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[ssls6]

I was looking at these lifters and noticed that they need to be adjusted to 0.12-0.13 after zero lash.  Does that mean you MUST use adjustable pushrods with these lifters?  Using stock pushrods are a no-no?  Do they make a longer stock type pushrod for these lifters?  Thanks.

[prodrag1320]

do your self a favor & get S&S standards or premiums,stay away from the gimmicky crap.stock P/Rods are fine with them even though I would recommend adjustables with any build

[grc]

I was looking at these lifters and noticed that they need to be adjusted to 0.12-0.13 after zero lash.  Does that mean you MUST use adjustable pushrods with these lifters?  Using stock pushrods are a no-no?  Do they make a longer stock type pushrod for these lifters?  Thanks.

They don't "need" to be adjusted to .120" - .130" preload, that is just a recommendation Bobby Wood makes to people running his cams to try to quiet the god-awful noise they make.  I'm not so sure running the plunger .030" further down the hole could possibly make enough difference in pushrod angularity, or whatever other theory they put forth to back up this claim, to actually make much difference, but to each his own.  I owned, for about one day, an early set of these lifters and had them removed and sent back when they wouldn't pump up properly.  The replacement set wouldn't fit in the cases properly due to poor machining and the Wood response was to blame the variability of Harley cases and to file them until the anti-rotation pins would fit.  Needless to say I had those sent back as well and just went with a set of Harley "B" lifters.

If you are set on running these gimmicky lifters and want to run them as recommended by Wood, you can buy a set of .030" oversize Perfect Fit pushrods from Harley.  Look in the SE Catalog for them.

Jerry

[ssls6]

Thanks, excellent info.

[Yellow09SERG]

Have to agree with what the others have said. Go S&S and be happy

[hrdtail78]

I agree.  Save your money and buy S&S's.  They will be quieter at start up as well.

[HD Street Performance]

Topline Hylift lifters offer one of the few that have axle bearing oil feed and bleed down much slower due to tighter tolerances. These are dedicated Harley lifters with the proper feed amount to the top and also feature a more precise control of OD sizing. This matters. The twin cams already are too liberal on clearance between the lifter body and case bore.

[TIMINATOR]

Bobby's cams have a faster ramp rate, thats what makes them noisier than slower ramp rate cams, but that also makes more power due to greater area under the lift curve. If you don't care about more power, and do care about the noise, use other brand cams. I'm about "chasing the numbers", I use Bobby's cams, but as I learned back in the mid 80s from Crane's original hydraulic roller experiments, lash the lifters up from the bottom about a half turn, and don't use any more spring pressure than needed to prevent valve float. More power and less noise are the benefits. Hydraulic lifters all bleed down, some faster than others; more spring pressure, higher rpm, thinner oil, faster ramp rates, cheaper lifters, lack of regular oil changes, all contribute to a noisy valve train. Reduced travel and slower bleed down rate lifters minimize this noise. Instead of buying reduced travel lifters, lashing from the bottom does the same thing only cheaper. This works well in HP car engines also, but since cars don't have adjustable pushrods, you have to use longer pushrods to keep the valve train geometry correct. Hydraulic roller lifters have about .125" to .190" plunger travel, and that's way more than needed except for the automotive worlds "net build lash" assemblies. Harleys are much closer to the desired "stack height" of the valve train. As a lifter engineer once told me: the best oil filter in the engine is the lifter, it has tighter clearances than most oil filters filtration pores. What that means to us is the lifters, no matter what the plunger fitment or quality, wear from the first minute of operation, and keep getting worse, and that means more bleed down as the miles accumulate. Lifters with the pressure fed axle oiling are more important for longevity than bleed down rate, if lashed from the bottom up.  Pick your cam for your application.   Just my humble opinion.    TIMINATOR

[johnsachs]

Without travel limiters(rev rings), you'd be in a world of hurt bottoming a hydraulic lifter out, and adjusting it a half turn from there.
John

[HD Street Performance]

Yep, good advice there

[TIMINATOR]

Haven't had any bad experiences adjusting from the bottom, with Harleys or car/ boat engines. I've been machining and building engines for over 40 years with no bad lifter issues. As I said, on car and boat engines make sure you use a longer pushrod to keep the geometry correct. Also been doing all HD cam installs from the bottom up. No issues yet on any of them.
I have noticed that on 3+ back to back runs on my Dyno Jet that every run (after the engine oil is warmed)  results in a slightly less HP number, unless the lifters are adjusted from the bottom. The HP repeatability is much better. JMHO   TIMINATOR   P.S. I used to make travel limiters for Hyd Rlr lifters until I started adjusting from the bottom, no need now in my experience. I do run RPM limiters on all of my builds though. The Hylift/ Johnson techs agreed with this, but they do make reduced travel lifters because: "there is a small demand for them."

