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[OILCAN1]

I have an 07 ultra classic w/a 110". happy with the power (100HP&110ft/lb) planning on changing the gearing using the 30tooth andrews front sprocket.

My SM told me no belt change would be required, Andrews web site says no belt change required, so hopefully that is the case. My question is will this throw off the speedometer and if so what is the proper way to correct this?

[Black Diamond]

I have an 07 ultra classic w/a 110". happy with the power (100HP&110ft/lb) planning on changing the gearing using the 30tooth andrews front sprocket.

My SM told me no belt change would be required, Andrews web site says no belt change required, so hopefully that is the case. My question is will this throw off the speedometer and if so what is the proper way to correct this?

I am looking into the same 30T front transmission pulley. My SM says that Andrews info is wrong. You must use a different belt to match. See this thread for details http://www.cvoharley.com/smf/index.php?topic=42529.msg648455#msg648455

It will throw off the speedo.

JW

[Twolanerider]

I am looking into the same 30T front transmission pulley. My SM says that Andrews info is wrong. You must use a different belt to match. See this thread for details http://www.cvoharley.com/smf/index.php?topic=42529.msg648455#msg648455

It will throw off the speedo.

JW

If going from the 32 to 31 you could use the same belt Jeff.  Down to a 30 you'd have to change belts too.

[Twolanerider]

My question is will this throw off the speedometer and if so what is the proper way to correct this?

Dakota Digital and others make devices that electronically adjust for the gearing change and thereby bring the speedometer back to accurate.  Some are not, so whatever you pick up make sure it's a plug type (no cutting and splicing).  The Dakota Digital piece is easy and cost competitive.  For however long this listing is active here's one just found on eBay:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=190335393795

[Black Diamond]

If going from the 32 to 31 you could use the same belt Jeff.  Down to a 30 you'd have to change belts too.

Ya that's what I was trying to say. I'm leaning toward the 30T as I rarely ride expressways or + 75 - 80 mph.

JW

[Mr. Wizard]

I made this same change back about a year ago on my trike...  30T Andrews, smaller belt and dakota speedo adjuster which I had to wire into the ECM. It won't work on an 07 unless you wire it in.

This to me was the long way around now that I have had to think about it. Changing the compensating gear is the cheaper and easier way to go.

[Black Diamond]

I made this same change back about a year ago on my trike...  30T Andrews, smaller belt and dakota speedo adjuster which I had to wire into the ECM. It won't work on an 07 unless you wire it in.

This to me was the long way around now that I have had to think about it. Changing the compensating gear is the cheaper and easier way to go.

What parts do you need to accomplish this with the 6 speed tranny?

JW

[Mr. Wizard]

What parts do you need to accomplish this with the 6 speed tranny?

JW

What parts are you asking for?  The front belt pulley, belt and speedo adjuster conversion or the compensating gear conversion?

[Black Diamond]

What parts are you asking for?  The front belt pulley, belt and speedo adjuster conversion or the compensating gear conversion?

Sorry  I'm not being very clear today.
 
JW

[Mr. Wizard]

S&S makes a compensating gear kit.

I have the info in my files. I'll look around for you. Hang tight, may take a few minutes.

[Mr. Wizard]

I'm trying to find it...  EVO Industries, NOT S&S

The 07 and up (6-speed) bikes have a 1.35 primary ratio (34 tooth compensator/46 tooth clutch) 46/34=1.35. Changing the compensator sprocket to a smaller size, increases RPM, making for stronger acceleration. Changing the compensator to a 30 tooth makes the primary ratio 1.53 (46/30)

Also, if you change the compensator you shouldn't loose your 6 gear indicator light. Changing the front belt pulley you will.


http://www.evoindusa.com/

30T SPROCKET FOR 2006 DYNA 2007-LATER BIG TWIN     

Evolution Industries 30 Tooth Sprocket For 2006 Dyna and 2007 and Later Big Twins


