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[JaronCVO]

I own a 2017 CVO Harley Davidson Street Glide. So far, I've added Stage 4 117 upgrade, V&H exhaust, Power Vision tuner, and a Trask breather. On a trip to Arizona from Washington State, my bike went into limp mode 700 miles from home. The EITMS kicked on while riding. I struggled to get the bike to 70 mph. I pulled over because I read about those who kept goin and blew their engines. The bike was extremely hot, oil mist/smoke coming from where you fill with oil and low oil level. Now, I've done a thorough research on oil sumping. I assumed oil sumping, as well. I rented a bike from a dealership in Chico, CA and road to LA, CA. I had have the rental bike back to the dealership earlier so I didn't make it to AZ. I got my bike back with the EITMS manually disabled and was able to make the 700 mile ride back with no issues. I then took the bike to my local dealership in Kitsap County WA. I explained the break down and wanted them to look into the oil mist coming into the air breather. I also asked them to check the oil pump and for sumping based on the HD bulletin M1450. The dealership didn't even know about the HD bulletin M1450. I told the service adviser to look it up and she was blown away that it existed. The local dealership told me they believe its the tuner and the MoCo voided my powertrain warranty. I understand the warranty if I blew the engine based on a timing issue, but on the bulletin, it states, any bike built before October 2017 needs a new oil pump. At this point, the bike runs, its only down due to waiting on parts in paint and a Native Customs Fat Tire mod. Anyone else have their warranty voided due to exhaust and tune?

[J.D.]

Yes, unfortunately.

Discussed here:

https://www.cvoharley.com/smf/index.php?topic=115352.0

[JaronCVO]

I guess i'll strike when the recall happens.

[grc]

There have been many discussions on this and other sites concerning the fact that the powertrain warranty can and will be void if illegal modifications are detected.  This was part of the agreement H-D signed with the EPA to resolve the tampering charges brought against them.  Any tune other than the official street legal tune provided by H-D is a violation.  Any change to the exhaust system that eliminates the catalytic converter is a violation.  People have been warned about this from the beginning of the 2017 model year. 

Harley and it's customers have lived a charmed life for decades when it came to emissions system tampering, but eventually someone at EPA did their job and started legal proceedings against H-D.  I always assumed Harley got a free pass because someone at EPA felt sorry for the customers, since bone stock Harley's ran like chit since the 90's.  Now that a stock bike at least runs without stumbling and stalling all the time, that free pass seems to have been revoked.

Jerry

[JaronCVO]

I agree with voiding the warranty. I chose that, however, a manufactured defect should be covered. It is what it is. I haven't blown the engine yet and compression is still within normal specs. I'll look into seeing if S&S has an motor that will fit. I have way too much money into this bike.

[GD214]

I agree with voiding the warranty. I chose that, however, a manufactured defect should be covered. It is what it is. I haven't blown the engine yet and compression is still within normal specs. I'll look into seeing if S&S has an motor that will fit. I have way too much money into this bike.

If your mods can't cause the failure, they shouldn't be able to void the warranty.  The purpose of a warranty is to protect the buyer for a certain number of years and/or miles from manufacturer defects, poor workmanship, design failures or flaws etc.....

I get that the EPA finally struck and is punishing all of us but they shouldn't be able to void our warranty because we make a change that has nothing to do with the failure of a part/piece/process on the motorcycle.  I'm not going to do anything more than swap the pipes and use a tuner to balance the air/fuel.  Not sure if my factory air will need modified but regardless, this isn't significant change to my bike yet, they can cancel my warranty?   So if I do this and my GPS or Boom system fails, or if my ABS system has a problem they won't repair or replace it?

I recently upgraded from a 12 non-CVO Ultra and bought a 18 SERG .  I also initially bought the extended warranty like I had on my 2012.  After my ride home from the dealer (about 400 miles) I cancelled the extended warranty because my Harley sounds like my BMW.  I don't think I'm going to make 2 years as it is. 

Regardless, it seems to me that the sumping issue should a recall.

[KGB]

 

[JaronCVO]

If your mods can't cause the failure, they shouldn't be able to void the warranty.  The purpose of a warranty is to protect the buyer for a certain number of years and/or miles from manufacturer defects, poor workmanship, design failures or flaws etc.....

I get that the EPA finally struck and is punishing all of us but they shouldn't be able to void our warranty because we make a change that has nothing to do with the failure of a part/piece/process on the motorcycle.  I'm not going to do anything more than swap the pipes and use a tuner to balance the air/fuel.  Not sure if my factory air will need modified but regardless, this isn't significant change to my bike yet, they can cancel my warranty?   So if I do this and my GPS or Boom system fails, or if my ABS system has a problem they won't repair or replace it?

I recently upgraded from a 12 non-CVO Ultra and bought a 18 SERG .  I also initially bought the extended warranty like I had on my 2012.  After my ride home from the dealer (about 400 miles) I cancelled the extended warranty because my Harley sounds like my BMW.  I don't think I'm going to make 2 years as it is. 

Regardless, it seems to me that the sumping issue should a recall.

I agree. I went off on the dealership then realized it was out of there hands, MoCo made the call about my modifications. At this point the only thing I can do is fix it and spend my money anywhere but H-D if I can help it. I'm not giving up on my Harley at this point. You gotta pay tp play, and I'm going to continue to work so I can continue to pay more and play less. The life of owning an H-D.

[grc]

You are correct when you say they shouldn't be able to void the entire warranty, and in fact that's not what's happening.  They are voiding the powertrain portion of the warranty, and the rest of the two year factory warranty should still be in force.  So if your electrical system fails, your paint flakes off, the suspension starts leaking, or any other non-powertrain items fail, they should still be covered.  If a dealership or H-D tells you otherwise, they are wrong and you would have legal recourse.

Jerry

[JaronCVO]

You are correct when you say they shouldn't be able to void the entire warranty, and in fact that's not what's happening.  They are voiding the powertrain portion of the warranty, and the rest of the two year factory warranty should still be in force.  So if your electrical system fails, your paint flakes off, the suspension starts leaking, or any other non-powertrain items fail, they should still be covered.  If a dealership or H-D tells you otherwise, they are wrong and you would have legal recourse.

Jerry

Thank you. I'm over it, I looked up the price for a new pump. It's not pricey, I'll install it myself.

[mark]

Unfortunately, it doesn’t appear the new pump is a cure for sumping.

[JaronCVO]

Unfortunately, it doesn’t appear the new pump is a cure for sumping.

I called Feuling today, they are in the process of building an oil pump for liquid cooled bikes. Should be out in about 2-3 months. They stated their pump has been effective on fixing the sumping issues on the oiled cooled bikes. Price is about $850 with pump and cam plate, plus about 8 hours of labor. I'll wait and buy a Feuling pump when it comes out.

[redtwin]

I was thinking about doing the fueling set up when I install the tts 200 cam later this year but it may happen a lot sooner
I have the stage 4 now,may be just some preventive maintenance and peace of mind.

[grc]

I'm not so sure I'd take the word of anyone at Fueling that they have the "fix" for an issue no one has actually proved is strictly an oil pump issue.  It's easy to make claims over the phone when you want to sell someone something.  I think I'd want a guarantee in writing that they would stand behind their claim and take responsibility for any damage from sumping after installing their parts.

JMHO - Jerry

[SDCVO]

Unfortunately, it doesn’t appear the new pump is a cure for sumping.

That for sure..