Topic: ?'s belt vs chain drive? (Read 7849 times)

Camojeeper · « **on:** October 12, 2015, 11:39:27 PM »

Ok guys my scoot is in the shop again! One more broken belt 2total in the last 33,000 miles last one has aprox 9200 miles and had been Indy adjusted 5 times in that mileage. One H-D belt and one aftermarket. Now ? my 110 is for the most part stock so ground shaking belt snapping power is not a big problem! I'm not a burnout or wheelie guy either. My Indy said to convert to chain drive. It's stronger less money etc etc. I also have about 1/2 mile of gravel road to ride out to the main road from my ranch so splitting the belt with rocks is on my mind as well? Help? Please
Thoughts and opinions?

Steve

hd-dude · « **Reply #1 on:** October 12, 2015, 11:54:24 PM »

I see you have aftermarket wheels, Do you have the stock rear pulley or an aftermarket pulley? Is the stock belt guard fully in tact? Have the pulleys been thoroughly inspected?

Aftermarket belts for these years are not as good as the factory belt.

My choice would be to keep the belt. They run quieter and have less maintenance. Chains will through lube all over the rear of the bike too.

Camojeeper · « **Reply #2 on:** October 13, 2015, 10:43:37 AM »

Stock pulleys in great shape. Belt guard in stock location.

tdkkart · « **Reply #3 on:** October 13, 2015, 11:12:19 AM »

2 belts in 30,000mi on a basically stock bike(even a 110") points to some sort of issue. Many people are running much
more power and miles on these belts without issue.

The "indy adjusted 5 times" statement bothers me.
My last bike had 27,000mi when I traded it. Other than a slight initial adjustment early in it's life, the belt was never adjusted again.
When I changed tires I marked the cams and put them back in the same place when I put them back on.

Something's not right, but the last thing you want to do is a chain conversion, absolutely not needed.

Camojeeper · « **Reply #4 on:** October 13, 2015, 11:29:12 AM »

I had the Indy adjust it 4 times in 4000 (last belt) I would stretch enof to skip the rear pulley. Then once more the day before it snapped. My real concern is the gravel road I ride on dropping rocks in on the belt.

twinotter · « **Reply #5 on:** October 13, 2015, 11:45:59 AM »

The aftermarket belts are nowhere near as good as stock. Having said that, a belt that goes out of adjustment 4 times in 4000 miles, has other issues. I would suggest that its not being set up properly, maybe the axle is not torqued to specs, the new cam type adjusters can cause issues if the axle is not torqued properly (100 ft/lbs).
Gravel roads are hard on belts, especially if the guards have been removed or modified.
A chain drive eliminates the breakage problem, especially if top quality components are used.
I run a EK 530ZZZ chain, Baker tranny sprocket, Drag steel wheel sprocket. Using Maxima chain wax eliminates 90% of the fling (when used as instructed), chain should last forever.
When I ran a belt, I avoided gravel roads if at all possible, just asking for trouble imo. twinotter

RayG · « **Reply #6 on:** October 13, 2015, 12:00:46 PM »

How is the alignment from the front to the rear sprocket? As HD Dude said the aftermarket belt is a crap shoot. I put on a Falcon belt when I went to a 30 tooth front sprocket, I took it easy but the belt shredded in 3,000 miles. Found a Harley belt that fits but I have the same issue as you concerning a very long gravel driveway causing me problems. I had a rock in my last belt so I had to install my spare belt last winter. My oil cooler on the lower front looks like it has been shot blasted. The rocks from the gravel road present a problem that will continue to have the potential to do some damage. Something just doesn't make sense on your belt issue. This should be an easy fix. I would spend time thoroughly checking the alignment and depending on the amount of damage you get from the gravel find a way to protect your belt or chain even if you do go the chain route. By the way I have an S&S 124" and I still don't do burnouts but I will get on hard once it's moving. I used to love doing burnout and wheelies with a passenger years ago but since it takes me so long to replace the belt I smartened up and just do roll-on's for my quest for adrenalin. Hope you find the problem and a solution.

windjammer · « **Reply #7 on:** October 13, 2015, 02:50:58 PM »

I have only broken 1 belt in my lifetime and it had 50000 miles on it. It also had a hole in it from a rock which I think was the primary cause. Best thing Was blacktoping the road to my house. Also a friend just traded a 2005 RoadKing with 96000 miles and no issues with belts.

