Topic: Throttle by wire MALFUNCTION!!!??? (Read 30756 times)

Lo Lo · « **on:** September 08, 2008, 10:42:22 PM »

So I dropped my 08 FLHRSE off at the dealership last Tuesday Sept. 2nd to have the gasket recall done along with my new Rineharts/Fuel Pack/LoJack. Just purchased my RK 3 weeks ago and knew the recall job had to be done before I purchased it. So the service dept. completes the install of everything the next day, and call me up to pick up my bike. Enroute to the dealership, they call me and tell me the guy washing my bike found an issue with my throttle. Seems that something "shorted out" on it, or it wasn't functioning as it should. I get there to see for myself in person since I was already close to the dealership, and my throttle moves like normal but with just a slight increase in RPM's! Almost like is has been disconnected or some contacts weren't touching?! They tell me they need to keep the bike to find out what the problem is. Next day rolls around and they call me up to scoop my bike, telling me it's fixed. As I was about to get a ride to the dealership from the wife, the call comes, and the service guy tells me there is a problem with the throttle (again) and my bike needs to stay!

To make a long story short, today is Monday Sept. 8th, it's been almost 7 days and the throttle issue is still trying to be figured out by my H-D service techs. The service guys are puzzled over it, and I am starting to wonder about my CVO purchase. Any thoughts on this issue? Anyone else have this problem? I tried to do a search, and found nothing. On a good note, I ordered a 21" RC wheel for my SERK awhile back, and my parts guy forgot to mention I needed new rotors that fit that specific wheel, so my dealership is eating the cost of 2 new RC matching rotors! That managed to heal the wounds left by my throttle issue, alittle....

SirMichael · « **Reply #1 on:** September 08, 2008, 10:50:46 PM »

Have not heard of any issues with the drive by wire yet, but I am sure there will be alot to come!!

But, it sounds like you need to find a new dealer maybe??

SirMichael

DCFIREMANN · « **Reply #2 on:** September 09, 2008, 07:11:18 AM »

I was not nor am I now a big fan of fly by wire. After talking to a few techs they had not heard of or saw any problems with it. This is the first time we have heard of any problems. Now what scares me is the techs trying to figure out the problem.

Good luck. And keep us posted!

Be Safe

THE DAWG

Gecko · « **Reply #3 on:** September 09, 2008, 07:27:40 AM »

I don't like the thought of another computer working the throttle either. It's only a matter of time before you roll on the grip and this voice cuts in, "What are you doing Dave?" "Ummm, trying to go faster...". "I'm sorry, Dave, I can't let you do that. The posted speed limit is sixty miles an hour". Seems like just another thing to go wrong (and has in your case). I've read about people having idle speed problems with the TBW, but not a partial disconnect like you describe.

sportygordy · « **Reply #4 on:** September 09, 2008, 10:17:01 AM »

Quote from: DCFIREMANN on September 09, 2008, 07:11:18 AM

I was not nor am I now a big fan of fly by wire. After talking to a few techs they had not heard of or saw any problems with it. This is the first time we have heard of any problems. Now what scares me is the techs trying to figure out the problem.

Good luck. And keep us posted!

Be Safe

THE DAWG

I'm no fan of it either. In fact I purchased a second TBW throttle to carry with me in event mine ever went out or malfunctioned. Most dealers no not stock these. When i purchased from Chicago i only waited four months for it. Not that i recommend everyone go and and do this, you should have one buddy around that has a spare in his trunk.

Diesel Dragon · « **Reply #5 on:** September 09, 2008, 01:23:57 PM »

Throttle by wire has been around for a while and working fine (I have it on a 1996 Dump truck with a CAT engine) but it's just starting on the Harleys, it can work here too just depends like everything on the quality of the parts making up the component. And in Harleys case that could be a big question mark....we will see.

DD

.

BIGDOG · « **Reply #6 on:** September 09, 2008, 03:50:09 PM »

Only Harley could get us to keep ordering new chrome for our bikes that don't run . That is Marketing Genius.

igofar · « **Reply #7 on:** September 09, 2008, 07:37:01 PM »

Man, again Mother Harley takes 10-15 year old technology and buggers it up!

But I keep waiting for the new models to be released each July..... $:-\$

Don't jump all over the HD techs at your dealership. This technology is new to them too.

Brad

grc · « **Reply #8 on:** September 09, 2008, 09:58:58 PM »

ETC (electronic throttle control) or "drive by wire" has been around for more than 20 years, just not at H-D. It's very reliable in cars and trucks, and even in airplanes, so ETC isn't something to be feared. Having a H-D dealership mess with it, however, seems to be a scary proposition.

