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[Coolbreeze]

I have a PCIII, B/S AC, V&H TruDuals, S&S SPO'S, VERY mild gear cam...   still a bit lean, still a bit hot, still lousy mileage...

My indy is really talking up the ThunderMax with it's "no need to ever dyno again" capability.  $1100 installed. 

Is this thing worth it?      Seems like every time I fart or see a new exhaust, or...etc etc..  I spend another 250 or 3 on a dyno tune, and ...  well....  then the weather changes and I go uphill a few thousand feet, and.....     

I'm stumped.

[rednectum]

the thundermax is a great tuner, but it wont help with that exhaust.

[Coolbreeze]

Why is that?

[Twolanerider]

Thundermax can't guarantee the lack of a need to visit a dyno for tuning.  Several here alone have had unsatisfactory base maps.  The autotuning feature is also not absolute.  Certainly no panacea.  It can and has made mistakes.

Shannon, some have loved it.  Some have had significant difficulties (even without "messing with it").  Unless you're local tuner recommending it can actually tune the device if need be it's a crap shoot though.  This is made even more so by the fact that if you actually need assistance from the mftr you are generally screwed.  Effective support is not their best thing.

[SBB]

Thundermax can't guarantee the lack of a need to visit a dyno for tuning.  Several here alone have had unsatisfactory base maps.  The autotuning feature is also not absolute.  Certainly no panacea.  It can and has made mistakes.

Shannon, some have loved it.  Some have had significant difficulties (even without "messing with it").  Unless you're local tuner recommending it can actually tune the device if need be it's a crap shoot though.  This is made even more so by the fact that if you actually need assistance from the mftr you are generally screwed.  Effective support is not their best thing.

Don, don't be bitter!

After the thousands of dollars you spent at Zippers did you really expect,

Good customer service?
Parts that worked as advertised?
Followup on your issues?
Someone to return your call?
Someone to return your call with answers?
Someone to return your call with answers that work.

"WELL?"

 

[Twolanerider]

Don, don't be bitter!

After the thousands of dollars you spent at Zippers did you really expect,

Good customer service?
Parts that worked as advertised?
Followup on your issues?
Someone to return your call?
Someone to return your call with answers?
Someone to return your call with answers that work.

"WELL?"

 

Woulda liked a hat ?   


A good deal of the Thundermax experience I've come to understand isn't my own of course.  Mine was only a single case.  And though the device certainly has its limitations I don't dismiss it at all.  Especially in installations without the autotune and with a good tuner to dial it in.

An acquaintance of mine we both know who tunes more in a rally weekend than any of us will ever own in a lifetime too often speaks of similar experiences though.  Autotune choices that are just wrong.  That can't be tracked to have been wrong looking from the base map to where they were at the moment of inspection.  They may work very well sometimes.  But that is not nearly universally the case.

The base maps are not an end all and be all.  In fact some have proved to be very poor indeed.  And the autotune isn't absolute; or even close.  When it works well that's wonderful for those that have it.  When it does not, however, you have the absolute foundation device for getting you down the road being a concrete foundation without rebar.

[Bubba]

Hey Don have you heard if John Golden is doing the SERT yet.  Has he had his school?  I sure would like for him to do mine.

~bubba~

[Twolanerider]

Hey Don have you heard if John Golden is doing the SERT yet.  Has he had his school?  I sure would like for him to do mine.

~bubba~

Last I heard him mention it not yet.  Much training or changing is never going to happen during the rally season for John.  If I hear of "The Great Change" I'll be sure and let you know.

[Bubba]

Last I heard him mention it not yet.  Much training or changing is never going to happen during the rally season for John.  If I hear of "The Great Change" I'll be sure and let you know.

Thanks Don, He sure did a good job on Mark's bike.... I just wish I knew then what I know now,,,,,  I would have kept the PC I bought but just didn't know of the "GREAT ONE" at that time... 

