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[trahog]

after all the suggested problems for wobble this is a new tire I recived yesterday with only 1300 miles on old one,still wobbles and look at all the weights 7 on each side.Has any one ever heard of that many weights or does any one think bad rim,not getting much help from the harley shop

[Wheelsnkeels]

Screams bad rim to me that's a lot of weight

[TN]

after all the suggested problems for wobble this is a new tire I recived yesterday with only 1300 miles on old one,still wobbles and look at all the weights 7 on each side.Has any one ever heard of that many weights or does any one think bad rim,not getting much help from the harley shop

too many weights, something ain't right. 

 i assume there 1/4 ounce a piece?? that many weights with yer old tire mounted?

3.5ozs



good luck

TN

[hogasm]

Have them  spin balance the rim without the tire

[trahog]

1'4 ounce a piece,with the old tire 2,had Harley emblems on old weights so do not know how much it weighed,but 7 on each side looks like chit

[VRODDAVE]

I would think you have a legitimate complaint for warranty.  

[1abastarsmda]

Maybe they've got someone there that doesn't really know how to balance your wheel.  I'd almost be willing to place a bet on it that if you took all of the weights off and took it elsewhere to have it balanced, you wouldn't have anything near resembling what you have now...otherwise that wheel probably isn't acceptable.

[murphy]

There is no way you should have that much weight on a rim... something is absolutely wrong!

[erniezap]

Is the dot on the tire lined up with the valve?

[Dan_Lockwood]

Is the dot on the tire lined up with the valve?

I agree, way too much weight for a new tire.

I had streetrod tires tht balance with way too much lead and I had them spin the tire 180 degrees on the rim and the tire balanced within a couple ounces.

Cast or forged bike wheels should not be that far off though.

Good luck.

[grc]

If the original wheel & tire combination was able to be balanced with only two quarter ounce weights, I seriously doubt that the rim is severely out of balance.  More likely they didn't index the tire properly on the rim, or the new tire is defective, or the person or machine used to balance this last combination isn't capable.  Somehow I don't think even Harley would think over three ounces of imbalance was acceptable.

Not sure what you meant by the comment about the cheap weights versus the good ones, other than maybe the fancier looking ones with the little logo's on them.   Doesn't matter, fancy weights or plain ugly ones, 3.5 ounces is too much.  How about the original complaint, any difference in the "wobble" with the new tire, or is it exactly the same?


Jerry

[trahog]

still wobble on new tire,said put some miles on it put on 90 yesterday and going riding today,will see

[Fullsac Performance]

If posible, jack it up and spin it. You might be surprised at what you see in regards to up and down and side to side run out.
Hopefully not, but a visual inspection of run out is the first place to start when you have a wobbler or shaker. You can balance these conditions
to zero but they will always give feedback through the bars.

Steve George
Fullsac Performance

[grc]

still wobble on new tire,said put some miles on it put on 90 yesterday and going riding today,will see

I love how the typical Harley dealership always recommends putting some miles on it, no matter what the problem.  Putting some miles on it isn't doing anything but getting you out of their hair, and they hope you give up and don't come back.

The previous post is right on the mark, this situation needs to be properly and thoroughly diagnosed, and that should have started with a complete runout check of the entire rotating mass (wheel, tire, rotors).  Balancing won't fix a runout problem.  And they still need to make certain the steering head adjustment is correct and to the latest specification (you might be surprised, but I'm not, to find that many so-called techs don't consult the manuals but just go by memory).  The fall away specs and torque specs were changed for '09 and later Touring models.

Good luck.  While you're out putting some miles on it, keep your eyes peeled for another dealership.


Jerry

[Chrome O]

Had the same problems with my 2011 Ultra Glide SE.  The dealership really fought Harley, turns out the wheel was drilled off center.  No amount of weight is going to fix that. 

Do as I did and make them show you the work they do, as they do it.  But that much weight is unacceptable.  Also the new wheels do not have a center grove to center the brake disc this could be "off center". 

I have to be honest, the bike still is not the smoothest, I have ever owned but its only bad at very high speeds, I just not going to admit here how fast that is but way over the posted speed.

[Ghost__Rider]

That's definitely a lot of weights. One option I often try when I have a tire that wants alot of weights is break it back down and rotate 180 on the rim, then re balance. Usually it takes half the weights.
I recently also just ran into a bad front tire. It was so out of round I couldn't get the low speed wobble out. It would balance out, but had too much lateral run out on the left side of the tire. Thus handle bar wobble at slow speed.
I read where someone mentioned the dot lining up with the valve stem. I know dunlop recommends this, but I have found that it is not necessary. Dunlop claims the dot is the lightest point of the tire, thus this is where they want the valve stem. I have to argue with the dot theory. 

