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[art2001]

I had the engine upgrade kit installed and have put about 500 miles. I now have a ticking coming from the top end, have been back to the dealer 3 times. Each time they have a different answer   1) I wasn't riding the bike right (not keeping the engine at right RPM levels). Checked the manual (no reference to RPM level but recommended shift speeds per gear)   2) Took manual to dealer and they said the manual is wrong. So I rode per manual and never got over 2600 RPM, dealer says engine should be driven and shifted at 3000 to 3500 RPM. So I rode to their specs and never got out of 3rd gear until over 50 MPH. I'm not riding a two-stroke dirt bike but a Touring bike. On the freeway the speed limit is 60 MPH and shifting into 4th gear takes the RPM's to 2500.   3) Had mechanic who did engine upgrade ride bike and he said he didn't hear anything but maybe a transmission whine. I round tripped this bike to Sturgis and never had this ticking sound and as a truck driver for over 30 years I know when there is a change in sound to an engine.     

Has anyone else experienced this??

[LRebel]

Mine has the ticking sound around 2800 rpm and I haven't had the upgrade done yet.
I'm hoping the tick will be gone after the upgrade.... Will probably have the "upgrade" done late next month.

I had a dealer tell me the ticking was normal..... so I found another dealer 

[hard10]

Art, I sent you a PM about the registry. What month was your bike produced? Mine was made 11/20/06 and the original rocker boxes needed to be clearenced to eliminate the valve springs from hitting. You are saying that the sound has only happened after the 0905 "fix"?

[napalm]

Had the Enhancement Upgrade done about five weeks ago...one week later my 2008 SEUC quit after pulling out of a different HD Shop....took two days to find that one of the wires coming off one of the ACRs had shorted out on the head and was blowing the ECM master fuse....fixed.  One week later to the day I rode up to Gettysburg and realized I had no headlight and no tail lights....

Rode down to HD Shop yesterday morning, real cold out in western Maryland, of course the heated grips stopped working at the end of my driveway!!!!

Dealership found that the light relay had come up plugged, easy fix.  Took several hours to fix the heated grips.  Had to replace them..

Seems like once a scoot is broken down, gremlins get into it when they put it back together!!!  Rode home yesterday afternoon, all seems to be working fine....

After getting the enhancement done...put some miles on your scoot before planning a long trip...get the gremlins out first!!!!!

napalm

[Deuce Bigelow]

Had the Enhancement Upgrade done about five weeks ago...one week later my 2008 SEUC quit after pulling out of a different HD Shop....took two days to find that one of the wires coming off one of the ACRs had shorted out on the head and was blowing the ECM master fuse....fixed.  One week later to the day I rode up to Gettysburg and realized I had no headlight and no tail lights....

Rode down to HD Shop yesterday morning, real cold out in western Maryland, of course the heated grips stopped working at the end of my driveway!!!!

Dealership found that the light relay had come up plugged, easy fix.  Took several hours to fix the heated grips.  Had to replace them..

Seems like once a scoot is broken down, gremlins get into it when they put it back together!!!  Rode home yesterday afternoon, all seems to be working fine....

After getting the enhancement done...put some miles on your scoot before planning a long trip...get the gremlins out first!!!!!

napalm

sounding like you might be close to using napalm on your bike.....LOL

[RedBone]

Had my upgrade done and the top is quieter then it has ever been and more balls less vibration all appears better so far

[Gecko]

My top end made noise new (dealer at the time said there was "definitely an unusual noise").  They ground out the rocker boxes and the noise continued as bad or worse than before.  Now they say it is normal.  That's how it is with HD - if they can't or don't want to fix something - - it becomes normal.

I wish you luck, you will probably be chasing this for a long time to come.

[ice6900]

mine is enhanced but.............this is what i woke to 2day, hope it all melts so i can go pick it up,

wife spoke to mech after the job, he said top end was all black n crusty, the leak from lower rear was caused by oring not seating correctly, (maybe that was caused when the other dealer fitted the head gaskets as it only started leaking from there afterwards) the new square oring was a pain in the a$$ to put it, he needed 6 hands to keep it in place..

[grc]

I had the engine upgrade kit installed and have put about 500 miles. I now have a ticking coming from the top end, have been back to the dealer 3 times. Each time they have a different answer   1) I wasn't riding the bike right (not keeping the engine at right RPM levels). Checked the manual (no reference to RPM level but recommended shift speeds per gear)   2) Took manual to dealer and they said the manual is wrong. So I rode per manual and never got over 2600 RPM, dealer says engine should be driven and shifted at 3000 to 3500 RPM. So I rode to their specs and never got out of 3rd gear until over 50 MPH. I'm not riding a two-stroke dirt bike but a Touring bike. On the freeway the speed limit is 60 MPH and shifting into 4th gear takes the RPM's to 2500.   3) Had mechanic who did engine upgrade ride bike and he said he didn't hear anything but maybe a transmission whine. I round tripped this bike to Sturgis and never had this ticking sound and as a truck driver for over 30 years I know when there is a change in sound to an engine.     

Has anyone else experienced this??

Since this noise became noticeable only after the dealer disassembled and reassembled the top end, and since it is common knowledge that the rocker cover/support can move during assembly to the point of valve spring retainer contact, you might want to suggest that they recheck for spring retainer contact.  If there is contact they should install the latest design part which has plenty of clearance.

Jerry

[AZSSE]

I have a FXSTSSE Springer Softtail, and I also noticed after getting the 110 recall upgrade, I have a lot of tapping that I never noticed before. I was hoping that it would go away as it got worn in, as I've only put about a thousand miles on it since. If there is a real problem with this, I hope MOCO comes out with a fix.

[sfarson]

0906 performed on the '07 FLHRSE3.  No issues before, no issues following.  Nevertheless as noted above, it is good counsel to ride an "enhanced" CVO well before pointing the wheels to a distant place.

[Gone Fishin']

mine is enhanced but.............this is what i woke to 2day, hope it all melts so i can go pick it up,

wife spoke to mech after the job, he said top end was all black n crusty, the leak from lower rear was caused by oring not seating correctly, (maybe that was caused when the other dealer fitted the head gaskets as it only started leaking from there afterwards) the new square oring was a pain in the a$$ to put it, he needed 6 hands to keep it in place..

Hi Ice!
Nice picture. I hope the snow is gone by now.

