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[Texas 103]

Just reinstalled my Stock ECM on my '05 and I get no engine light and no Injector pump running. Battery was disconnected when I reinstalled.   Is there a magic something I need to do when I reinstall the ECM. Checked the obvious, Battery and fuses...Any ideas?? Thanks Greg   

[Texas 103]

Just reinstalled my Stock ECM on my '05 and I get no engine light and no Injector pump running. Battery was disconnected when I reinstalled.   Is there a magic something I need to do when I reinstall the ECM. Checked the obvious, Battery and fuses...Any ideas?? Thanks Greg   


Just got off the phone with my Buddy at Harley and found out anytime that you disconnect the stock ECM from the system it has to relearn the password...Here's the process...I'll keep you posted.. 

Harley ECM Password Learn Procedure

When installing a new ignition or ECM on a security-equipped Harley there is a "Password Learn" procedure that must be performed. This applies to all Twin Cam and V-Rod models with factory security but may also apply to Twin Cam's with EFI. The TSM/TSSM and ECM have "learned" passwords that synchronize the control module with several other components. Once you remove a component from this chain the module shuts down and won't start. This is reported to only occur with EFI models but the new 2004 carbureted models demonstrate the same shut-down when changing the ignition module.

Once you have installed the ignition module and reconnected the battery, perform the starting sequence as normal. The engine will cough once in an effort to start but will fail when the module shuts off the fuel.

Special Note: During the Password Learning procedure the ignition will remain in the "On" position for an extended period of time (30+ minutes). While "On", power is supplied to the headlight thus draining the battery. If the battery charge drops below a certain level during the Password Learn procedure the process will cease and you will have to start over. To avoid this connect a trickle charger to the battery throughout the procedure.

Download the Password Learn procedure in PDF for printing.
Step    Action    Confirmation    Notes
1    Set Run switch to Run    -    - 
2    Turn Ignition key On-Off-On-Off-On-Off-On and then toggle the Left Turn Signal switch twice.    -      - 
3    Turn Ignition key Off-On    Verify the Check Engine lamp and Security Lamp illuminate briefly and then turn off.    Security lamp will not illuminate on non-security (TSM) Twin Cam models.
4    Attempt normal start one time.    Engine starts and stalls immediately. check engine lamp stays on.    Password has not been learned and sets trouble code P1009, thus stopping fuel flow.
5    Wait 10 seconds    Security Lamp remains lit for V-Rod and TC88 with TSSM. Lamp will not be on for TC88 TSM models.    ECM enters Password Learning mode for 10 minutes. Do Not cycle the ignition or disrupt power.
6    Wait until Security Lamp turns off or a minimum of 10 minutes has passed.    -      - 
7    Quickly (within 2 seconds) turn Ignition key OFF-ON    Security Lamp remains lit for V-Rod and TC88 with TSSM. Lamp will not be on for TC88 TSM models.    - 
8    Wait until Security Lamp turns off or a minimum of 10 minutes has passed.    -      Password Learning mode for 10 minutes. Do Not cycle the ignition or disrupt power.
9    Quickly (within 2 seconds) turn Ignition key OFF-ON    Security Lamp remains lit for V-Rod and TC88 with TSSM. Lamp will not be on for TC88 TSM models.    - 
10    Wait until Security Lamp turns off or a minimum of 10 minutes has passed.    -      Password Learning mode for 10 minutes. Do Not cycle the ignition or disrupt power.
11    Quickly (within 2 seconds) turn Ignition key OFF-ON    Security Lamp light and then turn off. Lamp will not be on for TC88 TSM models.    - 
12    Turn Ignition switch OFF. Wait 15 seconds. Turn Ignition switch ON and start engine to confirm the Password Learn Procedure is successful.    Engine will start and remain running. If engine immediately stalls and fails to restart the procedure was not successful. Start over at step 1.    - 
   The above steps must be timed and performed exactly as described. Any deviation will require you to start again from step 1.



 

[Texas 103]

Just reinstalled my Stock ECM on my '05 and I get no engine light and no Injector pump running. Battery was disconnected when I reinstalled.   Is there a magic something I need to do when I reinstall the ECM. Checked the obvious, Battery and fuses...Any ideas?? Thanks Greg   


Just got off the phone with my Buddy at Harley and found out anytime that you disconnect the stock ECM from the system it has to relearn the password...Here's the process...I'll keep you posted.. 

