www.CVOHARLEY.com
CVO Technical => Drive Train => Topic started by: TexasBowhunter on February 07, 2012, 08:27:36 AM
-
I need to replace my transmittion shaft bearing that are in the inner primary...Seems that they are gritty feeling and sounding
The book calls out for 9231 bearing for this job
I was curious if there was a better bearing out there on the market
2nd question is since this bearing is subject to the clutch wearing particules should I be overly concerned with it feeling kinda gritty when I roll them around with my fingers? I know that there should be no gritty feelings in bearing but with this senario is it applicable?
The race doesn't look bad but if I did decide to replace it is there a home made tool or forum method in which to replace it and re-install another new one? Is there a specific dimension I should be care full of when installing one?
Thanks
paul
-
Baker Drivetrain makes a good inner bearing replacement, but its only available for models up to 07. I assume you are looking for a bearing for an 09. You might want to contact them and see if they have anything in the works. For replacing the race, Georges garage has a tool that will do the job. Good luck!
-
http://www.johnsonenginetechnology.com/JETPAGES/parts/tc_inner_primary_bearing.html
-
There have been some changes made to the mainshaft over the past few years, so some of the aftermarket solutions may not be applicable to your particular bike. One example is the Baker bearing that only works for 2007 and earlier bikes. So I'd suggest actually calling before you consider ordering any of the aftermarket parts. There's nothing worse than ordering a part, waiting for it to arrive, finally getting it, tearing the bike apart, and then finding out the part doesn't fit your application.
Jerry
-
Sorry guys
I dropped the ball...The bike we are speaking of is a 09 FLHX
I checked with Baker and they are not offering anything at this time but are considering something else
However they feel that the solution is the new chain tensioner system they are about to introduce
The self ratcheting system HD offers is 2 tight and creating undue stress on the bearings and if one was to go back to the older fixed style it would be the answer...
paul
-
ok, ill bite - WHAT chain tensioner?
-
ok, ill bite - WHAT chain tensioner?
The primary chain tensioner...
-
thats a picture of the stock one - have had several of those self adjusting units - they can get too tight
the question is what is baker up to
to
-
(http://img811.imageshack.us/img811/4303/image044g.png)
http://bakerdrivetrain.com/attitude-chain-adjuster
$199
-
Perhaps I've just been lucky. But I've not had an issue with the ratcheting style tensioner. Though I do think it's amusing that Baker goes to the trouble of offering an old non-automatic tensioner as an upgrade rather than doing something like the Hayden or HB125 hydraulic units to offer to the market for the newer bikes.
-
Perhaps I've just been lucky. But I've not had an issue with the ratcheting style tensioner. Though I do think it's amusing that Baker goes to the trouble of offering an old non-automatic tensioner as an upgrade rather than doing something like the Hayden or HB125 hydrualic units to offer to the market for the newer bikes.
Would either of those be better than the stock auto one??? I hear some whinning coming from the primary area and I have been told it's the chain making the noise because the tensioner made is slightly too tight :nixweiss:
-
Would either of those be better than the stock auto one??? I hear some whinning coming from the primary area and I have been told it's the chain making the noise because the tensioner made is slightly too tight :nixweiss:
MJ, I don't think the "hydraulic" style aftermarket tensioners were ever released for the six speed bikes. They were/are common items before. But since the HD branded tensioner became standard on the newer bikes I've never seen the aftermarket offer a competitor.
-
The folks at Southern Oregon Hot Bikes did release a hydraulic wedge version of their automatic tensioner, but you don't hear much about it or see it promoted much either. Not sure why, and not sure if it's still available.
http://sohotbikes.com/wedge.html
Jerry
-
The folks at Southern Oregon Hot Bikes did release a hydraulic wedge version of their automatic tensioner, but you don't hear much about it or see it promoted much either. Not sure why, and not sure if it's still available.
http://sohotbikes.com/wedge.html
Jerry
Jerry...wouldn't that do the same as the factory one in terms of over tightening the chain??
Mike
-
Jerry...wouldn't that do the same as the factory one in terms of over tightening the chain??
Mike
Not necessarily Mike. The SOHB hydraulic version doesn't have a ratchet like the Harley part, so it can't overtighten and then not back off like the stock piece. The problem with the Harley part, IMHO, is strictly due to the ratchet. If it was just spring loaded, and they used the proper strength spring of course, it wouldn't be a problem. I'm not sure why they thought they needed the ratchet, a simple spring is what is used in the old Hayden M6 tensioner for the 06 and earlier models, and they have been around and performing satifactorily for decades.
Jerry
-
Here's my compare/contrast of the two.
A tensioner is needed to keep the chain tight (but not guitar string tight), and needs to be adjusted as the chain wears and stretches.
But, a chain stretches unevenly which causes the chain to run loose,tight,loose,tight,etc as it spins around the gears.
A manual tensioner has to be adjusted periodically (and correctly) because of this.
Is the chain cold/hot, new/old, loose/tight, etc are all variables that make this tough to get "just right".
A "auto/spring" tensioner should be able keep the chain tight without manual adjustment, and allow for uneven stretching/wear, and temp variations.