FlaHeatWave · « **Reply #8 on:** October 13, 2015, 04:33:56 PM »

Quote from: hd-dude on October 12, 2015, 11:54:24 PM

I see you have aftermarket wheels, Do you have the stock rear pulley or an aftermarket pulley? Is the stock belt guard fully in tact? Have the pulleys been thoroughly inspected?

Aftermarket belts for these years are not as good as the factory belt.

My choice would be to keep the belt. They run quieter and have less maintenance. Chains will through lube all over the rear of the bike too.

It sounds like you have an underlying issue with the bike? alignment? pulley(s) out of wack?

If it was mine, I'd go back to the OE Belt, and go over the alignment and pulleys with a fine tooth comb.

'Don't think the gravel is that much of an issue (unless you're going fast enough to kick up a bunch of pebbles?) My Bud has over 1/3 mi. of gravel driveway, does > 15k mi. / year has no belt issues for the last 6 years...

No way I'd go to a chain...

Camojeeper · « **Reply #9 on:** October 14, 2015, 01:22:58 AM »

Quote from: RayG on October 13, 2015, 12:00:46 PM

How is the alignment from the front to the rear sprocket? As HD Dude said the aftermarket belt is a crap shoot. I put on a Falcon belt when I went to a 30 tooth front sprocket, I took it easy but the belt shredded in 3,000 miles. Found a Harley belt that fits but I have the same issue as you concerning a very long gravel driveway causing me problems. I had a rock in my last belt so I had to install my spare belt last winter. My oil cooler on the lower front looks like it has been shot blasted. The rocks from the gravel road present a problem that will continue to have the potential to do some damage. Something just doesn't make sense on your belt issue. This should be an easy fix. I would spend time thoroughly checking the alignment and depending on the amount of damage you get from the gravel find a way to protect your belt or chain even if you do go the chain route. By the way I have an S&S 124" and I still don't do burnouts but I will get on hard once it's moving. I used to love doing burnout and wheelies with a passenger years ago but since it takes me so long to replace the belt I smartened up and just do roll-on's for my quest for adrenalin. Hope you find the problem and a solution.

Chain and sprockets ordered! After speaking with two local builders here. They both said belts fail quickly with anything bigger than an 88" both recommended the chain set up. The final piece of the puzzle was to check the alignment of the bike,which is in spec.
Thanks all for your time. I will post results as I can

ultrarider123 · « **Reply #10 on:** October 14, 2015, 08:24:39 AM »

Camo, good luck with the chain and I hope this works out for you better than your belt issues.

As for the comment from two local builders stating "

Quote

....belts fail quickly with anything bigger than an 88" both recommended the chain set up.

I will have to question that statement. I've never had any issues with a belt and all of my HD's over a span of 28 years with belts were traded/sold with many tens of thousands of miles on them....no belt issues. Not all of the motors were stock but none were racing motors either and all were used on the street, not the drag strip. Actually, over the years of riding alone and with others, I've not seen any belt issues. The belt is a good thing...cleaner, easier to maintain and from my experience very strong.

However, the bottom line is how comfortable you are with your bike. So, good luck with your changes and I wish you many, happy and repair free miles....

Camojeeper · « **Reply #11 on:** October 14, 2015, 11:42:21 AM »

Quote from: Haird on October 14, 2015, 08:24:39 AM

Camo, good luck with the chain and I hope this works out for you better than your belt issues.

