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[grofcvo]

Hi guys/girls,
As a new owner of a CVORK 2014 would like to know if there is a place for dyno runs so I can see what ppl have done to their cvo-s. I will change header pipe (probably fuel moto) and I will re core stock mufflers (like the look) and for cams I have no idea , thats why I need dyno papers to compare and decide. tnx
Grof

[Fired00d]

Search dyno in this board and model specific board(s) to find them.

 
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
 

[GMR-PERFORMANCE]

NOPE you get to sort through them like the rest of us.. HA HA welcome to the board congrats on your new bike. Tons of options out there, Before you dive in I would take your time and choose the cam an ex so that they work together. And know that you will need a dyno tune. Tuning cannot be done over the internet a free map is worth just what you paid for it . Keep those few things in mind. In the end you will get the gains you are looking for.


Example of our cam ex air cleaner and tune on a 2013 . These gains are typical with a good package

[Steve Cole]

I would start by taking the time to read and see what others have done that truely works for what your riding style is. I tell people to take a dyno sheet and fold it in half at the 4000 rpm point. Now go ride your bike and see where you spend most of your time running the engine. Then pull that sheet back out again and look at the side you spend most of your time on. To many people get started by wanting it all and it just doesn't happen! So take your time and pick something that you like and parts that are proven to work together. I would look at how much you want to spend and factor that into what your expecting too. Many here use the Fullsac head pipe and there recores for the stock mufflers and are very happy, so you may want to take a look at that as it's a matched set of parts that's been proven to work if that what you find your looking for. If you looking for more than just that then make sure to match the parts or you going to have nothing more than a lighter wallet.

[2k]

Welcome to our world of SE from NC. Tons of choices as you will find with a search. I went with the Fullsac X and Supertrapp pipes because they are easy & infinitely adjustable when  tuning. Oh yea, Feuling 574's worked great for me. Enjoy!!!

[HILLSIDECYCLE.COM]

Hi guys/girls,
As a new owner of a CVORK 2014 would like to know if there is a place for dyno runs so I can see what ppl have done to their cvo-s. I will change header pipe (probably fuel moto) and I will re core stock mufflers (like the look) and for cams I have no idea , thats why I need dyno papers to compare and decide. tnx
Grof

I like that color on that bike.
Scott

[grofcvo]

NOPE you get to sort through them like the rest of us.. HA HA welcome to the board congrats on your new bike. Tons of options out there, Before you dive in I would take your time and choose the cam an ex so that they work together. And know that you will need a dyno tune. Tuning cannot be done over the internet a free map is worth just what you paid for it . Keep those few things in mind. In the end you will get the gains you are looking for.


Example of our cam ex air cleaner and tune on a 2013 . These gains are typical with a good package

Tnx GMR for your dyno sheet I am looking just for that , so my riding is between 3k-3.5k rpm on open road but I would like torque to be on left side and to stay flat to right , meaning pulling from beginning and going as much as possible to right without loosing tqe. I hope I explained it well, had se 259e on a 103'' and pulled after 3k but I am not racing or going 140mph/hr , torque is more important than hp I think. tnx again

[grofcvo]

I would start by taking the time to read and see what others have done that truely works for what your riding style is. I tell people to take a dyno sheet and fold it in half at the 4000 rpm point. Now go ride your bike and see where you spend most of your time running the engine. Then pull that sheet back out again and look at the side you spend most of your time on. To many people get started by wanting it all and it just doesn't happen! So take your time and pick something that you like and parts that are proven to work together. I would look at how much you want to spend and factor that into what your expecting too. Many here use the Fullsac head pipe and there recores for the stock mufflers and are very happy, so you may want to take a look at that as it's a matched set of parts that's been proven to work if that what you find your looking for. If you looking for more than just that then make sure to match the parts or you going to have nothing more than a lighter wallet.

tnx Steve, my riding is between 3k and 3.5 k on fwy, I want torque to start more on left side meaning 2k and up. You said fullsac head pipe did anyone compare fuel moto any advantages or they are same. For recore exhaust which baffle would be good fro 110'' , can I find sounds file somwhre tnx. Grof

[TinSpinner]

Congrats on the new bike and welcome to the site! Go ahead and lube up the hinges on your wallet, you'll find plenty of ideas on here that will have you opening it frequently. As Steve mentioned, the Fullsac set-up is a proven system and a lot of us use it, myself included. I have the DX pipes and 2" cores with TTS, had Doc at Doc's Performance tune it on the dyno, runs great even with the stock cam, plenty of torque where you need it most. You can find some sound clips on here or probably easier on YouTube, actually I think Fullsac has some on their website; most fail to impress like the real thing though. Good luck!