Changes Stock 1.352 Gear Ratio To 1.5333 Gear Ratio

4th Gear 70 MPH @ 3620 RPM * New 4th Gear 70 MPH @ 4500 RPM’S

5th Gear 70 MPH @ 3042 RPM * New 5TH Gear 70 MPH @ About 3750 RPM’S

6th Gear 70 MPH @ 2570 RPM* New 6th Gear 70 MPH @ About 3250 RPM’S


Evolution Industries 30 Tooth Motor Sprocket Raises RPM To achieve Maximum Performance Eliminating Lugging Of Motor


* Evolution Industries 30 Tooth Sprocket Is Manufactured From Aircraft Quality Steel Heat Treated Per Evolution Industries Specifications to Insure Maximum Strength. Two Pounds Lighter Then Stock. Evolution Industries Recommends Installing a New Sprocket Bolt When Changing Sprocket.

* Includes 30 Tooth Sprocket, Custom Primary Chain and Easy To Follow Instructions.



EV:1012-1231 30 Tooth Sprocket Kit Fits 2007 and Later Touring Models
List Price 297.96

EV:1012-1241 30 Tooth Sprocket Kit Fits 2006 Dyna Glide and 2007 and Later Dyna and Softail Models.
List Price 302.04

EV:1004-3011 Front Evolution Industries Sprocket Bolt. Evolution Industries Recommends Replacing When Changing Sprocket.
List Price 11.08

EV:1011-2021 Primary Chain Replacement For 30 Tooth Sprocket Kit. EV:1012-1231
List Price 95.24

EV:1011-2031 Primary Chain Replacement For 30 Tooth Sprocket Kit. EV:1012-1241
List Price 95.24


ORDERING INFORMATION

PHONE 909 594 7969

FAX 909 594 7969
 

[Black Diamond]

I'm trying to find it...  EVO Industries, NOT S&S

The 07 and up (6-speed) bikes have a 1.35 primary ratio (34 tooth compensator/46 tooth clutch) 46/34=1.35. Changing the compensator sprocket to a smaller size, increases RPM, making for stronger acceleration. Changing the compensator to a 30 tooth makes the primary ratio 1.53 (46/30)

Also, if you change the compensator you shouldn't loose your 6 gear indicator light. Changing the front belt pulley you will.


http://www.evoindusa.com/

30T SPROCKET FOR 2006 DYNA 2007-LATER BIG TWIN     

Evolution Industries 30 Tooth Sprocket For 2006 Dyna and 2007 and Later Big Twins


Changes Stock 1.352 Gear Ratio To 1.5333 Gear Ratio

4th Gear 70 MPH @ 3620 RPM * New 4th Gear 70 MPH @ 4500 RPM’S

5th Gear 70 MPH @ 3042 RPM * New 5TH Gear 70 MPH @ About 3750 RPM’S

6th Gear 70 MPH @ 2570 RPM* New 6th Gear 70 MPH @ About 3250 RPM’S

Thanks for the information. This is from Evo Ind. website:  Not compatible with 6th speed indicator light.

Here's an rpm comparision for changing to the Andrews 30T pulley.

32T = 2402 RPM @ 65 MPH
31T = 2479 RPM @ 65 MPH
30T = 2562 RPM @ 65 MPH

32T = 2771 RPM @ 75 MPH
31T = 2861 RPM @ 75 MPH
30T = 2956 RPM @ 75 MPH

32T = 3141 RPM @ 85 MPH
31T = 3242 RPM @ 85 MPH
30T = 3350 RPM @ 85 MPH

Like everything in life, each has it's pros and cons.

JW

[Mr. Wizard]

The speed sensor, located on the tranny, looks for a certain range of resistance while in 6th gear. The ECM recognizes that range and turns on the 6th gear light. The reason I said "shouldn't" is because although I know of guys that have lost the light, several others haven't when using the compensating gear change. All that have used the front belt pulley change have lost the light including me.