Harley ECM Password Learn Procedure from   http://www.harley-performance.com/index.html

When installing a new ignition or ECM on a security-equipped Harley there is a "Password Learn" procedure that must be performed. This applies to all Twin Cam and V-Rod models with factory security but may also apply to Twin Cam's with EFI. The TSM/TSSM and ECM have "learned" passwords that synchronize the control module with several other components. Once you remove a component from this chain the module shuts down and won't start. This is reported to only occur with EFI models but the new 2004 carbureted models demonstrate the same shut-down when changing the ignition module.

Once you have installed the ignition module and reconnected the battery, perform the starting sequence as normal. The engine will cough once in an effort to start but will fail when the module shuts off the fuel.

Special Note: During the Password Learning procedure the ignition will remain in the "On" position for an extended period of time (30+ minutes). While "On", power is supplied to the headlight thus draining the battery. If the battery charge drops below a certain level during the Password Learn procedure the process will cease and you will have to start over. To avoid this connect a trickle charger to the battery throughout the procedure.

Download the Password Learn procedure in PDF for printing.
Step    Action    Confirmation    Notes
1    Set Run switch to Run    -    - 
2    Turn Ignition key On-Off-On-Off-On-Off-On and then toggle the Left Turn Signal switch twice.    -      - 
3    Turn Ignition key Off-On    Verify the Check Engine lamp and Security Lamp illuminate briefly and then turn off.    Security lamp will not illuminate on non-security (TSM) Twin Cam models.
4    Attempt normal start one time.    Engine starts and stalls immediately. check engine lamp stays on.    Password has not been learned and sets trouble code P1009, thus stopping fuel flow.
5    Wait 10 seconds    Security Lamp remains lit for V-Rod and TC88 with TSSM. Lamp will not be on for TC88 TSM models.    ECM enters Password Learning mode for 10 minutes. Do Not cycle the ignition or disrupt power.
6    Wait until Security Lamp turns off or a minimum of 10 minutes has passed.    -      - 
7    Quickly (within 2 seconds) turn Ignition key OFF-ON    Security Lamp remains lit for V-Rod and TC88 with TSSM. Lamp will not be on for TC88 TSM models.    - 
8    Wait until Security Lamp turns off or a minimum of 10 minutes has passed.    -      Password Learning mode for 10 minutes. Do Not cycle the ignition or disrupt power.
9    Quickly (within 2 seconds) turn Ignition key OFF-ON    Security Lamp remains lit for V-Rod and TC88 with TSSM. Lamp will not be on for TC88 TSM models.    - 
10    Wait until Security Lamp turns off or a minimum of 10 minutes has passed.    -      Password Learning mode for 10 minutes. Do Not cycle the ignition or disrupt power.
11    Quickly (within 2 seconds) turn Ignition key OFF-ON    Security Lamp light and then turn off. Lamp will not be on for TC88 TSM models.    - 
12    Turn Ignition switch OFF. Wait 15 seconds. Turn Ignition switch ON and start engine to confirm the Password Learn Procedure is successful.    Engine will start and remain running. If engine immediately stalls and fails to restart the procedure was not successful. Start over at step 1.    - 
   The above steps must be timed and performed exactly as described. Any deviation will require you to start again from step 1.



 

[Midnight Rider]

do you also have to chew gum, pat your head, and rub your belly?


Glad you got it figured out, and hope you are succesful with the timing!!

[Twolanerider]

Good grief!  And I thought I was applying some level of redundant backup by carrying the original ECM all wrapped up nice and safe in the bottom of the saddlebag after the Thundermax went on. 

That is a nutso procedure.  Totally nutso.  I thought the cruise cable lash adjustment was about two steps longer than it needed to be.  Some of the manual alarm functions are very funky as well.  But this one seems to set the record for a level of funk unsurpassed elsewhere.  The only excuse for a procedure like that is a software engineer with a bad sense of humor or one whose spouse hadn't been putting out for quite awhile.

