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Author Topic: Favorite Primary Oil  (Read 2494 times)

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2002FXDWG3

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Re: Favorite Primary Oil
« Reply #30 on: January 05, 2018, 08:10:21 PM »

Still isn't really making sense to me, but if it works for you no reason to switch.
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Chains

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Re: Favorite Primary Oil
« Reply #31 on: January 06, 2018, 10:53:33 AM »

ATF will hold up better than oil in most cases.  I had a severe draw on a metal stamping in a die running on a 600 ton press.  Could not get the form to stop cracking no matter what lubricant we tried.  I got a quart of ATF put it in a spray bottle and wet the metal prior to the form station and bang problem cured no cracks whatsoever.  I honestly never thought of running it in my primary till now even though I ran it in my dirt bikes years ago. 

Thanks for the post.
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longlast

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Re: Favorite Primary Oil
« Reply #32 on: January 07, 2018, 06:38:30 PM »

Interesting on the ATF. I'm inclined to give ATF a try but by Using ATF what affect dose it have on service milage?

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skratch

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Re: Favorite Primary Oil
« Reply #33 on: January 07, 2018, 10:50:33 PM »

shouldn't have any effect on service mileage.  atf is similar to a 15-20 wt oil.  the main difference is that atf does not have the detergent additive package that engine oil has mainly because the transmission does not have to deal with combustion by products.  also, does not have a lot of the friction modifiers that you find in engine oils, good for not having clutch slippage.
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fos41

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Re: Favorite Primary Oil
« Reply #34 on: January 08, 2018, 10:39:28 AM »

Interesting information in these post regarding oils. A different animal I know used some of the oils mentioned in the threads with good results my dirt/mx bikes over the years: Ford ATF  in a bike w/ sintered bronze plates and like Chains mentioned put Rotella 15/40 in my modern 4 stroke mx bikes.

Currently in my `15 S.G.S.G. with 10 k miles and started using 20/50 Amsoil & Lucas oil stabilizer 50/50. Seems to work or respectably hot and cold.  My bike had H.D. synthetic oil at 5500 mi.  and I tried Red Line primary oil once, but instantly noticed a lot of noise coming from front of primary  suspecting from the compensator with the thinner oil.

I am paranoid about compensator failure with all of the talk about compensators going bad and feel oil with heavier viscosity might be better protection knowingly sacrificing clutch action. I`m no H.D. expert, but from my automotive engine building days the Lucas leaves a nice oil film on internal parts so hoping this recipe will prolong the compensators life.

Do not expect perfect clutch operation until I can change it to a different one my bike has the dreaded A&S clutch had issues from day 1 and is a sore spot with me know there are lots of threads on that topic lol.

Donnie
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skratch

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Re: Favorite Primary Oil
« Reply #35 on: January 08, 2018, 02:05:49 PM »



Do not expect perfect clutch operation until I can change it to a different one my bike has the dreaded A&S clutch had issues from day 1 and is a sore spot with me know there are lots of threads on that topic lol.


what problems have you had with the a&s clutch?  i've had mine since 2013 and have had no problems since day 1.  other than the friction point being near the end of travel of the lever, which i have addressed with the oberon adjustable clutch lever.
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fos41

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Re: Favorite Primary Oil
« Reply #36 on: January 08, 2018, 03:20:11 PM »

Bike had 5033 miles on test ride the clutch had a super late clutch engagement, no gradual application more of and on application, also rattling and odd vibration/clunk in clutch lever and inconsistent mushy clutch application. 

Hydraulic action always been good. Got a lot of fluff from dealer and MoCo stating within H.D. specs no problem found. Eventually a new clutch master and complete clutch assembly and it worked properly and after 1500 miles now going bad again w same issues with zero abuse. If  you want to call me I can give you more info.
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longlast

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Re: Favorite Primary Oil
« Reply #37 on: January 08, 2018, 05:48:27 PM »

shouldn't have any effect on service mileage.  atf is similar to a 15-20 wt oil.  the main difference is that atf does not have the detergent additive package that engine oil has mainly because the transmission does not have to deal with combustion by products.  also, does not have a lot of the friction modifiers that you find in engine oils, good for not having clutch slippage.

I've had no issues with clutch slippage but do have some drag. My 07 is still running it's stock clutch and compensater. I've found by giving a quick short rev reduces or eliminates the clunk if I time it right.
I'm using Motul 4T 7000 fully synthetic 20w50 (a red oil) in all three holes. I have another 2k to go before the next service. I did a oil check just last week and the motor oil is still clean can see though it same thing with the primary.

If using ATF can eliminate clutch drag that I do have at the moment the drag I can reduce again by short revs when moving backwards or pop into N.
When I had my primary apart to replace the clutch hub and inner primary case bearing ( a failure of my own doing, but that's another story) the comp was in good condition, no wear ridges.
I hadn't really thought about it before but ATF being used in auto Trans power steering pumps and I know it's used in planetary  drives it would work for a primary.
« Last Edit: January 08, 2018, 05:53:26 PM by longlast »
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2002FXDWG3

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Re: Favorite Primary Oil
« Reply #38 on: January 08, 2018, 10:13:14 PM »

ATF is thin as it works similar to hydraulic oil in automatic transmissions and power steering pumps.

Here's some viscosity data (taken from published documents from the respective manufacturer's websites) for those into this sort of thing.
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2002FXDWG3

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Re: Favorite Primary Oil
« Reply #39 on: January 08, 2018, 10:13:59 PM »

And here's the chart for the visual.
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havenolife

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Re: Favorite Primary Oil
« Reply #40 on: January 13, 2018, 06:47:29 AM »

is there any way to put up a poll up so we can check witch oil we use and how about a break in the years because there so different like 06 and down 07-13 and 14 and up when hd put that tray in the primary and that new clutch or no use doing that what do you think
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2002FXDWG3

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Re: Favorite Primary Oil
« Reply #41 on: January 13, 2018, 10:21:33 AM »

Seems the early bikes will run on just about anything, mainly comes down to personal preference.

On the newer bikes, it would be interesting to see if there is any correlation between oil type and miles to compensator failure.
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grc

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Re: Favorite Primary Oil
« Reply #42 on: January 13, 2018, 01:41:55 PM »


Before assuming higher viscosity oil is preferred for the compensator, be aware that the problem with the compensators is the lube isn't getting into the areas where it's needed.  A higher viscosity lube isn't going to fix that, and in fact could make it worse.  ATF is a lot tougher than some of you seem to think it is, and it is subjected to a lot more in the typical automotive transmissions, transaxles, transfer cases, and even manual transmissions than anything your Harley is liable to encounter.  The early SE compensators didn't survive long even for those using MTL in place of the SYN3.  A different lube didn't and won't fix bad design and material choices.

Jerry
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2002FXDWG3

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Re: Favorite Primary Oil
« Reply #43 on: January 13, 2018, 03:23:21 PM »

Exactly.  Do the lighter viscosity oils somehow penetrate those difficult areas better than the heavier oils and ultimately provide better protection?  It would be interesting to see if there is some sort of correlation there.
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lpennock

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Re: Favorite Primary Oil
« Reply #44 on: January 13, 2018, 03:33:50 PM »

ATF and light oils do better in splash lube applications because they slash more. In submerged applications heavier oils may or may not do better but usually do better. 

Sent from my SM-G920T using Tapatalk

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