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Author Topic: CVO LIMITED 117 (loss of power)  (Read 8659 times)

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Fullsac Performance

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Re: CVO LIMITED 117 (loss of power)
« Reply #15 on: June 08, 2018, 09:26:23 AM »

Well, I just bought a 2018 CVO Limited. I love this scooter so far, but...

Today, while riding for about an hour, I notice it seems to sound different and lost a little bit of power. It has 400 miles on it. The throttle response is hesitant and it doesn't want to accelerate like it should.

The bike is completely stock except the baffles in the mufflers have been removed.

Is it "Sumping"???

Any time you suspect it's sumping, pull in the clutch and free rev it a few times. If there is excessive oil in the crankcase the RPMs will drop much quicker than normal when you release the throttle as the motor is being drug down by the oil. If you were to down shift and roll off the throttle, it will literally throw you forward on the bike. If any of this is going on pull over and let it idle for 5 minutes while holding it upright, not on the sidestand. There is another option if your under warranty and close to your dealer. As it looses power just keep downshifting and holding it wide open. Heatwave can explain the rest of the process.

Steve@fullsac.com
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09nessrg

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Re: CVO LIMITED 117 (loss of power)
« Reply #16 on: June 08, 2018, 09:47:34 AM »

Thanks for the instructions Steve, that is very informative, especially if crossing AZ!
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Heatwave

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Re: CVO LIMITED 117 (loss of power)
« Reply #17 on: June 08, 2018, 09:52:19 AM »

Any time you suspect it's sumping, pull in the clutch and free rev it a few times. If there is excessive oil in the crankcase the RPMs will drop much quicker than normal when you release the throttle as the motor is being drug down by the oil. If you were to down shift and roll off the throttle, it will literally throw you forward on the bike. If any of this is going on pull over and let it idle for 5 minutes while holding it upright, not on the sidestand. There is another option if your under warranty and close to your dealer. As it looses power just keep downshifting and holding it wide open. Heatwave can explain the rest of the process.

Steve@fullsac.com

What he said.... that’s a good description. Another simple approach is just leave it in the gear you normally would be in at those rpms. Hit the throttle hard to accelerate as if you were pulling onto a highway. If the bike simply doesn’t respond to the throttle to accelerate hard (like it does when the bike is fresh out of the garage), then your bike is sumping. Its a pretty simple test.

At that point, the longer you run on the road, the more you’ll fill the crankcase with oil and the hotter the engine will get.

The quick, short term solution is what Steve described. Get to a safe location. Park the bike. Let it cool down somewhat if its really hot. Then stand the bike up and let it idle. Maybe 5mins, maybe 10 mins. Hard to say how long. At some point, the oil should get cleared from the crankcase. Then get the bike to the dealer.
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SDCVO

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Re: CVO LIMITED 117 (loss of power)
« Reply #18 on: June 08, 2018, 11:43:42 PM »

4th engine continues to run great. It now has over 1500 miles on it.
Great news!!
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Alan

1Riseaboveit

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Re: CVO LIMITED 117 (loss of power)
« Reply #19 on: June 15, 2018, 07:01:38 PM »

Well, between me and the techs riding it... We're up to 800 miles. My local dealer replaced the oil pump. I made it 20 miles from there before it sumped again. I took it straight back and the confirmed that is exactly what is going on. Now what?
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grc

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Re: CVO LIMITED 117 (loss of power)
« Reply #20 on: June 15, 2018, 07:59:42 PM »

Well, between me and the techs riding it... We're up to 800 miles. My local dealer replaced the oil pump. I made it 20 miles from there before it sumped again. I took it straight back and the confirmed that is exactly what is going on. Now what?

Contact H-D Customer Service.  Check out the thread by Heatwave on this subject for a history of what's been done with his, and the thread by SDCVO on his.  Just throwing a new oil pump in one of these engines that's sumping hasn't been the answer, and I also get the impression that some dealerships (perhaps the majority) are not very capable.  The sooner you get H-D corporate involved the better IMHO.  Good luck.

Jerry
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1Riseaboveit

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Re: CVO LIMITED 117 (loss of power)
« Reply #21 on: June 15, 2018, 10:11:45 PM »

Thank you. The dealership where my scooter currently is... Plans to contact support tomorrow. They've already talked about a complete replacement engine.