[Fired00d]

Good grief!  And I thought I was applying some level of redundant backup by carrying the original ECM all wrapped up nice and safe in the bottom of the saddlebag after the Thundermax went on. 

That is a nutso procedure.  Totally nutso.  I thought the cruise cable lash adjustment was about two steps longer than it needed to be.  Some of the manual alarm functions are very funky as well.  But this one seems to set the record for a level of funk unsurpassed elsewhere.  The only excuse for a procedure like that is a software engineer with a bad sense of humor or one whose spouse hadn't been putting out for quite awhile.

Wise words spoken from my brother of a another mother.

 
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
 

[Texas 103]

Good grief!  And I thought I was applying some level of redundant backup by carrying the original ECM all wrapped up nice and safe in the bottom of the saddlebag after the Thundermax went on. 

That is a nutso procedure.  Totally nutso.  I thought the cruise cable lash adjustment was about two steps longer than it needed to be.  Some of the manual alarm functions are very funky as well.  But this one seems to set the record for a level of funk unsurpassed elsewhere.  The only excuse for a procedure like that is a software engineer with a bad sense of humor or one whose spouse hadn't been putting out for quite awhile.

Thoght you might appreciate this Don>> I just ASSumed that you could just yank the stock ECM on and off no big deal>>  No deal>>> Almost makes me want to put the TMAX back on and buy another one so I won't have to do it. Im going to give it a whirl and if it dosen't work I'll put the TMAX on ride it down to Harley let them do it and we are done>>> By the way is anyone going on the RUN FOR THE WALL SOuthern Route??? I'm picking it up in Weatherford Texas and going all the way to D.C>>>>     

[Fired00d]

..... By the way is anyone going on the RUN FOR THE WALL SOuthern Route??? I'm picking it up in Weatherford Texas and going all the way to D.C>>>>     

Not doing the Run To The Wall ride, but some of us are trying to get together during this event. Check/watch this thread - Rolling Thunder. Hopefully we can get something together for a meet/greet on Saturday someplace. I've found out in the past trying to meet someone on the Sunday of the event w/all the traffic/activity going on is near to impossible.

 
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
 

[Twolanerider]

Thoght you might appreciate this Don>> I just ASSumed that you could just yank the stock ECM on and off no big deal>>  No deal>>> Almost makes me want to put the TMAX back on and buy another one so I won't have to do it. Im going to give it a whirl and if it dosen't work I'll put the TMAX on ride it down to Harley let them do it and we are done>>> By the way is anyone going on the RUN FOR THE WALL SOuthern Route??? I'm picking it up in Weatherford Texas and going all the way to D.C>>>>     

Yeah, my head is still spinning over that setup.  I'm wondering one thing though; if the procedure only applies if another ECM has been hooked up in between or if it applies any time the ECM has been unhooked.

Wonder because my ECM had been unhooked before during Power Commander installations and removals.  Even had a Power Commander crap out on this bike.  Stopped at a rest stop.  Unhooked it.  Plugged the ECM back in directly and rode away.

So it's not an absolute that any time the ECM is unhooked it has to go back through this one legged toe tapping initialization procedure.  I'm almost curious enough to plug my OE module back in for a minute just to see what happens.  Almost......

[iski]

Just reinstalled my Stock ECM on my '05 and I get no engine light and no Injector pump running. Battery was disconnected when I reinstalled.   Is there a magic something I need to do when I reinstall the ECM. Checked the obvious, Battery and fuses...Any ideas?? Thanks Greg   

You need to install a mystery button.

There is a thread on this somewhere around here.

[Twolanerider]

You need to install a mystery button.

 

[Texas 103]

NO what the hell I need is an EASY BUTTON>>>>Greg

[Hoist!]

You need to install a mystery button.

There is a thread on this somewhere around here.

By jove, I think he's getting it! Hoist!

[Twolanerider]

NO what the hell I need is an EASY BUTTON>>>>Greg

Mystery button.  Easy button.  If you use 'em right it's the same thing!

[Texas 103]

Mystery button.  Easy button.  If you use 'em right it's the same thing!