Do you remember the discussion about the color of the oil in my '07 SERK? Well I had the engine cleaned thoroughly with two refills, and another oil and filter change done just early this month. Now I have put one 2.200 km and the oil is black again. 9 out of 10 people (including the sm) tell me that this is fine. "It is supposed to get black from doing its job" ... but I am still concerned. What's your take? Anyone else has black oil after a change and roughly a thousand miles (1.600 km)?

Ride safely,
Louis

[Air-Cooled]

Mine turns brown, not black. It is my understanding that true black color indicates metal wear.

[ice6900]

hi louis, aw: snow, roads are clear and dry, so i have my bike back home, just gave it a good wash down to get any salt off,  but snow is still settled on gardens and fields, thawing slowly i guess its all gone in a couple days.

re. ur oil?
 i have 1550km after a 16000km service, my oil is turning more brown but is still relatively clear, i am no scientist but i believe oil eventually turns black with wear and use. I would say air-cooled is correct in stating the black colouring is metal particals, which is normal wear and tear. also oil would change colour when subjected to high running temps. But i would expect oil after 5k 10k to be black not after 1.6k.
I have read in other threads that the 110 jugs machine tolerance .004/.005 is greater than 95cubic motors .001 if i understand that correctly. As time goes on i believe more and more the moco 110 is a lemon!
I luv my bike and want to keep it, but its gonna need $$$ in maintenance. We in europe r stuffed 2year warrenty, no options to upgrade as in the mother land.

[ice6900]

louis, isnt the oil drain plug magnetic? Did it have alot of lil filings clinging to it?  Which brand of oil r u using?
As u have double changed the oil and filter, i think u cant blame residual oil contaminating the new oil.

[AZSSE]

I had the 110 recall done about 2 months ago, and I knew I was hearing a different noise than before. I get a clicking noise, kind of like the old tappet noise from my 400" Pontiac firebird, which was known for knocking the top off of the rods. I didn't really know if the noise was new, or was always there, but unnoticed, since I recently started riding without my helmet so I would look cool. I get it at about 60-65 mph and 2300 rpm in 6th. The next time I go in for a service I'm going to ask about it. This is the very reason I like this site so much - it lets everyone know about all the problems,and all the solutions to things that I doubt anyone would even ask about if it wasn't for this site. This is why I donate and why I would encourage everyone to donate. I know that whatever I give, I'll get 100 times the value back.

[grc]

Black is more of an indicator of soot from the combustion process, not metal.  Most metal particles in these engines are either aluminum or steel, neither is black in color.  Also, some brands of motor oil start out much darker than others due to differences in additives, and will get much darker very rapidly in use.  Don't worry about the oil getting dark, all oil I've ever used or seen does the same thing.  On a positive note, the dark color makes it easier to read the dipstick.

Jerry

[sadunbar]

Oil that has metal in it - whether it is aluminum, steel, copper - will reflect back at you in direct light.  It will have a "metal flake" look to it, sorta like metal flake paint does...  Just black without flake in it is likely not a problem...   

[napalm]

Noticed yesterday I have an oil leak at the rear rocker arm base....it never stops!!!!

Have had two 110 motors, wouldn't buy a third (no stupid light on)  and still have not received the letter and book everyone is talking about!!!!

napalm

[BamaSE]

I had the engine upgrade kit installed and have put about 500 miles. I now have a ticking coming from the top end, have been back to the dealer 3 times. Each time they have a different answer  1) I wasn't riding the bike right (not keeping the engine at right RPM levels). Checked the manual (no reference to RPM level but recommended shift speeds per gear)   2) Took manual to dealer and they said the manual is wrong. So I rode per manual and never got over 2600 RPM, dealer says engine should be driven and shifted at 3000 to 3500 RPM. So I rode to their specs and never got out of 3rd gear until over 50 MPH. I'm not riding a two-stroke dirt bike but a Touring bike. On the freeway the speed limit is 60 MPH and shifting into 4th gear takes the RPM's to 2500.   3) Had mechanic who did engine upgrade ride bike and he said he didn't hear anything but maybe a transmission whine. I round tripped this bike to Sturgis and never had this ticking sound and as a truck driver for over 30 years I know when there is a change in sound to an engine.     

Has anyone else experienced this??

YES!! Here is another noise report.  Bought my '07 Ultra-SE2 in July '08 with only 650 miles on it.  Rode it for 600 miles before noticing oil at base of rear cylinder.  Took it to the dealer and they said they would replace the lower o-ring gasket.  Went to pick it up and they told me that there was a factory recall/upgrade for the 110 heads and that they had done the replacement.  They never did tell me exactly what got swapped out.  Anyway, now I definitely have noises that were not there before.  But since I had so few miles on the bike and the 110 engine to compare to, I was not certain that it was not "normal" to the beast.  (Traded up (?) from a '95 Electra Glide Classic that was perfect!) Below 2200 RPM the heads have no noticeable noise.  At exactly 2250 I have a ticking/tapping noise that starts.  It stays fairly constant up thru about 2750.  At 2800 it changes to a harder, much more solid tapping that gets loudest at 3000 before backing off slightly.  Have not had time to return to dealer. 

In the old days I would have said it needed a valve clearance adjustment but this thing doesn't have anything to adjust.  All the valve lash is taken up by the hydraulic lifters.  Right? 

Here are some specific questions for anybody who has time and knowledge.

1.  Has anybody had this noise that got it FIXED?  If so how? 

2.  Exactly what parts are swapped out in head recall? and What did they change in the design?

Something inside is not happy and I don't want to have to wait until it breaks to find out what was wrong all the time.

I'm still under warranty but not for long.

Tapping in Alabama!

Added 11-03-08

Follow thread 12405 from Chief   "Do you rat-a-tat-tat-tat" 
Sounds like the noise problem may be intake valves hitting rocker box cover and/or push rod length.
Good info.

[PAPA T]

Taking mine in for 2500 mile service and MOCO head gasket replacement Wednesday evening. (Supposed to rain Thursday.....lol)   
  Mine has definite "Tappet" noise at 3k rpm in all gears. When I am just cruising at that rpm in any gear it is LOUD!
  The last thing I road was a Panhead so I really have no reference for the 110 but gonna ask them to explain it to me.
 

