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Author Topic: Bleeding ABS without Harley Scan Tool  (Read 21105 times)

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Aussie

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Re: Bleeding ABS without Harley Scan Tool
« Reply #15 on: April 23, 2017, 08:49:29 PM »

Bleeding ABS without Harley Scan Tool

So I read the manual on how to bleed brakes. Step 1 is use a vacuum bleeder but if you don't have one follow directions below. Those directions use the old pump it up and crack the bleeder until clean fluid and no air bubbles pass. Next step is hook up the Harley scan tool and activate the ABS. Never instructed to bleed again. So I wonder if Dealer is vacuum bleeding, do they activate the ABS and bleed more or just circulate some fluid after bleeding is done ?


I bleed the Rear Brakes on my 2012 SG after experiencing poor braking.
I don't use the rear brakes that often and thought it was time to run a brake test before and after bleeding.
Before bleeding couldn't get the ABS to activate, after bleeding ABS kicked in on heavy braking.

Vacuum bleed the system and noticed lots of tiny air bubbles being sucked out, just got to be care full not to drain reservoir to low and suck air into the system.
Went for a test ride and cycle the ABS a few times, Brakes are 100% better.
« Last Edit: April 23, 2017, 09:01:55 PM by Aussie »
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skratch

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Re: Bleeding ABS without Harley Scan Tool
« Reply #16 on: April 23, 2017, 11:04:13 PM »

It would appear that since the ABS unit is no longer available, the alternative if the unit fails is to re-plumb to standard non-abs brakes.

I know this is an old thread, but I just saw the above quote.  I hadn't heard that you could no longer get the abs module, anyone know anything about that?  I know that for a while, they were on backorder.
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grc

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Re: Bleeding ABS without Harley Scan Tool
« Reply #17 on: April 24, 2017, 08:32:15 AM »

I know this is an old thread, but I just saw the above quote.  I hadn't heard that you could no longer get the abs module, anyone know anything about that?  I know that for a while, they were on backorder.

I seriously doubt Harley would be allowed to not make repair parts available for a less than ten year old safety system like the brakes.  As far as I can tell they changed from a single assembly that incorporated both the module and the pump/valves to a system where each is a separate part number.  I always assumed that was due to the fact they were having to pay for so many replacements under warranty and it was cheaper to only replace the part that was defective. :nixweiss:  There should be a way to update an older model to the new system.  I'd hate to think people are out there converting back to standard brakes after paying extra for ABS.  I sure wouldn't do it without first consulting H-D and perhaps NHTSA.

Jerry
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Chief2505

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Re: Bleeding ABS without Harley Scan Tool
« Reply #18 on: June 16, 2017, 05:33:57 PM »

Never gave changing brake fluid a thought until I received a letter from HD this week reminding me that it is very important to have this service work performed on my 13 CVO.

After doing some reading on here it appears I should change the brake fluid but I have neither the digital tech or a vacuum pump so I guess I am stuck paying someone to do this service.

Funny thing though the bike is 4 years old and this is the first time HD has reminded me to change the brake fluid and I have had ABS Harley's since 2008!
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FLSTFI Dave

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Re: Bleeding ABS without Harley Scan Tool
« Reply #19 on: June 17, 2017, 09:09:43 AM »

Never gave changing brake fluid a thought until I received a letter from HD this week reminding me that it is very important to have this service work performed on my 13 CVO.

After doing some reading on here it appears I should change the brake fluid but I have neither the digital tech or a vacuum pump so I guess I am stuck paying someone to do this service.

Funny thing though the bike is 4 years old and this is the first time HD has reminded me to change the brake fluid and I have had ABS Harley's since 2008!

Got the letter about changing brake fluid on my 13 CVO King recently also.  I have had several other CVO's with ABS and never got a letter
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TinSpinner

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Re: Bleeding ABS without Harley Scan Tool
« Reply #20 on: June 17, 2017, 09:25:28 AM »

Never gave changing brake fluid a thought until I received a letter from HD this week reminding me that it is very important to have this service work performed on my 13 CVO.