PROBLEM SOLVED!!!>> After using a test light across all the fuses I found the ignition fuse blown, It blew right down in the corner where you couldn't see it.  Called a buddy and Got got the print out and started disconnecting things.. Started with the ECM, put another fuse in it and it blew again...Removed the faring cap unplugged the connector for the ignition switch to the main harness ,put in a fuse and bingo. No blown fuse when the ignition turned on. What we found was the gray wire in the harness got wedged between the faring cap and the inner faring brace and pinched it put a little hole the size of  a ball point pen in the wire. You could see where it arced and went to ground, Repaired the wire slit some small rubber hose and tie wrapped it to the bracket. TURNED THE KEY AND THE MUSIC STARTED PLAYING!!! How sweet is it!!... A couple of lessons learned 1. Always check fuses with a test light. 2. Damn it;s good to have friends!

YOK TWOLANE>>>ou can breath easy now.. I had the stock ECM on the bike and it fired right up with out any of that Password learn stuff....Thanks to everyone for their assistance! Greg

[Twolanerider]

PROBLEM SOLVED!!!>>


YOK TWOLANE>>>ou can breath easy now.. I had the stock ECM on the bike and it fired right up with out any of that Password learn stuff....Thanks to everyone for their assistance! Greg

Dammit, now I feel bad.  Wondered about exactly that.  Even started to write it and ask it.  Then thought "ah, given how it was acting surely he checked it." 

Really sorry.  Should have just written it and not thought so darned much.

In any case glad that is all it was.  Also did a little homework through a source on the ECM programming and found out earlier today that we didn't have all those hoops to jump through just to swap to swap it in and out.  Nice to see it confirmed in practice though.  Thankyewveramuch  .

[Texas 103]

Dammit, now I feel bad.  Wondered about exactly that.  Even started to write it and ask it.  Then thought "ah, given how it was acting surely he checked it." 

Really sorry.  Should have just written it and not thought so darned much.

In any case glad that is all it was.  Also did a little homework through a source on the ECM programming and found out earlier today that we didn't have all those hoops to jump through just to swap to swap it in and out.  Nice to see it confirmed in practice though.  Thankyewveramuch  .

You are welcome>>>I looked right at that fuse even put a light on the back side of it..Damn it looked good>>>See you in Hot Springs and hope to see some of you on The Run For The  Wall>>>>>  I guess that password thing would be true if you were starting with a brand new ECM??? >> Greg 

[Twolanerider]

You are welcome>>>I looked right at that fuse even put a light on the back side of it..Damn it looked good>>>See you in Hot Springs and hope to see some of you on The Run For The  Wall>>>>>  I guess that password thing would be true if you were starting with a brand new ECM??? >> Greg 

Yes, that's what it looked like from what I saw.  New parts that have never seen each other before have that long winded initialization process.  Once they know each other, however, you can plug and play.

I'm really looking forward to Hot Springs too.  That's going to be a great group to get together.  Playing it all fast and loose will be an excellent non-plan too.

Have watched the mentions of the Run for the Wall also.  Have fingers crossed for enough time to do at least some.   But it's not looking to be too likely.  Still trying though.  Just have to wait and see.

[hd-dude]

Greg, Glad you got it worked out

[Smiler]

Greg - more wisdom for us ALL to file away for the future

[Eqcons]

Good grief!  And I thought I was applying some level of redundant backup by carrying the original ECM all wrapped up nice and safe in the bottom of the saddlebag after the Thundermax went on. 

I thought that was a good idea, after reading how you were doing it 2L.   But you'd need to carry the standard O₂ sensors too, I guess, yes?

Now if I am to do it, the map in the original ECM will be wrong, and, now that the active valves are missing from my inlet and exhaust, it would start trhowing out errors like there was no tomorrow.   So, I got to thinking (yes, that's what that strange noise was!)    Could I get someone with a SERT, and the latest SERT software to temporarily fit my ECM to their bike, check the boxes to disable the active valves, and install Map 84 or 94.  That way if I carried it as a spare, at least it would work without the valve errors, and have a close enough map.......  Possible? 

Jim

[Twolanerider]

I thought that was a good idea, after reading how you were doing it 2L.   But you'd need to carry the standard O₂ sensors too, I guess, yes?