[art2001]

surprise!!!!!!!! 
Just got notification from the dealer that they just got a service bulletin on the ticking sound. The one they said they couldn't hear and it was normal for the 110. I haven't had time to get there and talk to them about the fix. Hopping to do so tomarrow. Will let you know what they say.

[Billy]

Please let us know if there is a # to go with the recall My dealer also says normal  like every other problem until someone finds theanswer. Thanks Billy

[tennisman]

Hmmm...I have an 08 Ultra SE, Stage I, Rinehart TDs, SERT - I have received the upgrade offer letter and the book from the MoCo and my dealer has ordered the "upgrade" kit.  My dilemma is, especially after reading all this, that I have 7.5K miles and have no leaks, except I get some oil back thru the air cleaner that wets the air filter - had to clean the air filter once since new) and my engine is quite quiet.  I hear some general noise but nothing unusual for an air-cooled, aluminum block motor (as a matter of fact, it is quieter than I expected after renting 88 CID Ultras previously).
So, do I let the dealer open up a leak-free, quiet motor this winter or tell him to sit on the parts for now???

T-man

[LRebel]

surprise!!!!!!!! 
Just got notification from the dealer that they just got a service bulletin on the ticking sound. The one they said they couldn't hear and it was normal for the 110. I haven't had time to get there and talk to them about the fix. Hopping to do so tomarrow. Will let you know what they say.

Yes, inquiring minds want to know!

[BamaSE]

Update to my last post.  Back to the dealer today.  Service manager took the bike out (07 CUSE).  I had told him exactly how to duplicate the noises.  He rides for a while comes back and says ..... (are you sitting down for this?)  that he thinks I have an EXHAUST LEAK from the front jug!   It was all I could do to keep a straight face.  He says they want to get it up on the rack to check it out before he does anything else.  Taking it back tomorrow for more shop time.  And just for some more humor, I mentioned that my heated grips hardly had any warm much less heat.  He told me to "wear heated gloves!"!!  I kid you not.  That's a quote!

surprise!!!!!!!! 
Just got notification from the dealer that they just got a service bulletin on the ticking sound. The one they said they couldn't hear and it was normal for the 110. I haven't had time to get there and talk to them about the fix. Hopping to do so tomarrow. Will let you know what they say.

Wow, would SERIOUSLY like any information on a service bulletin you can get about head noise.

I'll mention the possibility of a service bulletin tomorrow and see if my guy can find anything.

[johnchalker]

I got a call from my dealer yesterday,my 08 cvo glide duracell went in for the recall on Monday, and they say that part of the recall is to check the barrells and mine needs new ones.The only problem is that the parts are on back order and they cant give me a time scale but they think about 8 weeks and I cant have the bike as the engine is in bits.I am so glad that i waited for the season to come to an end and I am not missing any days riding.

[ice6900]

that really sucks John, wouldnt want mine opened up for 8weeks. What is ur dealers storage facilities like; spacious warm dry heated like ur garage at home, over crowded outside but under a roof like mine was stored at the dealer last winter?
I would go there 2morrow to c exactly where and how its stored, maybe take ur own motorcycle cover there, to try to avoid unnescessary scratches.

[ultrafxr]

Black is more of an indicator of soot from the combustion process, not metal.  Most metal particles in these engines are either aluminum or steel, neither is black in color.  Also, some brands of motor oil start out much darker than others due to differences in additives, and will get much darker very rapidly in use.  Don't worry about the oil getting dark, all oil I've ever used or seen does the same thing.  On a positive note, the dark color makes it easier to read the dipstick.

Jerry

Running too rich maybe.

[Gone Fishin']

that really sucks John, wouldnt want mine opened up for 8weeks. What is ur dealers storage facilities like; spacious warm dry heated like ur garage at home, over crowded outside but under a roof like mine was stored at the dealer last winter?
I would go there 2morrow to c exactly where and how its stored, maybe take ur own motorcycle cover there, to try to avoid unnescessary scratches.

Like this? 



Luckily it was only two weeks until the parts got it ...

Ride safely,
Louis

[DESERTBEAR54]

Well I am getting ready to take mine into the dealer this coming Monday and I have also had the 605 campain done. I have clanging noise coming from the motor in 1,2,3rd gear between 2600 and 2900 rpm. I either shift early so I don't hear it or I wait and go right through it to 3000RPM. It never did this until I had the 605 campain. I also have developed a major start problem since the 605 campain and the only way I can start the bike is by bumping the starter and then hit it to get it started. I am also having the top lid on the TP replaced because the paint is flaking off the top around the luggage mount. My seat is also being replaced because the leather is flaking off next to the stitching.They are also repacing my oil filter housing because the powder coating is flaking completely off. I also have powder coating flaking off the motor. My heated handgrips also quit working and the left one broke loose and moves.On top of all this at 75mph in 6th gear I have loud ticking noise that is now very noticeable. I am loosing total faith in HD and I think it's time to unload my new 08SEUC. And to think I got rid of a perfectly good running 06 RK???

[bisounours]

Well I am getting ready to take mine into the dealer this coming Monday and I have also had the 605 campain done. I have clanging noise coming from the motor in 1,2,3rd gear between 2600 and 2900 rpm. I either shift early so I don't hear it or I wait and go right through it to 3000RPM. It never did this until I had the 605 campain. I also have developed a major start problem since the 605 campain and the only way I can start the bike is by bumping the starter and then hit it to get it started. I am also having the top lid on the TP replaced because the paint is flaking off the top around the luggage mount. My seat is also being replaced because the leather is flaking off next to the stitching.They are also repacing my oil filter housing because the powder coating is flaking completely off. I also have powder coating flaking off the motor. My heated handgrips also quit working and the left one broke loose and moves.On top of all this at 75mph in 6th gear I have loud ticking noise that is now very noticeable. I am loosing total faith in HD and I think it's time to unload my new 08SEUC. And to think I got rid of a perfectly good running 06 RK???

Sorry for your problems...
Do you've a pic of your seat ?

Thanks
Jacques

[DESERTBEAR54]

Jacques, My dealer took pictures and sent them to the Moco. I still need to get my camera out and take some pictures for you.

[tennisman]

If one has their ride in for a "free upgrade" and, due to parts unavailability, the bike is there for 8 weeks, does the warranty get extended for 8 weeks?  Hmmm....

[PAPA T]

I took my FXDSE2 in today for the Head Gasket Recall and 2500 mile service and asked about ticking noise Service Bulletin and they said " Don't have anything on that". 