If the system was working before the dealership worked on the bike, which I assume is the case since you rode it there, then common sense would suggest that in the process of disconnecting and removing the throttle body and then reinstalling it after the "upgrade" they have managed to screw something up that left the system in "limp home" mode. All it would take is one bad electrical connection. Or perhaps the wash boy managed to blast some water into a sensitive connection. No matter how they did it, it should be a straightforward diagnosis and repair. Perhaps they should look for trouble codes and then pull out the manual and follow the diagnostic routine.

Jerry

Greaseball · « **Reply #9 on:** September 10, 2008, 09:49:37 PM »

Quote from: Lo Lo on September 08, 2008, 10:42:22 PM

So I dropped my 08 FLHRSE off at the dealership last Tuesday Sept. 2nd to have the gasket recall done along with my new Rineharts/Fuel Pack/LoJack. Just purchased my RK 3 weeks ago and knew the recall job had to be done before I purchased it. So the service dept. completes the install of everything the next day, and call me up to pick up my bike. Enroute to the dealership, they call me and tell me the guy washing my bike found an issue with my throttle. Seems that something "shorted out" on it, or it wasn't functioning as it should. I get there to see for myself in person since I was already close to the dealership, and my throttle moves like normal but with just a slight increase in RPM's! Almost like is has been disconnected or some contacts weren't touching?! They tell me they need to keep the bike to find out what the problem is. Next day rolls around and they call me up to scoop my bike, telling me it's fixed. As I was about to get a ride to the dealership from the wife, the call comes, and the service guy tells me there is a problem with the throttle (again) and my bike needs to stay!

I had this same problem happen to me one evening when I went to go for a ride on my '08 Road Glide. I started the bike (it had been sitting in my dry garage for nearly a week since I had last rode it in dry weather) and let it idle while my wife got herself onto the bike. I pulled in the clutch, dropped the gear shift into 1st gear, twisted the throttle....and.....it still idled! I put the bike back into neutral, twisted the throttle.....and....it still sat at idling rpm. Then I really gave the throttle a hard twist to about WFO....and....NO CHANGE! I shut the bike off, scratched my head, and gave my wife a puzzled and sad look. After chatting for a couple of minutes, I restarted the bike, and the throttle was back.....it was a miracle healing!! This problem never repeated itself.

SPIDERMAN · « **Reply #10 on:** September 10, 2008, 09:52:54 PM »

My contribution to this discussion is that I have been informed by several techs I know that when the TBW malfunctions it requires complete replacement. It is not repairable. It may be that your dealer is finding this out the hard way (via you as a guinea pig)

B B

Rooster · « **Reply #11 on:** September 10, 2008, 11:29:09 PM »

Stopped by to visit a friend in a Indy shop. Was shootin the breeze as he told me about a guy who's tbw acted up while riding and caused him to go down. He got banged up pretty good and seemed to have a good attitude about the whole thing. Tried to get more info but that is all he had. Just another thing to lurk in the back of your mind while just trying to enjoy the ride.

grc · « **Reply #12 on:** September 11, 2008, 09:05:17 AM »

Quote from: SPIDERMAN on September 10, 2008, 09:52:54 PM

My contribution to this discussion is that I have been informed by several techs I know that when the TBW malfunctions it requires complete replacement. It is not repairable. It may be that your dealer is finding this out the hard way (via you as a guinea pig)

B B

Hey Brian, good to see you back on line.

The ETC (TBW) isn't just one part that can be replaced completely, it consists of several different parts. The sensor in the grip is one part, the actuator at the throttle body is another, then you have the ECM and several of the other sensors for the various engine functions plus all the wiring that connects this stuff. A problem can exist in any one of those areas that will cause the system to either go into limp home mode or just fail completely, depending on how it was designed. If the problem is just one component, all they have to do is follow the diagnostics to isolate the cause and replace that part (or fix the bad connection). It would be much easier if there was just one little box a dealer could replace, but unfortunately modern technology hasn't completely eliminated the requirement for a "technician" to be able to think or perform diagnostic tests.

Jerry

SPIDERMAN · « **Reply #13 on:** September 11, 2008, 09:10:06 AM »

Quote from: grc on September 11, 2008, 09:05:17 AM

Hey Brian, good to see you back on line.

The ETC (TBW) isn't just one part that can be replaced completely, it consists of several different parts. The sensor in the grip is one part, the actuator at the throttle body is another, then you have the ECM and several of the other sensors for the various engine functions plus all the wiring that connects this stuff. A problem can exist in any one of those areas that will cause the system to either go into limp home mode or just fail completely, depending on how it was designed. If the problem is just one component, all they have to do is follow the diagnostics to isolate the cause and replace that part (or fix the bad connection). It would be much easier if there was just one little box a dealer could replace, but unfortunately modern technology hasn't completely eliminated the requirement for a "technician" to be able to think or perform diagnostic tests.