[MUFFMAN]

I've had my Thunder-Max with Auto tune on the bike for about 5k. It came downloaded to coincide with head & cam work & so far no probs. Installing was a breeze & save yourself $300.oo. THE MUFFMAN

[FR8TRN]

I'll join 2Lane.....sold mine a long time back now and don't miss it one bit.  SERT works great......

[BayouBiker]

I've had my TMAT for over 15K mi in 13 months. I love it.
I play with the settings all the time, we got heat indexes over 110 and in the winter I ride when its 35.

I've had good experiences with Zipper's customer service, although others have not had the good fortune.
Personally, I would recommend the Thundermax...

[DCFIREMANN]

I can say YES it is worth it. I was one of the first to own one and I have loved it ever since. I keep a couple around the shop for some of the builds I do. I also have the newer version of the A/T. I have not as of yet installed it on Punkin.

The products for the most part are very good. It is their CUSTOMER SERVICE or shall I say lack of that is killing them. I hear a rumor they are on one of the other HD sites and are helping out with their problems. I don't know why they left here. Maybe because the PLUKING they gave a few of the members here. One thing about them when they are on top they like to stay there. When they go to the bottom they run and hide!

Be Safe

the dawg

[rednectum]

Why is that?

the ability to auto-tune is a good thing within reason. but its this same ability that can be a pitfall. imagine the reversion from the true duals reaching the wideband sensors. the sensors see the diluted gases and think the bike is lean, then they try to richen the mix------continuously!!!

now picture the same reversion being sensed as another exhaust pulse. the sensors may see the "double" exhaust as too  rich a mix and lean out-------continuously!!

add the fact the true duals have unequal pulse timings and you could have example 1 happening on front cyl and example 2 on rear clyinder.

i have alot of these units out there on different motor builds (2 on radical 124 builds) and the only problem i see EVER is when someone installs the tmax with true duals and the centerfold pipes like BSS, LS, radius, short fat, etc:. it is always a reversion issue. to sraighten em out, i usually turn off autotune, clear all learning offsets, and tune the unit just like any other tuning device.

hoping this helps

[SBB]

and the centerfold pipes like BSS, LS, radius, short fat, etc:..

hoping this helps

Dennis


I don't understand what you mean by centerfold pipes?
Splain it please!

 

[rednectum]

Dennis


I don't understand what you mean by centerfold pipes?
Splain it please!

 

ROFLMAPO

[bbrown]

I still do not get it???

[kojak]

I still do not get it???

You mean "rolling on the floor laughing his ass off" or the pretty to look at pipes?

[rednectum]

I had a 06 dyna, stock engine,v+h big radius pipes and had a tm auto tune installed and it still coughed and popped through the air intake sometime's and would back fire out the exhaust at the most inconvenient times usually when a jap bike was next to me or when someone Im riding with on another Harley whom I ranted and raved to about how great the tm is to. I worked at zippers and have to say what a awful place to work at  and talk about a bunch of CHEAP mf's geeez.Alot of the people working there seem very unhappy and some act like the rod thats in thier ass has a rod in it's ass .They never could get my tm right and I was so pissed off when I quit I decided I didnt want my dyna anymore so I sold it to some poor soul and got a 08 ultra. I wouldnt have another tm even if they gave it to me. keep in mind if you have errors which you will, you will have to put your stock ecm back in to clear them. They mark that freakin thing up 400% and a few people I know spent much much less on a HD race tuner, which that I never hear a decel pop or back fire from thier bikes A few people at zippers where nice  so im not speaking for all. Hey atleast Im honest. I hope Dan and Dave read this. see ya

raising the dumbf*ck flag. tell us, where are tony and rosie?? if you can answer that, you win first round.

[sportygordy]

I'll join 2Lane.....sold mine a long time back now and don't miss it one bit.  SERT works great......

didnt sell mine but replaced it with the SERT. Much happier with the SERT, less baby sitting.