The only issues Ive been having besides the ticking is the alarm sounds like birds chirping instead of the ear splitting noise it was, a squeak when rolling coming from the rear area that sounds like a wheel bearing, and the front end is very soft. (they said change to a heavier fork oil)   

Any info on SB for ticking appreciated!!!

[ice6900]

If one has their ride in for a "free upgrade" and, due to parts unavailability, the bike is there for 8 weeks, does the warranty get extended for 8 weeks?  Hmmm....

i havn^t seen any pigs fly lately!

Well my ride is enhanced, managed an hours ride 2day  as i got off work early, seems ok, runs just as b4, with all the normal 110 noises!

[art2001]

OK.....Made it to the dealer yesterday to check on the fix for the engine ticking after the upgrade.  They said that as of now there is not a service bulletin  and that they had a tech back at the MOCO who found out the info. They said the reason for the ticking is that the valve spring seats are larger then the stock and the spring clip is hitting the rocker box. The fix dramel the inside of the rocker box for .060 clearance. What is funny is that this is a noise they said they didn't hear and that it was normal. I told them the fix has been public knowledge for months on this site.    Not sure if I want to do this asap as it seems like a quick fix and not a solution, maybe take some time to  on it.

[mr_magoo]

They just don't listen to us.

[sadunbar]

OK.....Made it to the dealer yesterday to check on the fix for the engine ticking after the upgrade.  They said that as of now there is not a service bulletin  and that they had a tech back at the MOCO who found out the info. They said the reason for the ticking is that the valve spring seats are larger then the stock and the spring clip is hitting the rocker box. The fix dramel the inside of the rocker box for .060 clearance. What is funny is that this is a noise they said they didn't hear and that it was normal. I told them the fix has been public knowledge for months on this site.    Not sure if I want to do this asap as it seems like a quick fix and not a solution, maybe take some time to  on it.

Read the attached notice...you will see the MOCO has previously issued a service technical bulletin to resolve the problem of the valve spring retainers contacting the rocker boxes....TT370     

You can educate your dealer with a bulletin that was issued in May of 2008!

Note the section on New Rocker Housing and Gasket...  There are even pictures!!

http://www.cvoharley.com/smf/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=25486.0;attach=73693

[art2001]

sadunbar.... printed a copy of TT307 from the link you sent, I then went to the dealer"s on Sat. I kind of set up the service advisor in regards to the fix to the ticking, after all of the story unfolded I then asked for them to pull up the tech tip you referred too. The look on their face was priceless.  The end result is they are coming to pick up the bike next Sat. and do the clearance, then return bike. 

[sadunbar]

sadunbar.... printed a copy of TT307 from the link you sent, I then went to the dealer"s on Sat. I kind of set up the service advisor in regards to the fix to the ticking, after all of the story unfolded I then asked for them to pull up the tech tip you referred too. The look on their face was priceless.  The end result is they are coming to pick up the bike next Sat. and do the clearance, then return bike. 

Good deal....glad it worked out for you...!   

[Wildrat]

Sorry about this, but HD just does not seem to care about us, or their bikes. They know if they put their name on a toilet someone would buy it just because of the name. It's the same with their bikes, we buy them because they are HD's and we assume that because it is a HD the workmanship and pride is built into the bike but it is not. It's not the builders fault it is the money hungry employers. People talk about the Jap bikes, yea they have their issues but look at what you get as far as add-ons as compared to a HD and at a much lower cost. Don't get me wrong I'm not going to get rid of my HD for a Jap bike. It just stirs me up when I read some of this stuff. The Dealers are a whole different can of worms. I won't even go there. Again, sorry for the jack, but, but.....

[fxdsebeloved]

I had the engine upgrade kit installed and have put about 500 miles. I now have a ticking coming from the top end, have been back to the dealer 3 times. Each time they have a different answer  1) I wasn't riding the bike right (not keeping the engine at right RPM levels). Checked the manual (no reference to RPM level but recommended shift speeds per gear)   2) Took manual to dealer and they said the manual is wrong. So I rode per manual and never got over 2600 RPM, dealer says engine should be driven and shifted at 3000 to 3500 RPM. So I rode to their specs and never got out of 3rd gear until over 50 MPH. I'm not riding a two-stroke dirt bike but a Touring bike. On the freeway the speed limit is 60 MPH and shifting into 4th gear takes the RPM's to 2500.   3) Had mechanic who did engine upgrade ride bike and he said he didn't hear anything but maybe a transmission whine. I round tripped this bike to Sturgis and never had this ticking sound and as a truck driver for over 30 years I know when there is a change in sound to an engine.     

Has anyone else experienced this??

Mine started after the first Head Gasket fix.  I kept on complaining about the ticking to the point that they finally had a MoCo rep take it for a ride.  His responce was "I have heard worse"    It seemed a little quieter after the "Enhancement" was done. I commented about the how the new style rocker box must have quieted down the ticking.  The dealer said we didn't change the rocker box? that wasn't part of the Recall for your bike.  I told them it sure is  that came out in Dec 07 after I Had the gasket done in late Nov 07  Been on the phone with MoCo.....

[SERK3]

If one has their ride in for a "free upgrade" and, due to parts unavailability, the bike is there for 8 weeks, does the warranty get extended for 8 weeks?  Hmmm....

Where did you take your bike? Knox H-D ordered the parts for mine 6 weeks ago said they would call when they came in, Have not heard from them as of today, But i did not let them keep my bike. With all the problems i'm reading on here sounds like the fix is not fixing the problem. Since we have 2 years to have this done think i will wait even if they do call me, I have not had any problems with mine so why fix something thats not broke?

[BalDeagle]

Read the attached notice...you will see the MOCO has previously issued a service technical bulletin to resolve the problem of the valve spring retainers contacting the rocker boxes....TT370     

You can educate your dealer with a bulletin that was issued in May of 2008!

Note the section on New Rocker Housing and Gasket...  There are even pictures!!

http://www.cvoharley.com/smf/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=25486.0;attach=73693

Does this bulletin cover all the upgrades for the 07/08 110 or is there another bulletin with more stuff on?

Nige

[Gecko]

I took mine in yesterday evening for the recall, a balmy 36 degree ride.  My dealer told me a couple months ago that he'd call me when they got some more kits in.  Nothing.  Last weekend I was in and asked if they got any in....three.  With few bikes in for service this time of year you'd think they would at least want a little warranty work.