Jerry

It would appear that my function at times on this site is to play Costello to Jerry's Abbott. Those of you looking for solid information should pay close attention to what Jerry has to say. As usual Jerry, thanks for setting me and anyone else reading this thread straight. And yes, it's good to be posting again.

B B

TN · « **Reply #14 on:** September 12, 2008, 10:36:43 AM »

on my o8 fltr i had p-codes 1510 & i don't remember the other 21**. anyhow the cruise wouldn't work and check engine light was my only symptom. i'd clear the codes but they'd come right back. replaced tgs and all is well 12k later. i think there are several failsafes to keep from getting stranded because of fbw.

know of another code 1511 someone had and that required the actuator to be replaced.

TN

Lo Lo · « **Reply #15 on:** September 13, 2008, 12:05:39 AM »

Thanks for all the comments. As of today, the problem has been diagnosed (supposedly) and a replacement part is enroute. Service tech told me it was a bad Fuel shell that was causing the issues. Mine apparently took a dump while at the dealer....or maybe some asshat decided to swap my good one out with someone elses who has been waiting for the parts to come in.... Who knows...

All I know is that I still don't have my bike back. WTF!!!

2018_FLTRXSE · « **Reply #16 on:** September 13, 2008, 02:18:25 AM »

Quote from: Greaseball on September 10, 2008, 09:49:37 PM

I had this same problem happen to me one evening when I went to go for a ride on my '08 Road Glide. I started the bike (it had been sitting in my dry garage for nearly a week since I had last rode it in dry weather) and let it idle while my wife got herself onto the bike. I pulled in the clutch, dropped the gear shift into 1st gear, twisted the throttle....and.....it still idled! I put the bike back into neutral, twisted the throttle.....and....it still sat at idling rpm. Then I really gave the throttle a hard twist to about WFO....and....NO CHANGE! I shut the bike off, scratched my head, and gave my wife a puzzled and sad look. After chatting for a couple of minutes, I restarted the bike, and the throttle was back.....it was a miracle healing!! This problem never repeated itself.

My 08 Street Glidedid this ONCE in 13K.

I started up to leave for work and the first thing I noted was no high-idle which would be normal...

Went in the house, got my stuff, saddled up and the same thing... NOTHING.... WTF? My wife was looking at me funny... "I saw you twist the throttle"

Puzzled, I shut her down thinking I had an excuse to not go to work... until I turn the ignition back on and lit it up again and the high idle came back...and so did the throttle response.

One and only time it ever did that.

Twolanerider · « **Reply #17 on:** September 13, 2008, 03:16:23 AM »

Quote from: 2009_FLTRSEI3 on September 13, 2008, 02:18:25 AM

My 08 Street Glidedid this ONCE in 13K.

I started up to leave for work and the first thing I noted was no high-idle which would be normal...

Went in the house, got my stuff, saddled up and the same thing... NOTHING.... WTF? My wife was looking at me funny... "I saw you twist the throttle"

Puzzled, I shut her down thinking I had an excuse to not go to work... until I turn the ignition back on and lit it up again and the high idle came back...and so did the throttle response.

One and only time it ever did that.

Just the thought of that makes important parts of me want to curl up and hide behind my belly button. Could never escape the thought that if it could do it, just once, setting in the driveway that it could just as easily do it, just once, just as I was passing a truck on a two lane road with a semi coming right at me.

2018_FLTRXSE · « **Reply #18 on:** September 13, 2008, 04:40:37 AM »

Quote from: TwoLaneRider on September 13, 2008, 03:16:23 AM

Just the thought of that makes important parts of me want to curl up and hide behind my belly button. Could never escape the thought that if it could do it, just once, setting in the driveway that it could just as easily do it, just once, just as I was passing a truck on a two lane road with a semi coming right at me.

All the issues I have heard of were all at start up.... they either work or they dont.

Heaven forbid it should do it to me during the course of a "normal" ride.

Twolanerider · « **Reply #19 on:** September 13, 2008, 01:42:51 PM »

Quote from: 2009_FLTRSEI3 on September 13, 2008, 04:40:37 AM

All the issues I have heard of were all at start up.... they either work or they dont.

Heaven forbid it should do it to me during the course of a "normal" ride.

Unfortunately I've heard of some that weren't just at start up. Primarily issues with it not returning to idle all the way when coming to a stop. Knowing that it's so far from bullet proof would always be on my mind though.

I know what happens when a cable fails. And I can deal with it in all but the most inopportune of cases. A failure that can have a "mind" of its own though would worry the hell out of me.

2018_FLTRXSE · « **Reply #20 on:** September 14, 2008, 01:50:17 PM »

Quote from: TwoLaneRider on September 13, 2008, 01:42:51 PM

Unfortunately I've heard of some that weren't just at start up. Primarily issues with it not returning to idle all the way when coming to a stop. Knowing that it's so far from bullet proof would always be on my mind though.

