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[skreminegul07]

i totally agree.  I am not in favor of bailing out people with variable rate mortgages that didn't convert when the rates were at 40 year lows.  They opted to beat the system and higher monthly payments, but got caught.  Now that housing value is down, they can't refinance.  Shame on the banks for letting people borrow with bad credit anyway.  Didn't we do this in the 80's, the SNL collapse due to bad loans?  Are these the children of the bankers that screwed the pooch back then?
I remember last year when one of the investment houses, Bear Stearns (?) gave out 670 million in Xmas bonuses for such a profitable year.  When it goes south, they should ask for outside help.  Not too fair.
So much for early retirement.

[Midnight Rider]

It's not just HOG; the market as a whole has taken a major dump.  If I'm looking at the data correctly, we have just lost all the market gains generated in the entire year of 2007 in the space of a month's time, and the bottom isn't in sight yet.  And I love the reaction of our government leaders (you know, the folks who helped create the mess through deficit spending, turning loose the greed merchants, encouraging consumers to spend money they didn't have in their own version of deficit spending, encouraging speculatory practices in financial and housing industries, etc.).  The first thing Bush and Bernanke want to do is increase the deficit even more by issuing immediate tax rebates to consumers and tax breaks to businesses to keep the wheels turning.  I hope the average American realizes that this is just a poorly veiled attempt to delay the inevitable until after the election, and that there is no such thing as a free lunch.  I for one resent the fact that I'm going to take it in the azz with my retirement accounts because other people cheated and worked the system while our regulators sat back and did nothing. The only thing we can hope for now is that the idiots don't turn what should be a relatively short recession into something worse. F--k'n politicians anyway.

Jerry

Bush is going to do it anyway, Jerrry...just like he did with the whopping 600 buck one he "gave" to us before, then proceeded to squander a huge surplus that could have been used to pay down the national debt, implement tax policy that has hurt the working people in the worst way, and helped out all his rich buddies in the stratospheric percentile of income.  It was all a house of cards, and it's falling down.

It's going to get much worse, I'm afraid, before it gets any better.

Enjoy your $800 "rebate"....

[VAZHOG]

Things can't be all that bad - no one here has stopped paying HD's price for any CVO or other HD trinkets ALL programs will still be funded and who ever takes the white house will have a Full bunch of new give away programs based upon all the speech giving that is going on.

There will be plenty of Tax money to be givin away for all those who can apply legal citizen or not!