I'm going to check out those treads now...
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Heatwave

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Re: CVO LIMITED 117 (loss of power)
« Reply #22 on: September 26, 2018, 01:08:35 PM »

Thank you. The dealership where my scooter currently is... Plans to contact support tomorrow. They've already talked about a complete replacement engine.

I'm going to check out those treads now...

What's the latest on your bike?
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Para Bellum

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Re: CVO LIMITED 117 (loss of power)
« Reply #23 on: September 28, 2018, 01:23:27 AM »

What's the latest on your bike?
He hasn't been on the forum since Aug. 8th.  Wonder if he still owns a Harley?  SMH
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1Riseaboveit

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Re: CVO LIMITED 117 (loss of power)
« Reply #24 on: November 04, 2018, 10:38:51 AM »

Hello Gents,

     Just a little update... The MOCO decided to void my powertrain warranty leaving me and my dealership stuck with the sumping issues and repairs. My warranty was voided because while the dealer was replacing the "upgraded" oil pump a TTS Mastertuner was installed. The regional tech never even showed.

My dealership went through my entire engine, found heat damage, and did a rebuild. At the time, this scooter had 800 miles on it... Sumping since day one.

At the same time MOCO eventually sent the new cam plate. Good news is... It does help. It DID NOT fix my sumping issues completely.

I live in central Florida and took my scooter on an Iron Butt Run. I left here and rode up to "The Dragon". I did 1175 miles that trip. It sumped minorly in comparison to how it used to. I would just stop and let it idle (standing straight up)until it was back to normal.

When I came back I took it to the shop again. Still believing it is a crank case pressure problem, they starting investing the venting. Where the breather lines come up to the back of the air cleaner... They noticed that the bolts used for venting (holding the air cleaner on with holes through them) were not providing adequate flow. They drilled them out. More like the size on the old 110s. This combined with running a little less oil has helped as well.

It still gives symptoms of sumping if I run it really hard, but everything that has been done has helped. At it's worst now... It may have a 15% to 20% loss in power for a very short time and corrects itself while riding.

Since I now own my powertrain (Thanks MOCO) I plan to do a 124 kit and the S&S pump setup soon.
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r0de_runr

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Re: CVO LIMITED 117 (loss of power)
« Reply #25 on: November 04, 2018, 11:21:43 AM »

"My warranty was voided because while the dealer was replacing the "upgraded" oil pump a TTS Mastertuner was installed."
No, say it ain't so Joe!You mean to tell me that HD is actually doing something it promised to do?
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Unbalanced

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Re: CVO LIMITED 117 (loss of power)
« Reply #26 on: November 04, 2018, 11:29:58 AM »

Was the ECM flashed back to stock before or at the dealer prior to the digital tech being attached ? ? ?

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RivRaptor

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Re: CVO LIMITED 117 (loss of power)
« Reply #27 on: November 04, 2018, 11:38:35 AM »

Interesting update, thanks!  Mine has not sumped.  But I have been following these issues closely & believe they are crank pressure related. I run my bike a little under full on oil as it seems to like that also....so I don't smell oil every time I get off.  As with you I plan on a 124 kit, pump & seal mod.  Just waiting to see how all this sumping stuff shakes out in the long run or a concrete resolution is reached.  Hope that's not to much longer!  Now I want to take a look at those ac bolt holes.
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Re: CVO LIMITED 117 (loss of power)
« Reply #28 on: November 04, 2018, 11:43:52 AM »

Interesting update, thanks!  Mine has not sumped.  But I have been following these issues closely & believe they are crank pressure related. I run my bike a little under full on oil as it seems to like that also....so I don't smell oil every time I get off.  As with you I plan on a 124 kit, pump & seal mod.  Just waiting to see how all this sumping stuff shakes out in the long run or a concrete resolution is reached.  Hope that's not to much longer!  Now I want to take a look at those ac bolt holes.

Looking more like a compensator sequel than a resolution.   
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kojak

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Re: CVO LIMITED 117 (loss of power)
« Reply #29 on: November 04, 2018, 12:56:47 PM »

The dude in upped baffles out of his muffler and ran it to 110 mph! lol l
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