I know what happens when a cable fails. And I can deal with it in all but the most inopportune of cases. A failure that can have a "mind" of its own though would worry the hell out of me.

I know of one guy with an 08 that claims he has similar problems... but whenever I look at his bike it seems FINE... rider error or paranoia?

brassspike · « **Reply #21 on:** June 20, 2009, 12:04:00 AM »

Really hate to bring back this one but....'ol Maggie Mae has done it to me again. TBW has taken a dump. Wanted to ride Sunday too

I have throttle when at idle in nutral but very little if the brake or clutch are pulled. codes 1510 and 2138 which is the TBW. Guess I'll have to leave the ol at home and break out the 98 wide glide. It has never failed to start and run. Quite unlike my high dollar ride!

Eqcons · « **Reply #22 on:** June 20, 2009, 05:16:12 AM »

Quote from: Twolanerider on September 13, 2008, 01:42:51 PM

Primarily issues with it not returning to idle all the way when coming to a stop.

That's covered in the manual, Don.

Jim

Eqcons · « **Reply #23 on:** June 20, 2009, 05:17:37 AM »

Quote from: Lo Lo on September 08, 2008, 10:42:22 PM

my throttle moves like normal but with just a slight increase in RPM's!

That's the "failsafe" mode for it I seem to remember - if something goes wrong, you wouldn't want it stuck wide open after all......

Jim

anglia48 · « **Reply #24 on:** June 20, 2009, 12:34:25 PM »

Good to hear the problem was found. My 08 SERK has not had a TBW problem, but my cruise went haywire for awhile. The on-off switch would stay on in the off position. Now after washing the bike it seems to have fixed itself. Weird.

FUZZNUTS · « **Reply #25 on:** June 30, 2009, 09:40:09 AM »

Was in Laconia a few weeks ago. I stopped for gas, filled up and was ready to go. I started the bike, no problem. But when I rolled on the throttle nothing happened. It was one of those aw sh#t moments. But thanks to my good buddy HD Brad, He showed me how to reset the trouble codes on the bike when we were in Eureka Springs. Good thing I was paying attention. I would have been stuck at that gas station somewhere New Hampshire, waiting for a tow.............................................Thanks Brad.................................Fuzznuts

Eqcons · « **Reply #26 on:** June 30, 2009, 09:45:14 AM »

Quote from: FUZZNUTS on June 30, 2009, 09:40:09 AM

He showed me how to reset the trouble codes on the bike when we were in Eureka Springs. Good thing I was paying attention.

Care to share?

Jim

FUZZNUTS · « **Reply #27 on:** June 30, 2009, 11:48:52 AM »

I'm at work right now. When I'm home I'll go thru the steps and document with some pics............Fuzz

Eqcons · « **Reply #28 on:** June 30, 2009, 11:56:22 AM »

Quote from: FUZZNUTS on June 30, 2009, 11:48:52 AM

I'm at work right now. When I'm home I'll go thru the steps and document with some pics............Fuzz

Cool, thanks!

Jim

ultrafxr · « **Reply #29 on:** June 30, 2009, 12:45:34 PM »

Quote from: FUZZNUTS on June 30, 2009, 09:40:09 AM

Was in Laconia a few weeks ago. I stopped for gas, filled up and was ready to go. I started the bike, no problem. But when I rolled on the throttle nothing happened. It was one of those aw sh#t moments. But thanks to my good buddy HD Brad, He showed me how to reset the trouble codes on the bike when we were in Eureka Springs. Good thing I was paying attention. I would have been stuck at that gas station somewhere New Hampshire, waiting for a tow.............................................Thanks Brad.................................Fuzznuts

The trouble codes just tell you what happened to help you diagnose the problem. Don't think clearing them would cause the problem to go away - it would just erase the history that it ever happened. Coincidence I think explains why your bike started working. Electronics (especially on Harleys) can do very strange things.

FUZZNUTS · « **Reply #30 on:** July 01, 2009, 10:53:07 AM »

I'll have to ask one of the parts changers at the dealers. I'll take coincidence any day to get me back on the road.

Fuzz

GtreetSlide · « **Reply #31 on:** July 01, 2009, 05:32:23 PM »

Quote from: Lo Lo on September 08, 2008, 10:42:22 PM

along with my new Rineharts/Fuel Pack/LoJack.

I have seen friends with 07 and up Harleys have some really strange problems because the ECU is linked to just about every function of the bike and aftermarket parts have usually been the culprit... I would have tried disconnecting the Fuel Pack and LoJack as a first step in dianosis....

If the problem comes back it's a suggestion where to look...