Grinding out the rocker boxes didn't help mine; that was done long ago and the noise has become "normal".  With revenues falling customer service from the MOCO will only get worse.

[Hoist!]

Does this bulletin cover all the upgrades for the 07/08 110 or is there another bulletin with more stuff on?

Nige

Hey Nige, how ya doing? That Bulletin describes running changes they made to the 110's. They do not necessarily represent what they're doing to existing motors. Some of those items are included in the 0905/0906 Enhancements. You're not getting free new rocker boxes and gaskets or new heads. For the SERK, it's HG's, BG's, ACR's, and center bolt. As far as I know, that's all the SERK's get. Based on this, I agree with others here, if yours ain't broke, don't fix it. Ya got 2 years. Wait til it breaks/leaks again. It will!

Hoist!

[BalDeagle]

Hey Nige, how ya doing? That Bulletin describes running changes they made to the 110's. They do not necessarily represent what they're doing to existing motors. Some of those items are included in the 0905/0906 Enhancements. You're not getting free new rocker boxes and gaskets or new heads. For the SERK, it's HG's, BG's, ACR's, and center bolt. As far as I know, that's all the SERK's get. Based on this, I agree with others here, if yours ain't broke, don't fix it. Ya got 2 years. Wait til it breaks/leaks again. It will!

Hoist!

Hey Howie - I'm doin just darn tootin thank you very much.

I was interested to see what the full upgrade was supposed to be according to my Yankee chums. The stealership phoned me a couple of weeks ago to say that my bike had a recall on it. I asked what they were going to do and they said "change the gaskets" and nothing else! This kind of got me a little worked up anyway as they had already "changed the gaskets" following my leak at about 4,000 miles. I wonder why they didn't mention the other things that you have said above?

Bike performed great during it's 8,500 mile extravaganzy and you are right in saying that "If it ain't broke don't fix it". That was my intention anyway.

It would be nice to have a printed letter from the MoCo to fling in front of them regarding the other upgrades. I guess I need the SERK specific upgrade notice.

Say Hi to Binx 

Nige

[Hoist!]

Hey Howie - I'm doin just darn tootin thank you very much.

I was interested to see what the full upgrade was supposed to be according to my Yankee chums. The stealership phoned me a couple of weeks ago to say that my bike had a recall on it. I asked what they were going to do and they said "change the gaskets" and nothing else! This kind of got me a little worked up anyway as they had already "changed the gaskets" following my leak at about 4,000 miles. I wonder why they didn't mention the other things that you have said above?

Bike performed great during it's 8,500 mile extravaganzy and you are right in saying that "If it ain't broke don't fix it". That was my intention anyway.

It would be nice to have a printed letter from the MoCo to fling in front of them regarding the other upgrades. I guess I need the SERK specific upgrade notice.

Say Hi to Binx 

Nige

I surely will! And you do the same with Jan please!

You should bring this in. And taking a closer look, no BG's either! Actually, you should have gotten a letter from the factory. Believe it or not, even I got one. Yeah, like I'll be doing any of it! FTF!!!

Hoist!

[BalDeagle]

I surely will! And you do the same with Jan please!

You should bring this in. And taking a closer look, no BG's either! Actually, you should have gotten a letter from the factory. Believe it or not, even I got one. Yeah, like I'll be doing any of it! FTF!!!

Hoist!

Well TY kind sir  just what I was looking for.

I'm not sure what you mean by the last bit - have you altered your bike outside of factory specifications in some way?

 

Nige

[Hoist!]

Well TY kind sir  just what I was looking for.

I'm not sure what you mean by the last bit - have you altered your bike outside of factory specifications in some way?

 

Nige

Not at all Nige! I maintain much higher standards than they do, and exceed all of their specifications!

Hoist!

[BalDeagle]

Not at all Nige! I maintain much higher standards than they do, and exceed all of their specifications!

Hoist!

Not too difficult to reach higher than those in MHO.

Nige

[jazz]

I got a call from my dealer yesterday,my 08 cvo glide duracell went in for the recall on Monday, and they say that part of the recall is to check the barrells and mine needs new ones.The only problem is that the parts are on back order and they cant give me a time scale but they think about 8 weeks and I cant have the bike as the engine is in bits.I am so glad that i waited for the season to come to an end and I am not missing any days riding.
Hey John,
How many miles did you have on your duracell when she went in?

Jazz

[Wildrat]

8 weeks! That's insane! HD should just buy relabeled motors from a reputable builder. If the Government had used my economic plan and had given us the 480 billion dollars, I would have gladly bought you a new motor, that's economic stimulus, not giving it to the crooks who caused the problem. Oh Well, I know it's gonna bother ya them having your bike. Hopefully you will get it back without left over parts.

[grc]

Nige,

Try printing out the two attachments I'm about to post, they have a full list of parts and part numbers for the 2 different "enhancement" programs.

Jerry

[grc]

#2 attachment

Jerry

[johnchalker]

The mileage was 3700 when it went in for the recall. I have since spoke to Customer Services who have chased it up for me and the parts will leave Europe next Wednesday and arrive at the dealers 2 days later,so hopefully the following week the bike should be ready for me. 

The question is do I let them bring it back to me in their van or should I go and get it myself and give it a good run to see if there are any issues with the engine, its a 200 mile round trip to the dealers.

[jazz]

The mileage was 3700 when it went in for the recall. I have since spoke to Customer Services who have chased it up for me and the parts will leave Europe next Wednesday and arrive at the dealers 2 days later,so hopefully the following week the bike should be ready for me. 

The question is do I let them bring it back to me in their van or should I go and get it myself and give it a good run to see if there are any issues with the engine, its a 200 mile round trip to the dealers.

John,
I had just over 5000 on the clock when my duracell went in for the fix.  I had no leaks or any problems before, and no leaks or problems now. I have done about 250 miles since the fix and all seems OK, although I have experienced that ticking sound from the top end that some of the guys have mentioned.  I put that down to a bit of bedding in!  I also got those Monster Ovals fitted that you recommended, and they are awsome! 

Jazz

[Wildrat]

Go get the bike and ride, it's only hundred miles back to the house, should be a nice ride for ya, and you can get a few miles on the motor, and don't forget your cell phone just in case.

