11:23:53 AM »

I have been to Mexico once, that was once enough. I had a good time but that was with some friends. I would not take my family fearing for there safety.

RedFXR2 · « **Reply #94 on:** May 11, 2006, 11:38:35 AM »

Quote

I have been to Mexico once, that was once enough. I had a good time but that was with some friends. I would not take my family fearing for there safety.

I don't blame you.

It's been a while since this happened, but some friends went to visit some other friends in Tucson. They decided to go down to Nogales for some "real" Mexican food so the two couples jumped in the guy's somewhat battered desert-explorer Jeep and took off. As they were finishing dinner, the Police came into the restaurant and arrested all four for "Illegal prospecting". Seems the Jeep had a small shovel inside. From jail, after some screaming, begging, they were allowed a phone call. The guy called a lawyer friend back in Tucson, who arranged for their release. They were taken back to the border and put out--on foot. They never got the Jeep or their wallets (cash, credit cards, drivers' licenses, etc.), or ladies' pocketbooks (same personal effects for women) back. Seems no records of the "arrest" could be found by the Mexican authorities in Nogales.

It's a shame because Mexico has some spectacular scenery and history. The tourism industry could fluorish if safety weren't a concern.

EZRIDN · « **Reply #95 on:** May 11, 2006, 01:12:30 PM »

Quote

I have been to Mexico once, that was once enough. I had a good time but that was with some friends. I would not take my family fearing for there safety.

Same here, been there once (Laredo, Tx - Nuevo Laredo, Mx) a couple years ago and, to quote a particular South Park episode, 'it smells like ass' the whole time.

Can't say that my wife and I had a particularly good time. We stayed about 2 hours total, got followed by the street hawkers trying to sell us everything from trinkets, drugs, prescriptions, doctor/dentist referrals, shoe-shines (both of us wearing tennies, of course) and just flat out being followed. I did not feel secure there one bit...never had that feeling before in my life. We had intentions of staying longer and buying a few more things but, we couldn't wait to get the hell out of that stink hole and back to the good old USA. On the way back (by foot) on the bridge, we got to see an international incident take place with one car purposefully ramming into the side of another car in the middle of the bridge. Lot of yelling/screaming going on. The cops/security from neither side would venture out there to "no-man's land" to take charge...we kept on walking and didn't want to be mixed up in any of the crowd gathering. Have no idea how that all turned out...don't care.

Here's another thing...when we went across to Mexico and came back...no one on either side asked to look at anyone's identification. We did get asked on the return side as to what our nationality was....so much again for "Homeland Security". The people were coming/going across by the scores...many carrying packages & bags and no inspections being performed. Who knows who or what came across in front/behind us that day.

The resort communities might be worthwhile to see but, I don't think we'll ever go to Mexico again. Plus, you can buy the same crap here that you can get down there.

RedFXR2 · « **Reply #96 on:** May 11, 2006, 01:36:32 PM »

Quote

... got followed by the street hawkers trying to sell us everything from trinkets, drugs, prescriptions, doctor/dentist referrals, shoe-shines (both of us wearing tennies, of course) and just flat out being followed. I did not feel secure there one bit...never had that feeling before in my life.

<snip>

Here's another thing...when we went across to Mexico and came back...no one on either side asked to look at anyone's identification. We did get asked on the return side as to what our nationality was....so much again for "Homeland Security". The people were coming/going across by the scores...many carrying packages & bags and no inspections being performed. Who knows who or what came across in front/behind us that day.

EZRIDN got me thinking/remembering again. in 2002, I had occasion to walk across into Juarez from El Paso for the day. We were doing some repairs to a Spanish mission outside El Paso and wanted to look at a mission in Juarez to observe historic construction techniques.

Anyway, the man I was working with, a "gringo", told me to move my wallet to a front pocket, carry a bottle of water so we wouldn't need to drink anything down there, and don't engage any street people in conversaton, even children. He knew exactly where we were going so we kept moving at a fast pace and still had children following us, asking for money...and our bottled water. It was really sad, seeing the kids like that, but their parents (I presume) were standing on the street obviously sending the kids after us.

We didn't do anything, identification-wise at the border bridge to go south and only hurriedly showed a US drivers' license to get back. People were flowing across in droves, going both ways, mostly unchallenged, nearly all hispanic, and many with large parcels or luggage--unchecked. It reminded me of some movie about a breakdown of societal order.

EZRIDN · « **Reply #97 on:** May 11, 2006, 01:58:58 PM »

Quote

[highlight]It reminded me of some movie about a breakdown of societal order[/highlight].

It's sad that we have a real life documentary going on now.

Fired00d · « **Reply #98 on:** May 11, 2006, 04:46:14 PM »

Neve been to Mexico, and after hearing the last several posts doubt I will go.

[smiley=pumpkin.gif]
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
[smiley=fireman.gif]

VaEagle · « **Reply #99 on:** May 14, 2006, 09:02:44 AM »

I recieved the following via e-mail, thought it was creative way to deal with a problem.

Subject: INS

-Get ready....................this is so good !!!!!!