JMO, jb

FUZZNUTS · « **Reply #32 on:** July 02, 2009, 08:24:55 AM »

The following was pulled off of another HD forum. ( I'm just to lazy to type)..............Fuzz

The IM (instrument module) is capable of displaying DTC's (diagnostic trouble codes).
Speedometer Self Diagnostics: The speedometer is capable of displaying and clearing
speedometer, tachometer, TSM/TSSM and ICM/ECM Diagnostic Trouble Codes (DTC).
1- Turn Ignition switch to OFF & Run/Stop switch is to Run.
2- Push odometer reset button in & hold.
3- Turn ignition switch to Ignition and release odometer reset button. Background lighting
sould illuminate, speedometer needle should sweep its full range
and indicator lamps (battery, security, low fuel, check engine and cruise) should
illuminate. The word â€œdiagâ€ should then appear.
4 - Push the odometer reset button once and you will see the selection menu "PSSPt" with
the first P flashing.
5 - Each letter represents an area of the diagnostics module. The module that is flashing
is the one you are going to check. To move from one letter (module)
to the next, you push the odometer reset button one time. (from P to S to SP to t and back
to P, etc.)
P = ECM/ICM (Electronic Control Module (EFI) / (Ignition Control Module, 'Carbureted')
S = TSM/TSSM (Turn Signal/ Turn Signal Security Module)
SP = speedometer
T = tachometer
6 - To get the DTC within an area of diagnostics, push and hold the odometer reset button
in for 5 seconds and release. If there are any DTCâ€™s the code will be
displayed or the word â€œnoneâ€ will appear if there are no DTCâ€™s. Push the odometer reset
button again to view additional codes if they exist.
7 - Record the codes.
8 - If DTCâ€™s are not to be cleared, Press and release the odometer reset button. Part
number of module will be displayed.
NOTE: To determine if a code is current or historic, clear the displayed code by pushing in
and holding the odometer reset button ( longer than 5 seconds) until 'clear' comes up.
Release the odometer reset button. Turn OFF the ignition switch. Run your bike and shut it
down then recheck the DTCâ€™s again by repeating steps 1 to 9.
If the code is current it will reappear.
9 â€“ Press and release the odometer reset button to continue to the next module.
10 â€“ Turn Ignition switch to OFF.
--------------------------

vrog · « **Reply #33 on:** July 07, 2009, 10:32:47 AM »

Just curious if anyone else is having this problem:

When driving the bike hard through all the gears, never letting off the throttle at all, leaving it wide open while shifting, my bike seems to hesitate. I'm just wondering if its just the throttle by wire? I have never had this on any other bike. Its almost as if it stumbles between shifts.

Lo Lo · « **Reply #34 on:** August 23, 2009, 07:35:35 PM »

Well, I started this post last year sometime, and as luck would have it my Throttle by Wire has crapped out again! This time I almost had an accident when the idle dropped during a ride in traffic. Stopped at a red light behind a truck, and when the light was green an the truck in front of me started to go, I did also. My SERK started to move fine, and then the throttle went FULL OPEN by itself and I almost struck the trucks rear bumper in front of me. Luckily I pulled my clutch in and stopped before I hit it. Then I pulled off the road and shut down the bike, waited and re-started. I didn't want to be left on the side of the road, so I fired it back up and tried to take it easy as I headed for the HD dealership. About a 1/2 mile away from the dealership, the right side of my SERK started making a horrible clicking noise. I freaked and was even more anxious to get it to the service dept. As I pulled up, one of the service techs heard the noises and shook his head. When I dismounted, he approached me and said, sounds like a short in your throttle by wire. Needless to say my Harley is back in service AGAIN! This crap is started to piss me off. Did I mention my Harley was just in the shop a couple of weeks ago for my TBW malfunctioning a second time since I have owned this CVO SERK? Well this makes #3! What the hell is going on? Can I sue HD if I have an accident from this faulty TBW setup after having several episodes that weren't resolved? Because next time my TBW takes a dump, I may not be so lucky......

grc · « **Reply #35 on:** August 23, 2009, 09:07:25 PM »

Quote from: Lo Lo on August 23, 2009, 07:35:35 PM

Well, I started this post last year sometime, and as luck would have it my Throttle by Wire has crapped out again! This time I almost had an accident when the idle dropped during a ride in traffic. Stopped at a red light behind a truck, and when the light was green an the truck in front of me started to go, I did also. My SERK started to move fine, and then the throttle went FULL OPEN by itself and I almost struck the trucks rear bumper in front of me. Luckily I pulled my clutch in and stopped before I hit it. Then I pulled off the road and shut down the bike, waited and re-started. I didn't want to be left on the side of the road, so I fired it back up and tried to take it easy as I headed for the HD dealership. About a 1/2 mile away from the dealership, the right side of my SERK started making a horrible clicking noise. I freaked and was even more anxious to get it to the service dept. As I pulled up, one of the service techs heard the noises and shook his head. When I dismounted, he approached me and said, sounds like a short in your throttle by wire. Needless to say my Harley is back in service AGAIN! This crap is started to piss me off. Did I mention my Harley was just in the shop a couple of weeks ago for my TBW malfunctioning a second time since I have owned this CVO SERK? Well this makes #3! What the hell is going on? Can I sue HD if I have an accident from this faulty TBW setup after having several episodes that weren't resolved? Because next time my TBW takes a dump, I may not be so lucky......