Harley's auto tensioner has a spring behind the ramp, that tightens the chain to the "correct" tension.
The ramp's ratchet prevent the ramp from moving backwards, thus maintaining the "correct" tension.
Another set of springs are between the shoe and the ramp, which is supposed to allow for uneven chain stretch.
As the chain spins around the gears the shoe can "untension" slightly when the chain runs tight(er).
I believe this "untension" is also to allow for expansion when the primary heats up to operating temp.
The "Wedge" has a single spring behind the ramp, which does NOT ratchet.
As the chain spins around the gears the ramp can move back and forth to allow the shoe to "tension/untension".
There is a hydraulic valve within the wedge that is supposed to maintain the "correct" tension,
but allow slight movement to allow for uneven chain stretch and temperature variation.
-
Not necessarily Mike. The SOHB hydraulic version doesn't have a ratchet like the Harley part, so it can't overtighten and then not back off like the stock piece. The problem with the Harley part, IMHO, is strictly due to the ratchet. If it was just spring loaded, and they used the proper strength spring of course, it wouldn't be a problem. I'm not sure why they thought they needed the ratchet, a simple spring is what is used in the old Hayden M6 tensioner for the 06 and earlier models, and they have been around and performing satifactorily for decades.
Jerry
Is it worth changing to the SOHB version? I have to change the primary fluid anyway in the month or so.....it's just one more gasket....
-
Perhaps I've just been lucky. But I've not had an issue with the ratcheting style tensioner. Though I do think it's amusing that Baker goes to the trouble of offering an old non-automatic tensioner as an upgrade rather than doing something like the Hayden or HB125 hydrualic units to offer to the market for the newer bikes.
ditto...
-
Would be nice if Jim HD-Dude would voice his opinion on this subject. Is the auto-tensioner causing issues with the Primary Inner Bearing? Do we really need to revert back to the manual tensioner. This would require removing the Primary cover since Harley removed the inspection cover.
:bananarock: :bananarock:
Brad
-
Would be nice if Jim HD-Dude would voice his opinion on this subject. Is the auto-tensioner causing issues with the Primary Inner Bearing? Do we really need to revert back to the manual tensioner. This would require removing the Primary cover since Harley removed the inspection cover.
:bananarock: :bananarock:
Brad
Or at least changing to an after-market auto tensioner that works better that HD's....
-
The early versions of the HD tensioner did have a few issues with ratcheting up and being too tight on the chain. Even had one with a broken chain :o ..... I have not seen issues with the HD unit in quite some time now. As far as the aftermarket goes the Hot Bike unit is good and have installed them in many early style (pre-07) bikes and a few in the 07+ bikes as well.
Typically if we have a primary noise issue it has been comp related or inner primary bearing issues.
-
While were on the topic of bakers Chain Tensioner being a step backwards here's a new take on a familier name
hayden is offering a system like the H6
http://www.haydensm6.com/m6_bt07.htm
Read a bit about it here
Might have to give this some serious look thought...
paul
-
Decided to take the plunge and get one
Order 3 seems like a resolution to a possible concern
Since I'm up grading my motor I needed to up grade the clutch
I went with the Primo Rivera Clutch
Its recommended to run a lesser amount of fluid then most stock systems and since the reduced amount of fluid could possibly affect the SOHO chain tennsioner (even if it was acting up in the earlier released versions)
I'll keep you guys abreast on how it performs
FWIW
Hayden will not send the units till the instructions arrive to there location to be included in the packaging
Even if we are aware of how the installation is supposed to be they still wont release them so I won't be getting mine till the end of the month... :smilie_daumenneg: :smilie_daumenneg:
paul
-
Decided to take the plunge and get one
Order 3 seems like a resolution to a possible concern
Since I'm up grading my motor I needed to up grade the clutch
I went with the Primo Rivera Clutch
Its recommended to run a lesser amount of fluid then most stock systems and since the reduced amount of fluid could possibly affect the SOHO chain tennsioner (even if it was acting up in the earlier released versions)
I'll keep you guys abreast on how it performs
FWIW
Hayden will not send the units till the instructions arrive to there location to be included in the packaging
Even if we are aware of how the installation is supposed to be they still wont release them so I won't be getting mine till the end of the month... :smilie_daumenneg: :smilie_daumenneg:
paul
Looking forward to the update :2vrolijk_21:
-
Not necessarily Mike. The SOHB hydraulic version doesn't have a ratchet like the Harley part, so it can't overtighten and then not back off like the stock piece. The problem with the Harley part, IMHO, is strictly due to the ratchet. If it was just spring loaded, and they used the proper strength spring of course, it wouldn't be a problem. I'm not sure why they thought they needed the ratchet, a simple spring is what is used in the old Hayden M6 tensioner for the 06 and earlier models, and they have been around and performing satifactorily for decades.
Jerry
Thanks Jerry, actually our BT07 is done with research and development and is now produced and on the market.
http://www.haydensm6.com/m6_bt07.htm
-
Looking forward to the update :2vrolijk_21:
These are in stock and shipping daily.
Let us know if you have any questions, we're here to help all you guys.