I have a friend who is president of his homeowner's association down in Washington. They are having a terrible problem with trash on the side of the road that is around his association's homes.The reason, according to Wallace (my friend) is, there is being built just next to them, six new homes.....big ones! Wallace said the trash is coming from the Mexican work crews working at the construction sites. (McDonald Bags, Burger King trash, etc). He has pleaded with the site supervisors and the general contractor to no avail, called the City,County, the Police and got no help. So..................guess what some people in his community did?

They organized about twenty folks, named themselves The "Inner Neighborhood Services" to go out at lunch time and "police" the trash themselves. It is what they did while picki ng up the trash that is HILARIOUS !!!!!!!!

They got some navy blue baseball caps and had the initials "INS" in gold put on the caps. It doesn't take a rocket scientist, however, to understand what they hoped people would think it means.

Well the day after their first pick up detail, with them wearing their caps and some carrying cameras; 46 out of 68, of the construction workers did not show up for work the next morning!!!!!!!!.............and haven't come back yet!!!!! It has been ten days.

Now the General Contractor, I understand is madder than hell, but can't say anything publicly, because he could be busted for hiring "illegal aliens". Wallace and his bunch can't be accused of impersonating INS folks, because they have it on their home owner association records the vote to form the new committee within their association, plus they informed the INS about what they were doing in advance, and the INS said basically according to Wallace.... .........."have at it"!

SO FOLKS, I THINK YOU COULD SAY THAT YANKEE INGENUITY TRIUMPHS AGAIN!!!!!!!

SPIDERMAN · « **Reply #100 on:** May 14, 2006, 12:55:14 PM »

VA,
You made my day with this story
Thanks [smiley=xyxthumbs.gif]

Big B

Fired00d · « **Reply #101 on:** May 14, 2006, 04:48:54 PM »

VaEagle,
That is some funny chit!!! [smiley=xyxthumbs.gif]

[smiley=pumpkin.gif]
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
[smiley=fireman.gif]

Scooterhair · « **Reply #102 on:** May 14, 2006, 04:55:19 PM »

I AM AN AMERICAN !!!!

I respect AMERICA !!!

I speak English.
I read English.
I write English.
I pay my taxes.
We started and run our business without tax help from the US gov.

I respect AMERICA !!!

I don't try to change it just to benefit "my" way of life or heritage.

I'm getting really tired of seeing and hearing Spanish "everywhere" I go. This politically correct crap is so far out of control, it makes me so pissed.

I respect AMERICA !!!

Learn the language, laws, etc. of AMERICA or go back and change your country.

I respect AMERICA !!!

I AM AN AMERICAN !!!

RedFXR2 · « **Reply #103 on:** May 14, 2006, 09:01:31 PM »

VaEagle, that was a great story. [smiley=xyxthumbs.gif]

The Mysterious Q! · « **Reply #104 on:** May 15, 2006, 10:28:34 AM »

VA, That is a great story Bro. It is just a glimpse into what truly would happen if the real INS decided to do massive sweeps for illegals.They would scatter like roaches in the light. Later,Q

Fired00d · « **Reply #105 on:** May 15, 2006, 07:01:15 PM »

I've been reluctant to speak on this as I have some very passionate feelings toward this subject. As an AMERICAN of African decent it really upsets me the "fringe" benefits that some are getting for illegally coming to MY country. My forefathers were brought to this country against there will, and became slaves. There has been years of prejudice and racism that we as black Americans have suffered thru the years, but not once have we had a "Immigrant Strike", nor have we been given the luxuries that those that have come "illegally" to this country are receiving today.

I do believe that America is the land of opportunity, and as long as you work for things you can achieve them. But don't come to MY country illegally and demand all the perks that those here legally can't have. Our borders have always been open for those that wanted to come into our country legally and share in the freedoms and liberties we as Americans have. I've noticed more and more of the Hispanic population growing in my own community, and as long as there are here legally I don't have a problem with that. I do however have a problem w/someone being here illegally and my tax dollars taking care of them.

I received this email today that I would like to share with you. I did validate this before sharing as I didn't want to share an "urban legend". This letter comes from Charlie Daniels Website.

Due to the length of this email I will have to post it next post.

[smiley=pumpkin.gif]
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
[smiley=fireman.gif]

Fired00d · « **Reply #106 on:** May 15, 2006, 07:01:25 PM »

Mexican Standoff

I don't know how everybody else feels about it, but to me I think Hispanic people in this country, legally or illegally, made a huge public relations mistake with their recent demonstrations.

I don't blame anybody in the world for wanting to come to the United States of America, as it is a truly wonderful place. But when the first thing you do when you set foot on American soil is illegal it is flat out wrong and I don't care how many lala land left heads come out of the woodwork and start trying to give me sensitivity lessons.

I don't need sensitivity lessons, in fact I don't have anything against Mexicans, I just have something against criminals and anybody who comes into this country illegally is a criminal and if you don't believe it try coming into America from a foreign country without a passport and see how far you get.