[BalDeagle]

#2 attachment

Jerry

Thanks Jerry - always good to have more ammunition information than the enemy.

 

Nige

[RedDevil]

Dropped my SEUC off at the dealer today to have 0905 installed.  I'll be picking it up when I get off travel next Saturday.  So we'll see how it goes.

   

[graygost267]

   I have put about 1500 miles on my 08 CUSE3 since the new heads and gaskets were installed and have not had any ill effects.   Bike runs great and is quiet - at least from the engine perspective.  Pipes are a little louder than I prefer since I did a Stage 1 upgrade, but WTF, it runs great and I love it. I have bike 63/1800 and have been very pleased with its performance.  Of course at 71, I am not about doing wheelies or winding it out in each gear.  Did that 40 years ago, now it is so out of my system.  Now I just enjoy the open road and meeting new friends. 

graygost

[tennisman]

That's good news, Ghost!  How many miles did you have before you did the upgrade?  Did you have any issues b4 the upgrade?  I have an 08, Stage I, SERT, Rinehart TDs with no issues except a little drool in the air cleaner.  I did have the dealer order the upgrade kit but have become less interested in doing the upgrade after hearing some of the horror stories.
Appreciate your experience.
I also am long over wheelies, high speed at the golden age of 60.
T-man

[REGGAB]

  I have put about 1500 miles on my 08 CUSE3 since the new heads and gaskets were installed and have not had any ill effects.   Bike runs great and is quiet - at least from the engine perspective.  Pipes are a little louder than I prefer since I did a Stage 1 upgrade, but WTF, it runs great and I love it. I have bike 63/1800 and have been very pleased with its performance.  Of course at 71, I am not about doing wheelies or winding it out in each gear.  Did that 40 years ago, now it is so out of my system.  Now I just enjoy the open road and meeting new friends. 

graygost

Hopefully they have you squared away now, Ken.  If not, I know a top notch builder.   
We need to ride down there and see Rod.  I took him and Bob Wood to lunch at Luna's in Hanceville last Saturday.  Great BBQ.

[mcdonaldroadcapt]

Had my top end done, rode to Daytona and back plus many short trips.  All looks good to the eye.  I think that I have a little less noise since done.  Runs just as good as before as I had the SERC, Rineharts, and SE cleaner done at delivery.

[tennisman]

since you have same setup as me, let me know if a) you run some interstate speeds at least 30% of your travels and b) if you get any oil carryover in the air cleaner (I do, about a tablespoon every 2-3000 miles).

T-man

[graygost267]

   Hey T-Man:  I had just over 12,500 miles when I had the head recall done.  Bike ran great before the recall and seems to run a bit better now afterwards.  I never had a leak around the rear cylinder head or around the air breather before the recall and still don't have one.  I now have 14,350 on the bike.   All of that mileage was done in seven months.  I bought the bike in November 2007 and in December had a knee replacement and couldn't ride for five months (Dr's orders).  Have been making up for lost time since.  YEEEEEE  HAAAAAAAA. 

graygost267

[tennisman]

Good to hear, Ghost - I just turned 8,000 miles (bought mine end of June, '08).  I don't have a leak (just checked it) at the rear cylinder and I think I'll wait on the upgrade.  Hope I can roll on scores more miles without a leak...guess we'll see.
American Iron mag has an article on the 110 motor and rear cylinder leak in this month's issue.
T 

[BalDeagle]

I've now put on around 10,000 miles since the "B" gasket was installed. No problems since then. Still wondering whether to let them do the other upgrades.

[ice6900]

u have 2 years, if u were me i would wait till next winter, i had the same dilema as u, i would have waited till next winter except my lower rear was seeping.

[tennisman]

That is my inclination (to wait) BUT, there is the matter of the ACRs.  If one of those fail when I am, say, in the hills of West VA next summer, that would suck.  But I think I will wait, with fingers crossed. 
If I read all the info right, my valve guides are okay since my build month was May 08.  If I have this wrong, someone please let me know!
T-man

[tireless]

I had the recall work done at the 1K service because it seemed the ACR's didn't always do their job, every 3rd or 4th start would kick back and sound like the teeth were going to ripped of the starter. Was hoping the new ACR's would cure it..... no joy.

[ice6900]

I had the recall work done at the 1K service because it seemed the ACR's didn't always do their job, every 3rd or 4th start would kick back and sound like the teeth were going to ripped of the starter. Was hoping the new ACR's would cure it..... no joy.

ouch!  doesnt sound good to me.

[RedDevil]

I just picked my Jester up from the dealer today after having 0905 done.  I talked to the tech that did the work and he stated that I probably could have gone a long time or not even have had the enhancement done.  He stated that mine was "tight".  I told him that when I did have the head gasket leak the first time, they replaced the gaskets with the "B" version.  He said that's why mine looked so good when he opened it up.  He said mine was the best one he'd worked on.  The only difference I noticed after the enhancement is that it starts easier now.  One of my ACRs must have been bad.  He didn't say anything about either of them being bad though.  Engine runs the same as it did before the enhancement.

 

[HungarianKing]

Does anyone know why program 0906 doesn"t include new heads?
-HK

[RedDevil]

Because 0905 does?      (Sorry, couldn't resist that.)

 

[art2001]

Picked up the bike today. On the ride home the engine sounded like it did b4 the upgrade, power feels good.    However now the radio isn't working right but that is minor compared to mechanical issues.    I will be trying to put some miles on over turkey day break.
Thank you for all the good info and will keep you posted.

[tennisman]

"Does anyone know why program 0906 doesn"t include new heads?
-HK"

I understand that the other issue is valve guide fit and the bikes who get the 0906 kit already have the new valve guide design.

T-man

[RedDevil]

"Does anyone know why program 0906 doesn"t include new heads?
-HK"

I understand that the other issue is valve guide fit and the bikes who get the 0906 kit already have the new valve guide design.

T-man

That would seem to be the logical assumption, however, the 07 SE Road Kings had the exact same 110A engine that the 07 SEUC had, same heads, everything, and they're not in the 0905 campaign.    The only explanation I've heard, that somewhat makes sense, but not really, is that because the SEUC has the lowers, its rear cylinder get hotter than the free-flowing SERK, therefore the heads got hotter.  I dunno if that's the reason or not,  but that's the MoCo's story and they're sticking to it.

 

[tennisman]

So, if not the valve guide, then what is the diff in the heads?