You (or your estate) could sue, but why wait until it comes to that? For yours to fail 3 times now tells me there is something wrong that no one has found yet. Get on the horn to H-D to file an official complaint, and follow up with a formal letter detailing the problems and requesting prompt resolution. Resolution could include sending an "expert" to diagnose and fix your bike, or it could entail buying your bike back if they can't find and fix the problem. Regardless, document everything just in case.

Jerry

Buy early · « **Reply #36 on:** August 23, 2009, 09:57:48 PM »

Also check your local laws on "lemon law" details. You may be able to return the vehicle due to chronic problems the dealer can not fix. I would also consider getting a bit of legal counsel since the incidents are so likely to result in serious injury. You may want to send a letter (just to have it on file) to your dealer outlining your situation and warning them that if they do not take immediate action they will be held legally liable in the event of another failure. It helps to know what your rights are in this situation. This isn't like a motor failure that results in inconvenience, this is an extremely serious safety issue. If it were my bike, I wouldn't be riding it.

Twolanerider · « **Reply #37 on:** August 23, 2009, 10:27:13 PM »

Quote from: grc on August 23, 2009, 09:07:25 PM

You (or your estate) could sue, but why wait until it comes to that? For yours to fail 3 times now tells me there is something wrong that no one has found yet. Get on the horn to H-D to file an official complaint, and follow up with a formal letter detailing the problems and requesting prompt resolution. Resolution could include sending an "expert" to diagnose and fix your bike, or it could entail buying your bike back if they can't find and fix the problem. Regardless, document everything just in case.

Jerry

Jerry (or anyone), fly by wire throttles aren't a new thing. Even if new to Harley. Have you heard of an automotive failure of these in years? I haven't. And even the few I can ever remember hearing of or dealing with didn't fail to high throttle. A definite crock. A dangerous crock. But a crock nonetheless.

brassspike · « **Reply #38 on:** August 23, 2009, 10:44:50 PM »

I have a 2008 SERK an am now on my third throttle control. First one kept going to limp home. The dealer replaced that one and deliverd the bike with a new control that bound up and would stick as it opened. That was real safe! I had another dealer replace that one. Bike is fine....for now.

bbrown · « **Reply #39 on:** August 23, 2009, 10:47:55 PM »

Quote from: brassspike on August 23, 2009, 10:44:50 PM

I have a 2008 SERK an am now on my third throttle control. First one kept going to limp home. The dealer replaced that one and deliverd the bike with a new control that bound up and would stick as it opened. That was real safe! I had another dealer replace that one. Bike is fine....for now.

Wow I have had problems with my cruise but nothing like this

Lo Lo · « **Reply #40 on:** August 23, 2009, 10:58:58 PM »

Thank you all for the advice. I feel cheated that I invested all this money into my "baby" and something like this ruins my appreciation of the product. Ever since I was little, I longed to own a HD. I grew up riding sportbikes, and dirtbikes, and now I finally get my dream, and it comes crashing down around me with little incidents like this. Total time I have owned this Harley= 12 months so far, total time I have had this Harley in my possesion= 9 months. The rest of the time, it has been in the Service Department broke down, or waiting for parts to be fixed. To me, that is unacceptable, and maybe someday HD will be able to ride on the reputation of being reliable instead of an icon. Either way, I have fallen in love with this piece of steel and rubber, (and plastic haha), and cherish every time I throw a leg over my "baby" and take it for a ride...

I will keep you all updated with what unfolds.
Consulting with an attorney this week.
Do I foresee a 2010 CVO Street Glide in the garage?
Time will tell...
Did I mention how much I love my SERK...? Damn it!

FiveO CVO · « **Reply #41 on:** August 24, 2009, 12:16:39 PM »

There was a recent post on here about changing the blade opening to match throttle position. Granted it was with the TTS MasterTune software, but maybe they screwed up something when they installed your fuel pak and RH's?

Anything electrical is almost tied into the ECM or very close, especially when monitoring the engine/fuel and air ...

Just a thought.
SteveO

grc · « **Reply #42 on:** August 24, 2009, 02:00:19 PM »

Quote from: Twolanerider on August 23, 2009, 10:27:13 PM

Jerry (or anyone), fly by wire throttles aren't a new thing. Even if new to Harley. Have you heard of an automotive failure of these in years? I haven't. And even the few I can ever remember hearing of or dealing with didn't fail to high throttle. A definite crock. A dangerous crock. But a crock nonetheless.