What disturbs me about the demonstrations is that it's tantamount to saying, "I am going to come into your country even if it means breaking your laws and there's nothing you can do about it."

It's an "in your face" action and speaking just for me I don't like it one little bit and if there were a half dozen pairs of gonads in Washington bigger than English peas it wouldn't be happening.

Where are you, you bunch of lilly livered, pantywaist, forked tongued, sorry excuses for defenders of The Constitution? Have you been drinking the water out of the Potomac again?

And even if you pass a bill on immigration it will probably be so pork laden and watered down that it won't mean anything anyway. Besides, what good is another law going to do when you won't enforce the ones on the books now?

And what ever happened to the polls guys? I thought you folks were the quintessential finger wetters. Well you sure ain't paying any attention to the polls this time because somewhere around eighty percent of Americans want something done about this mess, and mess it is and getting bigger everyday.

This is no longer a problem, it is a dilemma and headed for being a tragedy. Do you honestly think that what happened in France with the Muslims can't happen here when the businesses who hire these people finally run out of jobs and a few million disillusioned Hispanics take to the streets?

If you, Mr. President, Congressmen and Senators, knuckle under on this and refuse to do something meaningful it means that you care nothing for the kind of country your children and grandchildren will inherit.

But I guess that doesn't matter as long as you get re-elected.

Shame on you.

One of the big problems in America today is that if you have the nerve to say anything derogatory about any group of people (except Christians) you are going to be screamed at by the media and called a racist, a bigot and anything else they can think of to call you.

Well I've been pounded by the media before and I'm still rockin' and rollin' and when it comes to speaking the truth I fear not.
And the truth is that the gutless, gonadless, milksop politicians are just about to sell out the United States of America because they don't have the intestinal fortitude to stand up to the face reality.

And reality is that we would never allow any other group of people to have 12 million illegals in this country and turn around and say, "Oh it's ok, ya'll can stay here if you'll just allow us to slap your wrist."

And I know that some of you who read this column are saying
"Well what's wrong with that?"

I'll tell you what's wrong with it. These people could be from Mars as far as we know. We don't know who they are, where they are or what they're up to and the way the Congress is going we're not going to.

Does this make sense? Labor force you say? We already subsidize corporate agriculture as it is, must we subsidize their labor as well?

If these people were from Haiti would we be so fast to turn a blind eye to them or if they were from Somalia or Afghanistan? I think not.

All the media shows us are pictures of hard working Hispanics who have crossed the border just to try to better their life. They don't show you pictures of the Feds rounding up members of MS 13, the violent gang who came across the same way the decent folks did. They don't tell you about the living conditions of the Mexican illegals some fat cat hired to pick his crop.

I want to make two predictions. No. 1: This situation is going to grow and fester until it erupts in violence on our streets while the wimps in Washington drag their toes in the dirt and try to figure how many tons of political hay they can make to the acre.

No 2: Somebody is going to cross that border with some kind of weapon of mass destruction and set it off in a major American city after which there will be a backlash such as this country has never experienced and the Capitol building in Washington will probably tilt as Congressmen and Senators rush to the other side of the issue.

I don't know about you but I would love to see just one major politician stand up and say, "I don't care who I make mad and I don't care how many votes I lose, this is a desperate situation and I'm going to lead the fight to get it straightened out."

I don't blame anybody for wanting to come to America, but if you don't respect our immigration laws why should you respect any others.

And by the way, this is America and our flag has stars and stripes. Please get that other one out of my face.

Pray for our troops

What do you think?

"God Bless America Again"
Charlie Daniels
April 10, 2006

[smiley=pumpkin.gif]
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
[smiley=fireman.gif]

DCFIREMANN · « **Reply #107 on:** May 15, 2006, 08:00:30 PM »

Quote

I've been reluctant to speak on this as I have some very passionate feelings toward this subject. As an AMERICAN of African decent it really upsets me the "fringe" benefits that some are getting for illegally coming to MY country. My forefathers were brought to this country against there will, and became slaves. There has been years of prejudice and racism that we as black Americans have suffered thru the years, but not once have we had a "Immigrant Strike", nor have we been given the luxuries that those that have come "illegally" to this country are receiving today.

I do believe that America is the land of opportunity, and as long as you work for things you can achieve them. But don't come to MY country illegally and demand all the perks that those here legally can't have. Our borders have always been open for those that wanted to come into our country legally and share in the freedoms and liberties we as Americans have. I've noticed more and more the of the Hispanic population growing in my own community, and as long as there are here legally I don't have a problem with that. I do however have a problem w/someone being here illegally and my tax dollars taking care of them.

I received this email today that I would like to share with you. I did validate this before sharing as I didn't want to share an "urban legend". This letter comes from Charlie Daniels Website.

Due to the length of this email I will have to post it next post.

[smiley=pumpkin.gif]
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
[smiley=fireman.gif]

I am with you my FIREFIGHTING BROTHER!!!!!! Something needs to happen and soon.

Be Safe

THE DAWG

Author Topic: Immigrant Strike (Read 12111 times)

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