[ice6900]

The only explanation I've heard, that somewhat makes sense, but not really, is that because the SEUC has the lowers, its rear cylinder get hotter than the free-flowing SERK, therefore the heads got hotter.

Thats the only explanation that makes any sence 2 me!

[tennisman]

??  Then what is the point of replacing the heads - it's not going to change the fact that the rear cyl is going to run hotter than on non-lowers bikes.  What the new head have that's not in the old head (cept maybe some carbon!)

[ice6900]

doesnt the new head have a circlip on the valve guides, to stop them falling down?  there are some pics on another thread but i couldnt find it.

[Gone Fishin']

The only explanation I've heard, that somewhat makes sense, but not really, is that because the SEUC has the lowers, its rear cylinder get hotter than the free-flowing SERK, therefore the heads got hotter.

Thats the only explanation that makes any sence 2 me!

I think you are completely right, even if the factory story is, well, strange. When I had the upgrade done on my '07 SERK I received new heads as well. It was a dealer courtesy, because at that time no one in Europe had any real documentation, at least not as much as was already available on this site. That is one of the reasons I started a thread specific to the parts used. Unfortunately that thread got hijacked and the good information is now buried under a lot of other comments.

Ride safely,
Louis
... still no delivery date on my '09 SEUC!!

[ice6900]

Louis
... still no delivery date on my '09 SEUC!!

u dont need it now till march anyway  do u?  No point havin it now n not riding it much till march, save ur self 4months warrenty

[Gone Fishin']

u dont need it now till march anyway  do u?  No point havin it now n not riding it much till march, save ur self 4months warrenty

Your right about the warranty, however I want to break it in in February to have it tuned and ready by March. Last year I had 4.200 km by the end of March on the '08 SEUC. We'll see. I spoke to the dealer today, still no word.

Ride safely,
Louis

[grc]

??  Then what is the point of replacing the heads - it's not going to change the fact that the rear cyl is going to run hotter than on non-lowers bikes.  What the new head have that's not in the old head (cept maybe some carbon!)

The new head assembly comes with the new valve guides, as well as the new ACR's.  That's the only difference.  

The new guides have a retainer circlip that will keep the guide from dropping and screwing up the engine.  That has happened on some 110's, obviously in large enough numbers that H-D thought they should redesign the guide.  In reality, if the interference fit of the guide to the head is done properly, the clip isn't needed.  Think of it as insurance for lousy quality control.

Jerry

[RedDevil]

??  Then what is the point of replacing the heads - it's not going to change the fact that the rear cyl is going to run hotter than on non-lowers bikes.  What the new head have that's not in the old head (cept maybe some carbon!)

T-Man, the only thing that I know that the new heads have is a retaining clip about half-way up the valve guide.  Not really sure how that's going to work.  All I know is that the tech said it's a lot nicer doing the ACR replacement in the 0905 campaign than the 0906 because the heads come with the ACR's already installed.  He was happy to see that because he said it's not necessarily hard to do, but time consuming. 

   

[johnchalker]

Just got my bike back from the recall.4 weeks it took and it was delivered back by van and no cost to me.Not being mechanically minded it sounds ok and when the weather is ok i will put some miles on it to make sure it rins ok.

[ice6900]

that was quicker than expected eh John,  i have the same problem cant put many miles on cus of da weather.

[DAD]

Got my bike back and was told the MOCO stopped replacing the heads so I got everything except for the new heads.  Seems to run okay for now.  My '08 SEUC was built in October of '07 and should have gotten new heads.     Has anyone else heard this or is the MOCO trying to get out of some of the expense?

[Hoist!]

Got my bike back and was told the MOCO stopped replacing the heads so I got everything except for the new heads.  Seems to run okay for now.  My '08 SEUC was built in October of '07 and should have gotten new heads.     Has anyone else heard this or is the MOCO trying to get out of some of the expense?

Sounds like you got screwed out of your new heads The Dugans! The EP clearly states new heads for the SEUC's. The other 3 SE bike guys got screwed out of new heads by definition of the 2 different EP's for these bikes. But yours was clearly to be provided with new heads. I'd demand them from them. Too bad they gotta break your motor apart again though. But I'd force this issue with them!

Hoist!

[DAD]

Sounds like you got screwed out of your new heads The Dugans! The EP clearly states new heads for the SEUC's. The other 3 SE bike guys got screwed out of new heads by definition of the 2 different EP's for these bikes. But yours was clearly to be provided with new heads. I'd demand them from them. Too bad they gotta break your motor apart again though. But I'd force this issue with them!

Hoist!

Thanks Hoist.  It's back to the dealer for another round!   

[RedDevil]

Got my bike back and was told the MOCO stopped replacing the heads so I got everything except for the new heads.  Seems to run okay for now.  My '08 SEUC was built in October of '07 and should have gotten new heads.     Has anyone else heard this or is the MOCO trying to get out of some of the expense?

I just got my SEUC2 back from the dealer and they received the complete kit from the MoCo, heads and all.  If you didn't get the new heads, it may be your dealer, not the MoCo.  I would also question then whether you got the new ACR's, because in EP 0905, which is what your bike should have fallen under, the ACR come pre-installed in the new heads.  So check on that too.

   

[HarleyJeff]

I had the recall work done at the 1K service because it seemed the ACR's didn't always do their job, every 3rd or 4th start would kick back and sound like the teeth were going to ripped of the starter. Was hoping the new ACR's would cure it..... no joy.

Hey tireless, I had the same problem after my fix. Made them change the starter, problem cured.

[aushog]

Dropped mine off this morning for new heads, gasket, and more.  Noticed a little bit of oil on the cylinders at about 2,000 miles.  Dealer said it was nothing.  At 5,000 miles, still not much happening.  Then, at 5,300 major leak developed.  Dripping off rear cylinder, blowing onto saddlebags when I ride, making a mess.  I'm surprised how fast it went.

I'll find out later this week how it all works out.

[tireless]

Hey tireless, I had the same problem after my fix. Made them change the starter, problem cured.

Thanks Jeff, I'll head down that path after Christmas

[sadunbar]

Dropped mine off this morning for new heads, gasket, and more.  Noticed a little bit of oil on the cylinders at about 2,000 miles.  Dealer said it was nothing.  At 5,000 miles, still not much happening.  Then, at 5,300 major leak developed.  Dripping off rear cylinder, blowing onto saddlebags when I ride, making a mess.  I'm surprised how fast it went.

