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[FNGw/08SERK]

JW that diamond cut looks awesome on that bike. Glad to hear the build is meeting your expectations 

I thought the Big Sucker A/C pushed the cover out and interfered with the legs.  I'm not sure but I would ask before I went that route.

[Black Diamond]

Hi to all

Tomorrow is dyno/tune day. I'm looking forward to getting her dialed in. The A/F ratio is off as I'm running rich. The plugs are pretty dark. Hoping this will clear up the slight hesitation I'm experiencing intermittently. I'll try to post asap.

Everyone stay safe and keep the painted parts up!

JW

[Hoist!]

Hi to all

Tomorrow is dyno/tune day. I'm looking forward to getting her dialed in. The A/F ratio is off as I'm running rich. The plugs are pretty dark. Hoping this will clear up the slight hesitation I'm experiencing intermittently. I'll try to post asap.

Everyone stay safe and keep the painted parts up!

JW

Good luck with the tune Jeff!!!

Hoist!

[Black Diamond]

Well I'm back from a long day of looking for ponies. There seems to be a number of them that got away when I wasn't looking. I don't have the proper program to download the disc provided to me on the map and dyno sheet so I can't share it with all but it comes down to this:
101 hp / 116 tq.  They may have said 103 hp but what's the difference! Needless to say,
I am not a happy camper. 

I had these guys build me a 110 Street Glide last year. With a SERT, Stage 1 A/C and Rinehart TD. I got 93 hp / 113 tq. That was with the HD kit.

The following is the information I have at hand:
Compression check showed 185 lbs rear cylinder / 194 lbs front cylinder. Should this be more in the 210 lbs area?
The kit came with JE Reverse Dome pistons. Would flat tops make that much difference?
Axtell 117 cylinders honed by Cyclerama
Wes at Cyclerama did the heads. He says they flowed very good. I'm not sure the cc of the chamber. I'm checking with him via email.
I also used his 595 cam.       Intake open 21 / close 41  lobe center 100   overlap 34
                                     Exhaust open 49 / close 13  lobe center 108
                                     Intake duration 242  exhaust duration 242
Exhaust Rinehart True Duals with standard baffles.
Harley SE 58 mm throttle body with stage 1 A/C. Could the new electronic throttle system be part of the problem?

None of can believe the numbers we're getting. I would be happy with 1:1 cubic inches to HP. After the tune the hesitation I was experiencing is gone. So is the occasional sudden lurch of power. If anyone has any ideas, let me have em. I'm not looking to toss blame at anyone, just fix the problem. Everyone involved in this build is doing their best and it's driving crazy. Me..I started that way so I didn't have as far to go.

JW

[Black Diamond]

Hey gang

Well the struggle continues...

Talked with Wes. Apparently the problem may indeed be Harley's new electronic throttle control system ( also called fly by wire by many ) It seems the TB will go wide open for a second or so then it is designed to close to 70 - 80%. The Race Tuner is unable to over ride this design. Harley has also stopped updating the Race Tuner (SERT) as they have gone to the Super Tuner.

The Super Tuner with the latest upgrade will let the TB go and stay wide open throughout the run. Of course its $500.00. And once I take the current SERT out, I can simply place it in the garbage can.

Can we be certain this will unleash the ponies. No.

I may put the stock 50 mm TB back on. My builder has done several 110 builds with cams and some head work that have made 110 HP easily. If the 50 mm makes more power with my build, I can be sure we've identified at least on of the problems.

This package of components has produce some very good numbers in 110 builds. Something is amiss but I still believe (hope) it's just a matter of finding the problem and making it right. I let you know...

JW

[Hoist!]

Hey gang

Well the struggle continues...

Talked with Wes. Apparently the problem may indeed be Harley's new electronic throttle control system ( also called fly by wire by many ) It seems the TB will go wide open for a second or so then it is designed to close to 70 - 80%. The Race Tuner is unable to over ride this design. Harley has also stopped updating the Race Tuner (SERT) as they have gone to the Super Tuner.

The Super Tuner with the latest upgrade will let the TB go and stay wide open throughout the run. Of course its $500.00. And once I take the current SERT out, I can simply place it in the garbage can.

Can we be certain this will unleash the ponies. No.

I may put the stock 50 mm TB back on. My builder has done several 110 builds with cams and some head work that have made 110 HP easily. If the 50 mm makes more power with my build, I can be sure we've identified at least on of the problems.

This package of components has produce some very good numbers in 110 builds. Something is amiss but I still believe (hope) it's just a matter of finding the problem and making it right. I let you know...

JW

Jeff, Wes' headwork and cam combo worked better with a larger TB, not smaller. I got much better results with the 62mm than the 58mm. So I wouldn't go with the 50mm. It sounds like you might need that Super Tuner if you can't stay at WOT. How can you tune to WOT if you can't open the TB to WOT? Sounds like that Super Tuner is the only way to tune these new TBW bikes.

Hoist!

[Black Diamond]

Well I've got 2500 miles on her since the build. I know what my numbers are and I beleive there is more torque and ponies in her but.... This scoot moves just fine. When I get that occassional wild hair, she's more than willing to do all I want. I wish now I never knew the damn dyno numbers. She's the fastest scoot I've ever rod (well there was that SE VRod and a couple of race replicias)  I'm going to figure this TB thing out but I'm one happy rider.