[joe_lyons50023]

First you need to come up with a budget and what your expectations are.  You might just try getting a good x-pipe fuel moto,fullsac,v&h + mufflers and get the bike tuned and see if you want more than that.  If you want more after that then there are lots more options but the expense starts adding up.

[grofcvo]

First you need to come up with a budget and what your expectations are.  You might just try getting a good x-pipe fuel moto,fullsac,v&h + mufflers and get the bike tuned and see if you want more than that.  If you want more after that then there are lots more options but the expense starts adding up.

Joe, I am looking for something like 110+ hp and 120+ torque , hope this can be achieved with good cams some compression on pistons , xpipes and recore mufflers, with dyno of course.

[joe_lyons50023]

Yes that can be done with cams and compression.  To do the baffle recores for the cvo mufflers you do have some effort involved including grinding away some welds on the inside lip of the pipe, but it does keep the epa stamps on the outside.  That Drago 2-1 is a pretty nice pipe also and has been doing great for power.  Headporting for sure will help out a lot and I think you already have a list of some great names for that.

[Steve Cole]

grofcvo

Are you looking to pay someone to do the work or do it yourself? At first it sounded like you were looking to keep the cost down now it looks like your not so much. Heads, compression and camshafts drive it up a lot versus good exhaust, air cleaner and tuning. 110 hp and 120 torque are outside of what your going to get with just and exhaust. A/C and tune. Sure you will find some BS dynocharts out there that say they did it but look at the average of many charts and you will see that it just doesn't happen in the real world. So if what you really want and are willing to pay for is 110/120 then your going to have to get into the motor and you HD warranty is gone at that point. So pick what you want carefully for your desired outcome and do not mix and match or you will not be happy.

[GMR-PERFORMANCE]

We have done a ton of testing on the 110. ( as we make a cam and wanted to test it step by step for our own kits)   But in a nutshell here is how it breaks down I am working off AVG numbers so please no one get there panties in a wad.

Stage I    Exhaust and air cleaner and tune   95/108 

Stage II  one of several bolt in cams            108/116

Stage III increased compression                  113/123

Stage IIII  larger t/b                                   120/123

Head porting will yield more but that opens a whole new door numbers above are from stock heads.  Who ported the head , did they do it correctly or turn the heads into a door stop.   Making 120/120 as a simple bolt on kit is nothing short of a great running set up. 

[grofcvo]

grofcvo

Are you looking to pay someone to do the work or do it yourself? At first it sounded like you were looking to keep the cost down now it looks like your not so much. Heads, compression and camshafts drive it up a lot versus good exhaust, air cleaner and tuning. 110 hp and 120 torque are outside of what your going to get with just and exhaust. A/C and tune. Sure you will find some BS dynocharts out there that say they did it but look at the average of many charts and you will see that it just doesn't happen in the real world. So if what you really want and are willing to pay for is 110/120 then your going to have to get into the motor and you HD warranty is gone at that point. So pick what you want carefully for your desired outcome and do not mix and match or you will not be happy.

Hi Steve,
Someone will do this for me (RC Cycles ) I am just exploring all options and searching what would be best bang for buck. What do you mean by mix and match.

[grofcvo]

We have done a ton of testing on the 110. ( as we make a cam and wanted to test it step by step for our own kits)   But in a nutshell here is how it breaks down I am working off AVG numbers so please no one get there panties in a wad.

Stage I    Exhaust and air cleaner and tune   95/108 

Stage II  one of several bolt in cams            108/116

Stage III increased compression                  113/123

Stage IIII  larger t/b                                   120/123

Head porting will yield more but that opens a whole new door numbers above are from stock heads.  Who ported the head , did they do it correctly or turn the heads into a door stop.   Making 120/120 as a simple bolt on kit is nothing short of a great running set up. 

thanks for this stages explanations  ,I would be happy with stage III , for this combo what would be best exhaust, cams, and pistons (anything else beside dyno tuning ...) I can't afford to do everything at once so I have to make decision and buy one by one thing and than do final changes.
 