It's something I really don't miss and have gotten used to it not being there.

The Dakota speedo device, SIM-1, does a good job of calibrating the speedometer. Just two buttons. One for MPH up and the other one is for down. You can use your GPS or follow a car that has an accurate speedometer. Grab the SIM-1 and push the proper button a few times and it moves your speedo indicator. When you don't change the button for 10 seconds the SIM-1 decides you are finished and retains the settings forever or until you hit another button. It comes with two plugs for the 06 and down. On the 07 and up you must locate the wiring to the speed sensor at the ECM and splice it in. That's not hard to do, just takes patience. When done you simply leave it under the right side cover and tie it up.

Here is a picture of the SIM-1  http://www.axiomcycles.com/pages/item/itemdetail.asp?item=28-205-0048&itemsection=514   I got mine on ebay for under 100 shipped.

Like I said, looking back... I would have changed the compensating gear. The kit from EVO can be found a little cheaper if you look around. The hardest part about that install is getting the compensating bolt off and back on correctly. You will also loose some of the compensating cushion with this kit. The gear is just a gear and has no compensating spring system built in. If you have the IDS on the rear pulley you will feel little to no difference in the drive train when snagging a gear.

[Hoist!]

I got a Baker 31T rear pulley to replace the stock. No belt change required. It takes you down from 80 at 3K RPM in 6th, to 75 at 3K in 6th. It should make 6th gear a lil more usable now. I felt going to the 30T wasn't worth it. Belt change required prolly, and it takes you down to 70 at 3K RPM in 6th gear, which is like the 5-speed gearing was. I was always looking for 6th gear with my 5-speed RK's! I haven't installed it yet, but I have all the parts. I got the Speedo re-calibrator too. I figure I'll set it up using my Zumo.

Baker Drivetrain

Hoist!

[moscooter]

 
" You will also loose some of the compensating cushion with this kit. The gear is just a gear and has no compensating spring system built in. If you have the IDS on the rear pulley you will feel little to no difference in the drive train when snagging a gear."

I have one of those EVO IND. gears and have hesitated to install it cause I have heard claims that (counter) the above quote.......If someone that has it installed and (STILL has it installed) and feels like the vibes have not increased significantly and/or other downsides,  I'd be happy to know about it.

[Twolanerider]

" You will also loose some of the compensating cushion with this kit. The gear is just a gear and has no compensating spring system built in. If you have the IDS on the rear pulley you will feel little to no difference in the drive train when snagging a gear."

I have one of those EVO IND. gears and have hesitated to install it cause I have heard claims that (counter) the above quote.......If someone that has it installed and (STILL has it installed) and feels like the vibes have not increased significantly and/or other downsides,  I'd be happy to know about it.

There are several here who lost the compensator when adding a left side crank support kit from a company called GP Designs.  I haven't had the spring loaded compensator on my 107" build for probably 25k miles.  Fortunately no vibration issues. 

Can't say that's been universal though.  A dozen or so of us got these things all about the same time.  At least one (MJZ from the Memphis area) did have a vibration and eventually removed the part and reinstalled the compensator.  For most though it's not been an issue.

[grc]

The main drawback to the EVO sprocket, IMHO, is the fact that you are eliminating a very important device which is critical to the health and well being of a marginal flywheel assembly (crankshaft).  The purpose of the compensator isn't rider comfort, it is protection for the mechanical bits and pieces.  Folks need to understand this before making a decision to eliminate the compensator.  As for the IDS eliminating the need for the compensator, I don't think so.  One other point for those with new bikes; I wouldn't expect H-D to honor the warranty if you have a subsequent crank, primary, or trans failure after your modification.  The EVO folks might try to imply that their part won't cause a problem, but I don't see them stepping up with a definite statement and warranty to protect you.

Just my opinion, but until someone comes out with a smaller sprocket that retains the compensator, the safest approach still involves changing the final drive ratio (trans output sprocket). 