I'll find out later this week how it all works out.

   

  huh? 

(if you walk into the doctor's office dripping just a little bit of blood - and the doctor says "it is nothing" - I'd go find another doctor...)

[aushog]

   

  huh? 

(if you walk into the doctor's office dripping just a little bit of blood - and the doctor says "it is nothing" - I'd go find another doctor...)

Yeah, there was a little oil on the back of the rear cylinder at about 2,000 miles.  Took it to the dealer and they said it must have been some oil spilled during the oil change, and blew back there when riding.  If it was leaking then, it was a very small leak.  No doubt about it now.

[tennisman]

When did you buy your 08 Ultra...curious to the month.  I have almost 9K and don't have any leak yet (fingers crossed).
T-man

[RedDevil]

Yeah, there was a little oil on the back of the rear cylinder at about 2,000 miles.  Took it to the dealer and they said it must have been some oil spilled during the oil change, and blew back there when riding.  If it was leaking then, it was a very small leak.  No doubt about it now.

Wait a minute!!  They said that it must have been spilled oil? First off, that's just plain sloppiness on the dealer's part if there's spilled oil and they didn't clean it off.  There's only three areas that could have any "spilled" oil, the oil pan plug, (hard to spill there), the filler tube, could spill there but it wouldn't blow forward and up to the rear cylinder, (unless you turned the bike upside down and drove it backwards), or sometimes oil gets caught between the oil cooler and the chrome oil cooler cover, but that would be physically impossible for the oil to fly up from there across the engine past the rear cylinder and then come back and end up on the rear of the rear cylinder.    Time to get a new servicing dealer...this place is clueless....JMHO....

   

[sadunbar]

Wait a minute!!  They said that it must have been spilled oil? First off, that's just plain sloppiness on the dealer's part if there's spilled oil and they didn't clean it off.  There's only three areas that could have any "spilled" oil, the oil pan plug, (hard to spill there), the filler tube, could spill there but it wouldn't blow forward and up to the rear cylinder, (unless you turned the bike upside down and drove it backwards), or sometimes oil gets caught between the oil cooler and the chrome oil cooler cover, but that would be physically impossible for the oil to fly up from there across the engine past the rear cylinder and then come back and end up on the rear of the rear cylinder.    Time to get a new servicing dealer...this place is clueless....JMHO....

   

 

[Para Bellum]

Wait a minute!!  They said that it must have been spilled oil? First off, that's just plain sloppiness on the dealer's part if there's spilled oil and they didn't clean it off.  There's only three areas that could have any "spilled" oil, the oil pan plug, (hard to spill there), the filler tube, could spill there but it wouldn't blow forward and up to the rear cylinder, (unless you turned the bike upside down and drove it backwards), or sometimes oil gets caught between the oil cooler and the chrome oil cooler cover, but that would be physically impossible for the oil to fly up from there across the engine past the rear cylinder and then come back and end up on the rear of the rear cylinder.    Time to get a new servicing dealer...this place is clueless....JMHO....

   

Oil spill?  Makes perfect sense to me...when you add oil through the rocker covers, it's easy to spill a little...OH Wait...that only applies to Harley-Davidson cars!  That SM/SA/mechanic must have worked for MoCo cars before transferring to the MC side...so it's a reasonable mistake. 

[dave56]

Have an 07 Road King Screaming Eagle that I love (but slipping out of love quickly) with 19,000 miles, with about 14 months of riding (in shop for upgrades and out of the country are my only days I have not ridden). I know every noise.  I've been riding 38 years, but first Harley.  Before my upgrade at 18,000 miles, not a single issue, after my upgrade I heard the tapping noise immediately, and am now having several other issues, including stalling.  All our dealers must attend the same training.  "I can't hear anything". and "I've heard worse".  I got HD involved, and demanded they send out someone from HD to ride and tell me what is going on.  They said it would be 6-8 weeks. This is after it started stalling in traffic and I told them it was a safety issue.  They said I can have it picked up and put in the shop again for 6-8 weeks until they get there on their normal rounds.  I get the attitude that I am the only one in the world with this problem.  Glad to see I am not.

Today I couldn't keep it running at lights without stalling out, so I have to put it in the shop and be at the mercy of HD.

I read about TT370 MOCO, that was a fix.  Any updates?

[SixGun]

Just got mine back from the "2nd" head fix!

My tank is scratched, the floorboard fell of in the parking lot, and the horn is banging the cylinders...Geezz!

I ain't taking it back, they phuque up more than they fix!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Does any service tech know how to do chit anymore?

[tennisman]

You make the case I have perpetuated for years, and that is:  DIY.   I have bought all kinds of tools; I even have a tire changer, so not to get things, as you say, phucked up!  Read AI mag - they have had a series of articles on the 110" design issues and why the current HD "fix" will only treat the symptom and the problem still exists.  I have the letter from the MOCO but am waiting for a symptom to show its ugly head.  I have 10,000+ on my UltraSE and have been lucky....so far.
My dealer, I believe, may be a tad better than your experience.  Dealer did do the SERT and a dyno with no bad cosmetic effects.
T-man

[bisounours]

Have an 07 Road King Screaming Eagle that I love (but slipping out of love quickly) with 19,000 miles, with about 14 months of riding (in shop for upgrades and out of the country are my only days I have not ridden). I know every noise.  I've been riding 38 years, but first Harley.  Before my upgrade at 18,000 miles, not a single issue, after my upgrade I heard the tapping noise immediately, and am now having several other issues, including stalling.  All our dealers must attend the same training.  "I can't hear anything". and "I've heard worse".  I got HD involved, and demanded they send out someone from HD to ride and tell me what is going on.  They said it would be 6-8 weeks. This is after it started stalling in traffic and I told them it was a safety issue.  They said I can have it picked up and put in the shop again for 6-8 weeks until they get there on their normal rounds.  I get the attitude that I am the only one in the world with this problem.  Glad to see I am not.

Today I couldn't keep it running at lights without stalling out, so I have to put it in the shop and be at the mercy of HD.

I read about TT370 MOCO, that was a fix.  Any updates?

Good morning dave56

  on the CVO website 

It would be nice for the other members if you present you in the thread New member introduction
with a pic of your bike 

Best regards

  Jacques