[GMR-PERFORMANCE]

Your email bounces however I have a customer that we just completed a 110 kit that makes the 113/123 range and he loves it however,, long winter and bored so we are in the process of building him a 124.. SO the parts he has have 4000 miles or so and would be for sale give us a ring. Be happy to put you in direct touch with him and you two can work that out.


682-647-1141

[Steve Cole]

Hi Steve,
Someone will do this for me (RC Cycles ) I am just exploring all options and searching what would be best bang for buck. What do you mean by mix and match.

What I mean is getting on the internet and buy parts from several different sources and then take them to someone to install it all. When you do not get what you think you should, who's at fault? Needless to say it happens and the customer feels they got screwed, the installer feels like he got screwed and everyone bitches. Then you go spend more money to try and get what you wanted in the first place. Now you've spent much more than if you had just paid a little more up front with one source to deal with. If you look at a combination of parts try and find several dyno charts for just those parts from several installs. If they have one chart at 120/120 and all the others are 100/100 you should know which ones are real!

Take your time and work with whom you are going to work with to get the job done, then if things are not what you want you have only one source to deal with and it makes it pretty cut and dry. Look for average numbers not the one off BS numbers that you can find on the internet at times. GMR has given you his combinations with straight answers, you can find more from others too but just talk with people upfront to save yourself a lot of time and trouble in the long run.

[prodrag1320]

im thinking he means,same as us (or any decent shop) that he`s got proven builds,but will mix other parts to get your build  to YOUR riding style

[GMR-PERFORMANCE]

I added the parts deal as he brought up the budget thing.. You always spend more on the step by step deal as the tuning costs add up.

[landar]

Keep us posted on your selection.  I too am doing my homework before jumping in and not getting what I thought I was would be.  Right now I'm leaning a a good stage one... Not sure I want to spend for tuning each time I do something to the engine though.

[grofcvo]

Keep us posted on your selection.  I too am doing my homework before jumping in and not getting what I thought I was would be.  Right now I'm leaning a a good stage one... Not sure I want to spend for tuning each time I do something to the engine though.

same here Landar, I wanna make just one time job and be done. It is time consuming do all this reading and searching asking people but at the end will be worth your time.

[GMR-PERFORMANCE]

Keep us posted on your selection.  I too am doing my homework before jumping in and not getting what I thought I was would be.  Right now I'm leaning a a good stage one... Not sure I want to spend for tuning each time I do something to the engine though.

Plenty of sheets to get a idea of what you will get with the stock cam. One thing that I am not thrilled about with the stock cam is the heat that the stock cam will create.. Having tested our own cam against the 255 cam with stage I set up. Nothing lost down low and more power across the curve and reduced heat and increased power in the upper rpm range.. Now Other cams can offer the same type of power. Being that we designed this cam and have it made we are going to keep on testing it vs others, I think most  would understand that    The 255 is and always will be a EPA cam. You are not going to change what it is.

I feel the best thing you can do is drop the stock cam install a better one and a good ex with tune. For most that is all that is needed. Good luck

[grofcvo]

Plenty of sheets to get a idea of what you will get with the stock cam. One thing that I am not thrilled about with the stock cam is the heat that the stock cam will create.. Having tested our own cam against the 255 cam with stage I set up. Nothing lost down low and more power across the curve and reduced heat and increased power in the upper rpm range.. Now Other cams can offer the same type of power. Being that we designed this cam and have it made we are going to keep on testing it vs others, I think most  would understand that    The 255 is and always will be a EPA cam. You are not going to change what it is.

I feel the best thing you can do is drop the stock cam install a better one and a good ex with tune. For most that is all that is needed. Good luck

Did a search for genesis 577 cams could't figure out who makes this cams,( saw you used it at dyno sheet posted above). I like the left side of the torque curve ,want to go with it and have to talk to Frank about exhaust for my RK. Also is it possible to bump compression up in any other way or  I have to change pistons.. tnx

[Unbalanced]

the 3 most common ways to bump up compression

1. Pistons is one way
2.  Smaller (Thinner) Head Gasket
     From the factory on the 110's you will see anywhere from a .04x to .05x thickness head gasket.   To get a thinner head gasket you can go to the after market with say Cometic you can get .030 or .040 thick head gasket.  Mother Harley also offers a thinner SE head gasket I think they are around .045 never used them have always stuck with Cometic.   On some builds you will have a flat base gasket which you can also play with, not the case with the 110 they are a O ring.
3. Decking the heads is yet another.  