[HD Street Performance]

So we agree then.
With limiters the bottom up deal works.
Where are you getting limiters for the top line hylift lifters?

[Ridgerunr]

Woods directional lifters>the extra dollars go directly from your pocket to his. 

[TIMINATOR]

Hylift makes limited travel lifters (for SB Chevy), but mine aren't, just std HD lifters lashed up from the bottom. I use their SB Chevy lifters in many of my HD builds, but I experiment on my stuff, hence the stock HD lifters, which have been in my bike for about 12,000+ miles so far in both mine and the wife's bikes. Some say that you will pound out the snap retaining rings if you lash deep, but the deeper you lash, the farther the plunger is from the retaining rings. With what I feel is excessive spring pressure that everybody's aftermarket springs are, lifter pump up has never been an issue for me. I have had many bikes on my dyno at up to 6600 RPM, trying to hurt something, and never have. My bike had the limiter in the T-Max set as high as 6650 during dragstrip testing before I realized it was faster shifting at 6100. No issues yet.
I machined limiter rings for the lifters about 30+ years ago when the Crane hyd roller cams for Chevys came out, but have been deep lashing them soon after that. IMHO the limiters weren't needed, except in automotive applications when you don't want to use longer pushrods to keep the geometry correct in some applications. I have been just installing the correct length pushrods shortly after that, as we run the valve train geometry in all of the engines we build anyway. I DO specify what the lash procedure is on the build sheets, otherwise the pushrod would be too long and the geometry would be wrong if preload is set conventionally.
I have also run solid roller lifters on hydraulic roller cams to prove my point also. I lash the intake to .003 and the exhaust to .005 for testing. THIS IS ON WATER COOLED V-8 ENGINES!!!!  ONLY!!!! On an HD the cylinder growth is too much to do this, except for dragstrip testing, but I still prefer to lash up from the bottom to keep from beating up the valve train.  TIMINATOR

[TIMINATOR]

JOHNSACHS: why would bottoming a hyd lifter put us in a world of hurt? The engineer at Hylift/Johnson recommended it. I told him I had been doing it for years and he said: COOL! Also old design lifters from the 60s and 70s could hurt the metering valve, but to his knowledge nobody still makes that type of lifter. What problems have you had? at how many miles? We all need more info on everything!   
P.S. had two new hyd rlr lifters fail and go stuck to the bottom last month in a SBChevy, but they were in a mild build and were lashed from the top at one half turn. The customer supplied his own parts. The cam and lifters were from a small company that I don't use, and now, never will.  P.S. if anybody wants to know what brand they are call me. I won't post it. The company refunded his cash for the lifters, but not the labor to replace them, but he had to pay us the labor to put Comp Cams lifters in it. Now we are down to using Comp or Hylift/Johnson lifters only. The customer was pissed at US for charging him labor to replace the set of bad new lifters! Really!  TIMINATOR

[HD Street Performance]

Downside is when the lifter pumps up most will not have enough piston to valve and valve to valve clearance to prevent a grenade.
Guys over rev these motors and not everyone has great valve springs.

[TIMINATOR]

Harley engines run more spring pressure than your typical car engines, and aftermarket springs for HDs are about 50+ lbs heavier seat pressure than aftermarket springs for car engine hydraulic rollers (aftermarket car hyd rlr cams typically run 125# on the seat.) Since all cams have had computer designed lobes for about the last 30+ years, I haven't run into lifter pump up in anything since the 1980s.
IMHO you should be using forged pistons with any large cam installation anyway, and the Weiscos that we use have HUGE valve notches. My Screamin' Eagle 257 (252/260@.053 at .569 lift and is a nice upper mid range street cam) has over .200" valve/ piston clearance with the deck set at .003 height. If my lifters pumped up solid they might hit, but they never have been close even when I was trying to hurt something even at 6700 rpm with the rev limiter disabled. The power is over by 5900 rpm with this cam in my 110 anyway, so how much more would I have to rev it over the 6700 rpm that I tried to hurt it at? My philosophy is breaking something gives me an excuse to build it bigger and faster next time. I do my "acid testing" on the dyno before I drive it hard. Just some random thoughts from the TIMINATOR