After doing some reading on here it appears I should change the brake fluid but I have neither the digital tech or a vacuum pump so I guess I am stuck paying someone to do this service.

Funny thing though the bike is 4 years old and this is the first time HD has reminded me to change the brake fluid and I have had ABS Harley's since 2008!

Same for me, got the letter yesterday. I knew it was recommended but since I don't have many miles on my bike I had not changed the fluid. I'll check with an indy I know first before I take it to the dealership. My dealership has changed hands and is now a clothes store that sells an occasional motorcycle, the service department seems to be an afterthought to them now.
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deldago

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Re: Bleeding ABS without Harley Scan Tool
« Reply #21 on: June 20, 2017, 03:15:00 PM »

Never gave changing brake fluid a thought until I received a letter from HD this week reminding me that it is very important to have this service work performed on my 13 CVO.

After doing some reading on here it appears I should change the brake fluid but I have neither the digital tech or a vacuum pump so I guess I am stuck paying someone to do this service.

Funny thing though the bike is 4 years old and this is the first time HD has reminded me to change the brake fluid and I have had ABS Harley's since 2008!
Just did all three calipers and clutch last week with a syringe that I bought off Ebay. It came with two hose ends that fit the bleeder on the caliper's bleeder and a smaller one that fit the bleeder on the clutch. I sucked most of the fluid out of the master cylinder that I was working on and then filled the syringe up with fresh fluid. Held the syringe upside down and got all the air out by depressing the plunger until brake fluid came out. Hooked the hose to the bleeder and cracked it open. Depressed the plunger until the mater cylinder was full, closed the bleeder and went through the process a second time for each. Any air bubbles are pushed up into the master cylinder naturally. The clutch was unbelievably dirty! After completing all brakes I took it for a ride and activated the ABS a few times to get fresh fluid through it. Everything works as new for a total cost of around $20 and a few hours of my time.
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Re: Bleeding ABS without Harley Scan Tool
« Reply #22 on: June 20, 2017, 06:48:19 PM »

Just did all three calipers and clutch last week with a syringe that I bought off Ebay. It came with two hose ends that fit the bleeder on the caliper's bleeder and a smaller one that fit the bleeder on the clutch. I sucked most of the fluid out of the master cylinder that I was working on and then filled the syringe up with fresh fluid. Held the syringe upside down and got all the air out by depressing the plunger until brake fluid came out. Hooked the hose to the bleeder and cracked it open. Depressed the plunger until the mater cylinder was full, closed the bleeder and went through the process a second time for each. Any air bubbles are pushed up into the master cylinder naturally. The clutch was unbelievably dirty! After completing all brakes I took it for a ride and activated the ABS a few times to get fresh fluid through it. Everything works as new for a total cost of around $20 and a few hours of my time.
You've been hanging out with the wrenches in the back of the shop again haven't you? ;D
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jachd17

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Re: Bleeding ABS without Harley Scan Tool
« Reply #23 on: June 20, 2017, 07:45:33 PM »

I got the letter yesterday. I am the second owner of the bike, not quite sure how I still got the letter. MOCO seems to be attempting to cover their backsides due to some reported ABS "issues". I do prefer the ABS over the regular brakes though.
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Dan_Lockwood

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Re: Bleeding ABS without Harley Scan Tool
« Reply #24 on: July 05, 2017, 04:00:47 PM »

I would just like to share my experience with vacuum bleeding.

First off it allows for a single person to bleed brakes and to get the majority of the fluid running through from the master to the slave.

But..... when you loosen the brake bleeder to allow fluid to be vacuumed out of the caliper or slave cylinder, you also now have clearance around the threads.  If the line/caliper resistance to flowing fluid is greater than sucking air in around the threads of the brake bleeder, you're going to see lots of tiny air bubbles.  These bubble may or may NOT be from the sealed brake system.