Jerry

[Twolanerider]

The main drawback to the EVO sprocket, IMHO, is the fact that you are eliminating a very important device which is critical to the health and well being of a marginal flywheel assembly (crankshaft).  The purpose of the compensator isn't rider comfort, it is protection for the mechanical bits and pieces.  Folks need to understand this before making a decision to eliminate the compensator.  As for the IDS eliminating the need for the compensator, I don't think so.  One other point for those with new bikes; I wouldn't expect H-D to honor the warranty if you have a subsequent crank, primary, or trans failure after your modification.  The EVO folks might try to imply that their part won't cause a problem, but I don't see them stepping up with a definite statement and warranty to protect you.

Just my opinion, but until someone comes out with a smaller sprocket that retains the compensator, the safest approach still involves changing the final drive ratio (trans output sprocket). 

Jerry

Don't disagree with Jerry at all that there is an intended and important benefit to the compensator being there.  In my case, and that of a few others that lost it when adding the GP Designs bearing support piece, a trade-off was being accepted.

After my engine work hp and tq numbers were such that I was more concerned about the lack of the Timken bearing in the left side than I was about the lack of the compensator.  Considering one issue against the other.  Rather than gut the bottom end and do a Timken conversion decided to try the bearing support and watch closely for any vibration or other negative indicators. 

Fortunately this particular engine has been smooth from day one since its build.  Other's results may vary without the compensator.  In my particular circumstance, however, it was a measured risk I was willing to take.

[Mr. Wizard]

I do not disagree either.....tons of conversations debating the pro's and con's about this everywhere you go. I, for one, aren't smart enough to know the truth (happily admitted) and have only ridden one compensator conversion with the IDS on a 08. I have the front belt conversion on my 07 UC trike without the IDS and can feel no difference between the two respective bikes either just cruising or haul'n arse though the gears. However, HD did make the IDS to help eliminate vibrations and cushion the shift strain.

This is just my point of view but if you are going to make the change to smoke the back tire right off the bike or you are used to banging gears then you should worry about scissoring the crank or blowing the bottom end but just cruising around and enjoying the day or riding with friends there should be no worries. This is what I'm thinking. Maybe one of the builder guys can help us out here?

Only reason I changed mine was to get a heavy trike moving without burning the clutch. I don't do much haul'n arse.   

[moscooter]

 
"However, HD did make the IDS to help eliminate vibrations and cushion the shift strain."
 
I believe the IDS was done by HD to counter the complaints that resulted when they came out with the six speed and/or gear whine that resulted from the (type) of gear used in (5th I believe ).   Of course,  then they have since changed that gear to eliminate the whine that had been there.  So,  now ya have an IDS that causes a (slight) power loss to the rear wheel and with the gear change you don't need it.

[Hoist!]

I won't give up the comp sprocket. That's why the rear pulley makes more sense. There's many things you can do to change gearing on pre-'06 Dyna/all '07 and up BT's. But not on these newer styles. Evo sprocket to replace the comp, trans belt pulleys, trans sprockets, or actual trans gear changes. But the simplest by far is going to the 31T trans belt pulley. I'm keeping the comp sprocket that way, and I'm adding the IDS when I do this too! And no belt or primary chain change required!

Hoist!

[infanterene]

I heard loosing the compensator adds HP. Actually that you loose less HP from the motor to the back wheel. Is this true?

[Hoist!]

I heard loosing the compensator adds HP. Actually that you loose less HP from the motor to the back wheel. Is this true?

I would agree that you lose HP thru the comp. You'd lose HP indirectly to the rear wheel. Directly you're losing it between the motor and the trans, thru the primary. That's fine if you're racing, since you're always breaking chit anyway! But it's not worth losin the protection it provides in normal applications!

Hoist!

[moscooter]

 
Per the service dept at my dealers,  you are also loosing a small percentage of HP due to the IDS setup in the rear hub.