[brwk]

Got mine last year at Octoberfest in FL.  Didn't live up to the salemans pitch.  After riding home I called customer support they then said that it was my cam choice.  Nice.....they knew exactly what I had before they installed it.  Then they offered to install their cams at a wonderful price...not.  Got my $ back minus the installation price
Typical bate and switch.  It would be nice to find someone totally honest, realiable, and good close to Frederick, MD.  This time I got the Xieds and SE 4" slips.....and Im done.

[Texas 103]

didnt sell mine but replaced it with the SERT. Much happier with the SERT, less baby sitting.

I'd love to sell mine, $400, complete Auto Tune system ..Greg

[copout221]

Stay away from this product !!!

About 3hrs from home my bike decided to stop idleing properly and I was forced to pull onto the shoulder several times in traffic. At one point I was pushing the bike in highway traffic for almost 3 miles. I WAS PISSED. I called Zippers and they made excuse after excuse blaming the bike, not their product. After I was able to get the bike moving (and cooling it down) it seemed to run OK until my tach and speedo stopped working and all my dash lights came on solid. I stopped and called Zippers again with no real answers. I was forced to pull the ECM fuse and reset the computer. It worked and I was back on the road. After arriving in Ohio I took the bike to a local dealer and explained what was going on. They looked at me like I was an idiot and recommended that I pull the Zippers stuff off and replace it with my factory ECM and O2 sensors. I had my wife ship my stock ECM, race tuner, and O2 sensors to Ohio and the dealer charged me $500.00 to pull the Thundermax, O2 sensors, and related wiring along with making me a custom map on the dyno. I got back on the road in two days and the bike has been running perfectly since. My only complaint with the dealer is they tuned my bike a bit too lean which I was able to correct after getting home (Thanks to DOC..He is a GOD) .

1.I bought the SERT and used it when the bike was new. Bike ran fine.

2.I got stupid and decided to try the Thundermax with Autotune which also seemed to be OK except for the occasional low idle issue and hard starting problems I experienced. I was always on the phone with their customer support and was always told something different.

3. TMax left me on the side of road and I will NEVER fool with one again. In addition, if you have any kind of warranty on your machine you are just stupid to use another ECM on your bike.

NOTE: Zippers offered to replace the ECM and Autotune module without any questions or refund my $$. After 1.5 years of use they refunded 100% of my money which really impressed me. There are not many companies like this out there anymore !!!

[Twolanerider]

Stay away from this product !!!


NOTE: Zippers offered to replace the ECM and Autotune module without any questions or refund my $$. After 1.5 years of use they refunded 100% of my money which really impressed me. There are not many companies like this out there anymore !!!

So they were useless with any effective assistance when it really counted, had no continuity to whatever assistance they did offer but yet are still good guys because they gave you some money back after costing you $500 or more of service fees and three days road time?  Sounds like all things considered you didn't even break even.

Not too long after the Thundermax w/AT came out an acquaintance of mine got one.  Shortly after headed out on a trip out west.  Out in the middle of Nowhere, Utah; within sniffing distance of the Great Basin and its desolation he breaks down.  Completely.  He's two good days from home if that were his next destination and only three days in to his only two weeks vacation of the year.

Bike gets towed to a local dealership.  They aren't bitchy about the bike having an alien ECM onboard but are sure the ECM is the culprit. 

He calls Zippers.  The TMax is only weeks old.  He doesn't assume warranty will be an issue.  He tells them he'll gladly pay any overnight charges on a warranty replacement to get it there the next day so that he can continue on his vacation.  All seems reasonable?  Right?

The company's response was that they'd just loaded up for Daytona (or MB or some other big event, I forget which).  The trailer with the inventory was still there but they couldn't send him a warranty replacement until after the rally event.  They wanted all the stock they could have on hand for the show.

The guy took a bus home.  Then went back out there two weeks later when his warranty replacement finally got in.  Then rode the bike home.  No vacation.  And no assistance from the mftr of any effective kind.  Yeah, these are good guys.  My opinion of their efforts costs more than a refund.