Typically I end up using a combination of head gasket trying to get a better squish and decking the heads together due to the large chambers the 110 heads have 94-96 cc typically.   I usually shoot for .030-.037 squish and try and stay under 194 cold cranking compression ideal for me would be about 185.

The higher the compression generally means less durability and the possibility of PMS from the motor.  

Good luck with your build.

[grofcvo]

the 3 most common ways to bump up compression

1. Pistons is one way
2.  Smaller (Thinner) Head Gasket
     From the factory on the 110's you will see anywhere from a .04x to .05x thickness head gasket.   To get a thinner head gasket you can go to the after market with say Cometic you can get .030 or .040 thick head gasket.  Mother Harley also offers a thinner SE head gasket I think they are around .045 never used them have always stuck with Cometic.   On some builds you will have a flat base gasket which you can also play with, not the case with the 110 they are a O ring.
3. Decking the heads is yet another.  

Typically I end up using a combination of head gasket trying to get a better squish and decking the heads together due to the large chambers the 110 heads have 94-96 cc typically.   I usually shoot for .030-.037 squish and try and stay under 194 cold cranking compression ideal for me would be about 185.

The higher the compression generally means less durability and the possibility of PMS from the motor.  

Good luck with your build.

tnx unbalanced, so let say if I go with cometic .30 gasket that will give me little bit of compression and it will result in little bit of gain in HP/TQ and still engine will be solid . Also do you know who makes this genesis 577 cams?

[shelby500]

tnx unbalanced, so let say if I go with cometic .30 gasket that will give me little bit of compression and it will result in little bit of gain in HP/TQ and still engine will be solid . Also do you know who makes this genesis 577 cams?

GMR Performance

[Unbalanced]

tnx unbalanced, so let say if I go with cometic .30 gasket that will give me little bit of compression and it will result in little bit of gain in HP/TQ and still engine will be solid . Also do you know who makes this genesis 577 cams?

GMR Performance makes the Genesis 577 cams.   

The extra compression should help give you a bit more, but it might not change anything it really depends on your heads and the flows and the cam / pipe combination you choose.   If all the components were in line with each other than yes adding a lil extra compression should help your build provided you aren't going over the top and adding PMS.

I would shoot for 185 cold cranking compression with the 577 cams

Here is the thing if you are going to pop the heads off to do a head gasket, then dont cheap out do the headwork / clean up work / springs / valves.   John Sach's does all my stuff and you won't find a better guy to do it there are others who do great work as well like WFO Larry, Bob Wright, Mega-Flow.

[grofcvo]

GMR Performance makes the Genesis 577 cams.   

The extra compression should help give you a bit more, but it might not change anything it really depends on your heads and the flows and the cam / pipe combination you choose.   If all the components were in line with each other than yes adding a lil extra compression should help your build provided you aren't going over the top and adding PMS.

I would shoot for 185 cold cranking compression with the 577 cams

Here is the thing if you are going to pop the heads off to do a head gasket, then dont cheap out do the headwork / clean up work / springs / valves.   John Sach's does all my stuff and you won't find a better guy to do it there are others who do great work as well like WFO Larry, Bob Wright, Mega-Flow.

tnx man, I just ordered dragos dragula 2:1 with 2.55 baffle and I thought to go with genesis 577 like a lot left side of the torque line , will see how  much goes for head work. But for now i spend already a lot of dough. Hope this is good combo for decent ph/tq.

[Unbalanced]

You will have to ask Steve @GMR what the optimal range is for that cam and where it will perform its best.   My guess is you will be a little light on compression to start, but ok, but once the cycle fund is built back up you will be easily able to do the headwork and set the squish with a smaller headgasket and have a real ripper.   I would just look at it as a 2 stage build.

Again good luck.

[GMR-PERFORMANCE]

The cam works very well at stock comp ratio and it has been installed at 11.2 as the highest that I am aware of . No issue at all.   I listed the basic kits from bolt in to all but head work. Another shop listed a few that where even higher.   Sky's the limit. 