Jim, with an 07 the ECM swap on the side of the road would be MUCH more trouble.  In fact not really a practical solution.  Mine is an 05 though.  So no sensors in the stock mix to contend with.

In my case it really would be just unplugging the T-Max ECM and plugging the stock piece back in its place.  To get in from whereever I might have been broken down could just ride with the wide band o2 sensors going along and doing nothing.  The map in my stock ECM had already been through a SERT install and would also be close enough to use as a tool to get me in from a break down situation.

I wouldn't ride it hard with that map in it.  But it'd certainly be better than being broken down hours away from support or beyond cell phone range.  Also like having it for that potential time something craps out a long way from home and the dealer or other shop says "d'uh, it must be that Thundermax thing; but we can't check it out without it being stock."  Then I could walk away, walk back in in 10 minutes, and say "hey Gomer, it's stock again you lazy f&*(*^g moron."

[Texas 103]

Jim, with an 07 the ECM swap on the side of the road would be MUCH more trouble.  In fact not really a practical solution.  Mine is an 05 though.  So no sensors in the stock mix to contend with.

In my case it really would be just unplugging the T-Max ECM and plugging the stock piece back in its place.  To get in from whereever I might have been broken down could just ride with the wide band o2 sensors going along and doing nothing.  The map in my stock ECM had already been through a SERT install and would also be close enough to use as a tool to get me in from a break down situation.

I wouldn't ride it hard with that map in it.  But it'd certainly be better than being broken down hours away from support or beyond cell phone range.  Also like having it for that potential time something craps out a long way from home and the dealer or other shop says "d'uh, it must be that Thundermax thing; but we can't check it out without it being stock."  Then I could walk away, walk back in in 10 minutes, and say "hey Gomer, it's stock again you lazy f&*(*^g moron."



Hey Don,
I wasn't going to share this because I already felt like a goober for pinching the wire>>But>>> I dropped the damned ECM on the garage floor before I installed it , not by design mind you, I just f&^k*d up..needless to say I was really thrilled when it fired up, Just thought you would like to have more peace of mind that your ECM swap will work.. Even if you drop it before you install it>>> Now that I think about it maybe that's why it is working>>>    Greg

[Twolanerider]

Hey Don,
I wasn't going to share this because I already felt like a goober for pinching the wire>>But>>> I dropped the damned ECM on the garage floor before I installed it , not by design mind you, I just f&^k*d up..needless to say I was really thrilled when it fired up, Just thought you would like to have more peace of mind that your ECM swap will work.. Even if you drop it before you install it>>> Now that I think about it maybe that's why it is working>>>    Greg

Ouch!  The drop test was certainly service above and beyond the call of duty.  Sure appreciate the extra support though    .

My old one is still safely bubble wrapped and still living under the rain gear and other stuff that just about never comes out of the right saddlebag.  Hopefully will never need.  But as free insurance for one of those "just-in-case" moments it's worth keeping stuck in there.

[Eqcons]

Jim, with an 07 the ECM swap on the side of the road would be MUCH more trouble.  In fact not really a practical solution.  Mine is an 05 though.  So no sensors in the stock mix to contend with.

In my case it really would be just unplugging the T-Max ECM and plugging the stock piece back in its place.  To get in from whereever I might have been broken down could just ride with the wide band o2 sensors going along and doing nothing.  The map in my stock ECM had already been through a SERT install and would also be close enough to use as a tool to get me in from a break down situation.

I wouldn't ride it hard with that map in it.  But it'd certainly be better than being broken down hours away from support or beyond cell phone range.  Also like having it for that potential time something craps out a long way from home and the dealer or other shop says "d'uh, it must be that Thundermax thing; but we can't check it out without it being stock."  Then I could walk away, walk back in in 10 minutes, and say "hey Gomer, it's stock again you lazy f&*(*^g moron."

Don't see it being much more trouble, 2L - just as you say, plus change the O₂ sensors - adds an extra 5 mins to the job.  The main reason for me wanting to do it is so Gomer can't moan about not being able to connect the digitech in the case of problems, just as you say.  It's either change the ECM + the O₂ sensors to do that if I have a SERT loaded map on it, or change the ECM + the O₂ sensors + the air cleaner + the whole exhaust system if I don't!
 

Jim