[Coolbreeze]

hmmm......   all things being equal....   I think I'll just try to richen up the map on my PCIII a little. 
My indy tuner went a bit lean, (14.7), and I think that's causing me a bit of heat issues....    I'm too cheap to have him re-dyno it, and he's too cheap to do it for free....     

thanks for the opinions guys.  I really appreciate it. 

BTW,  got back Saturday from the second 3200 mile run in less than a month, and the only probs I had were the broken shoulder in Yellowstone and the motor mount that tried to fall off.  My girls are happy biker kids!

[copout221]

So they were useless with any effective assistance when it really counted, had no continuity to whatever assistance they did offer but yet are still good guys because they gave you some money back after costing you $500 or more of service fees and three days road time?  Sounds like all things considered you didn't even break even.

Not too long after the Thundermax w/AT came out an acquaintance of mine got one.  Shortly after headed out on a trip out west.  Out in the middle of Nowhere, Utah; within sniffing distance of the Great Basin and its desolation he breaks down.  Completely.  He's two good days from home if that were his next destination and only three days in to his only two weeks vacation of the year.

Bike gets towed to a local dealership.  They aren't bitchy about the bike having an alien ECM onboard but are sure the ECM is the culprit. 

He calls Zippers.  The TMax is only weeks old.  He doesn't assume warranty will be an issue.  He tells them he'll gladly pay any overnight charges on a warranty replacement to get it there the next day so that he can continue on his vacation.  All seems reasonable?  Right?

The company's response was that they'd just loaded up for Daytona (or MB or some other big event, I forget which).  The trailer with the inventory was still there but they couldn't send him a warranty replacement until after the rally event.  They wanted all the stock they could have on hand for the show.

The guy took a bus home.  Then went back out there two weeks later when his warranty replacement finally got in.  Then rode the bike home.  No vacation.  And no assistance from the mftr of any effective kind.  Yeah, these are good guys.  My opinion of their efforts costs more than a refund.

WOW..And I thought my story sucked !!! I am just glad I got my money back and my bike is running fine now with the SERT. In addition, I should have NEVER installed an aftermarket ECM on a bike that bought an extended warranty on. NOT TOO SMART 

[Texas 103]

So they were useless with any effective assistance when it really counted, had no continuity to whatever assistance they did offer but yet are still good guys because they gave you some money back after costing you $500 or more of service fees and three days road time?  Sounds like all things considered you didn't even break even.

Not too long after the Thundermax w/AT came out an acquaintance of mine got one.  Shortly after headed out on a trip out west.  Out in the middle of Nowhere, Utah; within sniffing distance of the Great Basin and its desolation he breaks down.  Completely.  He's two good days from home if that were his next destination and only three days in to his only two weeks vacation of the year.

Bike gets towed to a local dealership.  They aren't bitchy about the bike having an alien ECM onboard but are sure the ECM is the culprit. 

He calls Zippers.  The TMax is only weeks old.  He doesn't assume warranty will be an issue.  He tells them he'll gladly pay any overnight charges on a warranty replacement to get it there the next day so that he can continue on his vacation.  All seems reasonable?  Right?

The company's response was that they'd just loaded up for Daytona (or MB or some other big event, I forget which).  The trailer with the inventory was still there but they couldn't send him a warranty replacement until after the rally event.  They wanted all the stock they could have on hand for the show.

The guy took a bus home.  Then went back out there two weeks later when his warranty replacement finally got in.  Then rode the bike home.  No vacation.  And no assistance from the mftr of any effective kind.  Yeah, these are good guys.  My opinion of their efforts costs more than a refund.

Damn Don, I was gonna try to get $39.95 out of mine, guess I'll just use it as a paper weight now....Greg

[Twolanerider]

Damn Don, I was gonna try to get $39.95 out of mine, guess I'll just use it as a paper weight now....Greg