[CVO2FIXUP]

  Hey there guy's is there a place on this forum where all the dyno charts are at? Where you can scroll down and pick the charts you want to look at. IE, 110 with pipe and breather and V&H pro pipe.  Click on it and there are the dudes charts and discussion. If there is not a place, can we somehow create one.

[Fired00d]

  Hey there guy's is there a place on this forum where all the dyno charts are at? Where you can scroll down and pick the charts you want to look at. IE, 110 with pipe and breather and V&H pro pipe.  Click on it and there are the dudes charts and discussion. If there is not a place, can we somehow create one.

There is no single one place for these... some are in the twin cam board, exhaust/intake board, and some may be included in threads in the model specific boards... there are several threads along w/this one that members have placed their dyno charts. You may want to search "dyno" to find more.

 
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
 

[lilcoot]

Hey, GrofCVO.  Have you done any of the work you've been talking about here?  I'm curious to see results, since I'm considering the Drago 2-1 pipe and the Genesis 577 cam as well.  Let us know what you end up doing and what kind of results you get.

Dan

[grofcvo]

Hey, GrofCVO.  Have you done any of the work you've been talking about here?  I'm curious to see results, since I'm considering the Drago 2-1 pipe and the Genesis 577 cam as well.  Let us know what you end up doing and what kind of results you get.

Dan

Hey , I got exhaust from Drago's , and got cams from GMR, (big tnx to both gentlemen ) I was sick more than week, been riding when I got time. Need to make 500 more miles to do first oil change and than install exhaust , cams and do dyno (TTS is on the way) . Also got cometic gasket but will not change it for now , reason gain vs cost. But will keep it for future, all work will be done by RC cycles. Soon as I finish this (wish could do it tomorrow   ) will let you guys know results.
be safe
Grof 

[grofcvo]

Hi guys,
Today was big day did dyno tuning on my bike.
Big thanks to Steve at GMR, Frank at Drago's bike work and Bob at RC cycles.
Got GMR577 cams, dragula 2:1, and Bob tuned it with TTS.
Bike is very responsive and smooth, love it. Power is no the left side of the chart where I ride most.
So thanks one more time for great products, and great work at RC's.

[SDCVO]

Hi guys,
Today was big day did dyno tuning on my bike.
Big thanks to Steve at GMR, Frank at Drago's bike work and Bob at RC cycles.
Got GMR577 cams, dragula 2:1, and Bob tuned it with TTS.
Bike is very responsive and smooth, love it. Power is no the left side of the chart where I ride most.
So thanks one more time for great products, and great work at RC's.

Bob is the best! chart looks great, enjoy!

[SG Racer]

Great looking results.
 Congratulations.

[hogdownunder]

Hi GMR,

In regards to this thread, for a 110 engine, with your Genesis 577 Bolt-in Cam, will the original factory Pushrods work OK, or does an adjustable pushrod alternative need to be fitted (eg, S & S). Also, do you suggest replacing the lifters with say  S & S while the Cam is being replaced?

[lilcoot]

Very nice!  Long, flat curve with torque above 100 from 2300 to 5300 rpm.    Sweet!  

Thanks for posting, grofcvo.

[GMR-PERFORMANCE]

Hi GMR,

In regards to this thread, for a 110 engine, with your Genesis 577 Bolt-in Cam, will the original factory Pushrods work OK, or does an adjustable pushrod alternative need to be fitted (eg, S & S). Also, do you suggest replacing the lifters with say  S & S while the Cam is being replaced?

We have used both stock push rods and adjustable's either way will work fine with stock parts. If a .030 head gasket where used I would feel better about a set of adjustable.  Stock lifters are not great so that goes without saying.   Great TQ curve 

[hogdownunder]

Hi GMR,

Thank you for your reply..

Best regards,..

[GMR-PERFORMANCE]

Sure thing.. What part?? I have friends in Port Kennedy , and Wodonga..

[hogdownunder]

Hi GMR,

I am from the state of NSW (New South Wales) near the City of Sydney.

[05Train]

Very impressive torque curve.  Bet that thing is a hoot to squirt out of corners.

[grofcvo]

would be nice to have a 'dyno discussion forum' here to see what people do  with CVO's.

[ImBroke]

I agree