As for the comment from two local builders stating "
I will have to question that statement. I've never had any issues with a belt and all of my HD's over a span of 28 years with belts were traded/sold with many tens of thousands of miles on them....no belt issues. Not all of the motors were stock but none were racing motors either and all were used on the street, not the drag strip. Actually, over the years of riding alone and with others, I've not seen any belt issues. The belt is a good thing...cleaner, easier to maintain and from my experience very strong.

However, the bottom line is how comfortable you are with your bike. So, good luck with your changes and I wish you many, happy and repair free miles....

Well I hope this works out if not it was about the same cost as a belt. I too have not had any belt failures in any of the 3hogs I've owned an80" FXDWG 80,000 when sold oe belt. 98 anniversary flhtc 95" 50,000 oe belt when sold. And now I have this thing with 2 busted belts?
Again thank you guys for you help and opinions

Camojeeper · « **Reply #12 on:** October 14, 2015, 11:48:36 AM »

Quote from: Camojeeper on October 14, 2015, 01:22:58 AM

Chain and sprockets ordered! After speaking with two local builders here. They both said belts fail quickly with anything bigger than an 88" both recommended the chain set up. The final piece of the puzzle was to check the alignment of the bike,which is in spec.
Thanks all for your time. I will post results as I can

so to be clear these builders said belts can be easily snapped with a big bike
Bigger motors and quick throttle changes are not a belts friend. I also would like to build a bigger motor over the winter so that was a factor as well. The last thing was there were 3 bikes there with chains. Not one had any mess.

hd-dude · « **Reply #13 on:** October 14, 2015, 01:20:19 PM »

Quote from: Camojeeper on October 14, 2015, 11:48:36 AM

so to be clear these builders said belts can be easily snapped with a big bike
Bigger motors and quick throttle changes are not a belts friend. I also would like to build a bigger motor over the winter so that was a factor as well. The last thing was there were 3 bikes there with chains. Not one had any mess.

I question statements like that!
I have many customers with big builds 130hp/tq that run the stock belt, very rarely do we see a broken belt. These bikes are ridden hard as well. I even have a customer with 150hp+ motor that drag races on the stock belt....never had one break after hundreds of runs down the quarter mile.....

Point is that a belt adjusted properly can and will last, even on big inch high horsepower and torque builds.

dartman · « **Reply #14 on:** October 17, 2015, 11:11:38 AM »

Very True, been running Belt drive since 1985 thousands of miles on gravel, no breaks.

JCZ · « **Reply #15 on:** October 17, 2015, 11:38:42 AM »

Not sure which indys you're talking with? I'm from Nor Cal (as are many members on this forum) and I've never heard of a shop in Red Bluff or Redding that has a reputation for performance. Not saying there isn't one....just haven't heard of one over the decades that I lived up there. I do know that the OEM belts are known to be very reliable. I'm one of those guys that for years rode harder than anybody I know and I never broke a belt. No, it's not common. Ask those indys for references of people that they know have broken belts (and had their belt guards in place) and I think you'll get your answer.....they'll sell you anything so they can make a buck.

Jim (hd-dude that's posted in this forum) always has his shop full of CVOs.....he knows motors! Do yourself a big favor (and save yourself headaches down the road and take your bike down to Metal Dragon in San Leandro and drop it off.

There's a reason Jim's shop is always full of CVOs and other big motor bikes......and they're all running belts.

Rooster · « **Reply #16 on:** October 17, 2015, 12:12:59 PM »

Well I think he has a couple running chains. But I think they were extra hard on the equipment

timo482 · « **Reply #17 on:** October 17, 2015, 05:46:36 PM »

my belt is still sort of ok.. but it has 4 or 5 rock holes from gravel. the big issue is that gravel here and gravel there are completely different. even from one county to another its a big difference - a bit of 3/4" hard dolomite will just flat break the belt and the stuff does get thrown. a 3/16 size rock is just a small hole.

in the late 70's i broke a chain when a bit of white limestone got in there - the only real fix is pavement or go real real slow and if it sticks to the tire even that won't help. I'm dreading having to replace the belt - chains had to be replaced but it took 20 min to do it. change the sprockets every third or fourth chain. and yes there was a mess but i have always figured I'm going to ride it so i don't care about a little dirt - if i want a clean one ill put it in a glass case and look at it.