Bob McMahon

[grc]

That's definitely a lot of weights. One option I often try when I have a tire that wants alot of weights is break it back down and rotate 180 on the rim, then re balance. Usually it takes half the weights.
I recently also just ran into a bad front tire. It was so out of round I couldn't get the low speed wobble out. It would balance out, but had too much lateral run out on the left side of the tire. Thus handle bar wobble at slow speed.
I read where someone mentioned the dot lining up with the valve stem. I know dunlop recommends this, but I have found that it is not necessary. Dunlop claims the dot is the lightest point of the tire, thus this is where they want the valve stem. I have to argue with the dot theory. 

Bob McMahon

Bob, the "dot" theory works just fine IF the lightest spot of the tire is actually at the dot, and IF the heavy point of the rim is actually at the valve stem.  I think the problem comes when the wheels aren't balanced properly during manufacture, so that even after adding the stem the heavy spot isn't at the stem.  And of course, the tire manufacturer's have been known to screw up the location of the dots as well.

In the auto plant I used to work at, both the tire and the rim were required to come to us with little bright yellow stickers attached to signify the heavy spot/light spot, and the automated mounting equipment indexed the tire to the wheel such that the decals lined up.  When we instituted that system, the number of balance weights used dropped significantly as did the number of balance related complaints from the field.  One thing that I noted more than once over the years was that the decal on the rims didn't always correspond to the valve stem.  I think one of the mistakes with the "dot" theory as applied to motorcycles is the assumption that the stem is automatically the heavy spot of the rim.


Jerry

[Ghost__Rider]

Bob, the "dot" theory works just fine IF the lightest spot of the tire is actually at the dot, and IF the heavy point of the rim is actually at the valve stem.  I think the problem comes when the wheels aren't balanced properly during manufacture, so that even after adding the stem the heavy spot isn't at the stem.  And of course, the tire manufacturer's have been known to screw up the location of the dots as well.

In the auto plant I used to work at, both the tire and the rim were required to come to us with little bright yellow stickers attached to signify the heavy spot/light spot, and the automated mounting equipment indexed the tire to the wheel such that the decals lined up.  When we instituted that system, the number of balance weights used dropped significantly as did the number of balance related complaints from the field.  One thing that I noted more than once over the years was that the decal on the rims didn't always correspond to the valve stem.  I think one of the mistakes with the "dot" theory as applied to motorcycles is the assumption that the stem is automatically the heavy spot of the rim.


Jerry

I agree with you 100%. I usually alway line the dot up first, but if I find it needs a lot of weight, I bust off the bead and rotate 180 and usually find this helps.

[trahog]

Thanks for all the info,Going to make another appt,next week and have them check it out again

[mandm1]

trahog, what did you find out at your last dealer appointment? I hope they took care of you ...

Mike

[trahog]

It's better,put the half ounce weights on this time so looks alot better also only 3 on each side instead of 7 quarter ounce ones.

[Chains]

Way too much weight, I agree on rotating the tire and trying again

[motosman1]

just a little FYI on this wheel balance issue. I am a "seasoned" tech and work with a BUNCH of kids 2 yrs. or less out of school. Many with NO previous mechanical experience and regretably lacking fundamental mechanical apptitude. Some of them lacking even decent grades in the basic cirriculum, simply recruited by MMI or ATI reps trying to fill seats at the campus. Sooooooo.... taking from the "Factory Authorized and supplied" service manual for 2011 Touring models, which is what these "kids" refer to;
     "Static balancing using WHEEL TRUING STAND (part No. HD-99500-80) will provide satisfactory results for normal 
      highway speeds. Dynamic balancing can produce better results for high speed operation but is not typically
      required."

     "The maximum weight permissible to accomplish balance is 3.5 oz. (99.2g) (total weight applied to the rim). If more
      than 3.5 oz. of is required to accomplish balance, rotate the tire 180 degrees on the rim and again balance the
      assembly. Wheels should be balanced to within 0.5 oz (14g)."

I guess my point is to not be so quick to discredit the tech for merely doing his job, "by the book". I mean, come on. Who out ther really beleives that 0.012" runout on a TC pinionshaft is acceptable. Check the manual!  Also Harley has gone greeen and the new weights are no longer made from LEAD-some kind of "pot metal", I guess.It now takes more pieces to equal the previous weight. If asked by the customer to rotate the tire to acheive balance with fewer weights , I will oblige. Many is the time I have done something out of my way only to have no one notice or care if brought to their attention. Sometimes it is a matter of "product of environment". Sad but true. I highly recommend talking to other riders and the techs of your local dealership and seeking out that one tech that knows his s**t and cares about the bike/customer relationship. Establish a good raport with him/her, take care of him/her when he/she takes care of you and specify yhat only that tech is to ever work on your bike. I know that techs like that (me) can be hard to find but they (we) are definitely worth seeking out.