Right you are Don. This is pretty old technology, in that it made it's first appearance on cars back in the 80's. As I've noted several times in the past, all this EFI and electronic stuff isn't new, it's just new to the dolts at H-D. So far everything they've borrowed from the auto industry they've managed to screw up.

I haven't heard of any failures in cars that went to WOT since very early in the history of throttle by wire. The automotive systems have redundant sensors and circuits to allow for continued operation with a fault (turns on the wrench light or check engine light and sets a code), and if they do fail completely they are designed to fail to idle, not WOT. I can't help but wonder if the aces running the MoCo didn't find another way to cheapen the system by eliminating some of the safeguards. Based on the cheap crap I've seen in the past few years, it wouldn't surprise me at all.

Jerry

Eqcons · « **Reply #43 on:** August 24, 2009, 03:03:39 PM »

Quote from: grc on August 24, 2009, 02:00:19 PM

.....redundant sensors and circuits to allow for continued operation with a fault (turns on the wrench light or check engine light and sets a code), and if they do fail completely they are designed to fail to idle, not WOT.

MoCo one is supposed to be just the same as that, Jerry.....

Jim

Lo Lo · « **Reply #44 on:** September 04, 2009, 10:36:50 AM »

Update:
Received the bike back fixed. Service Dept. stated it was my induction module that took a crap this time. Hmmmmm.... Anyways, picked my SERK up last night and rode it home in the rain. No issues so far. Bike is running strong. Time will tell. Naturally, I have all the service history logged, with supporting documents just in case. Stay tuned for my next episode...

Buy early · « **Reply #45 on:** September 04, 2009, 10:40:44 AM »

Glad to hear your bike is back. Hope it remains stable from here out.

Twolanerider · « **Reply #46 on:** September 04, 2009, 08:03:38 PM »

Quote from: Lo Lo on September 04, 2009, 10:36:50 AM

Update:
Received the bike back fixed. Service Dept. stated it was my induction module that took a crap this time. Hmmmmm.... Anyways, picked my SERK up last night and rode it home in the rain. No issues so far. Bike is running strong. Time will tell. Naturally, I have all the service history logged, with supporting documents just in case. Stay tuned for my next episode...

Maybe ignition module rather than induction module. Doubt they really replaced your induction module since, well; the bike doesn't have one.

TIF2 · « **Reply #47 on:** September 04, 2009, 08:39:22 PM »

Throttle-by-wire does not scare me much ... it is well proven.

The MoCo's implementation of this technology has me a bit concerned.
There simply CANNOT be a "field test" with this stuff; it has to be bullet-proof from day one.

It's a technology I love to hate if you know what I mean.

Lo Lo · « **Reply #48 on:** September 04, 2009, 09:28:39 PM »

Quote from: Twolanerider on September 04, 2009, 08:03:38 PM

Maybe ignition module rather than induction module. Doubt they really replaced your induction module since, well; the bike doesn't have one.

Really? I thought the induction module kit was all the components behind my air filter? The service dept. printout said it is an Induction Module part# 27685-08A $485.95, that they replaced.... along with a Filter Element gasket p#29645-08 $3.95, and Intake Manifold Seal P#26995-86B $7.90. So what gives???

Are they trying to pull the wool over my eyes?

grc · « **Reply #49 on:** September 04, 2009, 09:52:40 PM »

Induction module is another term for throttle body. I was under the impression that the throttle actuator was a separately replaceable part that attaches to the throttle body, and that would be what I would expect them to replace, not the complete throttle body. Maybe not.

I assume on the previous attempts at repairs they replaced the grip sensor. Now that they've replaced the entire system except for the ECM, what is their plan if it fails again? I assume a complete diagnostic including tracing all the wiring to see if there might be an intermittent open or short is out of the question, at least until you find a real tech and not a part changer.

Good luck, and I hope your ETC problems are behind you. If they aren't, and it happens again, I definitely suggest having an attorney contact the MoCo for you to facilitate a buy-back of an obviously unsafe vehicle. These bikes aren't worth risking your life for. As someone else on the site says quite often, this stuff isn't rocket science. However, somehow between the MoCo and the dealerships they seem to be able to make it all seem that way.

Jerry

Twolanerider · « **Reply #50 on:** September 05, 2009, 01:35:06 AM »

Quote from: Lo Lo on September 04, 2009, 09:28:39 PM

Really? I thought the induction module kit was all the components behind my air filter? The service dept. printout said it is an Induction Module part# 27685-08A $485.95, that they replaced.... along with a Filter Element gasket p#29645-08 $3.95, and Intake Manifold Seal P#26995-86B $7.90. So what gives??? Are they trying to pull the wool over my eyes?

No they're not trying to pull something on you. That was a case of something that seemed funny in my head not translating to text on a bare screen. Just a jab at the Harley's inconsitency in parts naming sometimes. My bad. Sorry for the confusion.

