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CVO Technical => Drive Train => Topic started by: kmn2psi on December 09, 2011, 07:38:02 PM
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As most of you know synthetic oil is used in exclusively in the CVO. I would like to change to non synthetic in the primary...simply for the reason the clutch does not feel so slippery...any advice?
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I suspect the dealer and or HD will claim it would void your warranty. I am no expert on this. It may be that your clutch hydraulics need to be bled. I don't know of anyone else who thinks they're clutch is too slippery. It seems to be more of an adjustment issue.
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Try not to fall for that "too slippery" wives tale about synthetic lubricants. And changing to a nonsynthetic won't affect your warranty; they (H-D) use non-syn in all the other bikes except the CVO's, and the primary components are the same.
There are many choices that others on the site use, from Formula + to Redline Primary Fluid to ATF. The main thing is to choose a fluid that is formulated to be used with a wet clutch.
If your clutch is slipping, it's not because of the SYN3. What is it actually doing?
Jerry
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I'd drain it and leave the Syn 3 for the lawn mower. Take your pick of the good synthetics out there, but I go with Mobil1 10w40 Racing 4T in the Primary which has no friction modifiers, which could lead to clutch slippage. Make sure you fill the the correct level. I also use 20w50 in the crank, and 75w140 in the trans. It's easy to find locally, priced reasonably and works great.
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My experience with non-syn and syn in the primary is based on the feel between the '09 RoadKing and the '12 CVO.
The RK has 17k where as the CVO 700 mi...clearly the CVO is not broke in but I always change the oils before 1k. Gives the peace of mind if there is some metal during break in, moving in the oil, that potential damage can be eliminated. I appreciate each of your comments...no doubt the hydraulic clutch feels different than the cable clutch, adjustment is not an issue in either bike. I'll continue to run the syn in the CVO but probably switch to Amsoil. Thanks guys.
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kmn2ps1, I have used amsoil,and redline in my primary and this last service I used HD Formula+ and I actually like it better. I am saying this based on the fact that it seems to make less noise when I engage first gear. I never had any problem with my primary, shifting or finding neutral. I also use it in my 95 Heritage which goes into gear like butter and shifts very smoothly. I have 75-140 Amsoil in both transmissions. I cannot notice any difference between redline shockproof and Amsoil in the transmissions. Although I would not use SYN3 in any of my bikes I am really considering going back to HD Dino 20-50 next oil change in both bikes which now have Amsoil straight 60 WT synthetic which works fine, but since my friend , who I have mentioned before, got 180K out of his 2001 Heritage softail using Dino 20-50 before his balancers went out on him.( I know most of you know this, but his engine is rigid mounted to bike that is why they use the balancers) I don't see the need to spend the extra money on Synthetic if you service your bike on a regular basis. JMHO. Any comments would be appreciated. CAHDBIKER
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seldom will you find a thread were there is more disagreement than what oil to use. My 2 cents is simple, IMHO stick with the oil the motor was born with, in this case, born with synthetics, stick with synthetics.
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....but my local dealer says....ah....he's full of shyte!
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I've used ATF, type F, in wet primaries for years. Car auto trans are full of wet clutches, function very similar to Harley wet clutch. The transfer case in my 4X4 has a chain like Harley primary, also uses ATF.
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Cah...the main reason for using synthetic oil in the crankcase is that higher operating temps have less effect on it than on dino oil. A 110 runs a lot hotter than an 88. They are very different motors in many respects. With 5K oil change intervals (and actually, synthetics can go longer than that) in a 110, it's just extra insurance. If you change more often than 5K, you're wasting money and resources, and if you change dino oil more often, then you've defeated any cost savings. That's my opinion.
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kmn2ps1, I have used amsoil,and redline in my primary and this last service I used HD Formula+ and I actually like it better. I am saying this based on the fact that it seems to make less noise when I engage first gear. I never had any problem with my primary, shifting or finding neutral. I also use it in my 95 Heritage which goes into gear like butter and shifts very smoothly. I have 75-140 Amsoil in both transmissions. I cannot notice any difference between redline shockproof and Amsoil in the transmissions. Although I would not use SYN3 in any of my bikes I am really considering going back to HD Dino 20-50 next oil change in both bikes which now have Amsoil straight 60 WT synthetic which works fine, but since my friend , who I have mentioned before, got 180K out of his 2001 Heritage softail using Dino 20-50 before his balancers went out on him.( I know most of you know this, but his engine is rigid mounted to bike that is why they use the balancers) I don't see the need to spend the extra money on Synthetic if you service your bike on a regular basis. JMHO. Any comments would be appreciated. CAHDBIKER
I used HD Formula + in my 2007 Ultra and will be changing to it in my 2011 at the 5000 mile mark. My '07 released smoothly with the Formula +. My CVO clutch grabs at the end of the clutch lever release. It may not be the issue but I blame it on the Syn 3!
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2012 CVO Street Glide
Syn 3 in the crankcase
Formula + in the primary and tranny
1st change of ALL fluids at 1k miles.
I have used this combo for years and have found it's the best for my riding style.
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I use Trick Shift ATF by B&M Hydro. The regular not sythetic. I think it reduces the clunk when putting into 1st gear on initial startup and I think it shifts smoother too. A few of my friends tried ot an they like it too. YMMV this is my humble opinion. The shop I work at always uses Formula+ in the primary on oil changes even on a CVO bike unless the customer requests something different.