So in my opinion, be a bit leery of just using the vacuum bleeder to do the work for you.  Again, it's a great place to start out, but I do like to do the final pressure bleeding with the master putting out the fluid under pressure rather than sucking out the fluid.
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Re: Bleeding ABS without Harley Scan Tool
« Reply #25 on: July 05, 2017, 09:44:49 PM »

Just did all three calipers and clutch last week with a syringe that I bought off Ebay. It came with two hose ends that fit the bleeder on the caliper's bleeder and a smaller one that fit the bleeder on the clutch. I sucked most of the fluid out of the master cylinder that I was working on and then filled the syringe up with fresh fluid. Held the syringe upside down and got all the air out by depressing the plunger until brake fluid came out. Hooked the hose to the bleeder and cracked it open. Depressed the plunger until the mater cylinder was full, closed the bleeder and went through the process a second time for each. Any air bubbles are pushed up into the master cylinder naturally. The clutch was unbelievably dirty! After completing all brakes I took it for a ride and activated the ABS a few times to get fresh fluid through it. Everything works as new for a total cost of around $20 and a few hours of my time.


Do you happen to have a link/part number to the one you bought? There sure is a lot of them.

Many thanks.

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deldago

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Re: Bleeding ABS without Harley Scan Tool
« Reply #26 on: July 11, 2017, 02:42:10 PM »

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Re: Bleeding ABS without Harley Scan Tool
« Reply #27 on: May 25, 2018, 09:12:18 PM »

suck resevoir out with wifes turkey baster[she will not miss it till thanksgiving] clean resevoir out as good as possible and refill with proper fluid. you can do this every oil change and it will cycle around system. if you want to go further, stop at parts store and get a 2-3 ft piece of vacum line[clear if possible] that fits bleeder, take top off resevoir clean out and refill,make sure bleeder will loosen, leave wrench on bleeder and put hose on bleeder and run to a clear bottle. open bleeder and let flow until clear fluid comes out, top off resevoir as needed so it does not run empty, usually 3 times resevoir capacity is plenty. gravity is you friend.  if you want to cycle the ABS when done,find a parking lot or un-busy street no sand or unstable materil on surface[make sure no one is behind you]15 to 20 mph try to lock up rear brake,it is a linked system so when one trys to lock up they both activate.   DO NOT GET BRAKE FLUID ON PAINTED PARTS  gravity bleeding is less likely to get air in system.
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SIX38

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Re: Bleeding ABS without Harley Scan Tool
« Reply #28 on: May 30, 2018, 08:23:15 PM »

Here is my tale of “Harley strikes again”,
My sons and I are preparing for a two week trip out to Oregon and the surrounding area. Trucker is picking up the bikes in NY this Sat, June 2. I have been busy getting the bikes prepared and I keep all their bikes in meticulous condition. I have been wrenching cars, motorcycles, hot rods etc. for over 50 years and have a fully equipped shop.
With that having been said, in order to play by the book, I brought the bikes into a HD dealership to have the “Brake Flush” recall performed and documented. So far all is well, we are ready to roll.
And today, two days prior to our trip, Michael’s 2010 Road King Classic has no rear brakes. The master cylinder and caliper is fine, but there is zero flow through the ABS Hydraulic Control Unit. Pedal is rock hard and not moving. Dealer is willing to repair in time, but of course the part is not available. I’m not happy at all‼️
Only Harley Davidson would have a ABS that fails with no braking as a result. Unbelievable.
Only Harley Davidson would use internal HCU parts that are prone to corrosion. (The hygroscopic properties of brake fluid are well known)
Only Harley Davidson would attempt to con their customers into believing that a fluid flush will solve an obviously defective ABS HCU design.
This defect will kill some one soon and there have been numerous accidents and injuries already reported. (Hence the NHTSA “flush”recall)
What needs to be done is a recall to replace this ticking bomb. PERIOD!
If you have experienced this problem (It can affect front or rear brakes) be sure to report this to HD and to the NHTSA and let all Riders you know about this potential killer defect.

As for our trip, all I will say is that Dad came up with a solution, and Michael’s bike has brakes front and rear.
Be safe out there!
Tom P.

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