JW

[Black Diamond]

Oh BTW   No leaks! I still hope all this talk about Harley fixing the 110 is true. I'm still happy with the direction I took. Once I get the SERK finished, I'll move on to upgrading the FB 95". She needs some love too.
JW

[Black Diamond]

As several have asked...

The motor has over 5500 miles on her with no leaks, no slips, no error. Still haven't put the super tuner on her to see what that will do as I'm riding when I'm not working. She's still stutters slightly every so often but I am happy with her for now. I hope when I get a little vacation time off, to see where I can go with the tune then.

Anyone out there done a tune with the SE 58 mm throttle body for the 08 electronic system?

JW

[AMP]

Hey gang

Well the struggle continues...

Talked with Wes. Apparently the problem may indeed be Harley's new electronic throttle control system ( also called fly by wire by many ) It seems the TB will go wide open for a second or so then it is designed to close to 70 - 80%. The Race Tuner is unable to over ride this design. Harley has also stopped updating the Race Tuner (SERT) as they have gone to the Super Tuner.

The Super Tuner with the latest upgrade will let the TB go and stay wide open throughout the run. Of course its $500.00. And once I take the current SERT out, I can simply place it in the garbage can.

Can we be certain this will unleash the ponies. No.

I may put the stock 50 mm TB back on. My builder has done several 110 builds with cams and some head work that have made 110 HP easily. If the 50 mm makes more power with my build, I can be sure we've identified at least on of the problems.

This package of components has produce some very good numbers in 110 builds. Something is amiss but I still believe (hope) it's just a matter of finding the problem and making it right. I let you know...

JW

That may not be so. I have heard that there is a way to "unlock" old tuners. I can check into it if you wish. I will be back on Monday...call me if you want to.

[Unbalanced]

Amp,

Curious what you mean by "unlock" the SERT and I mean this specifically to the fly by wire information. 

[Black Diamond]

Amp

Most assuredly I am interested in a method to unlock the SERT so I could put it on a different scoot, say my 03 Fat Boy. Let me know!

[AMP]

Amp,

Curious what you mean by "unlock" the SERT and I mean this specifically to the fly by wire information. 

Harry,
It doesn't change the way the SERT works. Just enables it to work with a different VIN. I have heard tale of this being done(by the dealer). I have not tried to have it done myself.

JW,
I checked on the "unlock"...Apparently, Harley doesn't offer the service any longer. Whoever they had contracted with to mfg the Tuners are no longer in the picture. I will try to find out who that might be.

[Unbalanced]

Amp,

Harry,
It doesn't change the way the SERT works. Just enables it to work with a different VIN. I have heard tale of this being done(by the dealer). I have not tried to have it done myself.

Amp wondering how this might help Black Diamdond if all it did was allow it to work with a different vin?   

JW,
I checked on the "unlock"...Apparently, Harley doesn't offer the service any longer. Whoever they had contracted with to mfg the Tuners are no longer in the picture. I will try to find out who that might be.

To my knowledge Harley dealers never had access to the back end of the program to do this unless someone there was privy to a hack.   It was always standard operating procedure to sell you a new SERT or sell you a new SERT / ECM if the ecm took a dump.   When you link the SERT to the ECM it supposedly writes a code into a memory region of the ECM that allows it to check for its mated partner which is how it supposedly knows the difference between its mated ECM and a new ECM which is why just putting your vin into an ECM does not allow it to mate with the old SERT that was previously mated to another ECM.

Folklore has it there is supposedly a hack that enables you to write a vin into an ecm just like the digital tech does and there is also supposedly more tables to be shown in the old SERT that are hidden without it.   Until you see it for yourself it's just that, folklore and myth and nothing anyone actually admits to having / using / seeing anyhow.   

Original SERT was made by Steve Cole (TTS Inc.)  soon to release V-Tuner, MasterTune  per Steve Cole it is being released for 02 based bikes first.

Kent Moore (TheTurboShop)  makes the new Super Tuner

[AMP]

Amp,

Amp wondering how this might help Black Diamdond if all it did was allow it to work with a different vin?   

It would help him to keep his old SERT outta the trash. It would be usable for another application.

To my knowledge Harley dealers never had access to the back end of the program to do this unless someone there was privy to a hack.   It was always standard operating procedure to sell you a new SERT or sell you a new SERT / ECM if the ecm took a dump.   When you link the SERT to the ECM it supposedly writes a code into a memory region of the ECM that allows it to check for its mated partner which is how it supposedly knows the difference between its mated ECM and a new ECM which is why just putting your vin into an ECM does not allow it to mate with the old SERT that was previously mated to another ECM.

Folklore has it there is supposedly a hack that enables you to write a vin into an ecm just like the digital tech does and there is also supposedly more tables to be shown in the old SERT that are hidden without it.   Until you see it for yourself it's just that, folklore and myth and nothing anyone actually admits to having / using / seeing anyhow.   

Original SERT was made by Steve Cole (TTS Inc.)  soon to release V-Tuner, MasterTune  per Steve Cole it is being released for 02 based bikes first.

Kent Moore (TheTurboShop)  makes the new Super Tuner

I don't know the specifics on how it was done, only that the service was available. (I have had an ECM "re-assigned" by HD.)

The point is moot now as HD no longer offers the service. Maybe Steve Cole could help a brother out...



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