Lo Lo · « **Reply #51 on:** October 25, 2009, 10:15:36 PM »

Guess what..... The issue with my Throttle by wire has returned!!!!!!!!!!!! Throttle cuts out mid ride, and most of the time won't work on startup during idle. Bike will be enroute to DIFFERENT dealership to find cause. About to take the gun to this CVO and put it out of it's misery....

Black Diamond · « **Reply #52 on:** October 25, 2009, 11:20:15 PM »

Quote from: Lo Lo on October 25, 2009, 10:15:36 PM

Guess what..... The issue with my Throttle by wire has returned!!!!!!!!!!!! Throttle cuts out mid ride, and most of the time won't work on startup during idle. Bike will be enroute to DIFFERENT dealership to find cause. About to take the gun to this CVO and put it out of it's misery....

Are you experiencing any problems with your tach or odometer?
I have similiar issue going on. See http://www.cvoharley.com/smf/index.php?topic=42583.0 for details

JW

Lo Lo · « **Reply #53 on:** October 26, 2009, 12:06:18 AM »

Yes, I read your post and started wondering if there was any relation? I am furious right now because I was nearly stranded yesterday with throttle issues. We need to find a fix to this nonsense!

Lo Lo · « **Reply #54 on:** October 27, 2009, 10:35:22 AM »

I just read an article on line about someone finding the cause of some throttle by wire issues. It stated the wiring harness under the seat was being crushed by the riders weight and causing the harness wires to break/disconnect under the shrink wrap at the zip tie where it plugs in. Anyone ever heard of this? The article spoke about maybe carving out an indentation under the seat to make a pocket, or get an aftermarket seat with more space....

Black Diamond · « **Reply #55 on:** October 27, 2009, 11:35:51 AM »

Quote from: Lo Lo on October 27, 2009, 10:35:22 AM

I just read an article on line about someone finding the cause of some throttle by wire issues. It stated the wiring harness under the seat was being crushed by the riders weight and causing the harness wires to break/disconnect under the shrink wrap at the zip tie where it plugs in. Anyone ever heard of this? The article spoke about maybe carving out an indentation under the seat to make a pocket, or get an aftermarket seat with more space....

That's another one I'll have checked.

JW

Eqcons · « **Reply #56 on:** October 27, 2009, 01:30:51 PM »

Quote from: Lo Lo on October 27, 2009, 10:35:22 AM

I just read an article on line about someone finding the cause of some throttle by wire issues. It stated the wiring harness under the seat was being crushed by the riders weight and causing the harness wires to break/disconnect under the shrink wrap at the zip tie where it plugs in. Anyone ever heard of this? The article spoke about maybe carving out an indentation under the seat to make a pocket, or get an aftermarket seat with more space....

I had that happen with the audio harness to my headset on one bike. Very plausible.

Jim

hdbrad03 · « **Reply #57 on:** October 27, 2009, 04:16:32 PM »

Quote from: Lo Lo on October 27, 2009, 10:35:22 AM

I just read an article on line about someone finding the cause of some throttle by wire issues. It stated the wiring harness under the seat was being crushed by the riders weight and causing the harness wires to break/disconnect under the shrink wrap at the zip tie where it plugs in. Anyone ever heard of this? The article spoke about maybe carving out an indentation under the seat to make a pocket, or get an aftermarket seat with more space....

Another GOOD reason for the MOCO to put a decent seat pan on their seats!!!

brad

cobra427man · « **Reply #58 on:** March 03, 2010, 08:20:33 PM »

I had the same problem with new '08 ultra. Start the bike up and all it would do was idle regardless of throttle input. In order to clear it, I had to cycle the bike on/off a few times. Check engine light would stay on afterward. After 4 trips back to dealer and a threat to get a lawyer involved, dealer bought the bike back for what I paid in an exchange for an '09 ultra. I had to pay some extra $$$ on the trade because the '09 had a special paint job. Overall, this was a very frustrating experience that definitely didn't build any confidence in H-D nor the dealers service department. So far the '09 hasn't been plagued with that problem, but it has been troubled with a transmission leak because they didn't tighten the side cover bolts on the transmission not to mention the tank recall.

TORKER07 · « **Reply #59 on:** March 04, 2010, 02:49:45 AM »

I hate to say this but Toyota uses throttle by wire. Hope this isn't going to be an issue for us too.

Chains · « **Reply #60 on:** March 04, 2010, 09:34:14 PM »

Too many electronics for a motorcycle, I'll stick with my cables.

Lo Lo · « **Reply #61 on:** March 06, 2010, 10:25:10 AM »

After my last post, I haven't had one issue. Go figure! So from this point on, it looks like I may have a happy ending after all!

Author Topic: Throttle by wire MALFUNCTION!!!??? (Read 30756 times)

SPIDERMAN

SPIDERMAN