chains are not really that much worse than belts - they are just lots more replacement and adjustment than belts but its easier to do.

ltank · « **Reply #18 on:** October 18, 2015, 05:41:44 AM »

I had replace a belt due to rock damage. Both pulley ' s looked fine.
I replaced the stock 1.5" belt with a S&S 1.125" belt and new rear pulley over 50k miles ago. Never had to readjust belt tension. Like the guys posted, belt alignment and tension is crucial.

timo482 · « **Reply #19 on:** October 18, 2015, 10:57:24 AM »

i had no idea s&s sold belts..... i wonder if they are any good?

FlaHeatWave · « **Reply #20 on:** October 18, 2015, 01:07:39 PM »

You can lead a horse to water, but...

Twolanerider · « **Reply #21 on:** October 18, 2015, 03:02:35 PM »

Quote from: timo482 on October 17, 2015, 05:46:36 PM

my belt is still sort of ok.. but it has 4 or 5 rock holes from gravel.

If you've got a belt with holes in it you've really got less of a belt and more of a break-down waiting for a place (away from home and three hours from a flat bed) waiting for a place to happen. Unfortunately now a question of when rather than if. Be safe and take a Saturday afternoon sometime and swap it out. Depending on thickness I might even have a good one I could send you. Let me know. Glad to check out the stash here and help if I can.

timo482 · « **Reply #22 on:** October 19, 2015, 07:04:45 AM »

boy do i know it.. its when not if the belt is going to break. its had holes in the belt since at least the fall of 07. gravel road to the office where i work. i only ride to work a few weeks in the spring but thats when it gets holes. after spring its the work truck to job sites never see the office again till november......

CVO2FIXUP · « **Reply #23 on:** November 10, 2015, 08:09:55 AM »

I am wondering if it's a misalignment issue causing the failures? And the misalignment created by the failure of the swing arm bushings. Torquing the swing arm off kilter and stressing the belt. Worth checking those bushings and that swing arm bolt. Wheel off, unbolt shocks and try to move the swing arm side to side. Should have no play.

BigLew · « **Reply #24 on:** November 10, 2015, 10:26:37 AM »

Well my input would be your builders either need some work or they are talking to hear their head roar. My 09 has 29,000 miles an S&S 124 with a procharger at 13lbs boost. 202 and 174 tq and I don't have any belt issues. The stock belts are really tough aftermarket not good at all.

BigLew

Camojeeper · « **Reply #25 on:** November 22, 2015, 12:42:23 PM »

Well I did the chain conv and while it was apart it got a Baker DD7. So far I'm happy with the chain. If it does not work out I'll go back to the belt.
Thanks again guys for you time
Steve

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timo482 · « **Reply #26 on:** November 22, 2015, 02:46:44 PM »

did you modify the swing arm for more adjustment? or can you get enough adjustment with the stock cam and half links?

to

Camojeeper · « **Reply #27 on:** November 22, 2015, 11:09:46 PM »

Stock cams work just fine

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GMR-PERFORMANCE · « **Reply #28 on:** December 04, 2015, 05:25:24 PM »

Are you setting to HD specs??? My opinion is that is way too tight. The aluminum pulley will expand with heat and most the times the belt is banjo tight once up to normal riding temps. I set them under the loose HD spec. With just a little run time the pulley heats up and its in spec.
I run a stock belt on my 124 and no issues there at all.. Best time a few weeks ago has been 11.005 so it sees a fair amount of drag strip , so I am not easy on it at all..

ltank · « **Reply #29 on:** December 04, 2015, 11:24:29 PM »

I installed a S&S V111 motor, 6 speed O.D. Gearset and a S&S 1.125
Rear belt over 60,000 miles ago. No problems. I too live on a dirt Ricky road. I do have the stock belt guards in place though.

Author Topic: ?'s belt vs chain drive? (Read 7849 times)

ultrarider123